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DeadIyArT

Seeing how the new smoke firing changes look and not a fan

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Ok i get how wg does not want BB and CA sitting in smoke firing but come on really wg you need to take a hard look at british CL.ie(Mino)  5.4 km from smoke.  This was a pretty good nerf to this class of ship that hole play style revolves around shooting from smoke.  You could give it a bone here ie speed from stop to go incress like in the lower tiers or lower the citadle below the water line, there for you dont get one shot. I feel in the next few weeks where going to see the mino drop in win rate and damage done by alot

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I have a mino as well and I feel this isn't a massive nerf. I mean if your 5.4km away in a mino your probably gonna be spotted soon or are screwed anyway. Besides I use radar instead 

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When I played it on the Public Test Server, I found it wasnt really a problem for the Minotaur.

 

However, the Leander, Fiji, Edinburgh and (particularly) the Neptune all got hurt. 

 

It is suboptimal.  Hopefully they will reduce the spotting distance on the tech tree ships to be no more than the Belfast (which has a shorter spotting range, for no apparent reason) soon.  

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If a DD comes within 5,4km to spot the mino, he should be rewarded with a spot for having a set of coconut sized balls. All it takes is for the mino to leave the smoke and the DD will be spotted and dead in nanoseconds.

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17 minutes ago, AdmiralOthuyeg said:

If a DD comes within 5,4km to spot the mino, he should be rewarded with a spot for having a set of coconut sized balls. All it takes is for the mino to leave the smoke and the DD will be spotted and dead in nanoseconds.

But if a BB has his guns trained in the same direction, so will be the Minotaur.

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34 minutes ago, Ace_04 said:

But if a BB has his guns trained in the same direction, so will be the Minotaur.

 

Most of the time they don't need to be spotter, I can't tell you how many citadels and kills I have farmed by shooting into smoke with my BB

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Now let's see what the rest of the community thinks about your smoke firing [edited] minonoob..... 

 

Oh, nobody cares about your toxic playstyle and your cheese mechanic. 

 

But so what. You can still smoke fire like a noob. It's only 5k to spot you so quit your whining and learn how to play instead of being a smoke firing little [edited]. 

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3 hours ago, UltimateNewbie said:

Fiji, ....got hurt. 

 

 

Maybe yours, I don't try to use smoke against ships 5-6km away. Too easy to eat torps or get hydro'ed and deleted. 

 

When they get below 7km, that's when I vacate.

 

So no change for me.

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32 minutes ago, Braize said:

Now let's see what the rest of the community thinks about your smoke firing [edited] minonoob..... 

 

Oh, nobody cares about your toxic playstyle and your cheese mechanic. 

 

But so what. You can still smoke fire like a noob. It's only 5k to spot you so quit your whining and learn how to play instead of being a smoke firing little [edited]. 

Someone got bad touched by a Minotaur one too many times. :Smile_teethhappy:

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39 minutes ago, Braize said:

Now let's see what the rest of the community thinks about your smoke firing [edited] minonoob..... 

 

Oh, nobody cares about your toxic playstyle and your cheese mechanic. 

 

But so what. You can still smoke fire like a noob. It's only 5k to spot you so quit your whining and learn how to play instead of being a smoke firing little [edited]. 

 

Wow, who pissed in your cheerios? We're having a friendly discussion, sharing opinions about the impact of the new smoke mechanics on the British CL's and you decided to come in and start hurling insults around? You're not the President of a large, English speaking country in the western hemisphere are you?

 

I'll be checking the new mechanics out tonight (and lobotomizing all my captains), but I'm wary of the impact of the smoke changes to my Edinburgh. I usually keep other ships at around the 10km range when I'm in smoke, but it's definitely going to make an already challenging ship even more complex to play.

Edited by Jiggiwatt

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38 minutes ago, Skpstr said:

 

Maybe yours, I don't try to use smoke against ships 5-6km away. Too easy to eat torps or get hydro'ed and deleted. 

