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LunchCutter

North Carolina, what am I doing wrong?

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 I like this ship but I have little luck with it. Most games I just seem to fire salvo after salvo at the enemy ships, all the shells are on target but nothing ever seems to hit and when it does the damage is often minimal. I've inflicted some major damage on cruisers but tier 8+ BB's seem to be immune to me. Just feel like I'm doing something wrong, when I spectate other NC's in action, they fire a long range salvo at a target and a few seconds later the target always seems to have a big chunk of its health wiped off. I do the same and my shells just splash all around the target..:( I understand the principles of angling and high shell drops but enemy ships seem to have no issue in bouncing me.

 A earlier game I attacked a distracted Montana who was side-on to me, I hit him multiple times but could do only minimal damage, he eventually turns around and shoots at me, I go the defensive, angled frontal stance but I still get 20+k wiped off my health, I return fire and do a grand total of 1200 damage.

 

 Find the guns,while they have pretty good trajectory still feel like a lottery, even at 8k range at a Tirpitz only a few shells hit him for minimal damage despite all been on target.

 

 Makes me thing I should just switch to HE, seem to see a lot of tier 8 BB's using it these days.

 

Screenshot of a earlier game, a truly abysmal accuracy score. Yet other ships like the New York and New Mexico I really did well in.

shot-18.01.31_18.36.11-0920.jpg

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Just because you can detect ships at long range and fire on them doesn't mean you should. I don't even bother with the long-range module for the NC. Instead, I load up on accuracy and stealth accoutrements and take a stealth build for the commander too. This way I can sneak in to less than 15 kilometers and fire before I'm spotted.  At less than 15 kilometers you are going to actually hit something. Remember to keep your nose pointed at the enemy. Never turn broadside. Only consider fleeing if faced by a Conqueror or Yamato and then back away.

If you are not sure where your shells are landing, then make yourself a training room with a bunch of targets and shoot at them a bit. Or, just play some Coop games, where there's not so much pressure.

Edited by Snargfargle
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Battleships aren't exactly my strongest class, but without having a replay file to watch my first assumptions would be that your aiming points are off and/or you're spending too much time trying to snipe from near maximum range (excluding the Tirpitz scenario you mentioned of course).  You also have to take into account that as you go higher in tiers, you face some pretty good players who understand things like proper angling and/or constantly making slight course changes to throw off your aim.

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The North Carolina is truly different from the pudgy dreadnoughts you've been accustomed to using which have shotgun like dispersion, meh AA and slow 21 knot top speeds. The main thing that you notice is how slow her 406mm shell velocity is compared to New Mexico's 356's and Colorado's 406's at only a mere 701m/s compared to the 768m/s of the Colorado. She is a stealthy fast AA battleship that excels at medium range engagements and can hold her own against T10's fairly well when played properly. First and foremost is your positioning, you generally want to know the general play on the map you are playing on then you want to identify which flank the enemy is heavily focused on. From there depending on which flank you ended up being on and on which side of the map you have the options of either pushing the enemy and deleting enemy ships or kiting back a bit and holding off the enemy advance. Her AA is unrivaled in tier by other tech tree battleships at T8 (when excluding premium battleships Alabama and Kii) and can melt enemy aircraft when captain and module builds are spec'd properly. She also doesn't take torpedoes as well as the dreadnoughts below her in the tech tree but that is made up for by her 27 knot top speed which allows you to better respond to incoming shell fire and or torpedo attacks and you don't bleed as much speed in turns. As a seasoned NC player your first priority should always be focusing on the most immediate threat to your team (granted that it is reasonable to do so, ie if a DD is torping a friendly 21km away or an enemy Atlanta is hunkering down behind a rock that you can't shoot over that should not be your priority.)

Below are screenshots of the most enjoyable, satisfying and best match I've ever had in the NC which showcases exactly how good the ship is when setup and played properly.

Image may contain: ocean, text, water and outdoorImage may contain: water

Edited by StatikTheWarmonger
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Are you fully upgraded, or are you getting frustrated with a stock ship?  Stock ships are almost always disappointing.

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3 minutes ago, desmo_2 said:

Are you fully upgraded, or are you getting frustrated with a stock ship?  Stock ships are almost always disappointing.

Nah she's fully upgraded. I think I should just save my ammo and engage at 15k. Any further and it's just a frustrating experience. 

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I don't know what's going on, then.  I loved New Mexico and even got along well with Colorado.  When I got North Carolina I noticed a distinct difference from the previous style of US BB, but it wasn't a bad thing.  I started blapping things hard pretty regularly.  NC is a great ship and is one of the two keepers in the line, IMO (New Mexico is the other, premiums excluded).

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Here's a video to watch & study.

I just recently got the NC and to date, have yet to get the B Hull, (almost there) but what Flamu teaches and says about the North Carolina makes a lot of sense.

