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Adalbertt

melting teams

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I was trying to bring this issue to this forum attention before and of course I just got trolled. It's very interesting that almost all the forum trolls are very loyal to Wargaming and fiercely attack anyone who wants to bring any issues to the forum attention. Anyone who has a business and hired PR agency knows that some "players" on this forum are basically hired by Wargaming people who's job is to praise what Wargaming does and to discourage anyone from saying anything bad about what WG does. Their job is to "improve company's image". it's a very common business practice. Of course there are those who just troll others because of their personality issues, but I don't thing those are majority here. I rarely see someone who praises WG being trolled in such a fierce full way as those who complaint about something. Also trolling not present to this extent in the game chat or other non-Wargaming WoWS forums.

I have found some answers outside this forum about melting teams, but I hope to find out more here. Anyway, here is the situation:

In the past weeks my average XP have improved by about 5%. My kill ratio is 1.32. My average XP in ranked battles is over 1400 and over 1000 in random battles. My win ratio used to be 53% for a several months but some time ago my daily win ratio usually stays at 20 - 30%. On average I take SECOND place by XP in my team and I'm the one of last surviving ships. In every game that is a Defeat, my XP within my team is 1st or 2nd. In Victory games it's on average 4th. My teams just melt. Looks like MM keeps putting me constantly in teams of weak players. Clearly when there are 23 other players my low win ratio is not caused by my skills. Even AFK games have average 40% win ratio, not 20. Again, I'm on average 2nd most experienced player by XP in my team (post game stats). This situation affects my account since August. It is very consistent. On a good day I get 40-50% win ratio but that's rare (once every 5-6 days). While getting such a low win ratio in the last days I got number of achievements like Kraken (up to 8 kills) or Witherer. My average account XP have improved by 5%. Isn't that interesting?

I have done an experiment: I have created second account some time ago, and when I play using that second account my win ratio is at 52% on average. On a bad days I get 40%, but then there are days when I get over 60% win ratio. When I switch to my original account i get 20% win ratio again. I have no doubt that Wargaming is manipulating (balancing) win ratio of players by MM player skill composition. They actually have a patent for doing this.

If you have experienced such thing, please let me know how long (how many games) it lasted until changed. Was there a threshold for an average win ratio that have triggered this?

 

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It happens man nothing can be done about it, I have solid win steaks all the time but then I seem to go into a dry spell. It may be annoying and depressing but its honestly just part of the game.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, murryhawk said:

Is your hat made out of tinfoil or lead?

There's a propeller on top of his beanie.

 

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46 minutes ago, Adalbertt said:

I was trying to bring this issue to this forum attention before and of course I just got trolled. It's very interesting that almost all the forum trolls are very loyal to Wargaming and fiercely attack anyone who wants to bring any issues to the forum attention. Anyone who has a business and hired PR agency knows that some "players" on this forum are basically hired by Wargaming people who's job is to praise what Wargaming does and to discourage anyone from saying anything bad about what WG does. Their job is to "improve company's image". it's a very common business practice. Of course there are those who just troll others because of their personality issues, but I don't thing those are majority here. I rarely see someone who praises WG being trolled in such a fierce full way as those who complaint about something. Also trolling not present to this extent in the game chat or other non-Wargaming WoWS forums.

I have found some answers outside this forum about melting teams, but I hope to find out more here. Anyway, here is the situation:

In the past weeks my average XP have improved by about 5%. My kill ratio is 1.32. My average XP in ranked battles is over 1400 and over 1000 in random battles. My win ratio used to be 53% for a several months but some time ago my daily win ratio usually stays at 20 - 30%. On average I take SECOND place by XP in my team and I'm the one of last surviving ships. In every game that is a Defeat, my XP within my team is 1st or 2nd. In Victory games it's on average 4th. My teams just melt. Looks like MM keeps putting me constantly in teams of weak players. Clearly when there are 23 other players my low win ratio is not caused by my skills. Even AFK games have average 40% win ratio, not 20. Again, I'm on average 2nd most experienced player by XP in my team (post game stats). This situation affects my account since August. It is very consistent. On a good day I get 40-50% win ratio but that's rare (once every 5-6 days). While getting such a low win ratio in the last days I got number of achievements like Kraken (up to 8 kills) or Witherer. My average account XP have improved by 5%. Isn't that interesting?

