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Bayren

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Is there a way to make this ship worth playing the reason why I ask is I have to suffer through this thing till I get the next tier ship. But my playing style is u need ships that well take punishment so far the bayren is not that ship

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Bayern is a tank at T6. If you can't take punishment in it, then you're playing it wrong. Push up a bit and brawl.

Edited by thegamefilmguruman
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It's hard to answer this objectively without seeing a replay, but the Bayern is pretty good at being on either side of a beating. The biggest issue I've seen with these ships is that players still tend to spam HE instead of AP and they feel that each salvo should be a broadside which opens them up to hard hits and torpedoes. If either of these describe your actions in any given match I would start there.

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Bayern is one tough ship and slug it out with anyone tier 5,6 and most 7s. Angling and not showing broadside have been the key for me in it.

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It's not upgrade a lot yet and setup probably not right either is there a place I can go to see set up on this ship plus all the rest in each class like battleship cruiser and so forth plus different nations

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1 minute ago, destoryer_JA said:

It's not upgrade a lot yet and setup probably not right either is there a place I can go to see set up on this ship plus all the rest in each class like battleship cruiser and so forth plus different nations

What set up do you have? Also do you have a replay? Having one will help us out in giving you advice.

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1 minute ago, destoryer_JA said:

The accuracy for me is also something that kills me it looks like a shotgun

This is why you've got to get closer. 

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No replay but upgrade are main armament1, aiming system 1 damage control1 stealing gear 1I have upgrade it to b hull also

Edited by destoryer_JA

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17 minutes ago, destoryer_JA said:

The accuracy for me is also something that kills me it looks like a shotgun

That is the whole point, all the German BBs are brawlers designed to get in close and pummel enemy ships. Focus on the secondaries and you will be fine just don't charge in alone.

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1 minute ago, destoryer_JA said:

No replay but upgrade are main armament1, aiming system 1 damage control1 stealing gear 1

Replace aiming system with secondary battery mod 2. Getting in close and brawling in your Bayern will make the inaccuracy of the main guns a mute point.

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You most certainly cant use it as a sniper like the Fuso. The most bang for your buck will come from brawling bow in. You may be able to live through a couple of broadside salvos but that is not recommended :Smile_teethhappy:  However, you must do it wisely. Don't charge in right at the beginning. Take your time and be patient. 20 minutes is a long time. Play it safe for the first 3-5 minutes to support your DDs (who should be capping) Then see where the rest of the enemy is and make your move. 

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Bayern, like most T6 BBs I've found, you either like her or don't.  The biggest difference is in the Bayern you face more experienced players who know how to strike German BBs for 10-20k of damage and there are ships which can punish her quite hard.

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She has excellent concealment and secondaries.  Close range knife fighter with punishing guns and hard to citadel.

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1 hour ago, destoryer_JA said:

Is there a way to make this ship worth playing the reason why I ask is I have to suffer through this thing till I get the next tier ship. But my playing style is u need ships that well take punishment so far the bayren is not that ship

In this game, moving up tier makes the game harder because ships and players gets better as you move up in tiers. If you aren't doing well at tier 6, moving up to tier 7 is not going to help you one bit. 

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1 hour ago, destoryer_JA said:

The accuracy for me is also something that kills me it looks like a shotgun

The accuracy does not get better with the gneis, Bismarck and FDG.  Learn to embrace the scattergun

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Now I think but not sure German bb I think does better with my playing style they seem to take more damage than other nation now I need to find a good cruiser nation that can take punishment if that's possible

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3 hours ago, destoryer_JA said:

Is there a way to make this ship worth playing the reason why I ask is I have to suffer through this thing till I get the next tier ship. But my playing style is u need ships that well take punishment so far the bayren is not that ship

Despite how many people will tell you Bayern's a "brawler", she just isn't. Don't know why people keep advice that is liable to keep getting ships sunk and games lost. I mean her range is pretty bad so I guess she's not a sniper either but this ship just can't take brawls. Pretty low HP pool, little higher than the Iron Duke but still pretty low compared to everything else at this tier. If this ship is a brawler it's much less so of one than the previous German BB's(Kaiser,Konig Albert and Konig I agree with the consensus here). She's got real good power and accuracy but what good is that if you can't take damage? 

A lot of the traits previous German BB's had which made them good brawlers are gone for the Bayern, (relatively)good HP pool, gone at both "top" and stock, lowest in the tier, ROF advantage gone, you've got 30 seconds. While this is an advantage/equal with all but 2 of the T6 BB's, T7 and T8 are a very different story and you're going to be matched up with them too. Even when you get the T5's this isn't an advantage really. 

The Bayern's main strengths are dispersion, it's guns and it's speed.It has the best dispersion of any tech tree T6, second most overall and is still has an advantage over the lesser T7's(USA and Japanese) as well. While range stops you from "sniping" from this ship, I'd say it's best in the 10 and 15 km range and not much closer. With it's guns, a considerable upgrade from the old German BB's. In terms of AP, only the UK BB's and Mutsu are better and Mutsu belongs at T7 and the QE has got those slow turrets. Also Bayern's HE  also has the same fire chance virtually as a QE/Warspite about as good as Dunkerque. These guns are more powerful than a good chunk of T7 too(including the new French one). In terms of speed Bayern is the fastest T6 tech tree BB(for now, apparently speed is going to be the French BB's "thing"), though all the premiums are faster. Kaiser was way better in terms of speed relative to tier though. 

