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MJPIA

Umikaze needs a survivability nerf

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I think most people agree quite a few of the Japanese DD's are in a bad spot, Umi isn't one of them and I have an issue with her.

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Her 25mm upper belt.

It'll shatter HE from every cruiser and destroyer she'll encounter.

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And angle and you'll just bounce those 12" shells right off.

d2iP3Kwh.png

And this isn't some gun boat that will be spotted all the time, this is a torp boat with a 3.5km stealth torping buffer without captain skills which will not have to deal with hydro, planes (except for the rare Katori) or radar.

And that's not all she gets.

This is the top hull health pools of all the low tier DD's.

Tachibana 7000 Umikaze 10300 Wakatake 8200 Isokaze 10300


Smith 7300

Sampson 9100 Wickes 8900 Clemson 10900
  V25 7700 G101 11000 V170 10300
  Storozhevoi 7800 Derzki 9700 Izyaskav 10300

Umi has more health than every other T2 DD, more than all but one T3 DD and is equal to T4 DD's.

 

I don't mind the large health pool in and of itself but combine that with the 25mm belt and I have a issue with that.

If a Umi is detected that can pop smoke to break contact and turn tail and flee and if a gunboat actually does its job and chases the Umi down and the Umi doesn't torp it or your team doesn't help you out it should be able to rip it apart without part of the DD being immune to damage.

And unlike Khab trying to use AP against a Umi is a exercise in futility.

She's too thin and you'll get more overpens than pens.
If a Sampson is focus on by the enemy fleet it should be ripped apart, if a V25 is focused down it should be shredded, likewise for Storoz.

And if a Umikaze is focused down it should be ripped apart without enemy cruisers and destroyers having to worry about their shells shattering on a 25mm belt, stealth torp boats (and destroyers in general) should not be able to tank and shrug off damage.

She can have her large health pool but stealth torp boats don't need 25mm belts.

 

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Umikaze also has very poor broadside firepower, with only 3 guns and 4 torps

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TBH in the Zucchini you should be firing HE a large portion of the time as her AP shells are rather anemic. The HE would blast the Umikaze into oblivion.

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14 minutes ago, MrDeaf said:

Umikaze also has very poor broadside firepower, with only 3 guns and 4 torps

Her gun reload is gimped badly with a 10 second reload but its not bad otherwise. 

V25 gets 2 double torp tubes with a single launcher each side but with a 40 second reload and 3 guns. 

Storoz gets 3 triple tubes but they are very short ranged and requires you to ambush ships or do suicide runs along with 3 guns. 

Sampson gets 4 doubles but only 2 a side which requires you to do turns to dump all 4 tubes and is more of a gun boat with its 4 guns albeit with a 7 second reload.   

All the other dds must either ambush ships with torps, shoot in smoke for a short duration undetected or they'll be detected while engaging enemies while Umi can sneak around chucking out 8km torps every 24 seconds

3 minutes ago, Drago_Ryder said:

Or you could just use ap and do regular pen damage.

Have fun with your .10 damage pens then. 

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zuchini should never see umi .      it is t2 DD with low health.   heck, I hardly play my tachibana because t2 MM sucks even though its a fun bote and don't fear umi.    

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10 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said:

TBH in the Zucchini you should be firing HE a large portion of the time as her AP shells are rather anemic. The HE would blast the Umikaze into oblivion.

^This. I play this ship like a BC and it is, in my opinion and experience, the penultimate DD Hunter/Killer for the tier.

Any DD that gets within 9km of me is toast - IDC what angle they take or how they try to wiggle.

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12 minutes ago, RipNuN2 said:

TBH in the Zucchini you should be firing HE a large portion of the time as her AP shells are rather anemic. The HE would blast the Umikaze into oblivion.

That was just me using what I had on hand to test since I don't have any T3 BB's currently and wanted to see what a 12 inch salvo of AP would do from various angles.

Obviously BB HE would shred it but I wanted to see how many bounces and how many pens and overpens I'd get.  

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Sorry OP, have to disagree with this. Whatever armor Umikaze gets she desperately needs because of her anemic guns. And her torps, while having very good range for tier 2 and reloading quickly, carry a very small warhead which does insignificant levels of damage when compared to other torps. The way to defeat Umi is to stay at range, watch for torp launches in order to dodge, and pound her with HE, which just eats her alive.

Who the heck uses AP on anything but a Khab?

I'm sorry you (apparently) had such bad games against her, but she is really an easy kill for either a DD or a CL.

I don't want to say "GIT GUD" because that is a sucky way to end a post; however, I would encourage you to play her and learn her (many) weaknesses so as to better understand how to kill her.

Just my opinion. 

