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KaptainKaybe

PSA: For the Love of All That Is Good, Please Stop Lemming Training Along One Flank in Standard Battle Already!

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This is a rant. I hate being that guy, but here it is. STOP LEMMING TRAINING ON A SINGLE FLANK IN STANDARD BATTLES!

 

You see, I have this curse. Or at least it seems like a curse due to the disproportionate number of times it happens on my Warspite (at least 75% of the time ... it's uncanny). Every time I load into Standard Battle in my Warspite, this always happens. Always. My team lemming trains to one side of the map. Some of the time, I have hope as I'll see a couple of cruisers and battleships turning with me towards a flank ... and then turn around, leaving me alone to cover an entire flank by myself. 1 tier VI Royal Navy battleship on one side, 11 ships on the other.

 

Now here I'm stuck with an impossible decision. Do I abandon my flank to dramatically increase my odds of survival at the risk of us being surrounded? Do I stay on that flank to delay the enemy push as long as possible before I die? I typically do the former because I have this faint hope that my team will wise up and turn back to give me a hand. I'll have spotted a half dozen ships coming towards me and pinging the map like mad. But it never seems to happen. And I do mean absolutely never.

 

Now you're probably thinking: "Oh you worry too much ... your team is pushing hard on one flank and will overrun the enemy there before splitting back to defend the base they left behind. Everything will be fine!" Yeah, you're so cute. I want to hug you for being so charmingly delusional. I wish I could live in your fantasy world too as it sounds ... awesome. But no. that never happens. Instead, the team stalls and goes full dear in headlights, no longer knowing where to move and then go camping behind an island when they start taking fire from two sides. So no matter how much I delay the enemy team, the odds means I get focus fired scarily fast, no matter how well I angle and wiggle my royal derriere.

 

So again ... guy ... and girls ... please stop with the lemming trains already. It's not that difficult to grok. I really love the Warspite ... she has great guns and great agility. But I am really tired of losing in this, my cursed ship. Could you please give this poor schlob a chance and not go full ret**d? Just for once? Please? Pleeeease?

Edited by KaptainKaybe
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Preach on Kap'n.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. When allies start trading paint: some realizing base is open, while others are turning tail(though they have the numbers advantage.. go figure. Bad habits die hard?), as well as the few pushing on... it turns into mayhem. It's a mess.

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If they all lemmingtrain one way; go with them.... don’t be stupid to hold the entire line by yourself... Did it a lot of times and died a lot of times as one of the first ingame because the enemy focused fire on me....

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I have said the same thing in the forums and have had so many tell me it works all of the time that it is a valid tactic.  The reality is all you can do is hope you and hopefully one other ship stays with you and you can delay them - it is your only real hope of winning (well the other team being bad is the other hope and they get rolled).

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If you are in the right ship(fast BB, cruiser with good gun range, DD) you can kite and survive with weak side delaying actions, but the team still probably loses if the lemming train stalls.

If the team lemmings wins are possible but they need to push HARD.

..

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The only time I will go solo at the other side of the map requires the following.

1. I'm in an IJN DD with good concealment

2. Enemy DD's have worse concealment than I do with at least a 1km buffer, they must also be few in number or spotted at other locations

3. Enemy must not have a CV

If the above happens, I'll kite them all day long dropping torps. It's actually exactly how I prefer to run my Shiratsuyu if it's on tier because with torpedo reload module I can generally line up a good starting 16 torpedo drop and if I plan it right I'll have the BB's on my team taking shots. This generally means the enemy team's BB's begin to engage them and most of the time they will believe one of them got spotted by another BB. Works quite well actually but if any of the following above is against you, good luck.

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imo it's fine as long as you can get back and defend base if needed. 

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34 minutes ago, Dr_Powderfinger said:

If you are in the right ship(fast BB, cruiser with good gun range, DD) you can kite and survive with weak side delaying actions, but the team still probably loses if the lemming train stalls.

If the team lemmings wins are possible but they need to push HARD.

Which is frustrating when you're in the Texas, and the lemmings get stalled by spotting one DD. 

Only way to win with the lemming train is if the train steams into the enemy base FAST.  If not, it's pretty much game over so just farm whatever damage you can before your imminent death. 

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 I want to hug you for being so charmingly delusional. I wish I could live in your fantasy world too as it sounds ... awesome. No offense intended. This is my favorite sentence ever in forum. If I am in Warspite I need to hug other slower ships never be last never be first. People treat you like first boyfriend (stick around tell something cuter shows up). Charming delusional, this is great to, this game brings the very best heard instincts out. I find myself letting out the occasional moo. as I run with heard. And you can live in this fantasy world also just give up some self-respect, good judgment and any self-identity you have. Always room in heard (just do not be injured one they leave you behind to occupy predators).

59e48795c1b78_images(1).jpg.fcbfeaae72a00743e79df5bba8eb23ed.jpg

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As I see this and hit F3 "Defend the Base" SPAM button ad-nauseum.

It's a game.   And it's far more entertaining to charge the enemy, then crawl into a fox-hole to wait.

I used to see this mistake all the time in the Newport scenario.

