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Just thought I'd share with you guys a really good battle I had in the Alabama.  It starts off ROUGH and then gets salvaged into a great battle till the very end!
 

 

I hope you guys enjoy!

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Nice.

Most o9f the times I've 'given up' though have been because my team was so abysmally bad it just sucked the energy and will to fight right out of me.

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1 hour ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

Nice.

Most o9f the times I've 'given up' though have been because my team was so abysmally bad it just sucked the energy and will to fight right out of me.

I'm always amazed at how much energy it sucks out of you to force yourself to play to the bitter end and last HP because it's so easy to give up.  What I've found is that the chances of winning INCREASE the harder I fight to stay in the fight.  Now if only I could motivate myself to operate at that level 100% of the time! :)

 

This is by no means the only battle this has happened in either!  I've had a few battles in the Kidd during Ranked play that have ended very similarly!

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2 minutes ago, UrPeaceKeeper said:

I'm always amazed at how much energy it sucks out of you to force yourself to play to the bitter end and last HP because it's so easy to give up.  What I've found is that the chances of winning INCREASE the harder I fight to stay in the fight.  Now if only I could motivate myself to operate at that level 100% of the time! :)

 

This is by no means the only battle this has happened in either!  I've had a few battles in the Kidd during Ranked play that have ended very similarly!

My games tend to go the opposite.  We get off to a good start, we're way ahead, I work on finishing off a flank, and next thing I know I look up and we're down 300 points and/or being capped with nobody near the base.  Or I hear those wonderful words, "Our team depends on YOU!"

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7 minutes ago, Harv72b said:

My games tend to go the opposite.  We get off to a good start, we're way ahead, I work on finishing off a flank, and next thing I know I look up and we're down 300 points and/or being capped with nobody near the base.  Or I hear those wonderful words, "Our team depends on YOU!"

 

This made me literally laugh out loud.

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5 minutes ago, Harv72b said:

My games tend to go the opposite.  We get off to a good start, we're way ahead, I work on finishing off a flank, and next thing I know I look up and we're down 300 points and/or being capped with nobody near the base.  Or I hear those wonderful words, "Our team depends on YOU!"

I'm also finding myself looking more and more at the minimap to determine how the game is or isn't progressing.  If I see a flank that is obviously failing, I'll dump my flank to try and get back to our cap in Standard Battles or position myself to support that other falling flank if it's a Domination mode.  IIRC, I had a video on the importance of situational awareness in game and how a little bit of in game knowledge can be used to put an end to some enemy pushes by taking out or panicking a key ship in the enemy force (like an advancing BB).

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Basing your future actions upon the statistical anomaly is guaranteed to lead to ruin.

 

It's colloquially known as the "gamblers folly"

 

Sure, you might win big this time, but in the end the house always wins.  The only way to avoid eating crapmore often than not is to know when to cut your losses because the odds just aren't favorable enough to justify continuing.

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1 hour ago, UrPeaceKeeper said:

I'm always amazed at how much energy it sucks out of you to force yourself to play to the bitter end and last HP because it's so easy to give up.  What I've found is that the chances of winning INCREASE the harder I fight to stay in the fight.  Now if only I could motivate myself to operate at that level 100% of the time! :)

 

This is by no means the only battle this has happened in either!  I've had a few battles in the Kidd during Ranked play that have ended very similarly!

It can go both ways.  I agree that in some fight to the bitter end battles, you can feel extremely drained after the battle.  But I think that that's usually a case of coming down off of an adrenaline rush.

But I've also experienced what Prophet mentioned, i.e. how an extremely terrible or stupid team can just suck all the desire to play right out of me.  It's not really that it sucks the energy out.  It's very much the desire to play that just drains away, almost like someone flushed it down the toilet.  It's there one moment and gone the next. 

And I have to say that the two maps most likely to have this happen to me are Strait and Two Brothers.  Strait, because there's some morons who abandon their side of the map, particularly without saying a god damned bloody word.  And Two Brothers because you get a bunch of selfish morons who decide that they ... THEY ... want to have "fun" (at their rest of their team's chances of winning) and charge up the middle.   Both are incredibly stupid and selfish.

I would love to see changes to these two maps to prevent these things from occurring. 

Strait would seem to be fairly easy to fix in this regard.  Spawn the two teams in the NE and SW, just like they were during season 7 of ranked on this map.  

Two Brothers would be far more difficult, I'm thinking.   Barring removing the channel entirely (in which case, you only have One Brother), or finding a way to keep it, but make it impossible to sail through (to preserve the map name's logic), I don't see what one could do.  Oh, I suppose that the teams could be spawned in the NE/SW or NW/SE and not have the channel directly in front of each team's spawn, though I really don't know what impact such a change would make.  

