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stardestroyer001

Moskva gameplay tips?

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I have less than 20 games in Moskva and I still don't understand how this ship is supposed to be played.

With the other Russian cruisers, it was firing from the second line, waiting for BBs to push, etc. With Moskva, I am focused on almost as much as Yamato, and I find I get myself into situations that I cannot get out of (pushing too far forward, etc). I watched Flamu's video for Moskva but I can't seem to follow his advice during the game; I see an opening, I push in, get caught, and die.

Any tips? I'd like to know how to play this ship properly and improve my performance and WR%.

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Sounds to me like you have a lack of patience or will power.  You know what Flamu's advice is and yet you can't seem to follow it.  Not to be harsh, but even if we gave you advice, what makes you think that you'd follow it any more than you would follow flamu's (which you don't)?

 

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5 hours ago, stardestroyer001 said:

I have less than 20 games in Moskva and I still don't understand how this ship is supposed to be played.

With the other Russian cruisers, it was firing from the second line, waiting for BBs to push, etc. With Moskva, I am focused on almost as much as Yamato, and I find I get myself into situations that I cannot get out of (pushing too far forward, etc). I watched Flamu's video for Moskva but I can't seem to follow his advice during the game; I see an opening, I push in, get caught, and die.

Any tips? I'd like to know how to play this ship properly and improve my performance and WR%.

Here's the thing, people do infact hate the Moskva's presence. Noone likes it, not a single ship, because the damn thing is punishing. DDs eat radar and laser HE. Cruisers eat citadels, Battleships eat citadels or even 8-10k damage every 10 seconds by pens, CV has to contend with the potential 8.2km AA bubble that frazzles his strikes. So everyone wants Moskva want dead, more than any other. That's the next point. You have to bridge that gap of BB and CA, and understand that you'll never get to go into an opening and just exploit it. The enemy team will see you, and they will do everything to stop you. This is why more than pushing openings, you need to setup a presence near an area just like a battleship, but use your speed and radar and chase down and flank. Moskva can burn stuff down, but the reality is, you'll have more impact using more AP than HE. 
The idea is, you have to setup a position where the enemy ships cannot simply bowtank or angle against your team forever, they eventually have to turn. Moskva AP flies so fast they don't have time to correct, and end up eating citadel or penetrations. Battleships trying to turn will eat at least 2-3 salvos on the broadside. 
The next key thing is, don't bowtank until you're past 15km from the battleships. Any closer and they start hitting your bow more than the deck, which results in lolpens. You'll have to learn the art of angling just right so their shells hit the main belt instead of the bow. Not broadside, not full bow on, get it right.
Flamu is too aggressive. If you're having problems, follow only his normal advice. Stop hunting for openings, and start moving into new positions you create.

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1 hour ago, Seniorious said:

Here's the thing, people do infact hate the Moskva's presence. Noone likes it, not a single ship, because the damn thing is punishing. DDs eat radar and laser HE. Cruisers eat citadels, Battleships eat citadels or even 8-10k damage every 10 seconds by pens, CV has to contend with the potential 8.2km AA bubble that frazzles his strikes. So everyone wants Moskva want dead, more than any other. That's the next point. You have to bridge that gap of BB and CA, and understand that you'll never get to go into an opening and just exploit it. The enemy team will see you, and they will do everything to stop you. This is why more than pushing openings, you need to setup a presence near an area just like a battleship, but use your speed and radar and chase down and flank. Moskva can burn stuff down, but the reality is, you'll have more impact using more AP than HE. 
The idea is, you have to setup a position where the enemy ships cannot simply bowtank or angle against your team forever, they eventually have to turn. Moskva AP flies so fast they don't have time to correct, and end up eating citadel or penetrations. Battleships trying to turn will eat at least 2-3 salvos on the broadside. 
The next key thing is, don't bowtank until you're past 15km from the battleships. Any closer and they start hitting your bow more than the deck, which results in lolpens. You'll have to learn the art of angling just right so their shells hit the main belt instead of the bow. Not broadside, not full bow on, get it right.
Flamu is too aggressive. If you're having problems, follow only his normal advice. Stop hunting for openings, and start moving into new positions you create.

I'll give that a try. I guess I was playing it like an HE-firing BB instead of some fusion between BB and CA. Thanks for the reasonable advice.

