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Musashi unveiled

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1 minute ago, Big_Spud said:

 

Its not even the higher damage overmatch and normal pens, its the fact that most tier 7's can't even hope to reply until around 12 kilometers, and that's ONLY if they catch it flat broadside.

 

With every other tier 9 BB, most tier 7's (Scharnhorst excluded) can punish a broadsiding tier 9 out until about 17 kilometers. Not so with Musashi. Something like Nelson, Hood or KGV needs to literally be within 8.2 kilometers of a perfectly broadside Musashi before it can hope to citpen it.

They need to get working on 1+/- match making. 

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1 hour ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

For comparison's sake:

No camo, no captain skills, no upgrades installed - All yanked off of my Yamato.

Tier IX Musashi / Tier X Yamato

HP 97300 / 97200

Plating

Musashi 32mm, belt 200mm-410mm

Yamato 32mm, belt 340mm-410mm

Main Battery 3x3 460mm (Identical, duh)

Firing Range 26.5km / 26.6km

HE damage 7300 (Identical)

HE velocity 805m/s (Identical)

AP damage 14800 (Identical)

AP velocity 780m/s (Identical)

Reload Time 35 seconds / 30 seconds

180 degree turn time 72 seconds (Identical)

Max Dispersion 275m / 276m (Functionally the same as the value reflects the dispersion Yamato has firing at her slightly longer max range than Musashi)

Sigma 1.8 / 2.1 (thanks, _Fantomex_)

Max Speed 27kts (Identical)

Turning Circle Radius 900m (Identical)

Rudder Shift Time 18.7 seconds / 22.1 seconds

Surface Detectability 17.5km / 18km

Air Detectability 16km (Identical)

Detectability after firing Main Guns in Smoke 19.3km / ???

 

Edit again:  Here's a link to some Armor Penetration Curves.

Frankly, Musashi does not need any of those nerfs and just a maneuverability buff to both rudder and radius. Her nonexistent AA and limited secondaries is already a major downgrade.

 

I expect WG will revert her sigma and armor back before she's released. After all, she just barely went into testing, or about to go into testing.

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3 minutes ago, Big_Spud said:

Its not even the higher damage overmatch and normal pens, its the fact that most tier 7's can't even hope to reply until around 12 kilometers, and that's ONLY if they catch it flat broadside.

 

With every other tier 9 BB, most tier 7's (Scharnhorst excluded) can punish a broadsiding tier 9 out until about 17 kilometers. Not so with Musashi. Something like Nelson, Hood or KGV needs to literally be within 8.2 kilometers of a perfectly broadside Musashi before it can hope to citpen it. 

 

And good luck flanking it in something like Colorado or Nagato.

Good thing Nelson & KGV have the best HE shells amirite?

Edited by GoldPile

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Just now, GoldPile said:

Good thing Nelson & KGV has the best HE shells amirite?

Hey don't ruin his argument with facts.

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Just now, DeliciousFart said:

 

Are you talking about the angled bulkheads of the citadel? To my knowledge those should be the same thickness as on Yamato.

 

Check the WG Facebook link in the original post.  The devs said 200mm-410mm.

 

410mm is the same as Yamato's belt protection on the sides.  However, Yamato isn't uniform as the angled bulkheads on her aft and fwd ends fluctuate from 340mm-350mm.  WG's said 200mm.  That's definitely not the 410mm sides, so...

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4 minutes ago, GoldPile said:

Good thing Nelson & KGV has the best HE shells amirite?

 

Well, Nelson will literally be instantly deleted because of its citadel, but KGV may last a few salvos. Good thing Musashi has 97,000 HP to burn through.

 

Or KGV's turrets will just be instantly destroyed, which is something that occasionally happens even when fighting tier 5's.

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Just now, HazeGrayUnderway said:

 

Check the WG Facebook link in the original post.  The devs said 200mm-410mm.

 

410mm is the same as Yamato's belt protection on the sides.  However, Yamato isn't uniform as the angled bulkheads on her aft and fwd ends fluctuate from 340mm-350mm.  WG's said 200mm.  That's definitely not the 410mm sides, so...

 

The lower belt of the Yamato and Musashi is 200 mm NVNC, so that may be what's being referred to.

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Just now, Big_Spud said:

 

Well, Nelson will literally be instantly deleted because of its citadel, but KGV may last a few salvos.

 

Or its turrets will just be instantly destroyed, which happens sometimes when its fighting tier 5's.

 

With that 1.8 sigma, Musashi isn't going to be precise at all.

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1 minute ago, Big_Spud said:

 

Well, Nelson will literally be instantly deleted because of its citadel, but KGV may last a few salvos.

 

Or its turrets will just be instantly destroyed, which happens sometimes when its fighting tier 5's.

You mean B turret. A and C turret do just fine, found this out facing KGV's in my Kongou sisters.

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5 minutes ago, Fog_Repair_Ship_Akashi said:

You mean B turret. A and C turret do just fine, found this out facing KGV's in my Kongou sisters.

 

I've lost A and B turrets more than anything else. They're extremely wide from the front, and anemically armored.

 

5 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

 

With that 1.8 sigma, Musashi isn't going to be precise at all.

 

Considering its still Japanese, with the usually low dispersion/km that comes in that package, 1.8 sigma isn't actually that bad. Especially if you can still take Aiming Systems Mod. 1

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I love all the battleship mains whining about how it's unfair to have a battleship that can threaten them and ignore their armor.