So this ship is accurate, pretty fast and powerful. While it's range makes it clear it's not a sniper, it's not a brawler either. I mean it can certainly dish it out, but it's really vulnerable. It's dispersion is best used at something of a distance as that'll be your biggest advantage. Whatever works best for you, is what you should do. If you can make Bayern work as a brawler, that's wonderful for you, it's just that I agree that this ship is terrible at taking punishment and I keep hearing people say that certain German BB's are brawlers, while for me the ship's great at distance but terrible in close combat. The more and more posts I read about people frustrated following that advice makes me eager to advise them to try sniping or avoiding damage. Maybe there's a magic way to play vulnerable German BB's(mainly talking Bayern and Tirpitz) that is much more efficient than brawling(I'm skeptical), but if shooting from a distance works for you and results in good games, is it worth it to keep trying to do it the other way? But to all those who insist Germans are brawlers, how exactly do you get around simply not having armor? Cause I get trying to avoid stupid deaths and traps from DD's and stuff but in a brawl where you are supposed to take sustained BB damage how do you get around bad armor? 

I want to add that I believe Bayern is the best T6 tech tree ship and while it's bad at taking damage, it's a  good ship and would be "OP", if it weren't for the premiums(two of which I think belong at T7). Just avoid getting hit. 

Edited by Aristotle83
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Bayern is a great ship if you love a brawl. He's a hardy little ship and can take a good bit of punishment plus, if it gets dangerous, he is speedy and can get out of there quite quickly

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On 1/29/2018 at 2:18 PM, destoryer_JA said:

It's not upgrade a lot yet and setup probably not right either is there a place I can go to see set up on this ship plus all the rest in each class like battleship cruiser and so forth plus different nations

http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Main_Page

Go ^^^ enter any ship name in the search window and it will tell you about the ship. Pros, cons, best upgrades, etc... It is not 100% fool proof and I don't always agree but it is a pretty good resource.

Here is the Bayern page...

http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Bayern

Bayern is one of the best T6 BB's. IMO it is the best standard tech tree BB at T6. It is MUCH better when fully upgraded. At T6 you now see the fast T8 BB's with much more armor and much bigger guns (bigger guns on T7's too but they are mostly slow still and most don't have the superior armor of T8).

It's a very good brawler. Don't try and snipe from range. Load your AP (100% agree with the other person who said not to go with HE - this is a new thing for people since the BRN BB's came out and it is NOT something to do all the time in other nations - if you aren't in a BRN BB or the T4 IJN Premium BB save the HE for very specific circumstances  - it is NOT your best weapon - AP is) and get into the 10-14km rnge and then close in when opportunity presents itself. 

Edited by AdmiralThunder

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My mileage varies. I generally find Bayern to be very tanky, but I usually try to stay at 10-15km. The turrets are very slow for point blank brawling.  There arent many BBs that worry me. Only Warspite, Mutsu, and another Bayern can overmatch my bow in the tier, but I dont usually sit straight on either. I try to take incoming fire into my belt, or avoid them entirely. Because the guns are so slow I tend to fire them in front and rear pairs, with a lot of maneuvering in between. The other day I fought a delaying action against 6 ships, 3 BBs and 3 CA/CL ranging from T5 to T7. I knew I couldn't kill them all but I knew I could tank them all for several minutes and keep them busy long enough that hopefully my team could take the other 2 points and come give me back up. Sure enough they played well and came to my aid several minutes later. I did make a mistake and showed too much broadside to the Colorado which resulted in taking some big damage but other than that Bayern held up really well. 

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On 29.1.2018 at 11:29 PM, Aristotle83 said:

Despite how many people will tell you Bayern's a "brawler", she just isn't. Don't know why people keep advice that is liable to keep getting ships sunk and games lost. I mean her range is pretty bad so I guess she's not a sniper either but this ship just can't take brawls. Pretty low HP pool, little higher than the Iron Duke but still pretty low compared to everything else at this tier. If this ship is a brawler it's much less so of one than the previous German BB's(Kaiser,Konig Albert and Konig I agree with the consensus here). She's got real good power and accuracy but what good is that if you can't take damage? 

A lot of the traits previous German BB's had which made them good brawlers are gone for the Bayern, (relatively)good HP pool, gone at both "top" and stock, lowest in the tier, ROF advantage gone, you've got 30 seconds. While this is an advantage/equal with all but 2 of the T6 BB's, T7 and T8 are a very different story and you're going to be matched up with them too. Even when you get the T5's this isn't an advantage really. 

