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OgreMkV

US and other call Loot Boxes - Gambling

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Well, this is interesting and could affect WGs sales model (especially Christmas boxes). 

Basically, Belgium declared loot boxes purchased for money with unknown contents "gambling". The US Rep from Hawaii wants to do the same to protect kids from "Predatory practices" from the "gaming industry". 

 

This all started with EA's Star Wars Battlefront, but WG's Christmas crates probably fall into the same category. 

https://hexus.net/gaming/news/industry/112424-us-politician-says-ea-created-star-wars-themed-online-casino/

 

https://www.engadget.com/2017/11/22/belgium-moves-to-ban-star-wars-battlefront-2-style-loot-boxes/

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It is gambling.

There is a reason for "Parental Guidance" rating.

The Parent or Guardian shouldn't give their children credit cards willy nilly

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12 minutes ago, OgreMkV said:

 

This all started with EA's Star Wars Battlefront, but WG's Christmas crates probably fall into the same category. 

EA is *far* from who started this. Valve isn't even who started it but their original loot crates (TF2) were probably the first *big* ones to get bought and noticed by huge swaths of gamers.

7 minutes ago, MrDeaf said:

It is gambling.

There is a reason for "Parental Guidance" rating.

The Parent or Guardian shouldn't give their children credit cards willy nilly

It's not just children. Gambling addiction can *ruin* adults and I suspect the vast, vast, VAST majority of 'whales' the games' industry literally preys upon are *mostly* adults with independent incomes but severe gambling issues. That's the part of this that makes it so reprehensible.

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If anything, they'll just mandate that companies offering lootboxes have to use an "adult" rating for their games, which will effectively change nothing.

 

Just a guess, but if you care about the ratings on the games your kids play, you're probably not going to give them free access to your credit card to "gamble" with anyway.

 

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No kidding it's gambling. Last years santa crates was gambling. But it was about 30 bucks I didn't need and I got some great stuff out of it so I'm really not that mad about it.

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3 minutes ago, _RC1138 said:

EA is *far* from who started this. Valve isn't even who started it but their original loot crates (TF2) were probably the first *big* ones to get bought and noticed by huge swaths of gamers.

It's not just children. Gambling addiction can *ruin* adults and I suspect the vast, vast, VAST majority of 'whales' the games' industry literally preys upon are *mostly* adults with independent incomes but severe gambling issues. That's the part of this that makes it so reprehensible.

$1000/yr on a game is decidedly cheaper than what is possible at a casino.

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6 minutes ago, _RC1138 said:

EA is *far* from who started this. Valve isn't even who started it but their original loot crates (TF2) were probably the first *big* ones to get bought and noticed by huge swaths of gamers.

 

That's totally True, but it was the flap with EA's SW Battlefront that seems to have inspired the regulatory agencies and US House to get involved. It was huge. 
 

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3 minutes ago, MrDeaf said:

$1000/yr on a game is decidedly cheaper than what is possible at a casino.

Depends on your luck, what games you play, and how often you play. At any rate, it is still *very* screwed up to prey upon those that can't help themselves. Again, proof in the pudding as it were, it isn't people buying 1, or 2 loot boxes every now and then that are the source of most of this income, it is people buying $1000's of dollars a year worth of them, a.k.a. Whales. That by definition means you are a preying upon a small part of the population, which means that small part is more sustainable to a gambling tactic.

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2 minutes ago, OgreMkV said:

That's totally True, but it was the flap with EA's SW Battlefront that seems to have inspired the regulatory agencies and US House to get involved. It was huge. 

At best, it was the straw that broke the camel's back. But this has been the year of the loot crate. Overwatch, WoWs, COD, and many others shoe-horned in loot boxes where they traditionally did not belong, and it clearly has pissed off a great many people. IDK why BF2 was the straw that broke the back, but it was hardly the worst offender. To me, that still is and will be Dead Space 3.

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28 minutes ago, OgreMkV said:

Well, this is interesting and could affect WGs sales model (especially Christmas boxes). 

Basically, Belgium declared loot boxes purchased for money with unknown contents "gambling". The US Rep from Hawaii wants to do the same to protect kids from "Predatory practices" from the "gaming industry". 