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I call it the fish school effect, swimming nose to tail up some flank, with trepidation leery of taking even the nearest cap. Like a hurricane that skirts the coast and heads out to sea to peter out, the caps fall to the reds one by one, the fish school circles aimlessly as the orcas close in on their timorous 'fishball' defense:

Fishball.jpg.de38fe1d15cc3caa87e1c041e3f05d6a.jpg

 

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6 hours ago, Lionel92 said:

If they all lemmingtrain one way; go with them.... don’t be stupid to hold the entire line by yourself... Did it a lot of times and died a lot of times as one of the first ingame because the enemy focused fire on me....

I guess this is what OP is talking about.

Standard battle - hello - not domination.

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I totally agree with the OP.

But the train is not the worst of it.  The lemmings generally start by going for a cap.  That's the sum total of the plan.  They get over to one side and cap, then it's like 12 individual lobotomies: "Derp, what do we do now?"  Some want to sit and hold the cap.  Others react to the carnage that's occurring elsewhere ("Save the CV!") and race off too late.  Others, seeing that all the other caps are red, head for the nearest to take it back.  (As I said in chat last night, "CAPS DON'T MATTER IF YOU'RE ALL DEAD".)

Yes, the lemming train can work, largely because a concentrated mass of ships is very powerful.  But it's practically impossible to employ effectively, and can be countered by ships working individually that now have a common target to concentrate on.

 

Not that any lemmings will ever read this... <sigh>

 

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You remind them before game starts it's a standard battle, don't all go the same way....they do anyways. You and 1 other ship scout and try to defend wide open side. Your scouting reveals heavy push on your base from open side, which is easily visible on mini map. Lemmings don't respond. You tell them that the enemy is attacking the weak side. They don't respond. You get sunk vainly defending the base. They don't respond. The enemy starts capping. They don't respond. The enemy is about half way done capping..."defend the base" they say. Too late you say and ask why they ignored your earlier warnings. You are told to STFU. It will never change.

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Your post is offensive to re***ds. My cousin functions on a 4th grade level and can't legally sign contracts or have a credit card in his name. Yet he plays better than the players in question.

 

I wish you would refer to them instead as "non-sentient beings".

 

/:Smile-_tongue:

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10 hours ago, Lionel92 said:

If they all lemmingtrain one way; go with them.... don’t be stupid to hold the entire line by yourself... Did it a lot of times and died a lot of times as one of the first ingame because the enemy focused fire on me....

i would rather just leave the abortion-in-the-making than sink the level of the stupid and hand the enemy team the win just so i don't risk getting my paint scratched.

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6 minutes ago, Shadeylark said:

i would rather just leave the abortion-in-the-making than sink the level of the stupid and hand the enemy team the win just so i don't risk getting my paint scratched.

True but sometimes you need to leave your pride...

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10 minutes ago, Lionel92 said:

True but sometimes you need to leave your pride...

i take more pride in not associating myself with those who are doomed to mediocrity (at best), or providing aid those who refuse to help themselves (aka leeches and thieves), than i do in fighting to the bitter end.

 

the only time fighting to the bitter end is something worth taking pride in, is when you have a reason for it.  there is nothing to take pride in fighting to the bitter end when the only thing you're fighting to defend is someone who would just turn around and bend over and beg for more if you weren't there.

 

fighting to the bitter end with these sorts of morons is about as pointless as fighting to defend the honor of a $2 hooker on payday.

Edited by Shadeylark

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9 hours ago, Dr_Powderfinger said:

 

If you are in the right ship(fast BB, cruiser with good gun range, DD) you can kite and survive with weak side delaying actions, but the team still probably loses if the lemming train stalls.

If the team lemmings wins are possible but they need to push HARD.

..

the problem with lemming trains is that it only takes one or two enemies to slow it down or flat out stop it, while the rest of the enemy pushes in.

 

or worse, when all but 1 or 2 of the enemy meet your lemming train, and those 1 or 2 that didn't cap everything behind you.

 

either way, the only way the lemming train wins is when it doesn't get slowed down... and considering the types of players that tend to lemming train are the types of players that hate to get their paint scratched, you're not gonna see a lemming train push through the gauntlet like it needs to except on such rare occasions that they are barely even worth mentioning.

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There is absolutely nothing wrong with going strong to one side in standard battle. Just have to know when to flex back if they go strong on the opposite side. If you are in a slow BB don't over commit.

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I tend to follow the lemming train to an extent. Follow it, but play to the middle of the map a bit more. So you have backup but you can rush back to base if you need to. You can't rely on your team to win the game by pushing, but you can make sure the other team either.

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The idea of the lemming train is a strong push against the enemy with consolidated resources. The reality of most lemming train is a force of multiple ships is either stopped cold or half of them run in terror at the sight of an enemy DD.

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There's a big difference between lemmings and a BB train.  'Line ahead' BBs form a very powerful unit, but they are hard to play.  You can't stop, you pretty much can't waggle, and the ones behind must follow the one in front.  A DD will wreck the formation unless it's guarded by cruisers.  So you almost never see one intentionally played.

 

 

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