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Sventex

Debunking Flamu's Garbage Dunkerque Advice

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Sventex    931
9 minutes ago, Arlios said:

The problem here is dunkerque is a poor fighter against bbs of her tier or higher, she stands a better chance against lower tier bbs. More often than not the dunkerque will run into a bb that will overmatch the bow, the average brit bb spams HE anyways so we can rule them out for firing ap, which their HE ignores bow armour because 1/4 memes.

When overmatched going for autobounce on the side armour helps prevent citadel damage at short ranges, similar to cruisers, you slightly angle your citadel front which decreases the chances of a bow on citadel and it's a slightly smaller target to hit.

Her accuracy is pretty dubious. With a below average sigma and large dispersion radius, it makes getting closer a preferred tactic, but that is contradicted by her huge detection range and lack of toughness the other battleships have and they are all much more accurate.

Cruisers and dds won't fire ap into any battleship unless they have a broadside or they have ascended potato, unless it's a brit cruiser. Why you're including them I don't even know why.

If I had to pick between any tier 6 premium battleship to buy, Dunkerque will be the last ship I consider, there way better tier 6 premium battleships ships for her price. Even Mutsu is mediocre but I find her better than the dunkeroo. 

As I advise with the Dunkerque, getting in close is for the endgame, staying back is for the higher tier Battleships to wear themselves out against each other, so that you can later go forward for the kill and knock them out like dominoes.  The Dunkerque isn't a sniper, but there's strategy involved by becoming one early in the match.  Even if fewer shells hit the target at long range, your still setting fires, disrupting ships from capping.

Even Cruiser and DD HE rounds will shatter against the bow, and RN cruisers don't even have the HE option, which means the Dunkerque is bow-tanking these ships.  Even if they are trying to start fires, they can only target the forward two sections of the ship, meaning you'll at most only experience 2 fires.  In the endgame, when a cruiser or DD has to defend a cap, they'll get eaten alive by the Dunkerque's bow-tanking abilities.

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23 minutes ago, Sventex said:

Stat padding doesn't make terrible advice magically good either.

To offer a serious opinion on the topic, I don't think Flamu is totally wrong, and if that works for him, great. However, not all of us (myself included) don't quite have the situational awareness or skills to make some of the things he does work (trust me, I've tried :Smile_sceptic:).

The problem here is that both of you can't seem to realize that different people play things different ways, and that you need to adjust strategies to different situations. Stats are relevant in whether you should trust an opinion. However stat-shaming adds nothing to the discussion but to make yourself look insecure.

25 minutes ago, Wulfgarn said:

As far as stat shaming goes... It's been said that if everyone ridiculed fat ppl  publicly, obesity would disappear.

Simmer down Snowflake..

You must be fun at parties. "It's been said" =/= truth. It might, or might just result in a higher public fight/murder rate. We don't know, because we're a civilized society who don't believe in such archaic measures anymore.

Also, your use of snowflake makes you, well, someone who probably believes in a 'WarshipsYesterday' alt-stats website.

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Wulfgarn    2,085
22 minutes ago, RivertheRoyal said:

I don't think stat shaming and obesity are related—even in the context you're trying to spin. 

 

For one, there will always be terrible players. It's a fact of life. Someone has to be at the bottom of the heap. 

Now, I'm all for helping those guys improve. But shaming them about being at the bottom of the heap makes about as much sense as insulting your server at a restaurant for working a low end job. It's just not productive, and often leads to spit in your food. I don't know about you, but I like my food spit free, and my games free of toxic crap like stat shaming and the arguments which invariably follow. 

If you want people to get better, insulting or shaming them isn't the way of going about it, just as making fun of a fat person will normally end in a fight.

 

It's because people need an impetus to get better. Something from within. Not just an angry internet rando yelling at them.    

As usual, you are reading far too much in what peeps post. Not everything is that literal.

 

The comparison is shaming can make peeps look at things differently, or another perspective.

 

Change can come from that. Not everyone sits in the corner sucking their thumb because of stat shame. The majority overcome it.

Edited by Wulfgarn
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xGreyGhostx    0
1 hour ago, Sventex said:

Flamu's advice is to always keep moving, that "being caught in the open and sitting still is a death sentence", but note how I do not stray far from my spawn point in the first 10 minutes of the match.  I operate out in the open, but I keep a healthy distance away from the enemy to ensure I am never outflanked.  Anyone whose played a RN BB knows that HE is best employed at mid-range, and that it's important to manage the distance between you and the enemy fleet.  Even at bottom tier,  I'm causing considerable damage by sitting back while also disrupting the enemies attempt to take the caps and setting fires.  It's only at the halfway point, where the team if outnumbered 6:3 and the caps are in danger that I put the Dunkerque's speed to use.  At this point, the enemy team no longer have any ships that can overmatch my bow, and thus the Dunkerque can play to it's own strengths and have unfair fights with the other ships, picking them off one by one and racking up the metals.  That's my advice for T8 battles with the Dunkerque, wait it out, let the higher tier ships duke it out with each other until they've destroyed each other, then move in to wreak havoc.  The Dunkerque is very strong against Destroyers and Cruisers at any tier, and will earn bonus points of sinking these higher tier ships, so you want to give yourself the best possible chance at taking them out.  So don't go full potato and brawl with a bunch of Tirpitzs like Flamu here.

Problem with your advice here is that you are letting the rest of your team die out without support at caps. Combine that with the video title being misleading in that there were a grand total of four t8's in that entire match, none of which were battleships. Of the battleships on the enemy team, the only one which could overmatch your bow was the Nelson who fell prey to extraordinarily bad positioning and managed to get himself killed, even with access to the RN superheal. Of the cruisers that were on the enemy team, the only ones which could pose a threat to you were the cleveland and budyonny. Seeing as how you were camping in your spawn the entire match you were pretty safe. Especially seeing as the Cleveland has anemic range, and the budyonny was doing a reasonable impression of you. The only real threats you faced that could have killed you in that match were the dd's who were busy capping and playing the objective, and the bb's who were busy having the situational awareness that I have come to expect of random players. All told, I am not sorry in the least to say that doing what you did in that match in a game with actual and competent t8's in it is a very good recipe to get yourself killed 9 times out of 10. Also the he spam was extremely debateable, but I'm tired and don't feel like getting into that conversation. As for Flamu....well, he's abrasive as all hell but he knows how to play the game very well. Trying to get into a debate in tactics like this thread is with him is a good way to make yourself look like a fool.

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RivertheRoyal    2,854
3 minutes ago, Wulfgarn said:

As usual, you are reading far too much in what peeps post. Not everything is that literal.

 

The comparison is shaming can make peeps look at things differently, or another perspective.

 

Change can come from that. Not everyone sits in the corner sucking their thumb because of stat shame. The majority overcome it.

 

Ah, I'm sorry for reading too far into this. I just take the issue very seriously, as it has a negative impact on the majority of our game's population. And I take a very dim view of those who do these things, since it's most often the least effective way of motivating a person. 

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Doomlock    2,331

Dunkerque is an odd ship, and requires a unique play style that is not replicated anywhere until the WiP Richelieu arrives.

 

That being said, Dunkerque can train you well for Richy being of a similar vein of ship. Picking your angles, the right ammo choice for the target, the times to turn, and the times to hold your ground.

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Radar_X    235

Folks as a reminder, please remain constructive when posting threads and posts.  Closing this one up!

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