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On 05/02/2018 at 11:33 AM, Seniorious said:

Here's the thing, people do infact hate the Moskva's presence. Noone likes it, not a single ship, because the damn thing is punishing. DDs eat radar and laser HE. Cruisers eat citadels, Battleships eat citadels or even 8-10k damage every 10 seconds by pens, CV has to contend with the potential 8.2km AA bubble that frazzles his strikes. So everyone wants Moskva want dead, more than any other. That's the next point. You have to bridge that gap of BB and CA, and understand that you'll never get to go into an opening and just exploit it. The enemy team will see you, and they will do everything to stop you. This is why more than pushing openings, you need to setup a presence near an area just like a battleship, but use your speed and radar and chase down and flank. Moskva can burn stuff down, but the reality is, you'll have more impact using more AP than HE. 
The idea is, you have to setup a position where the enemy ships cannot simply bowtank or angle against your team forever, they eventually have to turn. Moskva AP flies so fast they don't have time to correct, and end up eating citadel or penetrations. Battleships trying to turn will eat at least 2-3 salvos on the broadside. 
The next key thing is, don't bowtank until you're past 15km from the battleships. Any closer and they start hitting your bow more than the deck, which results in lolpens. You'll have to learn the art of angling just right so their shells hit the main belt instead of the bow. Not broadside, not full bow on, get it right.
Flamu is too aggressive. If you're having problems, follow only his normal advice. Stop hunting for openings, and start moving into new positions you create.

A very well thought out reply, and suggestions. Kudos @Seniorious! (unlike the previous post which is not helpful the to OP at all)

 

I shall revisit this suggestion, when I unlock the beast from the Soviet block.

 

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ups for ya

 

good solid advice

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Never be the first one infront unless all bbs are dead.  U can some some hits but won’t last long when focused.  Practice angling.  It can bounce some high caliber shells but at the right angle.  Never go bow on against a bb at close range under 12km cause they can overmatch your bow and citidel u.  Always keep moving and WASD.  Also stay at range if u can.  It’s not a brawler and the dpm is not like a Des Moines and does not have torpedoes like the Hindenburg.  I am not Unicum in my Moskva but I am pretty sure above average.  So far that is how I play my Moskva and it seems to be working out for me.  Good luck and have fun!

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I hear it's supposed to be like a sniper, but so god help me, I can't do !@#$ with this cruiser. It's beautiful, but it does not feel anymore accurate than other cruisers, the high shell velocity and therefore low trajectory disallows it from using islands effectively so you'll always get spotted from outer space, and it struggles to penetrate broadside battleships and overpens cruisers like no tomorrow. This is easily my worst performing cruiser. Poor DPM, terrible concealment, iffy armor, no torps, short radar(I don't have the mod)... what am I missing here?? PLS HALP!

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So I decided to try for the award in space battles for winning at least one match in each ship. When I got to the Moskva (Aurora)... This thing scares me. How is a ship that big with guns that powerful so fast? Why does it get over 11km radar? Why did my first salvo knock a third of the health off of an enemy CA?! Why is there a Soviet flag on my wall where none was before!? Why did my playlist spontaneously change to the Red Army Choir?!? Please, send help!

This is NOT a cruiser, in any way shape or form, and I don't care what the devs call it. This thing is... I don't even know, but it FEELS like a squishier, torpless Scharnhorst with radar and INSANE guns. This thing is evil. I need to go play my US ships and exorcise these demons of Siberia before I start falling victim to the sirens' call of stronk Russian "balanced" cruisers.

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On 4/1/2018 at 5:07 PM, Not_Your_Average_Potato said:

Never be the first one infront unless all bbs are dead.  U can some some hits but won’t last long when focused.  Practice angling.  It can bounce some high caliber shells but at the right angle.  Never go bow on against a bb at close range under 12km cause they can overmatch your bow and citidel u.  Always keep moving and WASD.  Also stay at range if u can.  It’s not a brawler and the dpm is not like a Des Moines and does not have torpedoes like the Hindenburg.  I am not Unicum in my Moskva but I am pretty sure above average.  So far that is how I play my Moskva and it seems to be working out for me.  Good luck and have fun!

Exactly this!  under 12km my Mosvka got lolpen by all BB and no amount of angling can save you, i found out the hard way and it was punishing! Unless the red team BB is a complete scrub he will citadel you all day long at the front bow if you allowed them to close in.  

This is not an easy ship to play when you compare it to Hindenburg, Zao, or DM, in the beginning I would suggest to keep her at around 15km~18km and play her like a BB, angle it to 11 or 1 o'clock and spam AP/HE at range, she is good at kiting.

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I have some specific questions about this ship, particularly when it comes up to a ship v ship matchup.

