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GambitHG

Grinding Strategy

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Since I got 180 Premium days from the Santa crates this year, I'm focusing on grinding up to some tier 10 ships so I can play Clan Battles. I'm focusing on the Japanese BB line, US CA line, and Pan-Asian DD line, spreading my play amongst all of those lines every day to take advantage of the first win bonuses and optimize my progression rate. I'm also playing the Soviet DD and CA lines to take advantage of the sale at the end of the month.

However, I'm noticing that my win rate and experience seem to be taking a hit. I'm wondering if switching between all these different ship classes and nations is affecting my ability to play these ships as I seem to miss a lot of shots that I used to make against opposing ships. Should I instead be focusing on just grinding down one line until I achieve Tier 10, or is my strategy valid and I just have to be more aware of the changes in muzzle velocity and turn radii as I go?

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I am tired of Tier 9 and ten. Too much crap there so I stay at 8 or lower.

 

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If your serious about grinding a line, then I would stick with it and really focus on just the one. Since you might wanna play while a ship is still in battle after dying early or something, I would pick a second line or ship to play that has a similar play style as not to throw you off. Like maybe primarily grind pan asian dds, but secondarily grind USN dds.

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playing various class can impact your win rate as you don't get enough practice to be good at it.    more you play though,  less the impact.

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I work on all lines at the same time and I do feel that it affects my WR, more due to not always having all of the upgrades and then moving up the line to the next ship. What seems to upset my WR most is when there is some kind of grind mission that upsets the game ship battle populations.

Playing more ships, you get to learn more ships and how to shoot at them and what their guns do so you know more what to expect. The hardest part is remembering which ships have a difference between AP and HE muzzle velocity. It always helps to check them in port since you can't in the game when in battle, which would be quite helpful info if it was on the pop up window for the ammo type in battle.

Edited by Sovereigndawg

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Personally, I play an individual ship at least five times each before switching to a new ship, and that has helped my skills a bit.

 

So; grinding perhaps meaning playing your prefered ship enough to learn, but not enough for it to become a drudge?

Like someone else said, I think switching ships too often reduces your ability to learn to use them.

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2 hours ago, Kapitan_Wuff said:

If your serious about grinding a line, then I would stick with it and really focus on just the one. Since you might wanna play while a ship is still in battle after dying early or something, I would pick a second line or ship to play that has a similar play style as not to throw you off. Like maybe primarily grind pan asian dds, but secondarily grind USN dds.

True that.   Still guilty of "switch-a-ship".   I did focus on USN BBs to grind up to the Montana, and found it easier to maintain a good win rate.     I was also grinding up my first 19pt captain.    But after getting Montana, I went back to jumping in various ship classes and nations (working on other skippers).    Now up to three 19pt'rs and nearly a fourth (18pt).   But, I jumped between USN and UK, and ground up my French line to Saint Louis.    Kinda all over the place.

I'd like to go back to dedicating time to a particular nation and ship class.    Not sure how successful it'll be, since I work through my 19pt'rs (on regular and premium ships for first win bonus).     BB 19pt captain drives Montana, Missouri, and Alabama, my 19pt CA captain drives New Orleans and Arizona, and my UK 19pt captain drives the King George and DoY.      That's 7 games to work on first win bonuses for elite commander XP before I even get to a grind ship.

Need to contemplate standardizing on a line -  really want the Hindy.  :fish_nerv:  But shiny object Musashi is only 55k free XP away....    Guess I'll get that first, get the fourth 19pt captain (Edinburgh) and THEN work on Hindy.   LOL! 

Edited by DiddleDum

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Switching between different nations but the same ship type is a good option for maximizing your XP earn rate, but yes--switching between different ship types can hurt your overall stats.  So it basically comes down to which matters more to you: getting down these lines as quickly as possible or maintaining your WR & game averages.

While I'm not trying to get down the lines as quickly as possible, I am currently "working" on Soviet, German, and PA DDs (already have Gearing & Shima), as well as KM battleships and KM & VMF cruisers.  But the destroyers are the only ships I play during every session...I'll throw some games into the battleships and/or cruisers whenever I still feel like playing after I've collected my daily destroyer wins.  I've also sunk about 75% of my games so far into destroyers, so jumping back into the DDs is completely natural at this point; I'm just still working on developing my BB & CA skills and turning them into second nature.