 

When they get below 7km, that's when I vacate.

 

So no change for me.

I do fully agree with you but too bad i wont be able to do the whole thing where i had three battleships rushing my smoke and i just waited for them to get 3km away and torp them all... ;( oh well fun times have to end sometime

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10 minutes ago, RiverTheIdiot said:

I do fully agree with you but too bad i wont be able to do the whole thing where i had three battleships rushing my smoke and i just waited for them to get 3km away and torp them all... ;( oh well fun times have to end sometime

You can still do that, you just will not be able to fire your main guns. I had to do that last night in a Leander. When BB got close to new detection range in smoke, i stopped firing to wait for him to get closer for torps. 

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Played kutasov and Belfast last night with no issues whatever, but I did enjoy not having BBs push me out of my own smoke and I really do think this change is a good thing for the game. We should note that any boat that produces it's own smoke has a lower detect than ones that do not.

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4 minutes ago, Drago25x said:

You can still do that, you just will not be able to fire your main guns. I had to do that last night in a Leander. When BB got close to new detection range in smoke, i stopped firing to wait for him to get closer for torps. 

Yeah but thats more risky... that means your soley relying on torpedos... dont get me wrong mino has a ton.

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I feel they probably out to slightly bump shell velocity and range to compensate.

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42 minutes ago, SgtSpud said:

I did enjoy not having BBs push me out of my own smoke 

 

And any that still do, because they didn't get the memo, will be punished severely! :Smile_teethhappy:

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6 hours ago, DeadIyArT said:

Ok i get how wg does not want BB and CA sitting in smoke firing but come on really wg you need to take a hard look at british CL.ie(Mino)  5.4 km from smoke.  This was a pretty good nerf to this class of ship that hole play style revolves around shooting from smoke.  You could give it a bone here ie speed from stop to go incress like in the lower tiers or lower the citadle below the water line, there for you dont get one shot. I feel in the next few weeks where going to see the mino drop in win rate and damage done by alot

 

I was up against one yesterday.  He cleverly sat in the smoke not firing until I had to move to more than 6km away due to changing tactical conditions.  Then he ripped me apart.

 

Good Minotaur players have zero problems with this change.  Only the button mashing idiots got hurt.

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The Neptune's the one that really got hosed. 6.58km vs 5.4km smoke firing detect vs the Mino. Not sure why since they're the same guns and the Mino actually starts with a worse detection range. 

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I punished several ships last night, including brit CAs while they were firing from smoke.   Curious how things will play out when people get use to these changes.   I can imagine a lot of people are ignorant or just forgot after playing so many games a certain way. 

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Just note the new detection range when setup your smoke so no reds likely to sneak up on you and you're good.

7 hours ago, DeadIyArT said:

Ok i get how wg does not want BB and CA sitting in smoke firing but come on really wg you need to take a hard look at british CL.ie(Mino)  5.4 km from smoke.  This was a pretty good nerf to this class of ship that hole play style revolves around shooting from smoke.  You could give it a bone here ie speed from stop to go incress like in the lower tiers or lower the citadle below the water line, there for you dont get one shot. I feel in the next few weeks where going to see the mino drop in win rate and damage done by alot

Seeing how any RN CL beginning with Leander dishes out hurt to broadside anything within 12km, there is no issue.

 

Here's an example of the self-defeatist attitude where the player is only concerned about himself.

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8 hours ago, DeadIyArT said:

Ok i get how wg does not want BB and CA sitting in smoke firing but come on really wg you need to take a hard look at british CL.ie(Mino)  5.4 km from smoke.  This was a pretty good nerf to this class of ship that hole play style revolves around shooting from smoke.  You could give it a bone here ie speed from stop to go incress like in the lower tiers or lower the citadle below the water line, there for you dont get one shot. I feel in the next few weeks where going to see the mino drop in win rate and damage done by alot

Just played a game last night with the minotaur on the enemy team score a kraken with nearly 3000xp. Winning the match by a hair line and he still survived.  Learn to adapt like he did. The ship can still perform. 

