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Ricky_Racer

?? Are US Battleships so slow

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Ricky_Racer    12

As the title states.

Why are they so slow?

I can get the Colorado, but that has a speed of 18.5. Even slower than the New Mexico I currently sail. It makes it really hard to get into the fight. No matter how hard I try, I seem to get into the fight either too late, or, all I can do is hope our team is dominating so I can get some damage posted or even a kill or two. But I can not get to where I want to be to help dictate the out come. Plus, the dispersion is really bad when compared to the other nations.

I notice the other nations have Battleships, same tier, with speed much higher, not to mention some have torpedoes and some, can shoot me even though I can not shoot them back. Retaliate.

Why?

Am I playing the wrong nation?

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Lert    15,687

Fully upgraded Colorado has a speed of 21 because that's what it historically did. Speed is one of those historical aspects that WG doesn't like to mess with, although some 'destroyers' are faster than they probably would've been if they'd ever been built.

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AtlanticRim    23

The US has great or OK everything else (Shell stats, gun stats, AA,torp protection, consumables, etc). The downside is the speed.

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warpath_33    51

Every USN battleship tiers 3-7 is a "standard battleship" which means they all share the same 21 knot speed so that they could all sail in a neat little battle line.

Edited by warpath_33
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Ricky_Racer    12
2 minutes ago, Canadatron said:

Realism is so fun, right?

 

 

Well, it's obvious, we didn't win the battles of the sea during WWII because the US had better ships.

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BiggieD61    216
1 minute ago, warpath_33 said:

Every USN battleship tiers 3-10 is a "standard battleship" which means they all share the same 21 knot speed so that they could all sail in a neat little battle line.

Except that the tier 8, 9 and 10 all go significantly faster - a design so that they wouldn't be left behind by CV task groups.

 

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warpath_33    51
Just now, BiggieD61 said:

Except that the tier 8, 9 and 10 all go significantly faster - a design so that they wouldn't be left behind by CV task groups.

I know, fixed that.

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Ricky_Racer    12
3 minutes ago, Lert said:

although some 'destroyers' are faster than they probably would've been if they'd ever been built.

So, the US ships are purposely "demoted" or the other nations are ""intentionally" given abilities they really never had?

Does War Gaming have some personal grudge against the US?

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4 minutes ago, Ricky_Racer said:

 

All Battleships in the US tech tree below the North Carolina were built under Battleship Doctrine. They were limited to a speed of about 20-25 knots. This was done so that in theory you would always have your Capital Ships sailing together to maximize firepower. However this is a pre-WW I doctrine and with the power of aircraft carriers and torpedoes it is a doctrine that was quickly abandoned after Prearl Harbor.

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Silver_kun    85

When you reach the North Carolina the real fun starts and from Iowa you get the amazing speed (It is currently the fastest battleship alongside Missouri contrasting most of the line).

 

There are quite a few BB's with torps in-game. The Gneisenau (One of my favourites) it's premium counterpart Scharnhorst,, the Tirpitz, The KII and I believe even the Mutsu. All the mentioned ones are premium except Gneisenau.

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Lert    15,687
1 minute ago, Ricky_Racer said:

So, the US ships are purposely "demoted"

Nope.

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Ricky_Racer    12
3 minutes ago, BiggieD61 said:

Except that the tier 8, 9 and 10 all go significantly faster - a design so that they wouldn't be left behind by CV task groups.

 

I am fairly new to the game, but from what I have read, tier 8 thru 10 Battleships don't compare with the tier 8 thru 10 Battleships from other nations. Except for maybe the North Carolina. But then my reading says she will get put against tier 10's most of the time. Kind of a disadvantage.

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mofton    908

The 18kt without upgrade is kinda rubbish. As WG have gotten rid of many of the worst of the former 'A' hulls (Amagi, Fuso etc.) there's certainly a justification for at least starting at 21kt stock.

Colorado and the USN standards never did 18.6 as a top speed so it doesn't make much sense. Those 2.4kt make a bigger difference than say the 1.4kt you gain from 26.6 to 28kt on KGV to go from fine to fine (which similarly makes no sense).

Jumping straight to 21kt is the least WG can do.

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warpath_33    51
Just now, Ricky_Racer said:

I am fairly new to the game, but from what I have read, tier 8 thru 10 Battleships don't compare with the tier 8 thru 10 Battleships from other nations. Except for maybe the North Carolina. But then my reading says she will get put against tier 10's most of the time. Kind of a disadvantage.

You see, there's this wonderful thing called aircraft. You may not have seen them before because no sane aircraft carrier will send planes with 5 km of you unless you're the only possible target.

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Silver_kun    85
Just now, warpath_33 said:

You see, there's this wonderful thing called aircraft. You may not have seen them before because no sane aircraft carrier will send planes with 5 km of you unless you're the only possible target.

Yeah lol, you have magic AA guns that shred planes.