The Bayern's main strengths are dispersion, it's guns and it's speed.It has the best dispersion of any tech tree T6, second most overall and is still has an advantage over the lesser T7's(USA and Japanese) as well. While range stops you from "sniping" from this ship, I'd say it's best in the 10 and 15 km range and not much closer. With it's guns, a considerable upgrade from the old German BB's. In terms of AP, only the UK BB's and Mutsu are better and Mutsu belongs at T7 and the QE has got those slow turrets. Also Bayern's HE  also has the same fire chance virtually as a QE/Warspite about as good as Dunkerque. These guns are more powerful than a good chunk of T7 too(including the new French one). In terms of speed Bayern is the fastest T6 tech tree BB(for now, apparently speed is going to be the French BB's "thing"), though all the premiums are faster. Kaiser was way better in terms of speed relative to tier though. 

So this ship is accurate, pretty fast and powerful. While it's range makes it clear it's not a sniper, it's not a brawler either. I mean it can certainly dish it out, but it's really vulnerable. It's dispersion is best used at something of a distance as that'll be your biggest advantage. Whatever works best for you, is what you should do. If you can make Bayern work as a brawler, that's wonderful for you, it's just that I agree that this ship is terrible at taking punishment and I keep hearing people say that certain German BB's are brawlers, while for me the ship's great at distance but terrible in close combat. The more and more posts I read about people frustrated following that advice makes me eager to advise them to try sniping or avoiding damage. Maybe there's a magic way to play vulnerable German BB's(mainly talking Bayern and Tirpitz) that is much more efficient than brawling(I'm skeptical), but if shooting from a distance works for you and results in good games, is it worth it to keep trying to do it the other way? But to all those who insist Germans are brawlers, how exactly do you get around simply not having armor? Cause I get trying to avoid stupid deaths and traps from DD's and stuff but in a brawl where you are supposed to take sustained BB damage how do you get around bad armor? 

I want to add that I believe Bayern is the best T6 tech tree ship and while it's bad at taking damage, it's a  good ship and would be "OP", if it weren't for the premiums(two of which I think belong at T7). Just avoid getting hit. 

 

Dude I stopped reading at “Bayern’s strength is her dispersion”... are you aware that the dispersion formula is a line trait and not ship specific? Vertical dispersion also depends on shell velocity btw (due to the arc) - the only ship specific accuracy parameter is more or less the Sigma value which is 1.8 for all German BBs. Furthermore the German BB dispersion pattern is bad at long range and encourages short range engagements - the IJN BB pattern is the opposite.

The big difference however is how many shells you have in the air - the more the better and this’ll create a different perception on your end.

So just NO - Bayern‘s dispersion is bad and 8 guns only means you painfully feel it. 

Bayerns strengths are rather:

- turtleback (no citadel hits)

- good AP

- manouverable & reasonably nimble 

She feels best in a 1-on-1 brawl in late game:

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10 hours ago, lron_Dog_of_Jutland said:

 

Dude I stopped reading at “Bayern’s strength is her dispersion”... are you aware that the dispersion formula is a line trait and not ship specific? Vertical dispersion also depends on shell velocity btw (due to the arc) - the only ship specific accuracy parameter is more or less the Sigma value which is 1.8 for all German BBs. Furthermore the German BB dispersion pattern is bad at long range and encourages short range engagements - the IJN BB pattern is the opposite.

The big difference however is how many shells you have in the air - the more the better and this’ll create a different perception on your end.

So just NO - Bayern‘s dispersion is bad and 8 guns only means you painfully feel it. 

Bayerns strengths are rather:

- turtleback (no citadel hits)

- good AP

- manouverable & reasonably nimble 

She feels best in a 1-on-1 brawl in late game:

Her volley casts a pretty wide net. Also I've played a few games in her and that's the first thing that really sticks out, how accurate she is even if you're making bad/low probability shots.  Bayern actually can't shoot at long range so what if you're saying is true it's kind of irrelevant. Her max range is just over 15 km, she's hardly capable of sniping, 10-15 is the sweet spot IMO. Bayern's got the same 8 guns setup that many ships in this game have, though yes, most T6 ships will have more than 8 guns. More the reason to not get into close range brawls with them. 

Late game might be a different story with brawling cause you have to fight only one ship but when multiple ships can hit you, Bayern is pretty cruiser like in terms of getting hit, and the OP's story shows I'm not the only one who thinks that. I haven't played her in a while so i don't recall whether I was getting citadel'd often or not but I do remember her being very paper mache in regards to getting shot. Some German ships are true brawlers like the Kaiser class or even Konig but Bayern isn't the Kaiser she isn't a tank. 

She is quite maneuverable. She reminds me of a smaller battlecruiser much more than most of the WWI BB's both for all the good and bad things that entails. She's fast, powerful and unlike the Hood isn't 800 feet long but she also really can't take a punch. She's light and small for a BB of the era(less than 600 feet still) and this comes with advantages and disadvantages. 

Regardless of this I still agree with Admiral Thunderer, she's the best tech tree ship at the tier. I think that how meaningful that  achievement is though is muddied by the quality premium foursome walking around at T6.    

Edited by Aristotle83

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