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BrandonKF

When Everything Goes Wrong Against an HE Spammer

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Sharing a replay for everyone.

Just an example of what happens.

I have an endurance build on my Kii. The RELIC player burnt me down and chased me all the way north. All cruisers to one side and one AFK.

https://replayswows.com/replay/11583

Me. A tier VIII battleship, having to leave because there's four battleships down south. The longer I run, the more they do.

25438963_10156586493719386_7910852979193

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So, I watched your replay. I was curious about it because some things were not lining up in the post game results screen, and I was curious about what happened. I will now give some harsh criticism. Please do not see this as anything other than what it is—an autopsy on what you did wrong, in the hopes that it will improve how you play moving on. 

So, first. You choose the wrong flank. In the first minute of the battle, you can look at the mini-map and generally glean where the rest of the team is going. Now, I will say that your fellow battleships were muppets. They didn't really go anywhere and just near spawn for the most part. This is bad, and those players should feel bad. Now, what you did is a different story, and bad as well. At least, with what you did, it turned out bad. 

In all honisty, I would have went down the same flank as you. Seeing that the majority of the team started pushing the B cap on the eastern side of the map, I would have held up the west, and prevented a flank for as long as possible. I think that you pushed in too far at the beginning though. Give those western islands a larger berth, and take things a little slower.

As it is, as soon as you were spotted, the entire enemy team on that side had one target—you. 

Hang back a little more next time, don't push past the islands. You want to avoid situations where you're caught out like you were, and take unnecessary damage. What I would have done, would be to already be turning around before reaching the end of the islands. Keep distance between the ships I know are coming, and all that. See, the south spawn on that map tends to send all their battleships on the Eastern flank. Always position on the assumption that they'll be coming, and try to avoid any shots from their spawn. 

 

Next, let's talk about your damage mitigation. You have your captain built for anti-fire to some extent, at least with Fire Prevention on him, and one of the fire reduction skills/flag/modules. This is good, and should ensure greater survivability to your ship. However, there's a problem. 

3 times, Brandon. 3 times you had one fire burning on ship, and put it out. Do not do this. It is a very bad idea. Let the single fire burn, and don't waste your damage control putting it out. The very first time you put out that single fire, you were lit again with two permanent fires. The second time, you weren't punished for it, not for lack of the Kiev's trying. The third time, you ate a torpedo and started flooding. That one was the one which guaranteed your death.

Don't put out single fires unless you are unspotted and not getting shot at. In combat, wait for two fires or more to be set before putting them out. It saves your health and the damage control party for bigger threats.

And, if there's a DD smoked up within torpedo range, expect torpedoes. It's an elementary rule. 

 

Moving on, there was something I noticed about your shooting habits. I was quite puzzled. And then I was extraordinarily upset. 

Firstly, you need to work on your aim. There were times where you weren't giving enough lead to a target, or ignored certain things. For instance, watch a ship's smokestack. It will tell you about how fast the ship is going, and if it is sitting still. You watched that Gneisenau for a good ten seconds before shooting. If you had been watching his smokestack, and the terrain behind him, or the wake of his ship, you would have noticed that he was sitting stock still in the water, not moving at all. Instead, you shoot way in front of him, as if he were moving at full speed. There were other instances where you didn't give enough lead to the Kiev, and undershot his ship. The hits you got on him were pure luck, where he had slowed down, or started turning. 

Other than that, there was another massive issue I noticed. 

Namely, you need to shoot more. There were times where your guns were silent for a few minutes. This is extremely bad. 

In a battleship, you want to be shooting right after every reload, unless you can drop off detection and get out of a bad situation. You were unable to go into concealment, and in that situation, you have nothing to lose by firing. Every time those guns are reloaded, pick the most broadside target and let loose. And it is not like you were starved of good targets in this game. Your flank alone should have kept you occupied for as long as you were afloat. 

Instead, you let the Kiev draw all  your attention. 

Brandon, you were tunnel-visioning hard. The Kiev was a threat only because A.) You were putting out single fires. B.) He was drawing almost all your fire. C.) You weren't shooting him enough

I know B and C seem a little contradictory, but it's true. You shot at him three or four times, over the course of 5 minutes. It was like you were expecting someone else to deal with him. This wouldn't be so bad, if it weren't for the fact that you also weren't shooting anyone else. You HAVE to keep those rifles hot. You were the best one to deal with him in that case. So, deal with him. Don't expect anyone else to, the Kii is more than capable of doing damage to a Kiev, as you should have found with those lucky hits. 

 

However, the largest issue comes from your complete blindness to the rest of the enemy team. You took a couple of potshots at them every now and then, but again, you weren't shooting nearly enough. You let the Kiev draw too much of your attention. Especially at the end, were you stubbornly charged his smoke, ignoring the three or four enemy battleships off to your side (which you were exposing full broadside to, at less than 10 km). You didn't even look at them! Never mind shooting them! 

