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CAPT_BAIUS

AA build USN battleships

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So I've recently unlocked Nagato, and less recently Bismarck, and wanted to return to grinding the USN line that I abandoned with NY.  My question to all seasoned USN captains is what builds do you run on your NCs and Iowas as this captain will eventually be in those boats? 

 

Personally, I feel the USN battleships are some of the most versatile.  An AA build is tempting with BFT, AFT and manual AA but is BFT worth it? Can the AA still be ferocious with just manual AA?  

 

I feel like speccing AA that much is a big waste when you won't see carriers in half your battles and I've heard what a monster NC can be with concealment expert.  

 

Anyways I can't wait to hear your thoughts! 

Edited by CAPT_BAIUS

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Manual AA a waste of points, just BFT and AFT is more than enough to defend yourself (plus that boost to secondaries sometimes is useful). I found more interesting concealment expert, makes some nasty surprises on the USN battleships.

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Manual AA is a waste of points. AFT is better simply by the range extension and doing the math. Manual AA doesn't help secondaries in anyway, so unless you're fighting a CV with planes in range it serves no practical use. You need 4 points to use it so you either sacrafice 2 or 3 other choices, substitutes out AFT, which immediatly nerfs manual AA with less range before you factor in the remaining DPS loss, or you sacrafice CE, which is key to any USN BB build.

 

Manual AA is only truly viable on a ship that has strong 127mm+ AA guns as part of an already solid AA setup where other points aren't better spent elsewhere.

 

Seeing as that leaves no ships as a viable choice for this skill, and it is a build that would truly only make sense on a USN ship, don't hold your breath on it being viable anytime soon.

 

War Gaming has been asked multiple times about how wasteful these hard earned points are in any game where there is no CV or they just flat out avoid you and it has been met with what amounts to the middle finger, neither recognizing a problem, nor even hinting at a resolution. As long as CV changes are being made and resultung issues addressed in such a half assed manner the problem will never be addressed. 

 

War Gaming has already stated how they feel the NA community whines to much, so I try my best to not be surprised at their disinterest.

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Ignore everyone who's saying manual AA should be ignored. For US BB's at least it's straight better than AFT for all T6+ except Colorado.

 

Check link in my sig for maths involved.

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I went on AA and Stealth build on NC and Iowa.

And a fire starter build on the Montana.

 

Also while having Manual AA on NC and Iowa...

Edited by DJ_PON3_ZaNe

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I don't usually build for AA on them too much as most CVs avoid you anyway until late game when your AA is likely blown up from HE spam. 

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Why would you put any points into AA builds? At T6+ how many CVs do you see per game, I am guessing 10% of games have a CV. Your AA is already good enough, unless you like to potato around alone and wait to get deleted by a CV, then no amount of AA will save you. IMO, best USN BB build is a CE / survival hybrid.

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49 minutes ago, CAPT_BAIUS said:

Out of curiousity, does anyone not use an aa build captain on American BBs? 

I built a couple of my USN BBs for AA. Texas of course, as well as Colorado since it's very likely to see Saipans and Kagas. Iowa has a partial AA build just to annoy whatever Saipans and Kagas get into a match with me, but the rest of the line I skipped AA builds because they either have insufficient AA power to make it worthwhile (like Arizona) or CVs are rare at the tier and the ones that do appear avoid me anyways until my AA mounts have been BBQ'd (like Montana).

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14 hours ago, Fastwolf66 said:

Manual AA a waste of points, just BFT and AFT is more than enough to defend yourself (plus that boost to secondaries sometimes is useful). I found more interesting concealment expert, makes some nasty surprises on the USN battleships.

Yeah pretty much this, don't waste that extra set of 4 points on MFAA considering the AA is mostly in the bofors and not the 5 inchers. 

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Carriers are becoming less and less frequent in battles.  AA builds just don't make as much sense as they used to, especially if your in a BB and the necessity of fire prevention.

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12 hours ago, CAPT_BAIUS said:

Out of curiousity, does anyone not use an aa build captain on American BBs? 

 

I have both. My New York shares a 10pt captain with Texas and I have BFT and AFT (PM & EM). MFCAA doesn't work on AA guns less than 85mm, so I won't get that for those two ships. I plan on adding some survivability to this captain.

 

With all the fire spewed at high tier, a combo survivability is what I'm going for there. My 13pt Colorado captain has PM, EM, BoS, CE, HA plus 1 pt. I plan on getting BFT and AFT to round out the 19 pts to help with AA and secondaries.

 

The South Carolina and Wyoming have low captains and I'll go survivability first on them and may not even spec for AA as the low tier planes are not devastating as the CVs only have 3 squadrons.

 

All of my T5+ US BBs have the AA module to increase the range and the aux gun module to make the AA and secondaries last longer by giving them +100% health.