I have done an experiment: I have created second account some time ago, and when I play using that second account my win ratio is at 52% on average. On a bad days I get 40%, but then there are days when I get over 60% win ratio. When I switch to my original account i get 20% win ratio again. I have no doubt that Wargaming is manipulating (balancing) win ratio of players by MM player skill composition. They actually have a patent for doing this.

If you have experienced such thing, please let me know how long (how many games) it lasted until changed. Was there a threshold for an average win ratio that have triggered this?

 

yeah, felt the same way over a year. every time I start making some improvement, I experience a major string of defeats, with spectacularly crappy teams. you will get trolled hard for saying anything about it.

the vast majority of my games are solo, which may have something to do with it. the last horrid losing streak was littered with the red team having multiple divisions, occasionally two divisions of three players, the green team having none or one of two players, and a pile of clan members in the better clans, where we were lucky to have any. if you post about this, you will hear about a small sample size, get to read more gifs than you thought there were, and all about foil hats and conspiracy theory.

after the last couple day's battles, i'm about ready to pack it in. not sure if WG just really doesn't give a crapabout the players in the game, can't figure out how to fix it, or both.

and, of course, the sort of crapthat crucis just posted. jesus, the only excuse for this is being 12 years old, drunk, or both.

Edited by not_acceptable

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23 minutes ago, Adalbertt said:

I was trying to bring this issue to this forum attention before and of course I just got trolled. It's very interesting that almost all the forum trolls are very loyal to Wargaming and fiercely attack anyone who wants to bring any issues to the forum attention. Anyone who has a business and hired PR agency knows that some "players" on this forum are basically hired by Wargaming people who's job is to praise what Wargaming does and to discourage anyone from saying anything bad about what WG does. Their job is to "improve company's image". it's a very common business practice. Of course there are those who just troll others because of their personality issues, but I don't thing those are majority here. I rarely see someone who praises WG being trolled in such a fierce full way as those who complaint about something. Also trolling not present to this extent in the game chat or other non-Wargaming WoWS forums.

Poisoning the well, check.

You really do need to get out more, if you think that this is in fact true. Companies almost never actually have to do this, as the sunk-costs fallacy will often prompt paying customers to do all of the work for them, whether they know it or not. And, of course, some people genuinely do like what those companies are selling. Equating happy customers with trolls, however, is quite the stretch, and I do consider myself somewhat of an amateur authority on trolls. :Smile_trollface:

23 minutes ago, Adalbertt said:

I have found some answers outside this forum about melting teams, but I hope to find out more here. Anyway, here is the situation:

In the past weeks my average XP have improved by about 5%. My kill ratio is 1.32. My average XP in ranked battles is over 1400 and over 1000 in random battles. My win ratio used to be 53% for a several months but some time ago my daily win ratio usually stays at 20 - 30%. On average I take SECOND place by XP in my team and I'm the one of last surviving ships. In every game that is a Defeat, my XP within my team is 1st or 2nd. In Victory games it's on average 4th. My teams just melt. Looks like MM keeps putting me constantly in teams of weak players. Clearly when there are 23 other players my low win ratio is not caused by my skills. Even AFK games have average 40% win ratio, not 20. Again, I'm on average 2nd most experienced player by XP in my team (post game stats). This situation affects my account since August. It is very consistent. On a good day I get 40-50% win ratio but that's rare (once every 5-6 days). While getting such a low win ratio in the last days I got number of achievements like Kraken (up to 8 kills) or Witherer. My average account XP have improved by 5%. Isn't that interesting?

I have done an experiment: I have created second account some time ago, and when I play using that second account my win ratio is at 52% on average. On a bad days I get 40%, but then there are days when I get over 60% win ratio. When I switch to my original account i get 20% win ratio again. I have no doubt that Wargaming is manipulating (balancing) win ratio of players by MM player skill composition. They actually have a patent for doing this.

If you have experienced such thing, please let me know how long (how many games) it lasted until changed. Was there a threshold for an average win ratio that have triggered this?

The reply to your previous thread was made without having fully and appropriately digested what you were really getting at, so what I had said there doesn't really apply. That said, there really isn't anything that can be done to fix your "problem," and in fact you still haven't clearly outlined what the problem exactly is. At least not in terms that readily lend themselves to identifying a cause and possible solution(s).