 

My point is, you were in a target rich environment. Lots of ships exposing broadside to you, but you weren't shooting them. For god's sake, shoot them. Don't wait a minute before deciding that they might be a good target. 

 

All in all, I think you only have yourself to blame for the results of this game. There were some blatant misplays made which made things a hell of a lot worse for you. Especially the whole situation with putting out single fires, and not firing your guns. If it were me in that situation, the Kiev would have been the first to go down, and at least one other battleship would have been taken too.

 

What I'm saying is, the situation you were in was one of your own making. It wasn't the Kiev's fault. It wasn't your team's fault. It was yours.     

  • Cool 2

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3 minutes ago, RivertheRoyal said:

So, I watched your replay. I was curious about it because some things were not lining up in the post game results screen, and I was curious about what happened. I will now give some harsh criticism. Please do not see this as anything other than what it is—an autopsy on what you did wrong, in the hopes that it will improve how you play moving on. 

So, first. You choose the wrong flank. In the first minute of the battle, you can look at the mini-map and generally glean where the rest of the team is going. Now, I will say that your fellow battleships were muppets. They didn't really go anywhere and just near spawn for the most part. This is bad, and those players should feel bad. Now, what you did is a different story, and bad as well. At least, with what you did, it turned out bad. 

In all honisty, I would have went down the same flank as you. Seeing that the majority of the team started pushing the B cap on the eastern side of the map, I would have held up the west, and prevented a flank for as long as possible. I think that you pushed in too far at the beginning though. Give those western islands a larger berth, and take things a little slower.

As it is, as soon as you were spotted, the entire enemy team on that side had one target—you. 

Hang back a little more next time, don't push past the islands. You want to avoid situations where you're caught out like you were, and take unnecessary damage. What I would have done, would be to already be turning around before reaching the end of the islands. Keep distance between the ships I know are coming, and all that. See, the south spawn on that map tends to send all their battleships on the Eastern flank. Always position on the assumption that they'll be coming, and try to avoid any shots from their spawn. 

Sniping doesn't do jacksquat.

1.7 sigma trolls you about seven-eighths of the time at any range greater than 15 kilometers.

3 minutes ago, RivertheRoyal said:

Next, let's talk about your damage mitigation. You have your captain built for anti-fire to some extent, at least with Fire Prevention on him, and one of the fire reduction skills/flag/modules. This is good, and should ensure greater survivability to your ship. However, there's a problem. 

3 times, Brandon. 3 times you had one fire burning on ship, and put it out. Do not do this. It is a very bad idea. Let the single fire burn, and don't waste your damage control putting it out. The very first time you put out that single fire, you were lit again with two permanent fires. The second time, you weren't punished for it, not for lack of the Kiev's trying. The third time, you ate a torpedo and started flooding. That one was the one which guaranteed your death.

Don't put out single fires unless you are unspotted and not getting shot at. In combat, wait for two fires or more to be set before putting them out. It saves your health and the damage control party for bigger threats.

And, if there's a DD smoked up within torpedo range, expect torpedoes. It's an elementary rule. 

I already do expect torpedoes. I also can't turn. Kii doesn't have torpbeats. Ever.

She's fast. With speed flag. Without, she's slower than half the other ships, and she takes twice as long to turn around.

Torpbeats she is not.

Damage mitigation I can try, but every time I have ONE fire, and I let it burn out, ANOTHER fire is started. By the time I pop heal for that one fire, the second one just eats up whatever I was going to get back.

3 minutes ago, RivertheRoyal said:

Moving on, there was something I noticed about your shooting habits. I was quite puzzled. And then I was extraordinarily upset. 

Firstly, you need to work on your aim. There were times where you weren't giving enough lead to a target, or ignored certain things. For instance, watch a ship's smokestack. It will tell you about how fast the ship is going, and if it is sitting still. You watched that Gneisenau for a good ten seconds before shooting. If you had been watching his smokestack, and the terrain behind him, or the wake of his ship, you would have noticed that he was sitting stock still in the water, not moving at all. Instead, you shoot way in front of him, as if he were moving at full speed. There were other instances where you didn't give enough lead to the Kiev, and undershot his ship. The hits you got on him were pure luck, where he had slowed down, or started turning. 

Don't know how to lead in those instances. Been practicing but mostly just use the 5 tic mark as a general aiming point on dynamic sights.

Also, I run Low settings. So I don't see wakes. Water effects are non-existent. Smoke I can see, but barely. I can try changing those settings and seeing what happens, but if it lowers my FPS below 25, I'll likely quit.

 

3 minutes ago, RivertheRoyal said:

Other than that, there was another massive issue I noticed. 

Namely, you need to shoot more. There were times where your guns were silent for a few minutes. This is extremely bad. 