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3 hours ago, GambitHG said:

Since I got 180 Premium days from the Santa crates this year, I'm focusing on grinding up to some tier 10 ships so I can play Clan Battles. I'm focusing on the Japanese BB line, US CA line, and Pan-Asian DD line, spreading my play amongst all of those lines every day to take advantage of the first win bonuses and optimize my progression rate. I'm also playing the Soviet DD and CA lines to take advantage of the sale at the end of the month.

However, I'm noticing that my win rate and experience seem to be taking a hit. I'm wondering if switching between all these different ship classes and nations is affecting my ability to play these ships as I seem to miss a lot of shots that I used to make against opposing ships. Should I instead be focusing on just grinding down one line until I achieve Tier 10, or is my strategy valid and I just have to be more aware of the changes in muzzle velocity and turn radii as I go?

Your WR taking a hit as you grind up a tree probably has more to do with the fact that you're going up to higher tiers where ships are more lethal and expected player skill level is higher.  Some people play better if they focus on a single type of ship while for others it doesn't really matter so it depends on what kind of learner/player you are. 

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41 minutes ago, DiddleDum said:

>Snip<

I don't follow my own advice lol, I jump around getting first wins and slowly grinding. Not good for my stats, when I focus I do much better.

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If I'm working on a line, and its fun (not a "grind"), then I tend to play them more than other ships.  In the last 3 days, I played German DDs exclusively (Z-46) to get my Z-52 (totally worth it BTW).  

If a line feels like a struggle, then I don't play them as much.  To each their own I suppose.

B

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14 hours ago, Harv72b said:

Switching between different nations but the same ship type is a good option for maximizing your XP earn rate, but yes--switching between different ship types can hurt your overall stats.  So it basically comes down to which matters more to you: getting down these lines as quickly as possible or maintaining your WR & game averages.

While I'm not trying to get down the lines as quickly as possible, I am currently "working" on Soviet, German, and PA DDs (already have Gearing & Shima), as well as KM battleships and KM & VMF cruisers.  But the destroyers are the only ships I play during every session...I'll throw some games into the battleships and/or cruisers whenever I still feel like playing after I've collected my daily destroyer wins.  I've also sunk about 75% of my games so far into destroyers, so jumping back into the DDs is completely natural at this point; I'm just still working on developing my BB & CA skills and turning them into second nature.

Honestly, I'm not too worried about my WR - it's not great, but I know I'm a pretty decent player. However, I especially find after grinding to a new ship, my rating always goes down as I grind my way through the upgrades than just using free XP to buy them. Not to mention each ship starts with a 1 point Captain. It's proving to be a problem as I'm getting into Tier 8 since a 10-point Captain is just about a prerequisite to do well in DDs at that level.

My main goal is to optimize purchases, not my win rate. Other than my tier 10 ship goals, I switch lines each month to focus on grinding ships that will have discounts. So far this month I've been grinding the Fushun and Gvenny at the same time. There's good synergies between the two as they're almost the same ship, but then I forget which one I'm driving and launch torpedoes that will never hit. I'm also grinding the New Orleans and Kirov to the point where I should have enough XP to purchase the Baltimore just before the line split and the Budyonny by the end of the month. Only when all four of the ships are still in battle do i take out the Nagato complimented by a Scharnhorst to train up some of my German Captains. Next month, I'll probably switch priority from DD grinding to BB grinding to get to the Amagi while working on the French BB line simultaneously.

Edited by GambitHG

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18 hours ago, GambitHG said:

I'm wondering if switching between all these different ship classes and nations is affecting my ability to play these ships

My answer would be yes. 

I can't talk much as I am a British cruiser main who's currently climbing UK BB and US DD tech trees (and dabbling in PA-DD's with not too much bother about how high I climb or how fast). That being said, UK CL's also exist in a smoke meta (like destroyers), so there are play-style similarities between most of the ships I play, and I'm not in any hurry to climb past T5 in either destroyers or battleships for now.

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2 hours ago, GambitHG said:

Honestly, I'm not too worried about my WR - it's not great, but I know I'm a pretty decent player. However, I especially find after grinding to a new ship, my rating always goes down as I grind my way through the upgrades than just using free XP to buy them. Not to mention each ship starts with a 1 point Captain. It's proving to be a problem as I'm getting into Tier 8 since a 10-point Captain is just about a prerequisite to do well in DDs at that level.