What you are basically asserting, near as I can comprehend, is that WG is deliberately manipulating the matchmaker to ensure that most players end up with a win rate at or around 50%. This is complete and total bollocks, and here's why: correlation does not equal causation. First off, does this patent actually exist, and if so, have you read it? Patents are matters of public record, after all, so you better be damn sure of what you're saying here. Second of all, it is actually a sign of decent to good matchmaking when "most" people have an "average" win rate, especially in team-based games. Average is as average does, and if you are an average to moderately good player, your stats will in large part reflect this (mind you, there is more to the measure of how good or bad one is at WoWS than what is taken into account to create these fancy stat signature images—heck, it could be argued that the game itself doesn't quite do this, either). And if you are a bad player, again your stats will reflect this.

I'm not about to go digging through your stats to see where you might be going wrong. That is for people who know the game better and have experience at that kind of thing, and have the patience to pick apart others' playstyle. What I will tell you is what others on this forum have taught me, which was sort of but not quite touched upon in my initial reply to you: there is only so much that you as a player can do in a team-based game to ensure a win. That said, it is entirely possible that, after having returned from your break, you came back into the game with a different mindset, one that is less conducive to win rate and more oriented toward bettering your personal stats. What might this be? Perhaps you are focusing more on dealing damage and getting kills on the targets that are easiest to hit, as opposed to doing things like taking capture points and/or preventing the opposing team from doing the same, or perhaps the targets you are shooting at are of a lesser priority?

I've had my own share of this phenomenon, so I'm not pulling this out of my rectum. About a week ago, after having played almost exclusively Co-op for months, I went back into Random Battles with a clanmate for a few days in a row. After that, I took a look at my stats and, realizing that they had taken a significant dip, began to realize that all of that time fighting bots had dulled my ability to play against other live human beings. So after thinking about where I had gone wrong in all those matches where I either died really early (and stupidly), or just didn't get much done to contribute to the overall effort, I started playing a lot more mid-tier battles by myself in the Kamikaze twins. And you know what I realized? That even though I wasn't really racking up big numbers or increasing my WTR by very much, I was improving my win rate by quite a significant degree.

How was I doing this? By being a lot less selfish. Sure, there were plenty of times where I screwed up and got myself deleted early on, but those times when I was able to just relax into the moment, know my job and how to do it, and then just going in there and accomplishing the mission, would often result in a win. Sometimes just being out there, throwing the occasional torpedoes around, making a nuisance of myself, was enough to draw the enemy away from the primary engagement, so that the rest of my team could get the job done.

When all is said and done, you should take responsibility for your own contributions to the game, and it sounds like you do (to a degree). But it is also just as important to realize what factors might be in play that are beyond your control. If there is too much of that in this game for your liking, then perhaps World of Warships isn't for you.

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One your daily W/R for the past week is 40%, second for the past 90 days its 46%, third you didn't listen to any of the advice last time.  

Everything you are talking about is [edited] non-existent tin-foil hat crap excuses for not actually trying to improve.

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First off, starting off a thread by lashing out at the forum community and calling them Wargaming shills is the one way you can ensure people will hate you from the start. What's that old saying ... you can catch more flies with honey than vinegar? So stop being so vinegar, dude.

Second, I feel your pain. While I don't feel there's some sort of grand conspiracy like you suggest, sometimes Potato RNG deals you a cruel blow. While I personally have gotten better over time and have become fairly good at pushing objectives and knowing who to target and when, I 'm not yet good enough to unicum carry a team solo, and I've been saddled with some truly truly potato teams as of late. So much so that it's greatly impacted my motivation to play as I'm tired of raging all the time. Been stuck around a 51.5% WR for months now and it's really genuinely bothering me.

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Quote

I was trying to bring this issue to this forum attention before and of course I just got trolled. It's very interesting that almost all the forum trolls are very loyal to Wargaming and fiercely attack anyone who wants to bring any issues to the forum attention. Anyone who has a business and hired PR agency knows that some "players" on this forum are basically hired by Wargaming people who's job is to praise what Wargaming does and to discourage anyone from saying anything bad about what WG does. Their job is to "improve company's image". it's a very common business practice. Of course there are those who just troll others because of their personality issues, but I don't thing those are majority here. I rarely see someone who praises WG being trolled in such a fierce full way as those who complaint about something. Also trolling not present to this extent in the game chat or other non-Wargaming WoWS forums.

