Jump to content
You need to play a total of 5 battles to post in this section.
WanderingGhost

Night Battle vs "Night Battle"

Night Battles or "Night Battles"  

133 members have voted

  1. 1. What type of Night Battles are you looking for?

    • Full night battles (spotting range reduced, need to use search lights, etc)
      77
    • Aesthetic Night battles (gameplay is the same, however lighting and all is darker giving the aesthetic of more a nighttime fight)
      25
    • Either or
      24
    • don't care
      7
  2. 2. If your looking for full night battles, would you be willing to settle on aesthetic night battles?

    • Yes
      67
    • No
      21
    • mmmmm...bacon
      45
  3. 3. Obligatory bacon related poll -

    • lightly done
      56
    • extra crispy
      77

52 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

897
[SSG]
Alpha Tester
3,459 posts
8,119 battles

So, seen this raging again, in the nest where I can't post, so, I figured I'd throw this little poll out there based on one of Pigeon's replies, namely to the effect of "do we know what were asking for?"

 

A lot of this focus has been on the mechanics involved of view range, adding spot lights, planes needing radar, etc. Though we do have to ask, are we really looking for the full experience, or do we more want the general effect of seeing the skies lit up by tracers and all? Do we want night looking battles without the crazy mechanics that would come with it? I for one really want more just the aesthetic, really see those fires burning, tracers everywhere as AA opens fires on planes and those flashes against the dark as a BB fires it's guns. I don't need, or in some cases want, the rest of the headache that comes with it, at which point it's just Wargaming having to make variant maps with darkened looks, Maybe a new one or two (note on that below). As opposed to having to add searchlights as a function for night fighting and all the rest that would go into it, ship lights could just be aesthetic to night battles, maybe storms. And would those that want the full deal be willing to settle on at least the aesthetic look of night battles to a degree?

 

And should the idea of aesthetic battles still being "too dark" even under a full moon and stars, make it not quite darkness (that time when the skies is extra deep blue a the sun rises/is setting but not quite there yet OR, take a page out of WoWP's playbook, one of the only ones besides "ship birthday's" I'd recommend doing, and have a map up further north in which you have not just the moon and stars but the Aurora Borealis or the like going as well casting extra light so that the skies and all aren't so dark but still darker as a night fight would be. 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
122
[DAKI]
Members
629 posts
6,455 battles

probably can work with searchlights and star shells or cvs dropping flares or something

sYbFBRs.png

Edited by awildpervert

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,976
[SYN]
Members
14,459 posts
10,475 battles

Like I said in the other thread.

I think a 'trial' of night battles would be nice to have as an Operation.

That way, any issues that might crop up can be worked out.

 

Because, I'm sure, everyone remembers the Hindenburg 203mm triple turrets on North and Hot Spot.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22,939
[HINON]
Supertester
19,247 posts
12,791 battles

Halved visibility, doubled firing penalty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,846
[WOLF3]
[WOLF3]
Members
16,169 posts
14,583 battles

There is no point to night battle if the only difference between that and day time fighting is the gamma being turned down.

  • Cool 2
  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,130
[NBGC]
Members
3,043 posts
10,248 battles

There are already some maps that have a night (North) or twilight (Trident) aesthetic, so I say that WG should at least try out a full-on night battle style of gameplay in an Operation, just as MrDeaf suggested.

If it's worth doing, it's worth doing well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
387
[INTEL]
Members
803 posts
8,327 battles

Funny. I enjoy cyclone battles. It puts an increased emphasis on teamwork.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
75
[5D]
Beta Testers
434 posts
7,845 battles

I feel the halloween operation is a test bed for night fights, reduced visibility and weather effects. Especially in the taint.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
825 posts
13,665 battles

they have already plenty of issues to deal with such as Invisible planes that spot you but you cannot see because a mountain is nearby. Unbalance of cyclones (it should not be a flat detect range, but a detect based on your conceal) and planes not penalized by it, Radars and Hydro that already work through terrain which is a poor implementation and an unnecessary advantage for all detection limitation conditions....