My main goal is to optimize purchases, not my win rate. Other than my tier 10 ship goals, I switch lines each month to focus on grinding ships that will have discounts. So far this month I've been grinding the Fushun and Gvenny at the same time. There's good synergies between the two as they're almost the same ship, but then I forget which one I'm driving and launch torpedoes that will never hit. I'm also grinding the New Orleans and Kirov to the point where I should have enough XP to purchase the Baltimore just before the line split and the Budyonny by the end of the month. Only when all four of the ships are still in battle do i take out the Nagato complimented by a Scharnhorst to train up some of my German Captains. Next month, I'll probably switch priority from DD grinding to BB grinding to get to the Amagi while working on the French BB line simultaneously.

I think most people move a captain up the line to avoid this issue; you can then recruit/take from reserve another captain for the lower tier ship you've left behind if it is a keeper.  I do my retraining penance in coop as well (or use premiums) to avoid having to take a captain in retraining into randoms.

This may be part of your issue, especially with DDs.  Past tier 5 or so, a non-Soviet DD with a captain without Last Stand and Concealment Expert is at a real disadvantage, as you note.

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Theoretically, your win rate should take a hit as you grind.  If you are not free exp’ing past the base hull, bringing a less competitive ship to your team.  Also, some ships play differently as you grind, and what was successful on a ship may not be on the next higher. There is a learning curve with ships, that can be a factor.  Also, there are duds in most of the lines, but you are forced to play ( unless free exp’ed).  

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First and foremost... are you not moving your captain while you progress up the line???     This is a large disadvantage if you are not...

Based on what you are saying it seems like you just want to press the battle button enough times to get to Tier10 instead of focusing on your gameplay improvement with each ship while you work your way up in tiers... so that once you are up in T8+ you can have better games and more fun.  

No offense but regardless of switching between lines... it shouldn't be an excuse to play poorly.  Sure, you may have to alter your playstyle a bit if you are running a stock ship bud I'd suggest focusing more on your gameplay each time you hit battle (regardless of the ship you are in).  Once you start playing better, getting better results, more wins, and more XP - you will find the grinding becomes much easier and fun.  Just looking at your profile, surviving 23% of your games is a clear indication that there are a lot of fundamentals that still need to be learned.  

In addition, I wouldn't suggest choosing the USN CA line nor the PA DD line to start.. both of these lines in my opinion require a bit more skill to be successful than some other lines.  USN CA's are short to mid range DD/Cap supporting ships (radar + floaty arcs) that require the ability to get in close and utilize terrain to be effective with radar and to deal damage (and getting out when necessary).   PA DD's require the ability to cap contest and knife fight other DD's without the use of torps.  

I'd instead suggest USN DD's and really any other cruiser line (but probably German cruisers if you like the AP playstyle of USN without as much of the risk/less armor)

Bottom line... grinding becomes easier if you play better which equates to more wins and better results.... regardless of which ships you play or if you switch back and forth.  

Premium + xp modifiers + quality games = less grind (and probably more fun).  

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22 hours ago, GambitHG said:

Since I got 180 Premium days from the Santa crates this year, I'm focusing on grinding up to some tier 10 ships so I can play Clan Battles. I'm focusing on the Japanese BB line, US CA line, and Pan-Asian DD line, spreading my play amongst all of those lines every day to take advantage of the first win bonuses and optimize my progression rate. I'm also playing the Soviet DD and CA lines to take advantage of the sale at the end of the month.

However, I'm noticing that my win rate and experience seem to be taking a hit. I'm wondering if switching between all these different ship classes and nations is affecting my ability to play these ships as I seem to miss a lot of shots that I used to make against opposing ships. Should I instead be focusing on just grinding down one line until I achieve Tier 10, or is my strategy valid and I just have to be more aware of the changes in muzzle velocity and turn radii as I go?

If you don't like your performance to take a hit, then using FXP to skip certain modules or ships entirely is the only way. 

A stock ship is statistically worse than fully unlocked counter parts. This is a huge problem, especially for newer players. WG really should considering decrease the module grinds.

Even with premium account, grinding a single line would take hundred of games. Spreading play time probably is not the most proficient.

 

If you do have any exp flags, especially the "special ones" at the bottom, save them all for when you have premium time. Then equip all 7 exp flags plus a detonation flags (which should also be saved for this exact occasion). 

 

With all flags equipped you can even unlock a T10 ship from T9 under 50 games.

 

If you don't have enough exp flags for the entire line, then save them only to unlock modules on ships that REALLY needs them. Like Hull B on a DD, or Fuso Hull B. 

Edited by NeutralState

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3 hours ago, Simers72 said:

First and foremost... are you not moving your captain while you progress up the line???     This is a large disadvantage if you are not...