If this is a troll, it is very promising. Attacking everyone for being a wargaming shill will definitely provoke a response!

If this is a serious post, I doubt anything anyone will say will convince you otherwise.  Because if they disagree, they are all part of the conspiracy, amirite?

 

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1 hour ago, MountainManxDan said:

One your daily W/R for the past week is 40%, second for the past 90 days its 46%, third you didn't listen to any of the advice last time.  

Everything you are talking about is [edited] non-existent tin-foil hat crap excuses for not actually trying to improve.

 

Dangnabbit, mountmanxdan, i was going to say that.

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3 hours ago, Adalbertt said:

I was trying to bring this issue to this forum attention before and of course I just got trolled. It's very interesting that almost all the forum trolls are very loyal to Wargaming and fiercely attack anyone who wants to bring any issues to the forum attention. Anyone who has a business and hired PR agency knows that some "players" on this forum are basically hired by Wargaming people who's job is to praise what Wargaming does and to discourage anyone from saying anything bad about what WG does. Their job is to "improve company's image". it's a very common business practice. Of course there are those who just troll others because of their personality issues, but I don't thing those are majority here. I rarely see someone who praises WG being trolled in such a fierce full way as those who complaint about something. Also trolling not present to this extent in the game chat or other non-Wargaming WoWS forums.

Quick tip for new players: insulting everyone on this forum before asking your question is likely to provoke a backlash and decrease the chance of people trying to help you.  They will assume that you think that all problems with the game are a result of other people, and there are no possible ways for you to get better, and give you the suitable level of cynnical derision such a mindset can deserve.  

3 hours ago, Adalbertt said:

I have found some answers outside this forum about melting teams, but I hope to find out more here. Anyway, here is the situation:

In the past weeks my average XP have improved by about 5%. My kill ratio is 1.32. My average XP in ranked battles is over 1400 and over 1000 in random battles. My win ratio used to be 53% for a several months but some time ago my daily win ratio usually stays at 20 - 30%. On average I take SECOND place by XP in my team and I'm the one of last surviving ships. In every game that is a Defeat, my XP within my team is 1st or 2nd. In Victory games it's on average 4th. My teams just melt. Looks like MM keeps putting me constantly in teams of weak players. Clearly when there are 23 other players my low win ratio is not caused by my skills. Even AFK games have average 40% win ratio, not 20. Again, I'm on average 2nd most experienced player by XP in my team (post game stats). This situation affects my account since August. It is very consistent. On a good day I get 40-50% win ratio but that's rare (once every 5-6 days). While getting such a low win ratio in the last days I got number of achievements like Kraken (up to 8 kills) or Witherer. My average account XP have improved by 5%. Isn't that interesting?

I have done an experiment: I have created second account some time ago, and when I play using that second account my win ratio is at 52% on average. On a bad days I get 40%, but then there are days when I get over 60% win ratio. When I switch to my original account i get 20% win ratio again. I have no doubt that Wargaming is manipulating (balancing) win ratio of players by MM player skill composition. They actually have a patent for doing this.

If you have experienced such thing, please let me know how long (how many games) it lasted until changed. Was there a threshold for an average win ratio that have triggered this?

 

Blaming MM will not help you get positive responses, either.  This game is very streaky, as others have mentioned.  For instance, today from 8 battles I've had 7 losses, none of which were even close (we killed two enemy ships in one battle!!!) I am an above average player, and I couldnt turn them around.  Nor the next battle, nor the one after that.  

It happens. 

My suggestion is that you continue to focus on your own positioning and your own play.  Always asking yourself: was there a way to bring an enemy down with you if you payed enough attention, eg a broadside cruiser in the middle-distance that you could have got one last salvo of AP into before you died, rather than continuing to focus on the target closest to you?  I often kick myself by not noticing a DD or other opportunity to help; occasionally, it can turn a game. 

If you want to blame MM for picking on you, go ahead.  Americans love conspiracy theories.  But it wont help you get better, alas.  

