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HellaCopterRescue

Carriers CAN NOT be detonated - here is the source

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You hear, here and there, that CVs can't detonate.....but no one can actually provide the primary source.

 

Did some digging and I found out that @vak_ has it posted here when @GoldPile asked about CV detonations. Unfortuantely with the new forum interface the old link only takes you to the top of the page. Needless to say it took a long time to find the comment but:

 

Here, on the Russian forum's Dev Q&A, is where Sub_Octavion makes the statment and is the primary source.

if you cannot click on that here is the actual link: https://forum.worldofwarships.ru/topic/33727-архив-ответы-разработчиков/?page=9#comment-2614397

 

Question from mishutka88

Quote

.....

2. Is it possible to detonate an aircraft carrier? After all, it still keeps bombs / torpedoes for shock groups and quite a significant amount of aviation fuel. 

 

@Sub_Octavian answers

Quote

No, CV does not have such modules

 

 

Use my post as a credible secondary source and use the link as the primary source.

 

P.s. Love ya @Pulicat :p

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It is kinda balanced though. It is the only ship that can loose all of it's offensive capabilities that are worth anything in salt while still taking zero damage.

Plus, once you shoot at a cv, it has no armor and is gone relatively quickly. So yeah, nothing to worry about here.

INB4 all the salt from people reacting without thinking first.

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Detonation chance is based on the ship's magazines for the main battery ammunition. As a carrier doesn't have any main batteries, it doesn't have any MBA magazines, and thus can't be detonated.

 

According to the Wiki:

  • "As stated above, taking damage to the magazines will increase the chances of detonation occurring. When a magazine loses all of its hit-points, the chance of detonation will increase to its maximum native value. Note that this is still below 100%. Each ship has its own metric for calculating detonation chance based upon magazine hit-pool.
  • Therefore, by this logic, aircraft carriers can never be detonated since they have no magazine."

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18 minutes ago, LordGomes said:

Detonation chance is based on the ship's magazines for the main battery ammunition. As a carrier doesn't have any main batteries, it doesn't have any MBA magazines, and thus can't be detonated.

 

According to the Wiki:

  • "As stated above, taking damage to the magazines will increase the chances of detonation occurring. When a magazine loses all of its hit-points, the chance of detonation will increase to its maximum native value. Note that this is still below 100%. Each ship has its own metric for calculating detonation chance based upon magazine hit-pool.
  • Therefore, by this logic, aircraft carriers can never be detonated since they have no magazine."

But they carry a huge amount of aviation fuel, which burns terribly well.:Smile_teethhappy:

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21 minutes ago, nuttybiscuit said:

But they carry a huge amount of aviation fuel, which burns terribly well.:Smile_teethhappy:

 

USS Lexington(CV-2) is a good example for the above point.

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Yeah, I can think of a few off of the top of my head that fuel or fumes from busted av gas storage tanks spread through the ship and either directly lead to or hastened their demise.

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1 hour ago, nuttybiscuit said:

But they carry a huge amount of aviation fuel, which burns terribly well.:Smile_teethhappy:

Yeah but jet fuel can't melt CV's :Smile_teethhappy:

 

 

 

 

I never really looked into CV's, but they must have a magazine /storeage area for all those bombs/ammo

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13 minutes ago, Smoked_Maple_Bacon said:

Yeah but jet fuel can't melt CV's :Smile_teethhappy:

 

 

 

 

I never really looked into CV's, but they must have a magazine /storeage area for all those bombs/ammo

Didin't the methods of ammunition stowage vary greatly between carriers of all nations? I have read some went to great lengths to prevent "catastrophic" scenarios, with multiple internal armoured bulkheads, venting routes in case of explosion, water tanks encasing armoured ammunition boxes, fuel tanks used as reserve flotation, while the means to service and repair aircraft meant they had very good repair and damage control abilities. 

http://www.armouredcarriers.com/hms-unicorn-maintenance-support/

details about HMS Unicorn's provisions make for useful reading on how to ensure carrier surviveability..