The thing is for me, those 2 maps are, when no one does this stupid stuff, pretty good maps.  But when people do those amazingly stupid near guaranteed game losing things, it just ruins the entire battle because it sucks the desire to keep playing right out of me.

 

 

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2 hours ago, UrPeaceKeeper said:

I'm also finding myself looking more and more at the minimap to determine how the game is or isn't progressing.

Ah yes, see, you are a cheater.  Using the minimap is unfair.  Apparently, only a few hundred players on the NA server have access to it, from what I have experienced.

Quit using unfair advantages, you hack.

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1 hour ago, Shadeylark said:

Basing your future actions upon the statistical anomaly is guaranteed to lead to ruin.

 

It's colloquially known as the "gamblers folly"

 

Sure, you might win big this time, but in the end the house always wins.  The only way to avoid eating crapmore often than not is to know when to cut your losses because the odds just aren't favorable enough to justify continuing.

Since this is a game with no real loss on my behalf, I'll continue fighting until the bitter end, always, because there is literally zero risk in this case.  If I was actually going to lose something of value (say the ship from my port) then maybe I'd be more cautious but since silver is in ready supply (over 100 million and rising) there is little reason to worry! :)

54 minutes ago, Crucis said:

It can go both ways.  I agree that in some fight to the bitter end battles, you can feel extremely drained after the battle.  But I think that that's usually a case of coming down off of an adrenaline rush.

But I've also experienced what Prophet mentioned, i.e. how an extremely terrible or stupid team can just suck all the desire to play right out of me.  It's not really that it sucks the energy out.  It's very much the desire to play that just drains away, almost like someone flushed it down the toilet.  It's there one moment and gone the next. 

And I have to say that the two maps most likely to have this happen to me are Strait and Two Brothers.  Strait, because there's some morons who abandon their side of the map, particularly without saying a god damned bloody word.  And Two Brothers because you get a bunch of selfish morons who decide that they ... THEY ... want to have "fun" (at their rest of their team's chances of winning) and charge up the middle.   Both are incredibly stupid and selfish.

I would love to see changes to these two maps to prevent these things from occurring. 

Strait would seem to be fairly easy to fix in this regard.  Spawn the two teams in the NE and SW, just like they were during season 7 of ranked on this map.  

Two Brothers would be far more difficult, I'm thinking.   Barring removing the channel entirely (in which case, you only have One Brother), or finding a way to keep it, but make it impossible to sail through (to preserve the map name's logic), I don't see what one could do.  Oh, I suppose that the teams could be spawned in the NE/SW or NW/SE and not have the channel directly in front of each team's spawn, though I really don't know what impact such a change would make.  

The thing is for me, those 2 maps are, when no one does this stupid stuff, pretty good maps.  But when people do those amazingly stupid near guaranteed game losing things, it just ruins the entire battle because it sucks the desire to keep playing right out of me.

 

 

Valid points.  Like I said, it requires the player to commit to channeling their inner Fubuki-chan and doing their best, always, regardless of their HP pool.  The premise of the video was to show how being in the right place at the right time and trusting your skills can yield amazing results!  That's not to say it will happen ALL the time, but it can definitely teach you A LOT about the ship you are playing to play where the risks are very high to achieve the reward. 

As for Strait, that map could seriously just be turned 90º (caps too) and it'd be a better map.  Basically a smaller version of North.  Maybe remove some of the islands on the ends so that they are a little bit more open and it'd be a fun map.  It's a decent map now, but it promotes a very lazy and campy play style that I dislike.  It's one of my less favorite maps in the game.  Two Brothers is just silly... the two biggest errors I've seen there is the lemming train to one side (always fails, especially in domination) and when the team doesn't lemming train, the half that isn't doing as well just YOLOing into the enemy rather than kiting them around the island and delaying their advance until your stronger side can flank the enemy.

2 minutes ago, desmo_2 said:

Ah yes, see, you are a cheater.  Using the minimap is unfair.  Apparently, only a few hundred players on the NA server have access to it, from what I have experienced.

Quit using unfair advantages, you hack.

!!!!  I also use WASD Hacks and Situational Awareness Hacks! =O  WG is going to ban me!

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Nice game. I myself have had a few games like this. It's better to press on, than to give-up.

~Hunter

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1 hour ago, UrPeaceKeeper said:

 

Valid points.  Like I said, it requires the player to commit to channeling their inner Fubuki-chan and doing their best, always, regardless of their HP pool.  The premise of the video was to show how being in the right place at the right time and trusting your skills can yield amazing results!  That's not to say it will happen ALL the time, but it can definitely teach you A LOT about the ship you are playing to play where the risks are very high to achieve the reward. 