 

When they get the mechanics working properly, then night battles could become a thing, but until then it would just be another annoying feature that people would rather not have in game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
404
[WOLF5]
Members
1,539 posts
2,148 battles

If we're going to go night battles, make them mechanically different, as well as, well, at night. All dark skies do is increase the reflections on my screen.

 

Cut spotting, increase firing flashes, maybe add star shells. Probably have to make the maps smaller, just a short range brawl. I actually think the filth in the Halloween mode is a pretty good start. Close range, dark, low visibility. Playing in it is a fast paced, close in brawl that is a lot of fun. 

 

Obviously it should be tested. Someone suggested putting it in Operations against the AI, which is a good idea, as just making it dark on a normal map would result in a lot of lonely sailing.

 

I think it would be a fun mechanic, but not something I want on every map every time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,817
[SALVO]
Members
17,106 posts
17,770 battles
1 hour ago, WanderingGhost said:

So, seen this raging again, in the nest where I can't post, so, I figured I'd throw this little poll out there based on one of Pigeon's replies, namely to the effect of "do we know what were asking for?"

 

A lot of this focus has been on the mechanics involved of view range, adding spot lights, planes needing radar, etc. Though we do have to ask, are we really looking for the full experience, or do we more want the general effect of seeing the skies lit up by tracers and all? Do we want night looking battles without the crazy mechanics that would come with it? I for one really want more just the aesthetic, really see those fires burning, tracers everywhere as AA opens fires on planes and those flashes against the dark as a BB fires it's guns. I don't need, or in some cases want, the rest of the headache that comes with it, at which point it's just Wargaming having to make variant maps with darkened looks, Maybe a new one or two (note on that below). As opposed to having to add searchlights as a function for night fighting and all the rest that would go into it, ship lights could just be aesthetic to night battles, maybe storms. And would those that want the full deal be willing to settle on at least the aesthetic look of night battles to a degree?

 

And should the idea of aesthetic battles still being "too dark" even under a full moon and stars, make it not quite darkness (that time when the skies is extra deep blue a the sun rises/is setting but not quite there yet OR, take a page out of WoWP's playbook, one of the only ones besides "ship birthday's" I'd recommend doing, and have a map up further north in which you have not just the moon and stars but the Aurora Borealis or the like going as well casting extra light so that the skies and all aren't so dark but still darker as a night fight would be. 

Ghost, I disagree with your poll.  It's too binary. There's no middle ground, no "night battles lite".

A.  Like Haze said, night battles that are just normal day time battles with greatly reduced gamma are utterly pointless.

B.  Hardcore night battles, including things like search lights and starshells, seem technically unfeasible. 

C. I've long suggested a "night battles lite", wherein the technically difficult or impossible things (like star shells and search lights) are ignored.  And the devs essentially leverage the cyclone model, just on a full battle duration scale.  Visibility should be reduced. But when you fire your guns, the gun bloom should allow you to be spotted out to your max gun range.  Use smaller maps relative to the max tier of the ships in the battle, so that teams don't go blundering around in the dark on overly large maps.  Also, I'd suggest using only Epicenter mode so that there's only one place on the map where ships should head to because that the single capture point (well, 3 concentric rings).  And the general graphics visibility doesn't have to be pure black.  The battles could always occur under a clear sky and full moon so that you didn't have total black out conditions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,817
[SALVO]
Members
17,106 posts
17,770 battles
1 hour ago, Greenday4537 said:

Hell no. Cyclones are a garbage game mechanic as it is.

Nonsense.  Cyclones are, or at least should be, great. The idea that battles should only occur under perfect visibility conditions is foolish.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
341 posts
1,906 battles
2 hours ago, Crucis said:

Nonsense.  Cyclones are, or at least should be, great. The idea that battles should only occur under perfect visibility conditions is foolish.

