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bubbleboy264

Finally understanding the Z-23...

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Earlier I had posted a pretty ragey thread saying how awful the z-23 was and how bad I’m in it. Well I’ve played her some more and finally gotten the ship fully upgraded, and it’s actually not half bad at all. The torps are amazing, I’ve already gotten a double strike from killing 2 unaware DD’s hiding in smoke together. The 150s dpm is low but the alpha is high and so is the fire chance, and you can still deal high damage with HE and AP if you aim well. And the hydro is very useful too. It isn’t very stealthy and is quite sluggish, but with SE I have almost 23k hp on a tier 8. I think I understand it’s playstyle now and have already gotten several 100k+ dmg games so far. It’s funny how this post is so polar opposite to the one I posted several hours earlier but it’s true, the ship is actually pretty good once you get the hang of it. I still liked the Maass a lot more and really want to quickly get the Z-46 as I hear it’s amazing but so far I’m doing better in the Z-23, as I usually get a ships playstyle eventually and do well in it, despite the initial raging. 

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Just now, FireAndHEspam said:

You should also invest in CE in the captain as well as the concealment module

I have it of course, I used it on all my ship builds

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Just now, bubbleboy264 said:

I have it of course, I used it on all my ship builds

If you’re having issues with the ships stealth if you have both those modifiers then something seems off. German DDs at that tier and higher are very competitive when specced for stealth. Granted I myself quit at the Gaede and went for the Shima instead which is far better IMO, but whatever the case is im glad you’re enjoying your ship

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Just now, FireAndHEspam said:

If you’re having issues with the ships stealth if you have both those modifiers then something seems off. German DDs at that tier and higher are very competitive when specced for stealth. Granted I myself quit at the Gaede and went for the Shima instead which is far better IMO, but whatever the case is im glad you’re enjoying your ship

Max stealth u can get for the z-23 is 6.2km, compared to Kagero: 5.4, benson: 5.8, and even ognevoi: 6.1. The z-46 and z-52 are quite stealthy but the z-23 isn’t, that’s honestly my main gripe with it besides the low gun DPM

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Just now, bubbleboy264 said:

Max stealth u can get for the z-23 is 6.2km, compared to Kagero: 5.4, benson: 5.8, and even ognevoi: 6.1. The z-46 and z-52 are quite stealthy but the z-23 isn’t, that’s honestly my main gripe with it besides the low gun DPM

Compared to other DDs no, but a SDR of 6.2 is still highly competitive and nothing to be ashamed of, especially with that German hydro

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Just now, FireAndHEspam said:

Compared to other DDs no, but a SDR of 6.2 is still highly competitive and nothing to be ashamed of, especially with that German hydro

Yeah I know, I’m just so used to my 5.8 km Fletcher (prob my favorite ship in the game) that having 6.2 is quite different 

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Just now, bubbleboy264 said:

Yeah I know, I’m just so used to my 5.8 km Fletcher (prob my favorite ship in the game) that having 6.2 is quite different 

I’m used to the Khabarovsk’s 9.7km. Now that I have the Shima my main thought aside from earning credits is “How the hell am I ever supposed to go back to the Khabarovsk now?

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Just now, FireAndHEspam said:

I’m used to the Khabarovsk’s 9.7km. Now that I have the Shima my main thought aside from earning credits is “How the hell am I ever supposed to go back to the Khabarovsk now?

Your username makes a lot more sense now...

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2 minutes ago, FireAndHEspam said:

~760 or so games in the Khab, 755 in Udaloi

Well at least you haven’t played that much in the conqueror... *cough Remove Khaba cough* :Smile-angry::Smile-_tongue:

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I'm still working on figuring it out.  Playing it quite a bit, but having a heck of a time really getting a handle on this ship.  I think I need to get more comfortable with the guns and not try to make the torps do the heavy work.

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I don't understand complaints about the guns.  There are DDs that can put the hurt on you if they know what they're doing, but the reverse is true and the guns are quality.  That sonar also is so good for making them dance!

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51 minutes ago, bubbleboy264 said:

Max stealth u can get for the z-23 is 6.2km, compared to Kagero: 5.4, benson: 5.8, and even ognevoi: 6.1. The z-46 and z-52 are quite stealthy but the z-23 isn’t, that’s honestly my main gripe with it besides the low gun DPM

I had some issues too until I got RPF on my Z-23 captain. With RPF you know immediately what direction to go to either disengage or close the range to spot them. It also lets your guns be on target.

 

48 minutes ago, FireAndHEspam said:

I’m used to the Khabarovsk’s 9.7km. Now that I have the Shima my main thought aside from earning credits is “How the hell am I ever supposed to go back to the Khabarovsk now?

Run Khab with the concealment module. Minotaurs can't ambush you and it lets you disengage much easier if you need to.

 

All the capping ribbons are handy too. Always fun when I get to mock the enemy team with "You guys just let a Khab solo cap."

