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buzz_bomb

Ship turning circle and French ship questions

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When I am making a turn does the ships speed affect how wide the turn is? That is do I turn tighter at slower speeds I often feel I do but wanted to make sure.

Also, do I get to keep the French ships earned through the French crates in the main game and do I keep the French ships earned from the test server?

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The turn circle is set in stone. Speed only makes it happen sooner.

Yes you keep your ships in the live server only. The ships you earn on PT you don't keep.

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4 minutes ago, buzz_bomb said:

When I am making a turn does the ships speed affect how wide the turn is?

Yes. Mouse and myself have done a lot of twirling with ships and we've found that, in general, 3/4 speed gives the tightest circle and 4/4 speed gives the fastest time-through-a-turn. Going 1/2 or 1/4 makes your turn wider, in most ships.

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3 minutes ago, CLUCH_CARGO said:

The turn circle is set in stone. Speed only makes it happen sooner.

Ah, nope.

It's easy-ish enough to double-check.

  • Go into a training room
  • Go rudder hard-over at a certain speed and wait for the speed to settle
  • Do five laps at this speed
  • Calculate the average time per lap
  • Apply math, using average time per lap and the ship's speed to calculate the circumference of the lap

Mouse and me have done this for literally dozens of ships, and for the vast, vast majority of them the outcome is 3/4 is tightest, 4/4 is fastest, 1/2 and 1/4 are wider.

Here, I'll summon @LittleWhiteMouse and she can confirm.

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3 minutes ago, Lert said:

Here, I'll summon @LittleWhiteMouse and she can confirm.

Doesn't she have the turning radius and characteristics of all the ships in-game? I remember she posted a whole set of ships turning on loop from above.

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Just now, Fog_Repair_Ship_Akashi said:

Doesn't she have the turning radius of all the ships in-game? I remember she posted a whole set of ships turning on loop from above.

We're working on it. It takes a lot of time do get the numbers, roughly an hour per ship. We tend to prioritize ships that are relevant to upcoming reviews.

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In general, speed does affect the rate at which you turn.

  • The FASTER your ship goes, the more quickly your bow will come about. For dodging shells and making yourself a harder target to hit, you want to go as fast as possible as you can change your direction more quickly.
  • However, if you want to make the radius of your turning circle smaller, you want to set your engines to whatever speed will get you between 15 and 20 knots in the turn (ships decelerate while turning so watch your speed).  This will tighten your turning circle and allow you to manoeuvre in enclosed areas better.  This is best used when trying to avoid collisions with islands or other ships.  Note that your smaller turning radius does not mean you turn more quickly.  As mentioned above, if you want to turn the nose of your ship faster, accelerate.

Examples:

Admiral Makarov (tier 6 Soviet premium cruiser) has a 730m turning radius listed in port.

  • At 1/4 speed (7.8 knots), she has a 1.4º per second rate of turn and a 845m turning radius.
  • At 1/2 speed (14.7 knots), she has a 3.4º per second rate of turn and a 670m turning radius.
  • At 3/4 speed (20.3 knots), she has a 4.8º per second rate of turn and a 660m turning radius.
  • At 4/4 speed (25.5 knots), she has a 5.4º per second rate of turn and a 730m turning radius.

Roma (tier 8 Italian premium battleship) has an 810m turning radius listed in port.

  • At 1/4 speed (7.3 knots), she has a 1.0º per second rate of turn and a 1100m turning radius.
  • At 1/2 speed (13.8 knots), she has a 2.5º per second rate of turn and a 850m turning radius.
  • At 3/4 speed (18.6 knots), she has a 3.6º per second rate of turn and a 800m turning radius.
  • At 4/4 speed (22.4 knots), she has a 4.2º per second rate of turn and a 825m turning radius.
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1 minute ago, LittleWhiteMouse said:
  • The FASTER your ship goes, the more quickly your bow will come about. For dodging shells and making yourself a harder target to hit, you want to go as fast as possible as you can change your direction more quickly.

Yup yup. As a teensy tiny addition, I will say that it helps to know at what speed your ship turns the tightest, for navigation purposes. Avoiding rams, islands, beaches, etc.

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12 minutes ago, Lert said:

Ah, nope.

It's easy-ish enough to double-check.