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Silver_kun    85
2 minutes ago, Ricky_Racer said:

I am fairly new to the game, but from what I have read, tier 8 thru 10 Battleships don't compare with the tier 8 thru 10 Battleships from other nations. Except for maybe the North Carolina. But then my reading says she will get put against tier 10's most of the time. Kind of a disadvantage.

Iowa is one of the favourite Battleships in game, and It is truly amazing, Montana also has the highest damaging broadside though it's not as attractive anymore compared to other nations for some.

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MDTJ    33
2 minutes ago, mofton said:

The 18kt without upgrade is kinda rubbish. As WG have gotten rid of many of the worst of the former 'A' hulls (Amagi, Fuso etc.) there's certainly a justification for at least starting at 21kt stock.

Colorado and the USN standards never did 18.6 as a top speed so it doesn't make much sense. Those 2.4kt make a bigger difference than say the 1.4kt you gain from 26.6 to 28kt on KGV to go from fine to fine (which similarly makes no sense).

Jumping straight to 21kt is the least WG can do.

^This. Why WG gimped the already slowest line in the game with an imaginary stock speed of 18.5 knots when they un-necessarily (IMO) hand out fictitious speed buffs to others is difficult to comprehend. If the others went realistic speeds this line wouldn't stand out so poorly in terms of speed.

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American standard type battleships are pretty much what they were. They are all large, heavily armored, but very slow ships. Remember that all of them on the tech tree before tier 8 are WW1 era designs. They don't focus on speed, they focus on line battle taking damage and dealing it out. Engines are no where near as efficient and many even modernized, it was mostly focused on fighting capability over speed. They were not fast attack ships.

The three fast battleships designs (North Carolina, South Dakota, and Iowa) are a departure from the traditional line of battle thinking. They use armor schemes called everything or nothing. Instead of solid armor all around, it's focused on protecting the major points of the ship. Secondly, they are much, much larger with massive engine spaces within and modern equipment. They were built to keep up with Carrier task forces or rapidly respond to situations.

Colorado are the last class completed and finished per the terms of the Washington Naval Treaty, after that it's a 20 some odd year hiatus for Battleship building in the US. So there is a large technology change between the time of the last standard and the first fast battleships.

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BiggieD61    216
6 minutes ago, Ricky_Racer said:

I am fairly new to the game, but from what I have read, tier 8 thru 10 Battleships don't compare with the tier 8 thru 10 Battleships from other nations. Except for maybe the North Carolina. But then my reading says she will get put against tier 10's most of the time. Kind of a disadvantage.

I think you will find that the Iowa/Missouri stack up quite nicely versus the Izumo, Friederich der Grosse and the Lion.  I certainly don't find them underpowered at ALL. 

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Ricky_Racer    12
6 minutes ago, Fog_Repair_Ship_Akashi said:

All Battleships in the US tech tree below the North Carolina were built under Battleship Doctrine. They were limited to a speed of about 20-25 knots. This was done so that in theory you would always have your Capital Ships sailing together to maximize firepower. However this is a pre-WW I doctrine and with the power of aircraft carriers and torpedoes it is a doctrine that was quickly abandoned after Prearl Harbor.

So, because the other nations did not follow such a doctrine, War Gaming has chosen to follow the same, illegal, non-confirming, "we're going to do what we want" mentallity, thus making it intentionally, unbalanced. If this is the case, why did the US Navy continue to dominate? If War Gaming is trying to make it balanced then why are the US Battleships put into such a disadvantage? Sorry. I don't get the fairness.

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warpath_33    51
1 minute ago, Ricky_Racer said:

So, because the other nations did not follow such a doctrine, War Gaming has chosen to follow the same, illegal, non-confirming, "we're going to do what we want" mentallity, thus making it intentionally, unbalanced. If this is the case, why did the US Navy continue to dominate? If War Gaming is trying to make it balanced then why are the US Battleships put into such a disadvantage? Sorry. I don't get the fairness.

:fish_palm:

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Ricky_Racer    12
6 minutes ago, Silver_kun said:

Iowa is one of the favourite Battleships in game, and It is truly amazing, Montana also has the highest damaging broadside though it's not as attractive anymore compared to other nations for some.

Maybe the Montana used to be, but it seems like it got demoted as well. Not really up to par with the new ships that came on board.

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Silver_kun    85
2 minutes ago, Ricky_Racer said:

So, because the other nations did not follow such a doctrine, War Gaming has chosen to follow the same, illegal, non-confirming, "we're going to do what we want" mentallity, thus making it intentionally, unbalanced. If this is the case, why did the US Navy continue to dominate? If War Gaming is trying to make it balanced then why are the US Battleships put into such a disadvantage? Sorry. I don't get the fairness.

It's called being "Historically Accurate" Besides the NC and Iowa are in themselves a reward I feel. 

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NCC81701    170
1 minute ago, Ricky_Racer said:

Maybe the Montana used to be, but it seems like it got demoted as well. Not really up to par with the new ships that came on board.

 

Maybe instead of mouthing off how high tier USN BB play, you should try to play them and form your own opinion. You have 350 games and maxed out at tier 6, you have no idea what you are talking about. 

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