 

1 hour ago, bubbleboy264 said:

Earlier I had posted a pretty ragey thread saying how awful the z-23 was and how bad I’m in it. Well I’ve played her some more and finally gotten the ship fully upgraded, and it’s actually not half bad at all.

Good to hear.

 

Quote

The torps are amazing, I’ve already gotten a double strike from killing 2 unaware DD’s hiding in smoke together.

I tend to focus on the torps as primary most of the time.
 

Quote

The 150s dpm is low but the alpha is high and so is the fire chance, and you can still deal high damage with HE and AP if you aim well.

Fire two salvos before you disappear behind an island, cut the engines and kick the rudder over so you stay behind it. Get everyone to wait for you to come out the other side. May not get you XP for doing that, but little distractions like that can take the heat off your teammates.

 

Also, keep an eye on who is on fire. See who uses their DC and set them on fire once the immunity period wears off. Have you tried the skill that cuts the time to switch ammo types in half? I keep finding myself missing chances to use AP because I have HE loaded. I think I may try that and see what happens.

 

Quote

And the hydro is very useful too.

Yup, sometimes when the game isn't going your way, the best thing you can do is screen the fleet.

 

Quote

It isn’t very stealthy and is quite sluggish, but with SE I have almost 23k hp on a tier 8.

Agreed, it REALLY benefits from having a highly skilled captain. I only had 12 points through most of the grind.

 

Quote

I think I understand it’s playstyle now and have already gotten several 100k+ dmg games so far. It’s funny how this post is so polar opposite to the one I posted several hours earlier but it’s true, the ship is actually pretty good once you get the hang of it. I still liked the Maass a lot more and really want to quickly get the Z-46 as I hear it’s amazing but so far I’m doing better in the Z-23, as I usually get a ships playstyle eventually and do well in it, despite the initial raging. 

I got the Mass to work, but didn't enjoy it. Z-46 is fantastic. Best thing is the turret layout. Like the Roon, you can shoot 2/3 of your guns while hauling [edited]away from a situation.

 

The thing I hated most about the Z-23 and Z-46 is knowing how much better they would be with a 19 point captain. I've been spoiled with my 19 point VMF DD CaptianXP farmers. I have my 19 point Roon captain, but they are my Scharnhorst and Spee captain, so I can't redo them as a DD captain.

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The KM DD line is all about the 52...  When you get there...  You will have loved the grind.  :)

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Z-23 is gude boot.  I just took a look at my stats to find, somewhat to my surprise, that my WR for Z-23 and Maass is the same as my WR with Khaborovsk.  My most successful DD though is V-170 - 70% solo random WR - that's a real seal clubber!

Edited by lemekillmister

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z-23 is a terrible ship. Radar turns it into a useless brick. At least other lines can be useful by smoking for the team.

 

You can charge an island in caps just to hydro but having the sit there all game is pretty dull.

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3 hours ago, bubbleboy264 said:

Earlier I had posted a pretty ragey thread saying how awful the z-23 was and how bad I’m in it. Well I’ve played her some more and finally gotten the ship fully upgraded, and it’s actually not half bad at all. The torps are amazing, I’ve already gotten a double strike from killing 2 unaware DD’s hiding in smoke together. The 150s dpm is low but the alpha is high and so is the fire chance, and you can still deal high damage with HE and AP if you aim well. And the hydro is very useful too. It isn’t very stealthy and is quite sluggish, but with SE I have almost 23k hp on a tier 8. I think I understand it’s playstyle now and have already gotten several 100k+ dmg games so far. It’s funny how this post is so polar opposite to the one I posted several hours earlier but it’s true, the ship is actually pretty good once you get the hang of it. I still liked the Maass a lot more and really want to quickly get the Z-46 as I hear it’s amazing but so far I’m doing better in the Z-23, as I usually get a ships playstyle eventually and do well in it, despite the initial raging. 

 

This is a very good ship if you use her right. Tier X matches will be a b*tch but this applies to any tier 8 DD. The best way to use z-23 (and Gaede) is: 

 

1. Spec for torpedo reload and concealment. You have the best torp reload at tier 8 and your concealment, although not amazing, is still good enough to sneak up on enemy cruisers/BBs as well as contest caps.

 

2. Use the BIG guns. They hit hard and have a good fire chance. You can outgun enemy DDs if you use the big guns, and even citadel cruisers if broadside. You get big guns, smoke and hydro - making you a very lethal cap contestant. The only equal tier threat to you is the Lo Yang, and you dont see many of those.

 

3. Have a seperate commander for your Gaede and Z-23, and ideally, try to spec him specifically for torp reload and big guns - meaning no need for AFT or BFT. I have mine specced with Priority Target, Expert Marksman, Adrenaline rush, Superintendent, Demo, Concealment which altogether makes him very effective on both DDs when you equip 6" guns.

 

4. Fight using guerrilla tactics, meaning torp from stealth and fire guns ONLY at cruisers/BBs that are preoccupied OR have their guns pointed in a different direction. 6" guns do good damage, and its easy to set a fire on the enemy before he manages to turn his guns on you. At that point go silent and bail.

Edited by Ulthwey

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