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Dareios

I have a 30% midway and a 40% saipan

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but Ive played CVs as a secondary class for years.

I think I play them quite well, contesting air space, spotting DDs, striking as required, etc

unfortunately about 80+% of the games are me as a solo cv, against a gold-typhoon league troll division of either mid/hak-DM/Mino-Montana or a sapain with double atlantas.

I just cant compete with a competent CV that has 2/3 map AA excluded by his troll division. There's just no way to win a no communication pug game vs a deck so heavily stacked to game the system, and with full comms. And having recently checked a few of these divisions, it seems that this is ALL they do. A hundred or more battles in this triple configuration, and maybe 2 or 3 solo in other ships.

This is, IMO, the single most broken mechanic in the entirety of the game. From the perspective of a 95%+ solo player who has met almost nobody and is tired of joining clans where there is never anybody online. cant git gud playing the game as intended.

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5 minutes ago, Dareios said:

There's just no way to win

 If you can't beat them, join them.

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I can sympathize to an extent, but in my experience, Saipan players who division with Atlantas are not very good. Saipan is everything you need to control the skies, so why are you bringing what should be overkill in Atlantas?

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2 minutes ago, HyenaHiena said:

Dont be a solo player in a team game.

two troll responses so far.

did we miss the part where I said no one is ever around who wants to division (and has more than a t6 ship they just researched).

I see you have recently played 6 times as many divisioned games as solo. Care to invite me?

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there is a good reason why you are 30-40% WR CV player.    while divisioning will  help,  I think you need to look at your own ability as well.   the fact that you are in a clan and can't find division mate  is interesting.

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Just now, Dareios said:

two troll responses so far.

did we miss the part where I said no one is ever around who wants to division (and has more than a t6 ship they just researched).

I see you have recently played 6 times as many divisioned games as solo. Care to invite me?

I play most of time with my clan and friends i made from 2+ years on this game.

Call your clan friends for division... or get a more active clan.

 

For example in our clan we really incentive people play in division, is just... logic, you have a better chance to win with 3 people working in team.

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1 minute ago, cometguy said:

I can sympathize to an extent, but in my experience, Saipan players who division with Atlantas are not very good. Saipan is everything you need to control the skies, so why are you bringing what should be overkill in Atlantas?

fair call. but AS a saipan, how do I do MY job for MY team versus that. Especially when you ask the team at the start to focus the atlantas (who are generally decent players) and then no one touches them ('cause 'lantas are scarey right) and the game ends on a loss with both atlantas on top on the enemy team still alive. I Had this happen 6 times (5 losses) over the weekend, and literally the only atlantas killed (out of the 12 faced) was on I dropped on.

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The stacked AA divisions are definitely offputting when I queue solo. They don't win nearly as often as you'd expect, which is somewhat surprising, but they unquestionably lower the quality of the experience for the other CV player.

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1 minute ago, centarina said:

there is a good reason why you are 30-40% WR CV player.    while divisioning will  help,  I think you need to look at your own ability as well.   the fact that you are in a clan and can't find division mate  is interesting.

so, exactly what is this reason oh trollish one. you have no ammunition whatsoever to base that attack on. Its 3--40% IN THOSE TWO CARRIERS, mostly for reasons stated.

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1 minute ago, Dareios said:

fair call. but AS a saipan, how do I do MY job for MY team versus that. Especially when you ask the team at the start to focus the atlantas (who are generally decent players) and then no one touches them ('cause 'lantas are scarey right) and the game ends on a loss with both atlantas on top on the enemy team still alive. I Had this happen 6 times (5 losses) over the weekend, and literally the only atlantas killed (out of the 12 faced) was on I dropped on.

 

I'm not a CV player, but studying game mechanics and ship specs is always the first place to start for any ship you're struggling with. You're not going to run into a unicum fishing div every game. 90% of the time, you'll see your average joe on the opposing team... entirely beatable. 

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Just now, Dareios said:

fair call. but AS a saipan, how do I do MY job for MY team versus that. Especially when you ask the team at the start to focus the atlantas (who are generally decent players) and then no one touches them ('cause 'lantas are scarey right) and the game ends on a loss with both atlantas on top on the enemy team still alive. I Had this happen 6 times (5 losses) over the weekend, and literally the only atlantas killed (out of the 12 faced) was on I dropped on.

When that happens to me, I generally resort to spotting a lot, and then from there, it depends on how the division deploys. If the Atlantas stick together, then I support anyone on my team playing the objective they're not at. If they split up, then it's tougher, and I end up waiting a while for one to get burned down some, then send in torp bombers one at a time with a fighter leading the way to absorb AA if they don't focus fire. Then if they pop def fire, your other bomber waits it out, and hits them on cool down.

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9 minutes ago, HyenaHiena said:

I play most of time with my clan and friends i made from 2+ years on this game.

Call your clan friends for division... or get a more active clan.

