Cesare vs Roma

[Ace_04]

So now that Roma has been released to the public for a few days now, the reviews are starting to pour in and they seem to be mixed at best.  Her dispersion seems to be the biggest gripe from what I have heard/read.

With that being said, is there any reason to really buy Roma when the potentially overpowered Giulio Cesare exists?  With her supposedly unreliable guns, it would be tough to see her de-throne North Carolina, Alabama, or Amagi in any competitive meta, while her use as a captain trainer for the future Italian BB line is negligible when I already have Cesare in port (yes, I know T8's make better trainers than T5's, but for fun factor alone Cesare is pretty hard to beat).

So, is there any convincing (and logical) argument to pick Roma over Cesare?

[IronMike11B4O]

No none what so ever. If you wanted to play against tier 8's take out your tier 10. With the state of MM there is 100% zero reason to get a tier 8 premium. The GC is much more competitive at tier 5 as it has tier 10 Cruiser turret rotation and god tier Dispersion. GC is a stud Roma is a dud.

[Ghostdog1355]

2 minutes ago, IronMike11B4O said:

GC is a stud

I second this. One fine, beautiful, powerful ship. Love it.

[Jonesyrules15]

I like the Roma.  I think what is different about her right now is that everyone is so used to a premium being noticeably better than tech tree ships.   

[NCC81701]

18 minutes ago, Ace_04 said:

So, is there any convincing (and logical) argument to pick Roma over Cesare?

Better credit/XP income at tier 8, farm both ships to train captain on X2 and X3 XP days; Also, why not both?

[Ace_04]

9 minutes ago, Jonesyrules15 said:

I like the Roma.  I think what is different about her right now is that everyone is so used to a premium being noticeably better than tech tree ships.   

Good point.  It's actually refreshing to see a premium released that is flawed yet competitive, than flagrantly overpowered just to appeal to the masses or a mythical legendary status.

[Ace_04]

1 minute ago, NCC81701 said:

Better credit/XP income at tier 8; Also, why not both?

Because at T8, I already have a glutton of excellent battleships that I doubt she would take the preference over.

[Stauffenberg44]

I got both but then I am a history-minded collector. Roma is the Regia Marina's Hood, a lovely unique ship that met a tragic end.

The Giulio Cesare is clearly the better choice if it is either-or, but the Roma is a beautiful ship and presents her own challenges to play well. LWM's "Gudbote" appraisal rings true to me after a few battles in her. The dispersion just may be buffed, too soon to say.

[NCC81701]

Roma is just good, not OP like GC and I just find it fun due to the great gun handling. I don't mind more T8 Prem BB since I like variety. If you are looking for only logical reasons why you should get one over the other; then really it's only credit/XP earnings and playing at tier 8.  Outside of logical reasons; it's fun, it's italian, it's a beautiful ship; at this point public opinion can't give you a "right" answer on whether you should or shouldn't get the Roma. 

[Jonesyrules15]

Just now, Ace_04 said:

Good point.  It's actually refreshing to see a premium released that is flawed yet competitive, than flagrantly overpowered just to appeal to the masses or a mythical legendary status.

Agreed.  My very first salvo in the Roma took 21K off a tirpitz.  I did 115K and sunk 4.  I should have gotten a Kraken but the shell performance caused me to overpen a cruiser down to 51 HP.  A couple of times I have had 30K plus stripped from me because I was showing to much flat broadside.

 

In my tirpitz I hit one for 3 cits and 43K.

 

My stats in her so far

6 battles

66% WR

80,760 AVG Damage

2.0 K/D

Survival 17% (I expect this to go up once I get my captain skills up)

[Xlap]

I have both Roma and GC, both are good ships, they are also beautiful ships to look at.

 

But tier for tier GC is much better. But to be honest GC is a border line OP ship. Roma is a more balanced ship. 

[BOOMER_USA]

I like Roma, with her armor scheme you can trade really well in 1v1s.  I'm hoping they'll bring her Sigma back to 1.9, I think it would go a long way to make all of her gunnery characteristics balanced.

 

 

Ultimately, if you want an Italian premium battleship, just get the Giulio.

[Lert]

Tier for tier Cesare is the better ship, but Roma is worth it as well. Get Roma if you:

- Want credits, a T8 prem makes more than a T5 one

- Like the ship because of its history / design

- Want high velocity 15s

[Dr_Venture]

Cesare set an unrealistic expectation for Roma and frankly i think that is where the hate comes from. Roma is VERY rare to see apparently, not nearly as much as the Scharnpocolypse or Tirpitland uber alles. Roma is very hard to make work for the average player and it requires many games to get an idea of how she handles. If anything people should buy Roma if they want a challenge, if they want to keep their skills sharp. She as no gimmicks to keep her alive, the skill ceiling for her is very high...but when handled right she can dominate. 

[EyelessCr0w]

I must be playing the GC wrong. I absolutely suck with that ship. My barrels seem to be made of rubber too judging how my dispersion is

[HazeGrayUnderway]

Roma is alright, but tier for tier, Caesar is superior.  The threats Roma faces are considerably stronger than the trash that populates and encircles Caesar.

 

Threats Caesar faces:  New York, Omaha, Kirov, Aoba, Emerald .  Lots of trash concealment DDs, trash concealment Cruisers with even more trash armor and citadel protection on said Cruisers.  Lots of Cruisers with trash guns and trash gun ranges.