Based on what you are saying it seems like you just want to press the battle button enough times to get to Tier10 instead of focusing on your gameplay improvement with each ship while you work your way up in tiers... so that once you are up in T8+ you can have better games and more fun.  

No offense but regardless of switching between lines... it shouldn't be an excuse to play poorly.  Sure, you may have to alter your playstyle a bit if you are running a stock ship bud I'd suggest focusing more on your gameplay each time you hit battle (regardless of the ship you are in).  Once you start playing better, getting better results, more wins, and more XP - you will find the grinding becomes much easier and fun.  Just looking at your profile, surviving 23% of your games is a clear indication that there are a lot of fundamentals that still need to be learned.  

In addition, I wouldn't suggest choosing the USN CA line nor the PA DD line to start.. both of these lines in my opinion require a bit more skill to be successful than some other lines.  USN CA's are short to mid range DD/Cap supporting ships (radar + floaty arcs) that require the ability to get in close and utilize terrain to be effective with radar and to deal damage (and getting out when necessary).   PA DD's require the ability to cap contest and knife fight other DD's without the use of torps.  

I'd instead suggest USN DD's and really any other cruiser line (but probably German cruisers if you like the AP playstyle of USN without as much of the risk/less armor)

Bottom line... grinding becomes easier if you play better which equates to more wins and better results.... regardless of which ships you play or if you switch back and forth.  

Premium + xp modifiers + quality games = less grind (and probably more fun).  

I'm rather selective to switch captains between ships as I prefer to take the XP hit while they're at lower levels. For the retraining hit on a 10-point Captain (even paying for half the retraining) I can train a new captain up to almost 6-points. I may as well make use of all the reserve slots that I pick up in the daily crates. On occasion, I do move the captain to the next ship in line. For example, since I already had the Shiratsuyu, I moved my 10 point Akatsuki captain up to the Kagero, and after a couple of games, I had upgraded the ship and the captain was fully trained. I'm not doing too bad with that ship with about a 60% win rating, I think.

I don't think I play poorly, this week was a bit of an anomaly because it seemed that every game I went to cap with a DD, the entire enemy fleet showed up at the cap 8-on-1 and lit me up with radar. No matter how much I tried to use terrain and sell myself dearly, none of my teammates would cap the other two objectives even when they obviously had local superiority. In standard battles, I'd usually manage to kill a ship before I died, but in some cases I was the only one of 1-3 players that had any kills on my team. In one game we actually won, our CV was AFK all game. It was an odd week, with me getting either 1500 base XP or 400 XP because I was the first to die. But yes, I will resolve to git gudder.

The reason I chose the IJN BB line, USN CA line and PA DD line are because they're mostly real ships. I would rather not play with paper designs that never existed in reality unless it's to power through to a real ship design. I've got all the lines to mid-tier already, with the German BBs, and Soviet CAs the only lines that are still at Tier V (I don't really play CVs). I'm waiting to purchase the Algerie and Edinburgh once they go on sale (with 10 point captains waiting in the wings) and I'll have the top historical ships for those lines. I'm almost at the Gadjah Mada, which I'll grind through to get to the Hsienyang, then grind concurrently with the Benson (once it goes on sale and if I have enough money).

I don't have a lot of money as most of it goes to my kids activities (soccer, dance, art - it's expensive when they're competitive), but I have a fair amount of patience. I used Christmas gift money to buy the Santa Boxes, so I have to be frugal for the next 10 months. And I honestly like most of the grinds, as by the time I've got 25 battles in a ship under my belt, I have a good handle on what it can and can't do (though getting there can be painful) and the more ships you play, the more you'll know how to play against them as opponents.

And I plan to use flags once I've ground through the new paper Tier IX US CA and plop that captain in the Des Moines.

Edited by GambitHG

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2 hours ago, GambitHG said:

I would rather not play with paper designs that never existed in reality unless it's to power through to a real ship design.

I know what you mean. I can live with ships that progressed to serious design studies. That being said, the high-tier meta does not really appeal to me, and if various distractions mean that I never progress past the Fiji I will not be upset. (I will research the Edinburgh in order to make the Fiji an elite ship, but that's that. The XP grind cost of retraining her captain is more than I care to pay.)

I can live with Lion because she was at least laid down as a physical keel, and almost considered for completion on numerous occasions. WIthout her, the British don't have anything realistically above Tier VII (except Vanguard, which WG has steadfastly refused to even hint at so far). I can live with Monarch because she was a serious consideration for what KGV might have become. But that's it.