Moskva v Hindenburg: what do you do? It feels like a loosing battle. Am I wrong? In either way how would you approach this one. Is it worth angling for the third turret or should I immediately go into damage control mode and make my profile as small as possible. Is there a range that works better? I'm assuming the Hindenburg player knows how to angle and bait AP. 

Moskva v Zao: seems a lot like Hindenburg, but easier to live through as they have to sail further out to not get punished by AP. When dealing with a good Zao player, do I fish for AP pens or just give up and go for HE.

Moskva v Des Moines: Is there ever a reason to shoot AP at a bow on Des Moines at any range? Aim for turrets? Just load HE and try and get out? Worth angling for third turret?

Moskva v BB: When angling what angle are we looking for relitive to the third turret maximum angle? I figure this angle might be different versus a Yamato or a Kurfurst, but without just making a million mistakes when playing the angles it's hard to get a good feel for what this angle is. What BBs would you encourage a 1v1 fight against? I've had some success with Yamato players, but it feels like a lot of that is just them giving me a large enough broadside to start shooting AP into not damage saturated areas. In particular I'm having trouble finishing off BBs that don't give me those extreme angles because their superstructure gets saturated and I don't think HE can pen their bow or stern armor. 

These are the things I'm struggling with on this ship. On paper I love the thing, and people still sing its praises, but for me it seems like it just plays as a cruiser support ship that needs a buddy to force enemy ships to give you a flank to win and straight ship to ship duel with most of its peers. Is this just the way it works? Based on average damage numbers I would assume it's just me not knowing the above things and how to manage those engagements in particular that are keeping me back.

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On 5/8/2018 at 3:14 PM, Sou1forge said:

I have some specific questions about this ship, particularly when it comes up to a ship v ship matchup.

Moskva v Hindenburg: what do you do? It feels like a loosing battle. Am I wrong? In either way how would you approach this one. Is it worth angling for the third turret or should I immediately go into damage control mode and make my profile as small as possible. Is there a range that works better? I'm assuming the Hindenburg player knows how to angle and bait AP. 

Moskva v Zao: seems a lot like Hindenburg, but easier to live through as they have to sail further out to not get punished by AP. When dealing with a good Zao player, do I fish for AP pens or just give up and go for HE.

Moskva v Des Moines: Is there ever a reason to shoot AP at a bow on Des Moines at any range? Aim for turrets? Just load HE and try and get out? Worth angling for third turret?

Moskva v BB: When angling what angle are we looking for relitive to the third turret maximum angle? I figure this angle might be different versus a Yamato or a Kurfurst, but without just making a million mistakes when playing the angles it's hard to get a good feel for what this angle is. What BBs would you encourage a 1v1 fight against? I've had some success with Yamato players, but it feels like a lot of that is just them giving me a large enough broadside to start shooting AP into not damage saturated areas. In particular I'm having trouble finishing off BBs that don't give me those extreme angles because their superstructure gets saturated and I don't think HE can pen their bow or stern armor. 

These are the things I'm struggling with on this ship. On paper I love the thing, and people still sing its praises, but for me it seems like it just plays as a cruiser support ship that needs a buddy to force enemy ships to give you a flank to win and straight ship to ship duel with most of its peers. Is this just the way it works? Based on average damage numbers I would assume it's just me not knowing the above things and how to manage those engagements in particular that are keeping me back.

Moskva vs Hindenburg: You want to be in a kiting position and use all your 3 guns.  You still have chance to use AP since their firing arc is about 35 degrees and they have bad rudder shift time You are right that this is pretty much a losing matchup since Hindenburg can pen your 50mm deck armor with HE and has superior firepower.

Moskva vs Zao: In a straight up fight, Zao will struggle against you since she has terrible firing arcs. You can do huge AP damage if Zao tries to use all her 12 guns. Outside of 15km, you still want to use HE. Zao can't pen your 50mm armor with HE, so she won't be able to deal damage to you very efficiently at further distance. Overall, you shouldn't fear a Zao who is constantly firing.  The most scary Zaos are those who know how to use concealment and ambush you from your broadside.

Moskva vs DM: Just use HE if he angles properly. You don't want to use 3rd turret if he is focusing you.  However, if you should avoid 1v1 shoot-out against DMs. You will always lose against a decent DM player.

Moskva vs BBs: You can effectively kite them at range. Even Yamato can't pen your 50mm deck armor. Closer up, you want to wiggle. Bait their shots into your belt armor. No matter how you angle your ship statically, a good BB player knows how to aim your bow and will devastate you. So you need to wiggle and change speed to put off their aims. 