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If it's a captain you can to use as you progress up the tree, the go with T1 skill Preventive Maintenance, T2 Expert Marksman, T3 Basics of Survivability, T4 AFT. Come back around and get T2 Adrenaline Rush and T4 Concealment Expert

 

For my permanent Colorado I run AA build because 87 AA rating at T7 while still regularly running into T5/6 and sometimes 7 CVs is just plain lulz because most players don't think a Colorado has good AA. I've been called hacker by many CV players lol

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The point of going AA build is to shoot down as many planes as possible before they drop their payload on your head. Your stereotypical USN BB with CE and AFT will only shoot down a minimal amount of planes from an equal tier CV before getting nuked. It's only when the empty planes are returning to the CV does the AA actually start shredding them, but the damage was already done.

 

I've used stealth, fire prevention, and AA builds on my Iowa and Montana before. If a Taihou sends 12 TBs after me in my Iowa/Montana, and I only have AFT, I'm pretty much guaranteed to lose half of my HP without team support. With AA build, I will wipe out at least 8-10 TBs by myself before they can even strike me. If you want to give yourself a good amount of protection against planes without relying on your teammates, you need BFT + AFT + MAA. For my Montana, I have one captain dedicated to fire prevention, and the other to full AA.

 

CVs are a rarity these days, but they're without question the most dangerous type of ship you can encounter on the enemy team. Personally, I can live without the extra stealth and fire prevention, but if I'm not running full AA build and a wild CV looks at my Montana with a lascivious gleam in its eyes, I'm toast. 

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4 hours ago, Raptor_alcor said:

Yeah pretty much this, don't waste that extra set of 4 points on MFAA considering the AA is mostly in the bofors and not the 5 inchers. 

 

Nope, the majority is in the DP guns actually. They shoot for longer that that makes them more effective. For a full build montana >60% of the output comes from the DP guns.

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Tier VIII+ USN BBs?  The typical build is the AA+Stealth Hybrid.

 

Traits centering on BFT, AFT, CE (w/ concealment camo).  This helps a lot the powerful AA suite of VII+ USN BBs.  A bit less for VII Colorado but for the VIII+ USN BBs with their strong dual purpose guns, it's a game changer, on top of the 40mm bofors, etc.  CE with concealment camo bring their detection ranges down quite well.  VIII North Carolina can be brought down to as low as 11.8km detection range.

 

Upgrades featuring AAGM2 and APRM2 for Tier IX+.  APRM2 is only possible for the IX+ USN BBs, NC & AL at Tier VIII don't get this option.  With BFT, AFT, and AAGM2 upgrade, you have set powerful AA to make runs against you more costly.  It won't make you immune to air attacks, but CVs tend to look for other targets than a USN BB early on.  Realize even with this, you'd still be stupid to take your USN BB sailing alone in a CV match.  With APRM2, you buff your main battery dispersion by 11% instead of the 7% other BB lines get with ASM1.

 

The AA+Stealth USN BB Hybrid Build gives you great stealth and respectable AA, while allowing you to improve your main battery performance for Tier IX+.  No other BB Line can do this. 

 

If a Non-USN BB player wants great AA, they have to give up ASM1, SBM2.

If a Non-USN BB player wants tighter main battery dispersion, then SBM2, AAGM2 is not possible.

If a Non-USN BB player wants great secondaries, then ASM1, AAGM2 is not possible.

 

This is all due to how the Upgrade System works uniquely for High Tier USN BBs.  It is why Iowa, Missouri, Montana can be deadly shooters at range while having good stealth, and AA to make CVs consider other targets first.

7 hours ago, alphainfinity said:

Carriers are becoming less and less frequent in battles.  AA builds just don't make as much sense as they used to, especially if your in a BB and the necessity of fire prevention.

The problem is when a CV does show up, it becomes a problem.  A very, very big problem.  And in some of these tiers, i.e. Tier VII+, a game ending problem that sends the BB back to port.

Kaga

Graf Zeppelin

Hiryu

Shokaku

Taiho

Hakuryu

Strike USN CV

 

These can lay a big amount of damage.  Some like Kaga will do an insane amount of alpha strike damage.  With even a decent AA build, you can mitigate these attacks to hurt you for a lot less by swatting down more planes so less cr*p hits your ship.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

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My Iowa has a AA build, AFT + manual AA + slot 2 AA module. I must say this makes my Iowa a AA monster, i can melt planes. Other day i saved a ally Bismarck from a full air strike from the T10 IJN CV. 

 

The only problem is that CVs arent very common, this can change with the USN CV rework. But when you do get a CV its totally worth it. 

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21 hours ago, CAPT_BAIUS said:

Out of curiousity, does anyone not use an aa build captain on American BBs? 