  • Go into a training room
  • Go rudder hard-over at a certain speed and wait for the speed to settle
  • Do five laps at this speed
  • Calculate the average time per lap
  • Apply math, using average time per lap and the ship's speed to calculate the circumference of the lap

Mouse and me have done this for literally dozens of ships, and for the vast, vast majority of them the outcome is 3/4 is tightest, 4/4 is fastest, 1/2 and 1/4 are wider.

Here, I'll summon @LittleWhiteMouse and she can confirm.

I am not a mathematician but the radius remains the same as the set tightest turn radi it will never get smaller. Larger yes but never smaller

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1 minute ago, CLUCH_CARGO said:

I am not a mathematician but the radius remains the same as the set tightest turn radi it will never get smaller. Larger yes but never smaller

The circle does change side based on ship speed.  With the dimensions of the turning circle changing, the radius changes too, stretching larger and smaller depending on engine speed.

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Just now, CLUCH_CARGO said:

I am not a mathematician but the radius remains the same as the set tightest turn radi it will never get smaller. Larger yes but never smaller

Dude, I've done the math. Well, Mouse has, but still. We've twirled the ships. Dozens of them. If not over a hundred, by now. I've even told you the method for how to calculate the turn radius (btw, the in game listed turn radius lies). Mouse has even posted two example ships.

What more do you want?

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Thanks Lert and Little White Mouse, always useful information. I was thinking also along the lines of trying to dodge torpedoes and taking evasive action slowing and turning into the torps. I think it would make sense then to slow to 3/4 speed and turn hard into torps once you believe the enemy torps planes have committed to the run. 

I also had a thought that its also a commonly held belief that switching to reverse while I'm cruising decelerates my ship faster. Is that true? 

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5 minutes ago, buzz_bomb said:

Thanks Lert and Little White Mouse, always useful information. I was thinking also along the lines of trying to dodge torpedoes and taking evasive action slowing and turning into the torps. I think it would make sense then to slow to 3/4 speed and turn hard into torps once you believe the enemy torps planes have committed to the run.

It's a choice between turning a bit tighter but slower, or throwing your bow around quicker. If you turn tighter but slower you run the risk of not turning fast enough to get your bow between torpedoes and if you turn at full speed you run the risk of not turning tight enough to dodge a torpedo. It depends on the situation, each and every time.

5 minutes ago, buzz_bomb said:

I also had a thought that its also a commonly held belief that switching to reverse while I'm cruising decelerates my ship faster. Is that true? 

Nope. The game treats any change in speed as an 'emergency' change in speed, and the ships does what it can do to achieve the new speed setting the fastest. So just set your new desired speed setting, the ship will do its best to power to that setting as fast as it can.

You can see this in action by comparing when you go from 4/4 to 0 speed with your engine active, or go at 4/4 speed and have your engine blown out - the former will decelerate you quickly, in the latter you just kinda drift ahead, slowly decelerating, taking minutes to slow to a mere crawl.

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18 minutes ago, Lert said:

It's a choice between turning a bit tighter but slower, or throwing your bow around quicker. If you turn tighter but slower you run the risk of not turning fast enough to get your bow between torpedoes and if you turn at full speed you run the risk of not turning tight enough to dodge a torpedo. It depends on the situation, each and every time.

Nope. The game treats any change in speed as an 'emergency' change in speed, and the ships does what it can do to achieve the new speed setting the fastest. So just set your new desired speed setting, the ship will do its best to power to that setting as fast as it can.

You can see this in action by comparing when you go from 4/4 to 0 speed with your engine active, or go at 4/4 speed and have your engine blown out - the former will decelerate you quickly, in the latter you just kinda drift ahead, slowly decelerating, taking minutes to slow to a mere crawl.

Hey, Lert any difference in 1/2 turn, Full turn for radius?

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1 minute ago, Airglide2 said:

Hey, Lert any difference in 1/2 turn, Full turn for radius?

Read this post.

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3 hours ago, Lert said:

Read this post.

(Can't tell if trying to be a massive [edited] or didn't understand question)

OK, let me write it this way:

 

Hey Lert, in addition to the forward speed dialing, does turning the ship a half turn or full turn have any say in turning tighter or not?

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3 hours ago, Airglide2 said:

Hey Lert, in addition to the forward speed dialing, does turning the ship a half turn or full turn have any say in turning tighter or not?

Ah, I misread.

Yeah, 1/2 rudder deflection gives a much wider turn than full. As one would think.

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A necro, but a worthy necro.

I'm pretty sure they've been posted.  Look in LWM's CC forum section.

 

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