 

"What's that? But you can't rush straight into the middle of the cap and gun down 5 dds with impunity now? "

 

Pretty sure they didn't want the minotaur to have one of the best aa guns, extremely good torps, and highest dpm all in one package as well as playing more agressively than a Z52.

Edited by Megrim3

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Played a few in my Edinburgh last night, wasn't a problem.  It's not like you're perfectly safe in smoke anyhow, you always need situational awareness and a evac plan ready to go.  This is just one more thing to worry about.

 

And, as a destroyer main... the Minotaur just smoked?  And you say you want me to drive into the sweet spot (I see him at 5.4 km, but his hydro sees me at 4.92 km) and sit there so you can shoot him?  hard pass.  

Edited by Brhinosaurus
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1 hour ago, Reymu said:

Just note the new detection range when setup your smoke so no reds likely to sneak up on you and you're good.

Seeing how any RN CL beginning with Leander dishes out hurt to broadside anything within 12km, there is no issue.

 

Here's an example of the self-defeatist attitude where the player is only concerned about himself.

How is this a self defeatist attitude?  Just bring up a valid point about how this class of ship plays and how it was balanced.  as you work you're way up the line to the top tiers you're citadel moves up above the water and you're start speed decrease same as you're stopping distance.  but in return you're rate of fire increase ie glass cannon.  unlike a destroyer you do have a citadel and can be easily one shot.  and now that regard regardless of if you pop smoke you still have 20 sec cool down so let's say you shoot that 18km if spec of detection range you have to wait 20 seconds before you pop smoke. 20 sec is along time to wait when you have 6 + people looking and firing at you.

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16 minutes ago, Brhinosaurus said:

Played a few in my Edinburgh last night, wasn't a problem.  It's not like you're perfectly safe in smoke anyhow, you always need situational awareness and a evac plan ready to go.  This is just one more thing to worry about.

 

And, as a destroyer main... the Minotaur just smoked?  And you say you want me to drive into the sweet spot (I see him at 5.4 km, but his hydro sees me at 4.92 km) and sit there so you can shoot him?  hard pass.  

the problem is not as bad in the lower tiers its more in the upper tiers.  As for the bold DD spotting a mino i really have no problem with that the problem i have is with the fact getting that ship to start to move is like watching a fully loaded dump truck try to start moveing forward.  Mean wial the enemy bb go mine mine mine and your one shot. I presonaly play the ship aggressively, i will have to change my play style. i also do well in the ship, by no means am i unicom player but i have gotten kraken unleshed a few time in this ship and have above avarage win rate in this ship. 

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26 minutes ago, DeadIyArT said:

How is this a self defeatist attitude?  Just bring up a valid point about how this class of ship plays and how it was balanced.  as you work you're way up the line to the top tiers you're citadel moves up above the water and you're start speed decrease same as you're stopping distance.  but in return you're rate of fire increase ie glass cannon.  unlike a destroyer you do have a citadel and can be easily one shot.  and now that regard regardless of if you pop smoke you still have 20 sec cool down so let's say you shoot that 18km if spec of detection range you have to wait 20 seconds before you pop smoke. 20 sec is along time to wait when you have 6 + people looking and firing at you.

Because it is not easy to hit a player inside smoke without the spotter plane, in first place (only BBs and Russian cruisers can get it), and in second place, more frustrating and less fun when facing an opponent that can smack you around while you've no visual and therefore return fire is much harder. It's not balanced unless both players can see and shoot at it each other, simply.

 

RN CLs that smoke at a distance will remain a threat as ever. It's only the ones that smoke too close to DDs that'll pay now. It's more balanced now except maybe for Minotaur, but since smoke attracts torps anyway, it's probably no big deal.

 

Aggressive players like me certainly dislike having to be more cautious, but hey, it's still a workable strategy, so there's still room for that playstyle.

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