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2 hours ago, GambitHG said:

I'm rather selective to switch captains between ships as I prefer to take the XP hit while they're at lower levels. For the retraining hit on a 10-point Captain (even paying for half the retraining) I can train a new captain up to almost 6-points. I may as well make use of all the reserve slots that I pick up in the daily crates. On occasion, I do move the captain to the next ship in line. For example, since I already had the Shiratsuyu, I moved my 10 point Akatsuki captain up to the Kagero, and after a couple of games, I had upgraded the ship and the captain was fully trained. I'm not doing too bad with that ship with about a 60% win rating, I think.

Moving captains as you change ship becomes more and more important as you move further up the tree. The further up you go in a tree, the more people will have captains with 10+ captain skills and the more you will be at a significant disadvantage if you get a new captain instead of retaining an old one for the new ship. You also stay in the ship for longer as you go up a tree which makes the math on retraining better as you move up the tree as well. I typically start migrating my captains as I move up the tech tree once I hit tier 5. Use a same nation premium ship to work off the retaining penalty if you have one. 

 

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1 hour ago, Ensign_Cthulhu said:

I know what you mean. I can live with ships that progressed to serious design studies. That being said, the high-tier meta does not really appeal to me, and if various distractions mean that I never progress past the Fiji I will not be upset. (I will research the Edinburgh in order to make the Fiji an elite ship, but that's that. The XP grind cost of retraining her captain is more than I care to pay.)

I bit the bullet and retrained my Jack Dunkirk for the Fiji. He's at 15 points right now and I don't regret it. A couple thousand more XP and he'll have Smoke Screen Expert and all the special skills. Did I mention I'm loving the Fiji?

1 hour ago, NCC81701 said:

Moving captains as you change ship becomes more and more important as you move further up the tree. The further up you go in a tree, the more people will have captains with 10+ captain skills and the more you will be at a significant disadvantage if you get a new captain instead of retaining an old one for the new ship. You also stay in the ship for longer as you go up a tree which makes the math on retraining better as you move up the tree as well. I typically start migrating my captains as I move up the tech tree once I hit tier 5. Use a same nation premium ship to work off the retaining penalty if you have one. 

I wasn't aware you could do this. I thought that when you switch a captain from a regular ship to another regular ship and take the penalty, moving that same captain to a premium would have no effect. I'll have to try that with the couple of premiums I got from the Santa Bundles. As for migrating captains, I'll sometimes hopscotch them over each other (ie. tier IV to Tier VI, Tier V to Tier VII, etc.).

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Unfortunately I'm not surprised you didn't know, there are a lot of non-intuitive things that WG doesn't tell its players..... Like turning on "last spotted markers" and "range rings" on the mini map, or using "Alternative battle interface" gives you far more relevant information than the standard UI.

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32 minutes ago, GambitHG said:

I bit the bullet and retrained my Jack Dunkirk for the Fiji. He's at 15 points right now and I don't regret it. A couple thousand more XP and he'll have Smoke Screen Expert and all the special skills. Did I mention I'm loving the Fiji?

I wasn't aware you could do this. I thought that when you switch a captain from a regular ship to another regular ship and take the penalty, moving that same captain to a premium would have no effect. I'll have to try that with the couple of premiums I got from the Santa Bundles. As for migrating captains, I'll sometimes hopscotch them over each other (ie. tier IV to Tier VI, Tier V to Tier VII, etc.).

IIRC how it works is as follows. Move captain from ship A to ship B. Play a token game (I'm not even sure you need to do this, but I would, to be sure. Someone can correct me.) Now move him into the premium ship. You still have to do the retraining grind, but his skills are all fully active instead of being at 50% or disabled (important if they include things which mitigate damage, like Last Stand, or give him extra heals etc. like Superintendent). Because of the premium XP boost, he completes the training quicker.

Now put him back in ship B. It will be like he never left it, and he will be up to full strength and ready to rock.

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1 hour ago, NCC81701 said:

Unfortunately I'm not surprised you didn't know, there are a lot of non-intuitive things that WG doesn't tell its players..... Like turning on "last spotted markers" and "range rings" on the mini map, or using "Alternative battle interface" gives you far more relevant information than the standard UI.

Agreed. Once I found out about the alternate UI and turned it on, I find I don't really need Aslain's mods anymore. And I'll try that method you said when I get my CAs

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The solution is before you play any ship is to get mentally prepared for it. Set goals and give yourself a objective on every map. Either support a cap or cap it yourself, but comnunicate it in chat. Let your intentions by known before every match and plan an escape route. 

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