 

For example in our clan we really incentive people play in division, is just... logic, you have a better chance to win with 3 people working in team.

 be great, if the clan was not 50% new players with low tier ships, and 40% students who have limited playtime and always seem to be on when I am at work.

I tried to clan shop, but the faux-elitism is real, and if you didnt start by divisioning, you really struggle to have that minimum 60% WR and WTR over 8000 required to join these good active clans.

7 minutes ago, Kombat_W0MBAT said:

 

I'm not a CV player, but studying game mechanics and ship specs is always the first place to start for any ship you're struggling with. You're not going to run into a unicum fishing div every game. 90% of the time, you'll see your average joe on the opposing team... entirely beatable. 

and another suggestion ignoring what I posted and saying I dont understand how to play a ship. If it WAS average joe 90% of the time I wouldnt have made this post mate.

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Just now, Dareios said:

 be great. if the clan was not 50% new players with low tier ships, and 40% students who have limited playtime and always seem to be on when I am at work.

I tried to clan ship, but the faux-elitism is real, and if you didnt start by divisioning, you really struggle to have that minimum 60% WR and WTR over 8000 required to join these good active clans.

So dont blame the enemy divisions...

Fight alone vs a great division is hard, but you need work with your team for try win (with is ridiculous hard because you depend from the MM not give you total potatos)... its hard, sometimes you gonna lose because the MM hate you....

...like yesterday i lose a "perfect game", i was in my hak and my team has 3 minotaur in division vs a potato hak without any AA on his team because my team was a total potato... (the 3 mino in division goes to same cap at middle of map and die in 5 min... so great... (if was my division i probabily gonna scream to death in discord with they) and my team die fast to surface ships.

 

Anyway, try call more people for division and make friends on this game. If your clan only play lower tier maybe is time to try find another clan, maybe not the 'unicuns' clans but you need start growing (if you want of course).

In pass i play most of time alone, today i still playing alone sometimes (most of time in afternoon) but most of time i play in night i with friends. :)

 

Well the better time to play 'alone' in a CV in TX is in afternoon, the night is for divisions.

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16 minutes ago, Dareios said:

I tried to clan shop, but the faux-elitism is real, and if you didnt start by divisioning, you really struggle to have that minimum 60% WR and WTR over 8000 required to join these good active clans.

Overall WTR and WR are less meaningful than recent performance. If, for example, you can demonstrate that your competency has increased over the last 90 days, I'm sure some of the better clans will consider you. As a recruiter for Kraken, I can tell you that's how we operate. 

 

16 minutes ago, Dareios said:

and another suggestion ignoring what I posted and saying I dont understand how to play a ship. If it WAS average joe 90% of the time I wouldnt have made this post mate.

Lack of performance is typically a result of shortcomings in game knowledge or understanding of ship capabilities. I'm not dogging on you, I'm just telling you from personal experience. As for the 90% thing, either you had a run of bad luck where you ran into multiple unicum fishing divs your you're suffering from confirmation bias. Either way, over a long enough period of time, you won't be running into these divs in the majority of games. 

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I wouldn't worry about it too much, Hindenburg goes from 51% solo to 61% in a 3-ship division. Midway goes from 45% solo to 67% in a 3-ship division.

Having 1/4 of the team know the other team will have a carrier is a huge advantage.

Having the game be a contest of skill rather than who can bring a better carrier division would be nice, but I'd add it to the list of many things which would be nice about carriers and a rework.

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I know you are on at way different times than most of us do to your location, but you are always welcome in our Discord and I will div if I can.  Talk to Koboye about joining up with us.  

Also, I struggle with the UI for carriers with a 30ms ping, I can't imagine trying to do it with yours.  You are at a significant disadvantage to anyone with a reasonable ping in strafing and even avoiding AA.  

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So I kind of agree with the OP on some of his points. But after seeing him blow off advice from some of the best CV (and general universalist) players... I went to check his stats. 

 

Hidden.

 

So I/others cannot analyze average plane kills, look into the API for average spotting damage, or anything of the like. 

 

Sorry bud, but until you’re willing to accept advice from players without calling them trolls or unlock your stats, there’s not much to be done.

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51 minutes ago, Dareios said:

.

unfortunately about 80+% of the games are me as a solo cv, against a gold-typhoon league troll division of either mid/hak-DM/Mino-Montana or a sapain with double atlantas.

.

 

I plays CV solo a lot 99% of the time in Kaga and Enterprise and have decent wins in them.  When I get MM like you described, I beg AA ships on my team to help me out by  parking at strategic locations as AA platforms and tell my team what they are up against so they will stay in groups. To my surprise, people tend to cooperate a lot of time. If no one care, thats the risk I takes for playing solo in random. Also when I am facing with those troll div, I just assign my fighters primarily escort/ scout duties against their attack planes so that chances of my team survival increases to carry the game.