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11 minutes ago, Smoked_Maple_Bacon said:

Yeah but jet fuel can't melt CV's :Smile_teethhappy:

 

 

 

 

I never really looked into CV's, but they must have a magazine /storeage area for all those bombs/ammo

IRL, yes. In this game ... not so much. At least from what I have seen from the in game armor viewer, which I hear (read) doesn't really show everything.

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1 minute ago, nuttybiscuit said:

Didin't the methods of ammunition stowage varied greatly between carriers of all nations? I have read some went to great lengths to prevent "catastrophic" scenarios, with multiple internal armoured bulkheads, venting routes in case of explosion, water tanks encasing armoured ammunition boxes, fuel tanks used as reserve flotation, while the means to service and repair aircraft meant they had very good repair and damage control abilities. 

http://www.armouredcarriers.com/hms-unicorn-maintenance-support/

details about HMS Unicorn's provisions make for useful reading on how to ensure carrier surviveability..

Yes they did. Be it luck or just damage control mismanagement I believe the Japanese were still having significant issues with it even late in the war. Taiho being an example of it even if you disregard the Shinano as being unfinished. On the other end of that spectrum you have the Franklin.

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7 minutes ago, issm said:

Detonations are realistic, don't you know.

Please, tell me more?

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1 hour ago, nuttybiscuit said:

But they carry a huge amount of aviation fuel, which burns terribly well.:Smile_teethhappy:

 

Carriers take additional fire damage in game as well:

 

Damage dealt by each instance of fire on a ship is fixed as 0.3% of its total health pool per fire per second (0.4% for aircraft carriers). Each fire has a base duration of 60 seconds, meaning that a fire which is allowed to burn for the full duration will consume 18% of a ship's maximum health (24% for carriers).

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2 hours ago, nuttybiscuit said:

But they carry a huge amount of aviation fuel, which burns terribly well.:Smile_teethhappy:

Which is true; regardless, the way the game engine is modeled, you can only have a magazine if you have a Main Battery Armament, and you can only detonate if you have a magazine.

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Non-Detonation with a CV doesn't matter.  When a CV is already under gunfire, things have gone to s--t and the match is over and won't last much longer, or they were an absolute moron and deserved to get blown out of the water early in the match by their bone-headed sailing.

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Not detonating CV's, although counter intuitive (surely the bombs/torpedoes for the planes are stored somewhere) is probably necessary from a game play perspective, losing a carrier early to a freak accident, bout of idiocy or snipe is bad enough but if yours detonates and the red doesn't... trouble,

 

I do find it a little frustrating that the way it works ships which historically 'detonated' very little detonate the most.

I'm a teaboo so RN figures are easier to mind, but they lost something like:

  • 150 destroyers, of which arguably HMS Khartoum was detonated (or uncontrolled fire), Gallant (survived the damage) and that's about it
  • 30 cruisers, of which I can't say that any 'detonated' per se
  • 5 dreadnoughts, of which Hood is a classic detonation, people have argued about Royal Oak and Barham exploded after capsizing

So for destroyers it's about 1.3% of losses, for cruisers 0% and for battleships 20%.

Other destroyers were lost, off hand I can think of the Pole, Grom bombed on her torpedo tubes. USS Shaw exploded after a fire in Pearl. IJN cruiser torpedoes are another story...

If you look wider afield of the 3 French battleships lost, one was struck in the magazine and exploded, of the 2 Italian lost Roma was hastened by a magazine explosion, of the 2 permanent US battleship losses Arizona was a magazine explosion. Japan I don't think lost any to magazine explosions directly, though there's Mutsu. Germany came out pretty well, Tirpitz exploded while capsizing and Gneisenau's forward turret exploded in a big way after bomb damage but neither are really a 'detonation'.

Clearly therefore it makes sense to have destroyers be most susceptible to detonations in game...

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While in game CVs are not detonated, they are easily citadeled.  Been on the receiving end of that.

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They do have magazines, but they are for ordnance - bombs and torpedoes. the Liscombe Bay was hit by a single torpedo, it detonated the forward magazine, and the ship went down. 

 

I don't know we need to change the game, CVs aren't hard to sink once you get them under fire. but they did have magazines (and fuel)

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Man that was so long ago when 10t0n was still around. :Smile_sad:

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