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db4100

Match Maker's Unfairness

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I understand the need for speed to get a match created, but can't you guys at WG see that sometimes the match is lopsided?  I have pointed out (some say complained) that sometimes matchmaker will create a match were on team has an extra battleship and a destroyer which is usually in a domination match (standard battle is not as much as a problem).  How is it fair to be put on a team that has to compete against another team that has one more battleship and a sneaky destroyer?  I can say that match maker does great in creating matches FAST, but how is that a good thing when it puts out poor quality matched teams?  Instead of spending a mere few seconds in the que, I wouldn't mind spending an extra 90 seconds in the que to get a good quality match made......maybe even a +1/-1 in the tiers?  <= save for another discussion.

This screen shot below is what I am talking about....of course we lost that game.

 

shot-17.12.19_15.10.27-0243.jpg

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Matchmaking is the most often cited reason in "Screw You Guys, I Quit" posts here in the forums. If you look at the negative Steam reviews, the complaint is second only to the inability to integrate your Steam account with your standard Wargaming account. IMHO it is about half the forum population who dislikes MM the way it is and about half that like it. Wargaming itself sees no problem with it even though quite a few players leave the game around tier 5/6. WoWS bleeds mid level players like a severed artery, this leads to fewer people at higher tiers. The solution is to drag lower tier ships into higher tiered games which just leads to more people leaving. It is a stupid solution but one that will not be dealt with because Wargaming says it isn't a problem... You go figure... 

Edited by Taylor3006
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I don't see the problem with that matchup. Quit trying to blame everything but yourself for your performance.

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Two radar ships on the Red team vs none on Green would be hard to counter if the Atlantas are good. 

 

Edit:  By the way, I though MM was going to be tweaked to prevent duplicate  ships  being on the same side (excluding divisions).

Edited by PrairiePlayer

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7 minutes ago, PrairiePlayer said:

Edit:  By the way, I though MM was going to be tweaked to prevent two of the same ship types being on the same side (excluding divisions).

They announced that it was going to happen in updates notes before a PT at some point (way) back in the day...I remember them specifically using a certain ship as an example (forget which 1 though) & the 1st match after the actual update here was 3 of that ship on 1 team & none on the other...went back & read the update notes (for the actual update) & it had been removed.

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I'm all for +1/-1.

 

What's the point of telling me that a ship is balanced for it's tier when you rarely see matches when you're battling your same tier?

 

Smh..

 

 

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After 4 years with WG this MM excuse gets very redundant.  Sh#t is not perfect. Can't be for reasons that have been explained over and over and over and over and over. And over. And over. :Smile_amazed:

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Just now, dmckay said:

After 4 years with WG this MM excuse gets very redundant.  Sh#t is not perfect. Can't be for reasons that have been explained over and over and over and over and over. And over. And over. :Smile_amazed:

Well when the excuse is there are not enough players to make it work, maybe someone should look into why we can't keep players playing.... 

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53 minutes ago, PrairiePlayer said:

Two radar ships on the Red team vs none on Green would be hard to counter if the Atlantas are good. 

 

Edit:  By the way, I though MM was going to be tweaked to prevent duplicate  ships  being on the same side (excluding divisions).

My feeling is they were either not able to get it working right or that it cause new problems.

13 minutes ago, Wulfgarn said:

I'm all for +1/-1.

 

What's the point of telling me that a ship is balanced for it's tier when you rarely see matches when you're battling your same tier?

 

Smh..

 

 

Balance among the ships would become a problem. Under performers would do better but the over performers would also do better.

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43 minutes ago, Taylor3006 said:

Well when the excuse is there are not enough players to make it work, maybe someone should look into why we can't keep players playing.... 

Exactly. :Smile_honoring:

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48 minutes ago, Taylor3006 said:

Well when the excuse is there are not enough players to make it work, maybe someone should look into why we can't keep players playing.... 

You make a good point.

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2 hours ago, Taylor3006 said:

Matchmaking is the most often cited reason in "Screw You Guys, I Quit" posts here in the forums. If you look at the negative Steam reviews, the complaint is second only to the inability to integrate your Steam account with your standard Wargaming account. IMHO it is about half the forum population who dislikes MM the way it is and about half that like it. Wargaming itself sees no problem with it even though quite a few players leave the game around tier 5/6. WoWS bleeds mid level players like a severed artery, this leads to fewer people at higher tiers. The solution is to drag lower tier ships into higher tiered games which just leads to more people leaving. It is a stupid solution but one that will not be dealt with because Wargaming says it isn't a problem... You go figure... 

I have to say tier 6 is the end of the line . Tier 7 has to deal with 9. Which might as well be 10 to a 7 and 8 is pretty much only seeing down tiered matches never seeing 6 or 7 much unless a tier 9 is present. Which in turn makes 6 so easy as you mainly play against tier 5 even when you see 7 or 8 it isn't the end of the world.

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10 hours ago, BrushWolf said:

I don't see the problem with that matchup. Quit trying to blame everything but yourself for your performance.

This particular game was pretty close, but most of the time the team with the extra BB and DD usually just dominates.  Of course a lot of it depends on the player's skill, and when the deck is stacked against you it is still not an automatic loss.  With that said it has been my experience that the team with the extra BB and DD has about a 75% win rate, as in they win MOST of the time.  And, I am talking about domination mode and not the standard battle mode.  In this case it was in the rarer epicenter mode where the destroyer is crucial to the team's success.  

If you have any game experience then you will know that is near suicidal to try a cap a contested area with a cruiser.  That task is best left to the destroyers with the support of cruisers and battleships.  THAT is where the unfairness in comes in.  The team with the extra BB and DD has that extra tandem to contest or take another cap.  If you can't see the obvious tactical disadvantage situation put upon the team with the extra 2 cruisers vs. the team with the extra BB and DD.....then you sir, have a very poor concept of the very tactical problem that match maker is creating.  