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2 hours ago, LastSamurai714 said:

Today has been tremendously bad.  The worst teams I have seen in months.

Quoted for Truth.  Today has been 100% rubbish.  

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3 hours ago, Adalbertt said:

I have found some answers outside this forum about melting teams, but I hope to find out more here. 

Right, so having looked at your stats, I make the following observations: 

  • You have played a very large number of ships, but have relatively few battles in each of them; 
  • You have a large number of premium ships, both low and high tier; 
    • Many with extremely low number of battles, including Perth and Nelson (2 battles each). 
  • Your tech tree ships are mainly low to mid-tier.

This makes me suspect a few things: 

  1.  You are still learning which types of ship your prefer, cruisers, battleships or destroyers; 
  2. You are used to a low-tier meta, and the mid-high tier maps and meta are still unfamiliar; 
  3. You arent becoming fully aware of how to get the most out of your individual ship. 

 

Do those three things, and you might be able to turn your losing streaks around.  On the other hand, you might have cursed ships - my Hipper has about a 38% winrrate but almost 50% more than server average damage; last battle I was even detonated by stray HE.  EDIT: And the very next battle, detonated in my Hipper again - this time by the gentle kiss of a torp on the bow... I really do despair.  EDIT2: OMG, I got the detonation hat trick - three battles, three detonations in my Hipper; the third was from near full health from an Ibuki HE round.  This ship is total garbage, cant wait to get rid of it, which is a pity given the Hipper's history.  

 

Have fun!

Edited by UltimateNewbie

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3 hours ago, Adalbertt said:

I was trying to bring this issue to this forum attention before and of course I just got trolled. It's very interesting that almost all the forum trolls are very loyal to Wargaming and fiercely attack anyone who wants to bring any issues to the forum attention. Anyone who has a business and hired PR agency knows that some "players" on this forum are basically hired by Wargaming people who's job is to praise what Wargaming does and to discourage anyone from saying anything bad about what WG does. Their job is to "improve company's image". it's a very common business practice. Of course there are those who just troll others because of their personality issues, but I don't thing those are majority here. I rarely see someone who praises WG being trolled in such a fierce full way as those who complaint about something. Also trolling not present to this extent in the game chat or other non-Wargaming WoWS forums.

Wait, does this mean WG is paying me and I don't know of this? Oh god, where is my Money?!?

4 hours ago, Adalbertt said:

Looks like MM keeps putting me constantly in teams of weak players. Clearly when there are 23 other players my low win ratio is not caused by my skills. Even AFK games have average 40% win ratio, not 20.

WR (especially solo-WR) is in fact the only stat that I would consider valuable. Sure you are 'only' 1 out of 12 Players, but given the way MM works this will even out over time. The blow-out losses and wins won't Change, but the Close games heavily depend on each and every one of your moves. Make a wrong turn and you lose, die and you lose, go into the wrong direction and you lose. Every mistake will cost you a lot.

All the other stats are either meaningless or flawed.

Average XP? Gets influenced by Premium accounts

Average Kills? A kill only requires you to deal 1hp of damage. I could hit a Yamato for 95k damage and someone else finishes him off. Who did better?

K/D Ratio? Look above

Average damage? This completely leaves out the Quality of your damage. This stat doesn't differenciate between 50k dealt against Destroyers and 50k dealt against a Battleship.

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Starts new thread exactly the same as old one and didn't listen to the advice before. Expects different result? I suggest you go read the excellent advice before.  Or you can continue to believe everything is controlled by wg and your fate is sealed. The choice is yours. 

Edited by RipNuN2

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I was trying to bring this issue to this forum attention before and of course I just got trolled

No- things were explained and you refused to take any advice since it did not fit into your preconceived notions and since you did nto get the response you wanted - "I got trolled"...  And now you are trying a second time to see if you can hear what you want.  Then you .will complain about being trolled 'again'.

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Well, this thread has exposed all the wargaming sock puppets! Success!

Oh, wait

Quote

 

Right, so having looked at your stats, I make the following observations: 

  • You have played a very large number of ships, but have relatively few battles in each of them; 
  • You have a large number of premium ships, both low and high tier; 
    • Many with extremely low number of battles, including Perth and Nelson (2 battles each). 
  • Your tech tree ships are mainly low to mid-tier.