Enjoy

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Can we see a replay? It sounds like you might be aiming at the wrong places. The NC has some of the most accurate guns in game, and hits hard too. A replay would let us see what's going on.

2 hours ago, StatikTheWarmonger said:

The North Carolina is truly different from the pudgy dreadnoughts you've been accustomed to using which have shotgun like dispersion, meh AA and slow 21 knot top speeds. The main thing that you notice is how slow her 406mm shell velocity is compared to New Mexico's 356's and Colorado's 406's at only a mere 701m/s compared to the 768m/s of the Colorado. She is a stealthy fast AA battleship that excels at medium range engagements and can hold her own against T10's fairly well when played properly. First and foremost is your positioning, you generally want to know the general play on the map you are playing on then you want to identify which flank the enemy is heavily focused on. From there depending on which flank you ended up being on and on which side of the map you have the options of either pushing the enemy and deleting enemy ships or kiting back a bit and holding off the enemy advance. Her AA is unrivaled in tier by other tech tree battleships at T8 (when excluding premium battleships Alabama and Kii) and can melt enemy aircraft when captain and module builds are spec'd properly. She also doesn't take torpedoes as well as the dreadnoughts below her in the tech tree but that is made up for by her 27 knot top speed which allows you to better respond to incoming shell fire and or torpedo attacks and you don't bleed as much speed in turns. As a seasoned NC player your first priority should always be focusing on the most immediate threat to your team (granted that it is reasonable to do so, ie if a DD is torping a friendly 21km away or an enemy Atlanta is hunkering down behind a rock that you can't shoot over that should not be your priority.)

Below are screenshots of the most enjoyable, satisfying and best match I've ever had in the NC which showcases exactly how good the ship is when setup and played properly.

Image may contain: ocean, text, water and outdoorImage may contain: water

That's the most impressive game results I've ever seen, and the highest BXP. Well done:Smile_honoring:

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One of the big strengths of the NC is stealth.... practice waiting and waiting... you may have a ship that you could hit, but waiting ten seconds for her to turn my be the difference in bounces and deleting her. I enjoy the NC/Alabama the most of all US BB's.

CO-op is a great way to practice gun arcs and distances as well as firing angles as well as were to hit ships. I have yet to figure out were to hit RN BB's.....

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26 minutes ago, AJTP89 said:

That's the most impressive game results I've ever seen, and the highest BXP. Well done:Smile_honoring:

I second that. I only dream of a game like that. I'm humbled.

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The shell arcs for the NC are ridiculous. I too have been bouncing shells off equal and lower tiered BBS. Not sold on this ship as a keeper.

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22 minutes ago, JonnyFreedom said:

Let me explain the North Carolina to you in one picture:
14zh5n.jpg

Considering you can't even tell the difference between a regular and radar cruiser, it doesn't surprise me you had problems.

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14 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Considering you can't even tell the difference between a regular and radar cruiser, it doesn't surprise me you had problems.

Amazing how I am always top damage in my Yammy though isn't it?  With a PR of 1639 in my yammy and 1655 in BBs, I must be trash.

Me

PnmeRwl.png

vs You

SwRT5N4.png

Yea.. I am sure you are the authority on BBs.  Oh.. that's right, you only play Radar Cruisers and your favorite one happens to be a seal clubber.

 

Stats mean everything, and that Yammy stat right there, tells everyone all they need to know.  So before you try to shame me, better look at your godlike play.  Because the only thing you are an authority on is seal clubbing.

Edited by JonnyFreedom

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Last night i hit a Montana at 27km away ...and hit her cit with a Musashi...and the sigma on Musashi was nurfed big time from Yamato...which means musashi spread is freaking messed up.  Lucky? idk.  however, i played several matches that night...and i'm still hitting Cit after Cit...am i luck or is it that i just know where to aim at.  

i do know the airtime of my shells and where the sweet spot are on most ships.  So, i just think you just need to get used to it a bit more and you will eventually find where you lead time is on your cross-hairs.  

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On 1/31/2018 at 5:54 AM, LunchCutter said:

 I like this ship but I have little luck with it. Most games I just seem to fire salvo after salvo at the enemy ships, all the shells are on target but nothing ever seems to hit and when it does the damage is often minimal. I've inflicted some major damage on cruisers but tier 8+ BB's seem to be immune to me. Just feel like I'm doing something wrong, when I spectate other NC's in action, they fire a long range salvo at a target and a few seconds later the target always seems to have a big chunk of its health wiped off. I do the same and my shells just splash all around the target..:( I understand the principles of angling and high shell drops but enemy ships seem to have no issue in bouncing me.