You don't have Hindenburg lol-pen HE against BBs. But you have laser guns to aim at specific point of those BBs. You want to aim at superstructure and front and stern. Your HE will pen armor at those places and the goal is to start 3 fires at those positions. Below 8km, your AP can pen BB belt armor. You can easily land lots citadels on ships like Montana, Yamato or Iowa. If they stay slightly angled, you can aim your AP at their bow below their A turret.

Moskva used to be the best T10 cruisers together with Zao. But after the buffs to Hindenburg and DM and introduction of new cruisers. I don't think she stands out anymore. She is not a very effective flanking ship due to poor concealment and extremely vulnerable broadside. She is best at being a support ship in frontal engagement. You do want to plan your actions well ahead of time due to the poor concealment. For example, you don't want to just go straight up bow-on against a few BBs or Hindenburgs, as they will kill you very quickly. A mistake I usually made when I first got the ship is wanting to forcefully use that powerful radar. However, it is easy to put yourself in a dangerous position you will never get out of. She is just like DM, very weak when enemy pushes down your flank. And even worse she doesn't have the concealment of DM to get out of trouble. So do plan ahead and counter properly.

 

 

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People will regularly shoot past your entire team to hit you in a Moskva; the moment it is spotted, there will be AP and everything else coming in from all over the map, virtually  every single time you are spotted.  Be prepared for that because it is unending.

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On ‎5‎/‎8‎/‎2018 at 5:14 PM, Sou1forge said:

I have some specific questions about this ship, particularly when it comes up to a ship v ship matchup.

Moskva v Hindenburg: what do you do? It feels like a loosing battle. Am I wrong? In either way how would you approach this one. Is it worth angling for the third turret or should I immediately go into damage control mode and make my profile as small as possible. Is there a range that works better? I'm assuming the Hindenburg player knows how to angle and bait AP. 
if I'm fighting a Hinden solo, I disengage. If he's kiting, let him run away. Load HE, start sniping him down and keep your bow on. Generally, you should avoid kiting ships period. Disengage, find something else. Your AP is strong, but if fighting cruisers holding heavy angles, HE is your best bet. Burn em down and try to use your range. 

Moskva v Zao: seems a lot like Hindenburg, but easier to live through as they have to sail further out to not get punished by AP. When dealing with a good Zao player, do I fish for AP pens or just give up and go for HE. 

A good Zao player will pretty much burn you down. You'll have to use HE again, because literally everyone knows what Moskva does when they load AP and get your side. 

Moskva v Des Moines: Is there ever a reason to shoot AP at a bow on Des Moines at any range? Aim for turrets? Just load HE and try and get out? Worth angling for third turret? 
Insert advice from above. 

Moskva v BB: When angling what angle are we looking for relitive to the third turret maximum angle? I figure this angle might be different versus a Yamato or a Kurfurst, but without just making a million mistakes when playing the angles it's hard to get a good feel for what this angle is. What BBs would you encourage a 1v1 fight against? I've had some success with Yamato players, but it feels like a lot of that is just them giving me a large enough broadside to start shooting AP into not damage saturated areas. In particular I'm having trouble finishing off BBs that don't give me those extreme angles because their superstructure gets saturated and I don't think HE can pen their bow or stern armor.  
When fighting BBs you have three situations. Kiting away. Bow on (Only past 15km, to make them hit the deck more often instead of bow). Typical HE spam while moving about. When you get into that last bit of saturation, you'll have to hope someone else comes in and finishes it, or that you start fires. Hence, Demolition Expert can be useful. 

The takeaway here is this; much like a battleship, you're rarely specifically fighting one target. You're best off sitting at a good range with AP loaded and watching for anyone that gives broadside. Keep angled or Bow on, and if you want to use that back turret, kick out and kick in. Don't keep it in the fight, the angle isn't that good. Remember, as below, everyone wants you dead. Watch your sides. Think of yourself as a BB that is designed to most effectively hunt cruisers. AP should absolutely be your dominant shell, you only use HE if there is absolutely no better target, I.E all the BBs are bow on and the cruisers are hiding. In that case, I would suggest going bow on yourself, reversing, and at this point you can hold your tail out enough to use the back turret and start raining HE. Keep your distance, and just start farming fires. 
As Flamu has said, it's impossible to NOT give broadside at any point in a match. Eventually, someone will screw up, and Moskva needs to be there with AP loaded to exploit it. That's your calling card. Loaded AP, use your laser guns to punish someone the second they try to turn away or come out of a corner. Doesn't matter if it's a cruiser or a BB, out to max range, you will still do massive damage. There is no cruiser ingame that is safe from Moskva at max range. Battleships will eat pen damage on the upper belt at max range, and sub 16km you'll be citadelling BBs with higher citadels, including Yamato. 