 

However, T9 and T10 are completely different stories since you will see more troll div and competent players. In my case, a lot of players simply outplay me even one-one-one. And I just suck it up and use them to improve my CV skills. IMO, I learnt new tricks not from the matches I won but from the ones I lost. I find T7-T8 is somewhat of a sweet spot for decent MM where you will face players with different skill levels.

 

I will add you to my contact and look for you when I am online. I can use my DM and Moskava for you. CV player base is very small and so don't give up.

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12 minutes ago, Kombat_W0MBAT said:

Lack of performance is typically a result of shortcomings in game knowledge or understanding of ship capabilities. I'm not dogging on you, I'm just telling you from personal experience. As for the 90% thing, either you had a run of bad luck where you ran into multiple unicum fishing divs your you're suffering from confirmation bias. Either way, over a long enough period of time, you won't be running into these divs in the majority of games. 

I dunno, Wombat.  I think most "average" CV drivers give up the class completely before they get to tier 8, let alone tier 10.  I think most of the CV drivers in T9/T10 have competitive experience at least in Clan Battles if nowhere else.  At T6, sure 90% are going to be Joe Average CV drivers on the other side.  Once you get up to T9/T10, I'm pretty sure there are a lot more whales swimming in that sea.

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3 minutes ago, Fishrokk said:

I dunno, Wombat.  I think most "average" CV drivers give up the class completely before they get to tier 8, let alone tier 10.  I think most of the CV drivers in T9/T10 have competitive experience at least in Clan Battles if nowhere else.  At T6, sure 90% are going to be Joe Average CV drivers on the other side.  Once you get up to T9/T10, I'm pretty sure there are a lot more whales swimming in that sea.

 

You might be right. The "average" CV players probably don't swim in high tier waters as much. Whenever I end up in a high tier CV game, I go look up the performance of both players. In most cases it's either a 40-45% player or a 60-65% player, rarely anyone in the middle. However, I run into way more 40-45% players than I do the better ones. 

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i don't play CV, but i do participate in those divisions a lot, and this is usually what happens:

a good CV player apoears online on discord

i see them, i yell carry me

they usually wont refuse

then when i know i div eith CV, i obviously will pick high AA ships to make myself more comfortable

and there we go , CV with DM/Mino/grozo

 

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I have 190 out of 196 Tier 7 CV games playing Solo...  and while I have gone against some Saipan/atlanta/belfast/flint/insert ship name here divisions - It is usually not that often.  To say it happens all the time or frequently is simply not the case.  If I had to put a number - I'd say 50% of the time it is vs an average player, 20% it is bad, 20% it is good, and 10% it is good/unicum + AA division.

This still gives you plenty of opportunities to provide your team a good chance in winning..

I'd probably suggest looking for a clan that is active during your play times - many clans that are recruiting freely ask players that are interested to hop on their discord/TS to play with them - I'd probabably recommend this so you can decide if said clan is indeed active during the times you play.  

 

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I was curious as to OP's core claim - that a "average" or even "good" CV player could actually have a low winning rate due to constantly be matched up aganst unicum CV players.  All of us, even those who don't play CVs, understand what it's like to be in a match where when carrier player outclasses the other, so the idea seemed plausible at least.

Warships.today has distribution curves for winning rates of every ship in the game.  As you would expect, they fall into the "bell curve" shape.  Most people are about average.  Here's Cleveland, for example:

cleveland.png.485ac4cd8f985ee1ce389b8b4729409e.png

I do not know why there is a weird spike right in the middle of the curve.  I suspect it might be a data artifact.

 

Anyhow, in a world where OP is right, you could see the Win Rate for high tier carriers take on a two-lobed shape.  One group of unicum, frequently divisioned players, would have a high win rate.  A second group would almost always lose to that group and go 50/50 against members of its own group, so there would be a second lobe centered below 50%.  The results do not bear that out, however.

Midway:

midway.png.c8f21ddc0f13ec900fb85d0b4fa564c1.png

Saipan:

saipan.png.9dbc204e9bd041b978d3fd1e023d6d00.png

The curves are a lot messier because there are far fewer people playing carriers than cruisers.  The curves are also broader - a much higher percentage of carrier players will have a win rate less than 30% and or greater than 70% than cruiser players.  However, it's still a curve.  There is nothing in this data to suggest that an average carrier player shouldn't be able to achieve an average win rate.  Based on OP's win rates, either the sample size is too small, or OP does indeed seem to be a below average carrier player.

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OP, when looking at a clan, ask what time zone the majority of the players are in. If you are a West Coast guy, you need to find a primarily West Coast clan.  If you are a retired guy playing during the mornings, you need to find a clan full of retired guys or ones who work at night. 

If you are a fun and engaging type of person, you can probably worm your way into a better w/r clan - but is that what you want?  Some players can be standoffish or just ignore invites if they think you are going to drag them to a loss every time you div up.  Try to get into a clan where their average is slightly better than your overalls, and use the divs to help you improve and strengthen your stats.  If you are grouchy, irritable and unpleasant .... sorry, I got nothing for that scenario.

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