As for Strait, that map could seriously just be turned 90º (caps too) and it'd be a better map.  Basically a smaller version of North.  Maybe remove some of the islands on the ends so that they are a little bit more open and it'd be a fun map.  It's a decent map now, but it promotes a very lazy and campy play style that I dislike.  It's one of my less favorite maps in the game.  Two Brothers is just silly... the two biggest errors I've seen there is the lemming train to one side (always fails, especially in domination) and when the team doesn't lemming train, the half that isn't doing as well just YOLOing into the enemy rather than kiting them around the island and delaying their advance until your stronger side can flank the enemy.

By paragraphs...

 

1. When I'm in a battle where I'm fully engaged, I absolutely fight to the last HP.  Unlike some players (seemingly), I work hard to preserve my HP, whether it's be seriously aggressive defensive maneuvering when playing cruisers or gunboat DDs, or when in stealthy ninja torp boat DDs, having the presence of mind to not get too close and knowing when to turn away and break off to stay undetected.  Or in BBs, working your armor and angling your ship to maximize the number of bounces, etc.

 

2.  As for Strait, if you remember the set up on Strait during season 7 of Ranked, that was a great layout.  Spawn the teams in the NE and SW corners.  Have the spawning ships spawn with their bows aimed at the very center of the map, so that they could choose between turning towards the nearby channel to head (north/south) or turn towards the middle of their side of the map to defend.  This map could even support a single cap Encounter or Epicenter mode in this layout.  Or a Standard mode with the caps around where the current domination A and C caps are.

One change that I'd make to Strait would be to either get rid of the gap between the center and  east channels.  Or alternatively tweak the islands between the west and center channels so that it also had a gap.    IMO, this gap only existing on one side is a bit unfair, though it can be a double  edged sword.  In standard mode in a battle with CVs, a ballsey west spawning DD can try to sneak through that gap and try to ambush the east spawning team's CV.  It's not so doable in domination mode because (a) most teams tend to have at least 1 DD heading into the B cap and (b) the very existence of the B cap means that you can't really sneak over to the gap without letting people know that a DD is on B cap, even if you're unspotted.

As for Two Brothers, I don't know what one does to stop people from yoloing middle, short of removing the channel, like I said before.  And as for lemming trains, that's a problem too, but that's even more difficult to counter, because how do you ever stop lemming trains, regardless of the map?  Some people are just herd animals at heart and want to follow the herd.

But here's one random idea that might ... might ... help.  Rather than spawning all of a team's ships directly behind the main 2 islands, as is the case now, why not split the team into two groups.  And spawn one group in the west and the other in the east.  That is, the north team would spawn NW and NE, while the south team would spawn SW and SE.  And no ships spawning behind the main 2 islands.  This would mean that there were no ships really close to the middle channel.  And it should limit the number of ships that do the really dumb thing of spawning on the left most side of the current spawn formation and deciding that they'd rather go to the right side of the map, rather than staying on the side of the map they spawned on.  I don't know if this would help, but it might be worth a try.

 

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5 hours ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

Nice.

Most o9f the times I've 'given up' though have been because my team was so abysmally bad it just sucked the energy and will to fight right out of me.

Doesn't really happen to me - I'll drag the match out to the last second trying to kill one more red, and playing like the game isn't hopeless.  That is, trying to kite and ambush or set fires. 

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Had one of the most enjoyable games ever last night.  In an Orion we were down 850-439 and they held 2 of 3 caps.  Our team was dying rapidly but the Guilio and I buckled down and we brought it back to a win.  The results were most gratifying.  A win, Kraken, Fireproof and Confederate with 95K damage as bottom tier.

 

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Nukelavee45 said:

Doesn't really happen to me - I'll drag the match out to the last second trying to kill one more red, and playing like the game isn't hopeless.  That is, trying to kite and ambush or set fires. 

Generally; what many people seem to say.

Grinding higher in the trees, (I couldn't care less about reaching the tier ten ships; the reasons for which are their own story...) and collecting credits/fxp aren't motivators for me; (not when I have comfortable levels of both already, and little reason to spend them)

Fight and die; run off and hide...

...either one works for me.

Edited by Estimated_Prophet

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10 hours ago, UrPeaceKeeper said:

I'm also finding myself looking more and more at the minimap to determine how the game is or isn't progressing.  If I see a flank that is obviously failing, I'll dump my flank to try and get back to our cap in Standard Battles or position myself to support that other falling flank if it's a Domination mode.  IIRC, I had a video on the importance of situational awareness in game and how a little bit of in game knowledge can be used to put an end to some enemy pushes by taking out or panicking a key ship in the enemy force (like an advancing BB).

I know, I know...it's just that even after more than 3,000 randoms I still suffer from noob tendencies like expecting my teammates to at least break even with an 8:4 ship advantage on the other side of the map, and/or to react to the enemy DD that's capping us 8km away from them and 20km away from me. :Smile_amazed:

Selective memory, etc...if there's one thing we all should have learned from the WoWs community as a whole it's that any ills which befall the team were clearly someone else's fault. :Smile-_tongue:

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2 hours ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

Generally; what many people seem to say.