 

Threats Roma faces:  Musashi, Yamato, Enterprise, Taiho, Shokaku, Hakuryu, Missouri, Montana, GK, etc.  Roma faces tons of DDs with 5.8km or so stealth and far more dangerous torpedoes.  PADD torpedoes are at their deadliest with Chung Mu and Yueyang.  The Cruisers are very dangerous, Roon, Hindenburg, Charles Martel, Saint-Louis, Zao, Des Moines, Moskva.  A number of said Cruisers can face tank 15" AP with no problems.  Many of these higher tiered Cruisers can work you over at long range.

 

Not only is Caesar a good BB for her tier, but she is just surrounded by so many trash ships.  Roma faces nothing but the very best ships.  Even the Tier VIII BB competition is extremely fierce.  Amagi, NC, Alabama, Tirpitz, Bismarck.  Kii is doing very well.  In Tier VIII BBs alone, those are amazing ships.  What does Caesar face among Tier V BBs?  New York? 

[Veasel]

35 minutes ago, Dr_Venture said:

Cesare set an unrealistic expectation for Roma and frankly i think that is where the hate comes from. Roma is VERY rare to see apparently, not nearly as much as the Scharnpocolypse or Tirpitland uber alles. Roma is very hard to make work for the average player and it requires many games to get an idea of how she handles. If anything people should buy Roma if they want a challenge, if they want to keep their skills sharp. She as no gimmicks to keep her alive, the skill ceiling for her is very high...but when handled right she can dominate. 

I won the Cesare in a Super Container recently, only got around to playing her this weekend, holy jebus that ship is disgusting at T5 - I think I got 4 High Caliber in 20 games, and I'm a pretty mediocre BB driver.    When your happy to be facing Scharnhorst in a T5 you know there's issues with balance.

I think I'll pick up the Roma for the exact reason you mentioned, I've getting pretty sick of the community bagging on the "underpowered" premiums.

They can always buff the Roma in the future but now we're stuck with a battleship with RADAR, a cruiser with RADAR and  smoke, and a T9 battleship with 18.1" guns and a 30 second reload at T9, and I'm getting pretty sick of it.

And I'll openly admit I play both my Belfast and Missouri regularly, because in the end I want to help my team, and when there's 4 Mo's on the other side what do you do? 

Like Nuclear Weapons, once they're out there it's too late.

[Veasel]

3 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Roma is alright, but tier for tier, Caesar is superior.  The threats Roma faces are considerably stronger than the trash that populates and encircles Caesar.

Caesar would easily fit into T6.   The thing that really impressed me about the ship was the pen on the 320s, they're vastly better than there low calibre would indicate, they easily citadel the USN Standards.

[SavageTactical]

10 minutes ago, Veasel said:

When your happy to be facing Scharnhorst in a T5 you know there's issues with balance.

I don’t know man. I don’t own a GC, but I’ve faced enough to not really fear one in my Scharnhorst...or my DOY. Granted, not really keen on facing one in my Texas.

[Veasel]

11 minutes ago, SavageTactical said:

I don’t know man. I don’t own a GC, but I’ve faced enough to not really fear one in my Scharnhorst...or my DOY. Granted, not really keen on facing one in my Texas.

I'm not saying you can 1v1 a T7 BB, but your not getting absolute wrecked in it like you would in a New York.  

Unlike the other T5 BBs, she's actually fairly comfortable to play in a T7 match.

[HazeGrayUnderway]

1 minute ago, Veasel said:

I'm not saying you can 1v1 a T7 BB, but your not getting absolute wrecked in it like you would in a New York.

Unlike the other T5 BBs, she's actually fairly comfortable to play in a T7 match, especially since the 320s absolutely wreck the more heavily armoured T7 cruisers (Less overpens MOAR citadels.)

Unlike NY, Caesar can run away and hide and fight later against the Tier VII BBs.  Kongo can run good also but she has IJN BB stealth.

[SavageTactical]

11 minutes ago, Veasel said:

I'm not saying you can 1v1 a T7 BB, but your not getting absolute wrecked in it like you would in a New York.

Unlike the other T5 BBs, she's actually fairly comfortable to play in a T7 match, especially since the 320s absolutely wreck the more heavily armoured T7 cruisers (Less overpens MOAR citadels.)

Fair point. Can’t deny her cruiser killing ability. She preys on them.

[Veasel]

11 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

Unlike NY, Caesar can run away and hide and fight later against the Tier VII BBs.  Kongo can run good also but she has IJN BB stealth.

Kongo also has a massive easily punished citadel, a actually dev striked one in a the Caesre 100-0 at about 10km. 

Just like the New York, Kongo is showing her age - I hope they revisit them soon.

[Battlecruiser_Siegfried]

I like my GC; I like my Roma more. 

GC is like a battleship version of Molotov - a fast, maneuverable ship with laser guns.

Roma is more like a Hood merged with a Bismarck (minus the good secondaries) - a big, long, sleek, very fast battleship with meh guns but trollish bow tanking.

Roma isn't OP, but I think people are expecting way too much from her, which is where the letdown comes in. I 3-citadel one-shotted a Charles Martel through the stern with it from 16km out last light, and it was one of the more satisfying salvos I think I've ever fired in this game. The ship isn't for anyone, but, interestingly enough, neither is GC. 

[VVoony]

While I own Cesare, I've yet to play a game in her..

So I don't know how the Cesare is but I got my Roma yesterday and I love it.

It's not OP but it's one of the better tier 8 battleships.

and it is indeed a good looking ship(but so is the GC)

If you want a fun, good performing tier 8 battleship it's the Roma.

Yes I prefer Alabama over Roma for the performance but Roma is more fun with faster shell and turret traverse.

Plus Roma makes much more credit with Kobayashi Camo.