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18 minutes ago, Umikami said:

Sorry OP, have to disagree with this. Whatever armor Umikaze gets she desperately needs because of her anemic guns. And her torps, while having very good range for tier 2 and reloading quickly, carry a very small warhead which does insignificant levels of damage when compared to other torps. The way to defeat Umi is to stay at range, watch for torp launches in order to dodge, and pound her with HE, which just eats her alive.

Who the heck uses AP on anything but a Khab?

I'm sorry you (apparently) had such bad games against her, but she is really an easy kill for either a DD or a CL.

I don't want to say "GIT GUD" because that is a sucky way to end a post; however, I would encourage you to play her and learn her (many) weaknesses so as to better understand how to kill her.

Just my opinion. 

Yes, because we should all believe the guy with 391 battles in their Umikaze.

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19 minutes ago, Umikami said:

Sorry OP, have to disagree with this. Whatever armor Umikaze gets she desperately needs because of her anemic guns. And her torps, while having very good range for tier 2 and reloading quickly, carry a very small warhead which does insignificant levels of damage when compared to other torps. The way to defeat Umi is to stay at range, watch for torp launches in order to dodge, and pound her with HE, which just eats her alive.

Who the heck uses AP on anything but a Khab?

I'm sorry you (apparently) had such bad games against her, but she is really an easy kill for either a DD or a CL.

I don't want to say "GIT GUD" because that is a sucky way to end a post; however, I would encourage you to play her and learn her (many) weaknesses so as to better understand how to kill her.

Just my opinion. 

Yes anon, we should fire our guns on an IJN DD.

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Umikaze compared to other tier 2 DDs is anywhere between meh and bad. I have CE captain skill and it's still bad. In a one to one fight with other t2 DDs it's outgunned and out-torped since it can only launch 2x2.

Just leave her alone. 

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Maybe it needs fixing, maybe it doesn't, do we really want WG to spend time and resources fixing a T2 when other issues are more critical, imo, of course. Also, yes an umi can see an Ishi, in a fail division scenario.

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2 hours ago, centarina said:

heck, I hardly play my tachibana because t2 MM sucks even though its a fun bote and don't fear umi.    

Try using an Akizuki captain with IFHE on her.  Ends up being a pretty good time.

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3 hours ago, TwinTanker said:

Yes, because we should all believe the guy with 391 battles in their Umikaze.

I'm the guy with 10,438 battles total.

I'm the guy with over 7500 battles in DD's.

I'm the guy with 391 battles in this DD alone.

You're the guy with 845 battles TOTAL.

Let the player base believe whomever they wish.

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3 hours ago, Slntreaper said:

Yes anon, we should fire our guns on an IJN DD.

I don't know if this is sarcasm or not (and truly do not care); however, unless you're playing a CV, or are VERY good with torps, shooting one is the only way to get rid of one.

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4 minutes ago, Umikami said:

I don't know if this is sarcasm or not (and truly do not care); however, unless you're playing a CV, or are VERY good with torps, shooting one is the only way to get rid of one.

Negative sir, you left out ramming! :Smile_izmena:

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Just now, Stampz said:

Negative sir, you left out ramming! :Smile_izmena:

If you can ram an Umikaze you are either damn lucky or damn good; and either way I don't want to see you on the red team!

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59 minutes ago, Umikami said:

I don't know if this is sarcasm or not (and truly do not care); however, unless you're playing a CV, or are VERY good with torps, shooting one is the only way to get rid of one.

Anon, the Umikaze has literally the best torpedo range compared to the tier 3 and tier 4.  Your guns are kinda okish, but the main offensive work, and what makes the line unique, should be done with torpedoes.

 

And don't bring "muh game count" [edited] into this, what the other guy is saying is that we shouldn't trust the person who spams the tier 2 as a clubing bote because they will always advocate for buffs to make clubbing seals easier.  

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No she doesn't.  Umi is just fine where she is.  Her guns.. well, the said about her guns the better though every now and a again they are useful, but the traverse is SOOOO BAD that to use the guns you got hold course.  Any wiggling and the guns will track right off the point of aim.  Umi strengths are her speed (not bad) here concealemnt (uttery awesome) and her torp range of 8 Km with a 24 second reload time (Godly!) ((which used to reload even faster but it got nerfed!)).

 

So like most of the IJN DD line stay at a distance chuck torps and don't get seen!   Once upon a time when there wasn't a 1 tier spread rule built into the game in divisioan some of used to take Umikaze's into tier X battles just to torture Yamato's and Montana's.  The high tier BB players screamed blue bloody murder because the Um drivers were doing very very very well! (this was before the advent of Radar, and the Germans with their hydro all over the place).

 

Umi is a super sneaky DD and is very nearly OP.  It can hold it's own in ANY tier of a fight  (those 8 Km, 48 knot, 1.1 detection range torps with the 24 sec reload..are its one and only real ace to play... but its a very good ace!)

 

Not doing well in your Umi... get a little less aggressive, stay a little further back,  and play with more patience.  

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