It's boring as crapto sail around, not see anyone, then have a 2 second battle. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,817
[SALVO]
Members
17,106 posts
17,770 battles
12 minutes ago, Greenday4537 said:

It's boring as crapto sail around, not see anyone, then have a 2 second battle. 

Then you're not doing it right.

  • Cool 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
626
[NMKJT]
Members
2,733 posts

I think that Pigeon said a few days ago that people complain about concealed firing enough, night battles would make it much worse

 

Also there would be a ton more pink ships

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
626
[NMKJT]
Members
2,733 posts

I should add I am too old; my eyes could not handle the lack of contrast. It would have to be a separate mode or I would have to give up the game

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34
[TWFT2]
Beta Testers
262 posts
3,996 battles

I'd think, all things aside, it would be cool if your ship spotlights pointed where you aimed the guns,

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
147
Members
712 posts

it would have to be aesthetic night battles, as the other alternative would just lead to people abusing their monitor/display setting brightness to gain unfair advantage.

 

as for spotlights, that would be silliness of the highest order, as the very last thing you want to be doing at night in a battle is having lights on that screams to everyone else "I AM HERE, SHOOT AT ME", that's why you have illuminating shells that you fire towards you enemies position, that lights them up and NOT you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50
[SYN]
Members
102 posts
8,422 battles
1 hour ago, b101uk said:

it would have to be aesthetic night battles, as the other alternative would just lead to people abusing their monitor/display setting brightness to gain unfair advantage.

 

as for spotlights, that would be silliness of the highest order, as the very last thing you want to be doing at night in a battle is having lights on that screams to everyone else "I AM HERE, SHOOT AT ME", that's why you have illuminating shells that you fire towards you enemies position, that lights them up and NOT you.

 

What is, The Battle of Savo Island?

 

 "At 01:50, when the U.S. cruisers were illuminated by the Japanese searchlights, Vincennes hesitated to open fire, believing that the searchlight's source might be friendly ships."

-https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Savo_Island

 

it'd be cool to have searchlights during cyclones and darkness. Even as an asthetic thing, and only visible to enemies when you're detected.

Edited by MrSharkswith

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
147
Members
712 posts
30 minutes ago, MrSharkswith said:

 

What is, The Battle of Savo Island?

 

 "At 01:50, when the U.S. cruisers were illuminated by the Japanese searchlights, Vincennes hesitated to open fire, believing that the searchlight's source might be friendly ships."

-https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Savo_Island

 

it'd be cool to have searchlights during cyclones and darkness. Even as an asthetic thing, and only visible to enemies when you're detected.

 

as I said silliness, as applied to most cases and ranges, unless it causes confusion with your opposition or helps you pummel already damaged ships.

 

you do know that on a night there is a good moon and a mostly clear sky even far out at sea you can see quite a long way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,817
[SALVO]
Members
17,106 posts
17,770 battles
9 hours ago, Destroyer_Suzukaze said:

I think that Pigeon said a few days ago that people complain about concealed firing enough, night battles would make it much worse

 

Also there would be a ton more pink ships

Sorry, but at some point, developers have to man up themselves and tell the childish little whiners to pound sand.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
375
[KOZ]
Beta Testers
1,485 posts
1,186 battles

I don't think Searchlights would be anything besides Aesthetics, unless it's a consumable unique to Night and Cyclone. [TBF, I think that'd be a good idea. "Searchlights: In reduced visibility situations, allows for full visual range for X seconds." (so it'd wind up being a CD that temporarily allows you to have full detection range on enemy vessels) Make it compete with Smoke Generators and Radar.]

Honestly, Night would boil down to Cyclone but with full view range. Which actually would require new coding due to how the Cyclones work. Otherwise it'd be nothing more than an Aesthetic over Cyclone that doesn't go away. A Full Battle Cyclone wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing though. It'd be interesting to say the least.