 A earlier game I attacked a distracted Montana who was side-on to me, I hit him multiple times but could do only minimal damage, he eventually turns around and shoots at me, I go the defensive, angled frontal stance but I still get 20+k wiped off my health, I return fire and do a grand total of 1200 damage.

 

 Find the guns,while they have pretty good trajectory still feel like a lottery, even at 8k range at a Tirpitz only a few shells hit him for minimal damage despite all been on target.

 

 Makes me thing I should just switch to HE, seem to see a lot of tier 8 BB's using it these days.

 

Screenshot of a earlier game, a truly abysmal accuracy score. Yet other ships like the New York and New Mexico I really did well in.

shot-18.01.31_18.36.11-0920.jpg

1) Please dont shoot HE in NC unless you know what you're doing. There is a time and a place for it, but not often. Generally you only select HE if you are facing a bow-on ship you can't overmatch, or you're about to face a DD.

2) If Montana blapped you for 20k, you probably weren't angled enough. Read up about ricochet and overmatch mechanics. WoWS Wiki is an excellent start. 

3) Shoot Tirpitz into the top portion of the belt. It's hard to citadel her, but all too easy to slap for 10-15k normal penetration per salvo. 

4) Get as close as you can without dying. Easy to say, I know, but that's the key to being effective in BB. This makes aiming easier and negates bad BB dispersion. 

5) Practice your aim in the training room (select that mode in the client, by clicking the random battle icon). It helps. 

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You need to spec fo concealment, then anti-aircraft....you will basically eat everything. 

The NC/Iowa/Montana are best played with concealment and anti-aircraft. Ideally you wanna avoid giving your side...angle so you get those first two turrets, but can turn in a pinch to show the third. You gotta really time using that third turret though as you can get paddled easily. 

18-15 seems to be the sweet spot...the closer you get the better those 16 inches work. 

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2 hours ago, JonnyFreedom said:

Amazing how I am always top damage in my Yammy though isn't it?  With a PR of 1639 in my yammy and 1655 in BBs, I must be trash.

Me

PnmeRwl.png

vs You

SwRT5N4.png

Yea.. I am sure you are the authority on BBs.  Oh.. that's right, you only play Radar Cruisers and your favorite one happens to be a seal clubber.

 

Stats mean everything, and that Yammy stat right there, tells everyone all they need to know.  So before you try to shame me, better look at your godlike play.  Because the only thing you are an authority on is seal clubbing.

It's my first Tier VIII & X ship and it's gotten better, but nice try though :Smile_glasses:

 

Edit:  Hold on now, those aren't even your stats :Smile_veryhappy:

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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I just got a fully upgraded NC..............for free

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6 minutes ago, Triela50 said:

I just got a fully upgraded NC..............for free

Same.  Certainly made up for missing 2 days of the Ovechkin op due to their snafu!

Opened my second Ovechkin container yesterday and BAM!  There was a bonus op for a North Carolina.  So happy, as I was dreading playing up from the Wyoming. 

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Just now, Mortis007 said:

Forum Necromancy...

Well, it is Halloween season in the US!

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1 hour ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

It's my first Tier VIII & X ship and it's gotten better, but nice try though :Smile_glasses:

 

Edit:  Hold on now, those aren't even your stats :Smile_veryhappy:

Yes they are: https://na.wows-numbers.com/player/1032362862,JonnyFreedom and Yamato is my first and only T10 BB.  

Edited by JonnyFreedom

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Well, since ya'll brought it up....

Others have noted the general items, like the need for replay...but here's my assessment.

Bottom Line:  Too far back.  Move up.

1.  Less than 10% hit rate is extremely poor.  In general, it should be in the 20% range...at least.  OP is either long range sniping, or poor aiming...or both.

2.  In a 12 minute match, the NC was hit 30 times for 17K total.  If this was a win, then the team did all the work while NC sat back.  If this was a loss, then the team got wiped while the NC sat back.

3.  Only one fire, extinguished immediately.  Using a DCP to extinguish the first fire in a T10 match is almost always tactically unsound...unless....the ship is unspotted and will remain so for a good amount of the cooldown.  If this is the case, see the Bottom Line.

 

Get close.  Do more damage. Take more damage (See note below).  Get lit more often.  Learn prudent DCP use strategy.

 

Note:  Taking more damage isn't the objective here.  It is a result of being in the fight.  There is a sweet spot for a T8 in a T10 match.  A spot where you maximize damage on the enemy in trade for damage on self (and the team in aggregate).  All the issues in that end game result point to a player playing too conservatively...staying too far back...sniping...when the better strategy is to move up and engage closer.  There is a happy distance....not too close...not too far away...where a player can make a difference.

Remember, when running a T8 in a T10 match, you're often not going to be the top player.  But you do have enough power...enough punch...and presence...to swing the game from a loss to victory.  But only if you're in the fight enough to make yourself felt.

 

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