 

Looks like you'll have to play against it like you were a cruiser. Dodge incoming fire and hit it with HE.

 

What's that you're always telling cruisers? "git gud & dodge more"?

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5 minutes ago, Big_Spud said:

 

Well, Nelson will literally be instantly deleted because of its citadel, but KGV may last a few salvos. Good thing Musashi has 97,000 HP to burn through.

 

Or KGV's turrets will just be instantly destroyed, which is something that occasionally happens even when fighting tier 5's.

I forgot about Nelson... It's already bad enough you have to be pixel perfect... They should offer refunds for it. I would gladly take back my 375,000 XP.

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1 minute ago, AraAragami said:

I love all the battleship mains whining about how it's unfair to have a battleship that can threaten them and ignore their armor.

 

Looks like you'll have to play against it like you were a cruiser. Dodge incoming fire and hit it with HE.

 

What's that you're always telling cruisers? "git gud & dodge more"?

I noticed that irony as well just didn't want to comment on it.

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2 minutes ago, Big_Spud said:

Considering its still Japanese, with the usually low dispersion/km that comes in that package, 1.8 sigma isn't actually that bad. Especially if you can still take Aiming Systems Mod. 1

 

So do the other BBs (except for USN below Tier IX that can't get APRM2).  KGV can take ASM1 and has a faster ROF.

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2 minutes ago, MorbidGamer said:

I forgot about Nelson... It's already bad enough you have to be pixel perfect... They should offer refunds for it. I would gladly take back my 375,000 XP.

I still love mine, just use her as an artillery barge if you don't want to be deleted by high pen lolpen.

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4 minutes ago, MorbidGamer said:

I forgot about Nelson... It's already bad enough you have to be pixel perfect... They should offer refunds for it. I would gladly take back my 375,000 XP.

Nelson is bad? I beg to differ.

 

Capture.PNG

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Really? People are saying it's going to be underpowered with 1.8 sigma? I have to deal with that in my Alabama all the time.

 

This is just a terrible idea.

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31 minutes ago, SteveStevenson said:

I asked for this a few weeks ago. Not necessarily at T9, but hey. I hope we get HE from those 6" guns, combined with the better rudder shift we might have an interesting brawler for the IJN.
 

 

 

A bit of a faster rudder doesn't compensate for 35s reload and 72s 180º traverse.  Throw in laughably reduced side armor and this thing is just another boring "sniper" battleship that can't hold a candle to other battleships in a brawl, with or without additional secondaries.

 

Cruisers should tear this thing apart in close quarters.

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5 minutes ago, Fog_Repair_Ship_Akashi said:

I noticed that irony as well just didn't want to comment on it.

They'll just make excuses about rudder shift and turn circles, ignoring that many cruisers have the same agility as same-tier battleships.

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14 minutes ago, AraAragami said:

I love all the battleship mains whining about how it's unfair to have a battleship that can threaten them and ignore their armor.

 

Looks like you'll have to play against it like you were a cruiser. Dodge incoming fire and hit it with HE.

 

What's that you're always telling cruisers? "git gud & dodge more"?

 

There are fundamental issues present when it comes to dodging shells in a ship with a 15+ second rudder shift, and a 900+ meter turning radius. Most ships will be fine, but the times that it does see tier 7 will be painful, moreso than when something like an Iowa, FDG or Izumo gets downtiered.

 

Really, the only ships that this doesn't change anything for are the high tier British, as they will simply continue to fire HE at everything, heal back all normal pens and overpens, while remaining impossible to citadel. But I'm sure the Izumo players in particular will appreciate being deleted through their bows though.

 

11 minutes ago, HazeGrayUnderway said:

 

So do the other BBs (except for USN below Tier IX that can't get APRM2).  KGV can take ASM1 and has a faster ROF.

 

Yes, and? The simple fact of the matter is that 1.8 sigma is not that bad when combined with typical Japanese dispersion and the aiming systems modification. It's not going to be a shotgun or something. 1.8 sigma is literally .1 lower than Iowa, and the same as Izumo.

 

 

To make it clear, I don't necessarily think that this is gamebreaking, but I do think that it's going to be extremely strong. Like a Japanese Missouri, which is fine imho.

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2 minutes ago, Fog_Repair_Ship_Akashi said:

Nelson is bad? I beg to differ.

 

Capture.PNG

I have way better stats then that on it. But as I said it's bad that you have to be pixel perfect... Meaning angled... You are off 2 degrees you eat cits like nothing. Now there is going to be a ship that will delete it no matter the angle. So yeah I want my XP back!

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2 minutes ago, AraAragami said:

They'll just make excuses about rudder shift and turn circles, ignoring that many cruisers have the same agility as same-tier battleships.

My point exactly. Why complain? I'm a BB main and I say judgement needs to be reserved untill we know more. like this interesting tidbit from @Pigeon_of_War that seems to say Musashi will not be a normal premium at least.

 

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1 minute ago, MorbidGamer said:

I have way better stats then that on it. But as I said it's bad that you have to be pixel perfect... Meaning angled... You are off 2 degrees you eat cits like nothing. Now there is going to be a ship that will delete it no matter the angle. So yeah I want my XP back!

Yes eat Cits that you can heal back with the Zombie ship...I say user error for your results.

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