Do know though, your radar has great range, and it'd be a shame to not use it. On areas where you have cover, use it to good effect and if the DDs are near, load HE. You have a hilariously easy time hitting them. Just remember that at such close ranges, the Moskva handles like a pig. Stay bow on when possible. 

22 hours ago, BullHalsey said:

People will regularly shoot past your entire team to hit you in a Moskva; the moment it is spotted, there will be AP and everything else coming in from all over the map, virtually  every single time you are spotted.  Be prepared for that because it is unending.

This. It's why I HIGHLY recommend using a tanky Moskva build, this means premium heal, premium repair, Superintendent, so forth. You have a massive health pool and access to heals, don't get antsy on fires. 

1 hour ago, BearlyHereBear said:

Enjoy:

A great meme and a generalized understanding of what it can do and what you are capable of, but lacks in depth advice on how to finesse through situations. 

EDIT: 
Fun meme to do, load the speed flag. It's hilarious because now you're faster than every other ship ingame, probably only the French cruisers can outpace you. You can even chase down some DDs like Gearing. You are excellent at rapidly moving from point to point. To this end, I also recommend using full stealth build on Moskva, regardless how you intetend. Get Concealment expert first and use the Concealment module too, always run a camo. That same speed lets you kite away and disengage fast too.

Edited by Seniorious

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I frequently begin a game by driving all the way to the edge of one side.  That keeps everything in front of you.  I also usually bow tank and never turn. I burned down 2 GKs at once that way.  They kept moving toward me and I kept backing up.  They would have killed me if they separated, but they stayed together and paid for it.  Also citidelled a Yami at max range once.

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Always keep the bow toward the enemy slightly angle to bounce shot . One time in 2 salvo hitted 7 time the citadel of a Yamato . The most citadel I got was like 11 I think in a game 180k damage on a lost . 

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Moskva is all about angle and distance. Its an amazing ship if you play in a safe zone of 12km to 18km, AP is amazing and since Conqueror update HE isnt that good because everyone runs captain skills to mitigate fire damage.

If you get too close of a BB you must use WASD to avoid hits and use your speed for some nice citadels. Dont be afraid to spam AP and dont bow on, just angle.

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I put my Moskva down for a while after it finally donned on me that I was the most targeted ship in the game.  Imagine being in a despised Khabarovsk, except you're huge, unwieldy, have no torpedoes and most of the time little to no concealment.

Sure it's a challenge and all that, not putting it down there but for me it got old rather quickly.  Always wondered why you see so few of them in battle; Hindys, Zaos, DMs, Minotaurs everywhere but a Moskva here and there only.  I think this is why.  Another comparison would be imagining a T10 Kutuzov without smoke or torpedoes.

And Moskva is only situationally strong hull wise.  Look at the armor and compare it to the others; 155mm belt I think.  It is no battleship, though it does have the HP pool to eat cits and heal for a while.  You can bow tank a Yamato with one; I've death rushed T10 BBs and prevailed but it doesn't quite make the whole thing work for me.

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On ‎6‎/‎7‎/‎2018 at 4:33 PM, BullHalsey said:

I put my Moskva down for a while after it finally donned on me that I was the most targeted ship in the game.  Imagine being in a despised Khabarovsk, except you're huge, unwieldy, have no torpedoes and most of the time little to no concealment.

Pretty much this. Moskva is renowned for her meme worthy guns, and thus people want to quickly dispose of her presence. On top of this, she pays for her strengths with a high citadel. Show broadside or just too much side, and you'll eat it. The key to proper tanking in Moskva is to utilize the 50mm deck armor, which denies all HE bar battleships and Hindenberg, and can autobounce Yamato. She has the accuracy, flat arcs,  and penetration to operate at max range comfortably, and her strong deck emphasizes this with survivability.  At medium ranges, she has the strong radar and a deceptively small turning circle, though her rudder is somewhat sluggish. Bow armor can resist cruisers, but don't expect to bow tank a Des Moines that is accurately beating you with HE. 