 

This all started with EA's Star Wars Battlefront, but WG's Christmas crates probably fall into the same category. 

https://hexus.net/gaming/news/industry/112424-us-politician-says-ea-created-star-wars-themed-online-casino/

 

https://www.engadget.com/2017/11/22/belgium-moves-to-ban-star-wars-battlefront-2-style-loot-boxes/

 

Its about time the law caught up with those greedy EA a.s.s.h.o.l.e.s. Tear the whole thing down!

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4 minutes ago, _RC1138 said:

At best, it was the straw that broke the camel's back. But this has been the year of the loot crate. Overwatch, WoWs, COD, and many others shoe-horned in loot boxes where they traditionally did not belong, and it clearly has pissed off a great many people. IDK why BF2 was the straw that broke the back, but it was hardly the worst offender. To me, that still is and will be Dead Space 3.

 

 

I think it was the fact that the game had microtransactions associated with everything, it was kinda marketed like a mobile game.

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4 minutes ago, _RC1138 said:

At best, it was the straw that broke the camel's back. But this has been the year of the loot crate. Overwatch, WoWs, COD, and many others shoe-horned in loot boxes where they traditionally did not belong, and it clearly has pissed off a great many people. IDK why BF2 was the straw that broke the back, but it was hardly the worst offender. To me, that still is and will be Dead Space 3.

 

I suspect it was because it's "Star Wars" and not "Battlefront". If SW wasn't involved, I'd bet no one would care. 

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it is a game of chance, so in that sense it is gambling. Nevertheless, if the contents are unknown before purchase, they are always worth (according to WG) the cost of their purchase, while buyers know in advance, the possible contents. Morally, dubious, but just fine distinction enough to mean these boxes are not at the same level of gambling abuse as a game of casino roulette. 

Gambling it is, and no, minors should not be allowed to take part in it.

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As i understand it the christmas loot boxes only have stuff in them that is worth at least the money you pay for it. You never get less then the worth just you may get more. But I can see it being addictive.

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Just now, QinsCoCoPops said:

As i understand it the christmas loot boxes only have stuff in them that is worth at least the money you pay for it. You never get less then the worth just you may get more. But I can see it being addictive.

both points you make are true, but this does not make the loot boxes less than gambling. Where I live, a lucky dip at a local school for kids, where they are guaranteed to win something, requires an official gambling permit!

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At casinos you can get them back at the all you can eat buffet. I went over to the prime rib counter and said, "Hit me again!"

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2 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said:

At casinos you can get them back at the all you can eat buffet. I went over to the prime rib counter and said, "Hit me again!"

But if you spent too much then you would need quite the appetite to get the same value back by eating lol.

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5 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said:

At casinos you can get them back at the all you can eat buffet. I went over to the prime rib counter and said, "Hit me again!"

And if you actually could eat that much this could happen too: http://worldnewsdailyreport.com/man-kicked-out-of-all-you-can-eat-buffet-after-eating-more-than-50-lbs-of-food-sues-for-2-millions/

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Of course its gambling, even if you disclose the chances of each drop, its still gambling. People need to stop thinking so rigidly and rewrite laws that were written, in some cases, 100+ years ago, to include language that incorporates modern society. Essentially, if its classified as gambling in a casino, then its gambling in a game, regardless of disclosures.

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29 minutes ago, _RC1138 said:

EA is *far* from who started this. Valve isn't even who started it but their original loot crates (TF2) were probably the first *big* ones to get bought and noticed by huge swaths of gamers.

It's not just children. Gambling addiction can *ruin* adults and I suspect the vast, vast, VAST majority of 'whales' the games' industry literally preys upon are *mostly* adults with independent incomes but severe gambling issues. That's the part of this that makes it so reprehensible.

 

I expect that is not the case. If they had severe gambling issues, they'd be gambling, not grinding to get three containers a day and waiting for once a year lootboxes. I am a whale myself, and I know many others who spend lots of money on this game, and none of them or myself are gambling addicts.

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9 minutes ago, Silver_kun said:

But if you spent too much then you would need quite the appetite to get the same value back by eating lol.

 

You should check out John Pinettes buffet routine. It's hilarious and what I was referencing hehe.

 

 

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I thought WGs crate system basically guaranteed that you always got more than what you paid for from the loot crates. That was my experience last year anyways, I spent like $50 and got well over $150 worth of stuff. Everyone else I was exchanging bawxes with basically had the same story.

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