 

  •  

Sorry OP, you are merely a bad player.  EVERYONE knows that owning premiums artificially inflates your win rate, as WG gives you superior MM and RNG when you use them because you spent money on the game. If you can't win with that advantage... well.... git gud is all I can say.

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1 minute ago, evilleMonkeigh said:

EVERYONE knows that owning premiums artificially inflates your win rate, as WG gives you superior MM and RNG when you use them because you spent money on the game.

NOW who needs a tin-foil hat?

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5 hours ago, Adalbertt said:

I was trying to bring this issue to this forum attention before and of course I just got trolled. It's very interesting that almost all the forum trolls are very loyal to Wargaming and fiercely attack anyone who wants to bring any issues to the forum attention. Anyone who has a business and hired PR agency knows that some "players" on this forum are basically hired by Wargaming people who's job is to praise what Wargaming does and to discourage anyone from saying anything bad about what WG does. Their job is to "improve company's image". it's a very common business practice. Of course there are those who just troll others because of their personality issues, but I don't thing those are majority here. I rarely see someone who praises WG being trolled in such a fierce full way as those who complaint about something. Also trolling not present to this extent in the game chat or other non-Wargaming WoWS forums.

I have found some answers outside this forum about melting teams, but I hope to find out more here. Anyway, here is the situation:

In the past weeks my average XP have improved by about 5%. My kill ratio is 1.32. My average XP in ranked battles is over 1400 and over 1000 in random battles. My win ratio used to be 53% for a several months but some time ago my daily win ratio usually stays at 20 - 30%. On average I take SECOND place by XP in my team and I'm the one of last surviving ships. In every game that is a Defeat, my XP within my team is 1st or 2nd. In Victory games it's on average 4th. My teams just melt. Looks like MM keeps putting me constantly in teams of weak players. Clearly when there are 23 other players my low win ratio is not caused by my skills. Even AFK games have average 40% win ratio, not 20. Again, I'm on average 2nd most experienced player by XP in my team (post game stats). This situation affects my account since August. It is very consistent. On a good day I get 40-50% win ratio but that's rare (once every 5-6 days). While getting such a low win ratio in the last days I got number of achievements like Kraken (up to 8 kills) or Witherer. My average account XP have improved by 5%. Isn't that interesting?

I have done an experiment: I have created second account some time ago, and when I play using that second account my win ratio is at 52% on average. On a bad days I get 40%, but then there are days when I get over 60% win ratio. When I switch to my original account i get 20% win ratio again. I have no doubt that Wargaming is manipulating (balancing) win ratio of players by MM player skill composition. They actually have a patent for doing this.

If you have experienced such thing, please let me know how long (how many games) it lasted until changed. Was there a threshold for an average win ratio that have triggered this?

 

Since no one can prove one way or another what WG's MM system is or isn't, there is nothing wrong with believing that it could be rigged. Whether it is or isn't, just keep playing..or take a breather change ships and tiers. there are days I am convinced its rigged and other where I win almost every game. But remember this there are only three great mystery's.....How did the Universe start, Women and WG's MM.....Simply unsolvable 

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48 minutes ago, Umikami said:

NOW who needs a tin-foil hat?

Silence, sycophantic wargaming puppet!  Just admit your premium gives you unfair advantage...    ....nice skills you "buy"

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4 hours ago, KaptainKaybe said:

...What's that old saying ... you can catch more flies with honey than vinegar? So stop being so vinegar, dude.

I spent lots of time on my grandfathers farm when I was a kid.

And I can tell you: Bullsh!+ and horsesh!+ reel 'em in better 'n anything.

Edited by MannyD_of_The_Sea
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6 hours ago, Adalbertt said:

 It's very interesting that almost all the forum trolls are very loyal to Wargaming and fiercely attack anyone who wants to bring any issues to the forum attention. Anyone who has a business and hired PR agency knows that some "players" on this forum are basically hired by Wargaming people who's job is to praise what Wargaming does and to discourage anyone from saying anything bad about what WG does. Their job is to "improve company's image". it's a very common business practice.

 

So we're to believe that you got trolled by WG shills, but we're to take it on faith that you aren't an "anti-shill"?

 

That's a common business practice too.

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