I run full concealment build on my Moskva, with EM and reload module to maximize my efficiency at dealing damage. Essentially, you have to build the ship to nullify her BB characteristics of bad turret traverse, bad reload, and bad concealment. Once you do that, you can actively switch between roles. Run SI too, for that 5th heal that lets you shrug off fires and farm dreadnought achievements. As Flamu says, cruisers become exponentially stronger late game when there are few ships left to focus fire them. For Moskva, this is especially important. Late game Moskvas become brutal. 
Start your game off long ranged, punishing broadsides from 19km away or getting preemptive fires on BBs (but don't get comfy pushing HE, her strength is AP and should absolutely be your main shell), and then start closing and pushing in. If you have the opportunity, you can also start off domination games by getting near cover and providing radar support. You can laser down DDs with HE and radar, and then reverse into cover to nurse any wounds you suffered. It's all about risks, and it's HP you're risking. Potentially lose tons of HP early, and gain a cap/dd advantage, or conserve for late game where you can really put your carry pants on. Thankfully, Moskva has a lot of HP to give. Don't feel ashamed in open water maps to park bow in next to your Iowas and Montanas and overlook capture points, like on Okinawa in front of B/C.  Use AP to DPM ships crossing broadside between caps and HE to burn up bow tanking BBs. You can move in later with radar to really pressure capture points once you know there aren't many threats to bring you down in the area.

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On 6/11/2018 at 1:46 PM, Seniorious said:

Pretty much this. Moskva is renowned for her meme worthy guns, and thus people want to quickly dispose of her presence. On top of this, she pays for her strengths with a high citadel. Show broadside or just too much side, and you'll eat it. The key to proper tanking in Moskva is to utilize the 50mm deck armor, which denies all HE bar battleships and Hindenberg, and can autobounce Yamato. She has the accuracy, flat arcs,  and penetration to operate at max range comfortably, and her strong deck emphasizes this with survivability.  At medium ranges, she has the strong radar and a deceptively small turning circle, though her rudder is somewhat sluggish. Bow armor can resist cruisers, but don't expect to bow tank a Des Moines that is accurately beating you with HE. 

I run full concealment build on my Moskva, with EM and reload module to maximize my efficiency at dealing damage. Essentially, you have to build the ship to nullify her BB characteristics of bad turret traverse, bad reload, and bad concealment. Once you do that, you can actively switch between roles. Run SI too, for that 5th heal that lets you shrug off fires and farm dreadnought achievements. As Flamu says, cruisers become exponentially stronger late game when there are few ships left to focus fire them. For Moskva, this is especially important. Late game Moskvas become brutal. 
Start your game off long ranged, punishing broadsides from 19km away or getting preemptive fires on BBs (but don't get comfy pushing HE, her strength is AP and should absolutely be your main shell), and then start closing and pushing in. If you have the opportunity, you can also start off domination games by getting near cover and providing radar support. You can laser down DDs with HE and radar, and then reverse into cover to nurse any wounds you suffered. It's all about risks, and it's HP you're risking. Potentially lose tons of HP early, and gain a cap/dd advantage, or conserve for late game where you can really put your carry pants on. Thankfully, Moskva has a lot of HP to give. Don't feel ashamed in open water maps to park bow in next to your Iowas and Montanas and overlook capture points, like on Okinawa in front of B/C.  Use AP to DPM ships crossing broadside between caps and HE to burn up bow tanking BBs. You can move in later with radar to really pressure capture points once you know there aren't many threats to bring you down in the area.

Yeah I built mine the same way, then later gave up 1/2 concealment for double rudder shift.  Really woke the thing up for me; doesn't change the radius of course but you can wiggle and dodge fire very well for what it is, not to mention start a turn just that much faster.  One of my last matches me and another Moskva popped from opposite sides of an island broadside of each other, headed in the same direction.  I was able to turn in and bounce his AP, while he wasn't and ate cits rather severely.  Poor guy vaporized and I was hardly scratched.

I've found the most success in it when I can support a competent BB player or two.  I have also done Flamu's Yamato bow tanking trick, which really blows their mind.  Works well until you are point blank and quite worth it to see a Yamato player give up and turn to Run.

This said, I think I have been able to do better in Hindenburg, largely due to being a great deal less of a Kill It!! target.  And I was also dealing with a very impressive run of steamroll losses the last time I played it; you know the kind where 2-3 ships are gone in the first minute and the dominoes just start falling faster.  Wasn't being killed in it a lot but being forced to kite superior numbers at range while being such a favored target got old.

Edited by BullHalsey

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