Grinding higher in the trees, (I couldn't care less about reaching the tier ten ships; the reasons for which are their own story...) and collecting credits/fxp aren't motivators for me; (not when I have comfortable levels of both already, and little reason to spend them)

Fight and die; run off and hide...

...either one works for me.

Well, I don't really grind for any particular goal, I just buy a ship when I have the xp requirement done, silver isn't an issue for me, either.  I generally sit at about 100 million or so.  I sometimes forget that I even own some ships -Hindenburg sat for a couple months before I bothered to play it.

I play because I enjoy the game, at any tier.  While I do play to win, so long as I'm happy with the play I got, as well as my playing, I'm happy.  

It's the same attitude I had doing pvp in WoW, with my warlock (affliction) until WoD dropped.  that toon was fun to play no matter what, and just because my team was being apathetic, didn't mean I wasn't going  try and kill everything on the map until the game ended.

On a tangent, for those who used to or do play WoW, damn, but  I used to have fun in AV on lost cause matches.  I'd camp the General and stall teh Alliance push forever with fear bombs to trigger a pull.  Good times.

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14 hours ago, UrPeaceKeeper said:

Since this is a game with no real loss on my behalf, I'll continue fighting until the bitter end, always, because there is literally zero risk in this case.  If I was actually going to lose something of value (say the ship from my port) then maybe I'd be more cautious but since silver is in ready supply (over 100 million and rising) there is little reason to worry! :)

i don't know bout you, but i count my time as valuable... not going to waste it with a pack of incompetents that will do nothing but frustrate and annoy me with their blatant and unforgivable stupidity.

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2 hours ago, Shadeylark said:

i don't know bout you, but i count my time as valuable... not going to waste it with a pack of incompetents that will do nothing but frustrate and annoy me with their blatant and unforgivable stupidity.

My time is also valuable, but using it in game is a valuable use of my time, even if it's dealing with a "pack of incompetents that will do nothing but frustrate and annoy me".  Furthermore, maybe some of those packs of incompetents will actually pay attention to what I'm doing and improve their game play so that the community as a whole gets better at the game and I have to deal with less of them.  Kind of the premise of my YT channel you know! ;)

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14 minutes ago, UrPeaceKeeper said:

My time is also valuable, but using it in game is a valuable use of my time, even if it's dealing with a "pack of incompetents that will do nothing but frustrate and annoy me".  Furthermore, maybe some of those packs of incompetents will actually pay attention to what I'm doing and improve their game play so that the community as a whole gets better at the game and I have to deal with less of them.  Kind of the premise of my YT channel you know! ;)

You have more faith than I in the willingness to improve among the unwashed masses.

 

I've found that I'm more likely to hear "[edited] you!  I play for fun!" Than anything resembling a "good idea, lemme try that instead" (Fun being code for, I play how I want, no matter how poor the results) 

 

Can't fix stupid and it's not worth my time to try, nor is it worth my time to put up with it, and it certainly isn't worth my time to try and carry it.

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9 minutes ago, Shadeylark said:

You have more faith than I in the willingness to improve among the unwashed masses.

 

I've found that I'm more likely to hear "[edited] you!  I play for fun!" Than anything resembling a "good idea, lemme try that instead" (Fun being code for, I play how I want, no matter how poor the results) 

 

Can't fix stupid and it's not worth my time to try, nor is it worth my time to put up with it, and it certainly isn't worth my time to try and carry it.

Then why do you play the game?  Lets face it, you aren't going to get rid of those types of players, ever, so why bother wasting your time playing the game?  Ohh that's right, because you enjoy it! :)  I suspect a large part of the reason why you get the obligatory "**** you!" is probably more due to the tone of the message you are sending than the actual content of said message.  

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1 hour ago, UrPeaceKeeper said:

Then why do you play the game?  Lets face it, you aren't going to get rid of those types of players, ever, so why bother wasting your time playing the game?  Ohh that's right, because you enjoy it! :)  I suspect a large part of the reason why you get the obligatory "**** you!" is probably more due to the tone of the message you are sending than the actual content of said message.  

Because when it is a quality match between evenly matched teams it's enjoyable, even in a loss.

 

And yes, tone is likely to play a part in the response, but then again, I have a very low tolerance for suffering fools, and I'm aware of that so I've come to peace with it.  As far as I'm concerned, if someone's tone is reason enough for you to ignore good advice, you're already a lost cause in my eyes; it's the content of the message that matters, not how the message is delivered, those who feel otherwise are doomed to mediocrity at best and aren't people I wish to associate with.  As I've said many times, Its better to associate with a toxic but competent [edited] than a nice but incompetent carebear.

Edited by Shadeylark

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