Edited by AirshipCanon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50
[SYN]
Members
102 posts
8,422 battles
1 hour ago, b101uk said:

 

as I said silliness, as applied to most cases and ranges, unless it causes confusion with your opposition or helps you pummel already damaged ships.

 

you do know that on a night there is a good moon and a mostly clear sky even far out at sea you can see quite a long way.

 

I do, in fact. I work as a marine engineer. But it can be hard to distinguish distant shapes against the background, especially if they're running dark.

 

And, yeah, spotlights aren't a great idea. The US had good radar, and thus relied less on lighting and more on radar guided gun batteries.

 

As an asthetic, though, it'd be cool. Like having the lights on your tank work in WoT.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
897
[SSG]
Alpha Tester
3,459 posts
8,119 battles
22 hours ago, Crucis said:

Ghost, I disagree with your poll.  It's too binary. There's no middle ground, no "night battles lite".

A.  Like Haze said, night battles that are just normal day time battles with greatly reduced gamma are utterly pointless.

B.  Hardcore night battles, including things like search lights and starshells, seem technically unfeasible. 

C. I've long suggested a "night battles lite", wherein the technically difficult or impossible things (like star shells and search lights) are ignored.  And the devs essentially leverage the cyclone model, just on a full battle duration scale.  Visibility should be reduced. But when you fire your guns, the gun bloom should allow you to be spotted out to your max gun range.  Use smaller maps relative to the max tier of the ships in the battle, so that teams don't go blundering around in the dark on overly large maps.  Also, I'd suggest using only Epicenter mode so that there's only one place on the map where ships should head to because that the single capture point (well, 3 concentric rings).  And the general graphics visibility doesn't have to be pure black.  The battles could always occur under a clear sky and full moon so that you didn't have total black out conditions.

 

The reason for that is because I couldn't think of a decent one. Namely because at that point, no one shoots till somebody gets inside 8 km of another ship, carriers in the method you describe are absolutely useless even on a smaller map as they don't see targets till they are basically on top of them, any cruiser with 8km+ torps that isn't already capable of stealth torp gains it meaning they can go unspotted, same with DD's that mostly already have stealth torp or none. It's why there's actually quite a bit of gripe, or there was till those people left, about cyclones and they aren't exactly wrong. If Wargaming could find a middle ground I'm all for it. But what you describe will likely push players to just use ships with torps if it comes up cause they can't be spotted and make CV's useless most of the battle. There needs to be something besides that and radar to spot ships, unless we give everything including planes radar.  Those potentially "unfeasible" things need to work or have an equivalent so it's not just cyclone a whole match cause that will irritate people, even me. And while pointless from your and other's point of view, some of us aren't dead set on hardcore night battles and all about using search lights, flares, and all that. Some of us are fine with something that's more aesthetic just to mix up what is basically (aside from 2 maps I've never seen based on that one reply) a bunch of day time maps with islands that start to seem the same and where you can't really see weapons fire sometimes.

 

17 hours ago, Destroyer_Suzukaze said:

I should add I am too old; my eyes could not handle the lack of contrast. It would have to be a separate mode or I would have to give up the game

Believe it or not, young as I am... well, kinda young, I actually have contrast issues as well, I constantly give Wargaming gripe that I can't read the chat half the time cause of it, and have at times yeah, had some aim issues on that one ship not sporting camo. But that's why for the Aesthetic type in particular, I look at it the idea is to darken things but keep visibility roughly the same if not exactly the same, so aesthetic searchlights (for those bringing it up only visible in your normal spotting range)helping to illuminate the ship against the dark, or set it not at the darkest of night but a point where enough light is there to see normal but dark enough gunfire is better seen as are tracers. Or a scenario the AB creates additional light, something that looks more like night but isn't going to heavily impact gameplay if it does at all.

 

Why I agree any sort of night battle, realistic, aesthetic or something in the middle should have an operation or something. As I recall the Halloween event I think uses a darker sky that's more like a night time setting, know for sure in a couple days when it comes back. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×