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3 hours ago, db4100 said:

This particular game was pretty close, but most of the time the team with the extra BB and DD usually just dominates.  Of course a lot of it depends on the player's skill, and when the deck is stacked against you it is still not an automatic loss.  With that said it has been my experience that the team with the extra BB and DD has about a 75% win rate, as in they win MOST of the time.  And, I am talking about domination mode and not the standard battle mode.  In this case it was in the rarer epicenter mode where the destroyer is crucial to the team's success.  

If you have any game experience then you will know that is near suicidal to try a cap a contested area with a cruiser.  That task is best left to the destroyers with the support of cruisers and battleships.  THAT is where the unfairness in comes in.  The team with the extra BB and DD has that extra tandem to contest or take another cap.  If you can't see the obvious tactical disadvantage situation put upon the team with the extra 2 cruisers vs. the team with the extra BB and DD.....then you sir, have a very poor concept of the very tactical problem that match maker is creating.  

It is all about picking the fights you can win. I only see an issue with that kind of match up with epicenter where unless they are complete gaming morons the team with the extra DD really does hold all the cards. Any ship can cap, I took the center in a Tears of the Desert epicenter match but I waited till the enemy was depleted and away from the center. Never ever give up so that even in a loss the enemy knows they were in one hell of a fight.

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Can't always have exact balance in ship types. If there are 5 DDs in the queue, one side will get 3 and the other 2. I accept that. My complaint is when the sides could have been balanced but were not. Had a game last night ,T6-T8. Our side had 7xT6s, 2xT7s and 3xT8s. Reds had 5xT6s,  4xT7s and 3xT8s. None of this imbalance seemed to be division based so MM easily could have balanced things but for some reason, the math was too hard. By the way, we lost.

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Everytime I am in a game with this MM "unfairness" I will post the battle results.

Another domination game where the enemy team had the extra BB and DD....result= we lost.

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On ‎12‎/‎19‎/‎2017 at 5:46 PM, SuperSpud1 said:

Ryan Reynolds Facepalm GIF - Hopeless Disappointed RyanReynolds GIFs

I love this; just ... THANK YOU!

On ‎12‎/‎19‎/‎2017 at 5:37 PM, db4100 said:

How is it fair to be put on a team that has to compete against another team that has one more battleship and a sneaky destroyer?

Wow, really? The red team didn't get an EXTRA anything; they have 12 ships just like your team did. They did get more BB's and DD's, but you got 2 more cruisers, which are the most flexible and versatile ships in the game. I'm going to guess you agree with that since you were playing the french heavy.

MM, while still horribly screwed up and a bad joke on it's best day, is NOTHING NEAR as bad as it used to be. Uneven matches where one side got 12 ships and the other got 15; matches where the ships were +3 instead of +2; matches where one side had CV's and the other didn't. Ya ... much better now.

Play to your strengths; if you have more cruisers, wolf pack them into burning BB's down. If you don't believe that will work, ask a BB player; he'll be able to tell you how it's done. If you have more BB's; stick together for maximum firepower effect, as well as that massive secondary assist. More DD's; get the stealthy one to spot, smoke up, and burn everything in sight.

If you play to your strengths, it CAN always work; but remember, the reds are trying too.

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On ‎12‎/‎19‎/‎2017 at 8:25 PM, GreyFox78659 said:

Which in turn makes 6 so easy as you mainly play against tier 5 even when you see 7 or 8 it isn't the end of the world.

OK, here is your New Mexico; go kill the North Carolina.

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12 hours ago, Umikami said:

OK, here is your New Mexico; go kill the North Carolina.

Yeah, no.  Instead of your skewed logic, how about that New Mexico go and kill the two extra cruisers on the team that got shorted a BB and DD instead.  Easily done as cruisers don't have the DDs detection range for protection, and can easily get deleted fast by battleship two tiers lower.  Then that leaves the red team with the extra DD to wreck havoc by capping and hunting battleships.  In case you haven't noticed, battleships don't do well fighting destroyers in this game.

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1 minute ago, db4100 said:

In case you haven't noticed, battleships don't do well fighting destroyers in this game.

But cruisers do, they were built to, and that team had 2 more. I'm not sure if you're whining or begging, but either way, quit.

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58 minutes ago, Umikami said:

But cruisers do, they were built to, and that team had 2 more. I'm not sure if you're whining or begging, but either way, quit.

NOPE

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In general, the team with the most DDs wins, 90% of the time. The only exception to that is which team has the most radar.

So, when you get a match where on one side there are 3 Iowas and on the other side there are 3 Missouri's (and an extra DD) Care to guess how that match went???


MM is broken. Its BEEN broken since Beta.  (Note the BETA tag in my name, speaking from experience here). The only time it improved is when WG cut the limit on the CV nonsense down; but even that didnt fix the many many many unbalanced teams we have.

MM is one of the prime reasons why, now that Im done with the DOY missions, Im not touching Randoms for a while; Im doing the scenarios as at least that's somewhat feasible.

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On 12/19/2017 at 8:49 PM, IfYouSeeKhaos said:

They announced that it was going to happen in updates notes before a PT at some point (way) back in the day...I remember them specifically using a certain ship as an example (forget which 1 though) & the 1st match after the actual update here was 3 of that ship on 1 team & none on the other...went back & read the update notes (for the actual update) & it had been removed.

Yeah, why would they want balanced team, at T10 it is laughable for one team to get 2 shimas and the other team get 2 gearings when the ships are not even close to being balanced against one another, its getting old.

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It has been said "To err is Human"

it has also been said " To blame it on others is MORE HUMAN"

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