In a battleship, you want to be shooting right after every reload, unless you can drop off detection and get out of a bad situation. You were unable to go into concealment, and in that situation, you have nothing to lose by firing. Every time those guns are reloaded, pick the most broadside target and let loose. And it is not like you were starved of good targets in this game. Your flank alone should have kept you occupied for as long as you were afloat. 

Instead, you let the Kiev draw all  your attention. 

Brandon, you were tunnel-visioning hard. The Kiev was a threat only because A.) You were putting out single fires. B.) He was drawing almost all your fire. C.) You weren't shooting him enough

I know B and C seem a little contradictory, but it's true. You shot at him three or four times, over the course of 5 minutes. It was like you were expecting someone else to deal with him. This wouldn't be so bad, if it weren't for the fact that you also weren't shooting anyone else. You HAVE to keep those rifles hot. You were the best one to deal with him in that case. So, deal with him. Don't expect anyone else to, the Kii is more than capable of doing damage to a Kiev, as you should have found with those lucky hits. 

Yes, I tunnel-visioned.

3 minutes ago, RivertheRoyal said:

However, the largest issue comes from your complete blindness to the rest of the enemy team. You took a couple of potshots at them every now and then, but again, you weren't shooting nearly enough. You let the Kiev draw too much of your attention. Especially at the end, were you stubbornly charged his smoke, ignoring the three or four enemy battleships off to your side (which you were exposing full broadside to, at less than 10 km). You didn't even look at them! Never mind shooting them! 

My point is, you were in a target rich environment. Lots of ships exposing broadside to you, but you weren't shooting them. For god's sake, shoot them. Don't wait a minute before deciding that they might be a good target. 

All in all, I think you only have yourself to blame for the results of this game. There were some blatant misplays made which made things a hell of a lot worse for you. Especially the whole situation with putting out single fires, and not firing your guns. If it were me in that situation, the Kiev would have been the first to go down, and at least one other battleship would have been taken too.

What I'm saying is, the situation you were in was one of your own making. It wasn't the Kiev's fault. It wasn't your team's fault. It was yours.     

Sure. My fault.

I'm still in a hateful mood. So it's going to smolder for a good long while.

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So a little blaming of the game mechanics, for what is in fact more human error and poor teamwork? I was hoping that I could reply directly after River's post, but OP got in first.

OP, good on you for admitting you're not in the best of moods! A great deal of what River states is true and when you've got time to reflect on what she said you may see it too. As I said, credit to you for admitting you were hateful when writing this post - we all get frustrated at times, not all will admit this. +1 for you both. :Smile_honoring:

 

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9 minutes ago, BrandonKF said:

Sniping doesn't do jacksquat.

1.7 sigma trolls you about seven-eighths of the time at any range greater than 15 kilometers.

You didn't even try though. Even when the enemy ships were no longer in sniping ranges. It's better to get some damage than none at all. 

 

10 minutes ago, BrandonKF said:

I already do expect torpedoes. I also can't turn. Kii doesn't have torpbeats. Ever.

She's fast. With speed flag. Without, she's slower than half the other ships, and she takes twice as long to turn around.

 

Torpedo beating isn't about reacting to torpedoes, it's about anticipating them in the first place. Plot a course, make it seem like you're going straight, then turn or slow down. You did none of these things, and just kept running towards the DD's smoke. Which was a bad move in and of itself. Better would have been to turn away and draw out the engagement with the battleships, while returning fire with them. 

 

13 minutes ago, BrandonKF said:

Damage mitigation I can try, but every time I have ONE fire, and I let it burn out, ANOTHER fire is started. By the time I pop heal for that one fire, the second one just eats up whatever I was going to get back.

 

Two full course fires over the period of 90 seconds or so are still better than two full course fires over 45 seconds. Draw out the process of losing health as long as possible. Damage mitigation isn't about not taking damage, it's about taking as little as possible over as long a period of time as possible.  

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Brandon, just you know most BBs do not do torpedo beats very often unless they were pointed right at the ship that launched them, I do my best to, but sometimes it is a matter of doing your best to limit how many you take.  And like River said, don't put that first fire out right away, wait till you are looking 2-3 fires before putting them.  Most if not all Fire Damage can be healed, but it is better to let them burn, at times if it is advantageous and I can pull it off I will take the burn so I can get the fire reduction flags for going fireproof. 

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9 hours ago, gcangel82 said:

Brandon, just you know most BBs do not do torpedo beats very often unless they were pointed right at the ship that launched them, I do my best to, but sometimes it is a matter of doing your best to limit how many you take.  And like River said, don't put that first fire out right away, wait till you are looking 2-3 fires before putting them.  Most if not all Fire Damage can be healed, but it is better to let them burn, at times if it is advantageous and I can pull it off I will take the burn so I can get the fire reduction flags for going fireproof. 

Also, Kii (like Japanese ships in general) turns like a barge. If you haven't started preemptive turning, by the time you've spotted the torps it's too late. Vigilance is a worthwhile skill for the IJN if you end up closing with DDs.

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