Been driving the Monty for awhile now, and I haven't run even a partial aa build since the new Mexico at t6 close to two year ago when cvs we're far more plentiful.

 

Usn bbs are the Jack of all trades, master of none bbs.  Their strength lies in their versatility and never being at a particular disadvantage in any given scenario (like the gk at range or yammy brawling).

 

I go fire prevention and concealment build.  A sneaky big boat that won't burn down in a fight.  Cvs are too rare to build around the eventuality of seeing one at all, let alone being the one ship out of twelve on your team to be targeted.

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For the T7 Colorado straight through to Montana I have gone with the AA Mod and BFT/AFT for the Capt. No need for manual AA Capt skill IMO.

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I wish they would combine manual AA and manual secondaries into the same captain skill.

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On 11/27/2017 at 8:15 AM, Fastwolf66 said:

Manual AA a waste of points, just BFT and AFT is more than enough to defend yourself (plus that boost to secondaries sometimes is useful). I found more interesting concealment expert, makes some nasty surprises on the USN battleships.

  This^^^

  With BFT; AFT; and AA upgrade2, Nor-Cal is nearly at 100 for AA.  Heck- I don't think I have even BFT on mine, and it still eats squadrons like handfuls of popcorn.  (logging on to game to check)

  16 point captain:

Priority Target.  always useful to know when and how many are pointing their guns at you.  Esp useful to know when it's safe to unmask that rear turret!

Expert Marksman.  A no brainer for BB's.

Adrenaline Rush.  Makes you even more strong towards the end of the game, as damage taken = faster reloads.

Basics of Survivability.  This section is lousy with good choices for BB's, and I've considered ditching the second 4 pointer, so I can get BoS; BFT; AND Superintendant.  (and adding Preventative Maintenance to keep my AA guns alive longer)  You're a BB- you will burn, and occasionally flood.  BoS speeds up their auto repair.

AFT. 

Fire Prevention.

Upgrades:

Auxiliary armaments mod 1.   Useful for keeping the AA guns and secondaries alive longer in the World of Fire Spam.

AA Guns Modification 2.  Stacks with AFT to boost the AA range.

Damage control System mod 1.  Just because.

Steering Gears mod 2.  worth it!  Makes torpedo beating easier.  Not to mention covering your citadel when multiple reds are looking at you.

Concealment upgrade.  I went with this instead of CE, so I could get fire prevention and AFT.

  This is my survivability/AA hybrid build.   As it stands, I plan to complete it with Superintendent, for the extra heal.

With just AFT and AA guns 2, I have a 99 AA rating.   Shooting down planes is NOT a problem, lol.

  As this ship is a keeper, it has a dedicated captain.

My 19 point captain is on Colorado, and is shared with my premium ships- even Indy.   Same build, but with CE instead of Fire Prevention.  ( this captain was completed pre- RN BB's)  It gives Colorado a 77 AA rating.   When I use it on 'Bama (which is most of the time, lol), it gives that ship a 97 AA rating.

Monty's captain is a work in progress, as I stole Steven Seagal off my Nicholas for the boost to turret traverse.

12 points with 2 unused:

Preventative Maintenance

Expert Marksman

Basics of Survivability

Fire Prevention.

  So far it's a pure survivability/main battery build.

upgrades:

Auxiliary Armaments

AA guns 2

Artillery Plotting room 2

Damage Control 1

Rudder mod 2

Concealment 1

  Even with just that AA2 upgrade, it has a 95 AA rating.  

I plan on continuing the current build, as it's AA is already excellent.  It is also a nasty monster to enemy surface ships.

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Actually the DP guns are a sizable chunk of the DPS on tier 8+ USN BB 

 

When carriers were more common i used to go manual AA, and it was quite troll :Smile-_tongue:

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6 minutes ago, Fletcher7_1944 said:

  This^^^

  With BFT; AFT; and AA upgrade2, Nor-Cal is nearly at 100 for AA.  Heck- I don't think I have even BFT on mine, and it still eats squadrons like handfuls of popcorn.  (logging on to game to check)

 

Fletcher here are the AA ratings for US BB T7+ with AAGM2 and a Capt w/ BFT/AFT. The Colorado at T7 is where the AA starts to get really good but the big jump is at T8. 

  • T7 Colorado - 84
  • T8 North Carolina - 100
  • T9 Iowa - 100
  • T10 Montana - 100

I don't have a Capt with enough points on New Mexico at T6 to give the full rating but a T6 NM with AAGM2 and a Capt w/ BFT has a 57 rating (so probably around 60-65 w/ AFT).

 

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18 minutes ago, Fletcher7_1944 said:

(and adding Preventative Maintenance to keep my AA guns alive longer) 

Unfortunately, Preventative Maintenance does nothing to help out AA guns.

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