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ChisanaJun

Naval Railgun tech

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Interested in Naval railguns both Russian and the United States have program.

The underlying physics involved in the railgun are not complicated. Current flowing through an inductor creates a magnetic field. The current flowing through the field creates a Lorentz force on the inductor tending to push the coil apart. If one portion of the coil is free to move, this portion will slide away from the power source. Building a unit and having it function for multiple firings requires very advanced engineering.  

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Oh amazing! AVR_Project-sama, I would like one please. (she laughs). Is this the one they are having difficulties with the frictional and current damaging rails. So are building them out of a graphite compound.

To be involved in this research would be amazing. 

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9 hours ago, MzFortune said:

Will this technology, ever make it to a naval vessel? 

It's a matter of making it effective to use and then shrinking it down while keeping or improving it's effectiveness so it can for on a ship. One they do that field artillery would likely be next with tanks being after that and maybe even rifles eventually, heck there's a couple videos out now of people that made rifle sizes rail guns or Guass guns, while not to powerful and unable to fire repeated shots it's definitely feasible in the future

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8 hours ago, Psycodiver said:

It's a matter of making it effective to use and then shrinking it down while keeping or improving it's effectiveness so it can for on a ship. One they do that field artillery would likely be next with tanks being after that and maybe even rifles eventually, heck there's a couple videos out now of people that made rifle sizes rail guns or Guass guns, while not to powerful and unable to fire repeated shots it's definitely feasible in the future

I look at these systems and no not how they stabilize and protect projectile from the extreme velocity and atmospheric friction. Very fascinating. Arigatōgozaimashita

ありがとうございました

 
 

 

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On 10/7/2017 at 9:34 AM, sutekina_akuma said:

Will this technology, ever make it to a naval vessel? 

 

The USN’s Zumwalt class, though now cut-off at a limited number of ships, was designed w/ a much larger power generation capability w/ the intent of possibly including rail gun kinetic energy projectile weapons & directed energy weapons in the future.   This is probably the start of seeing this type of weapons technology on future classes which will succeed the Zumwalts and Burkes of today.

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Will the weapon be an Anti-missile system or used in surface warfare. The Physics fascinate me of this entire project. Thank you for the response. 

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20 hours ago, sutekina_akuma said:

Will the weapon be an Anti-missile system or used in surface warfare. The Physics fascinate me of this entire project. Thank you for the response. 

 

The initial phases of the railgun are projected to be used as a kinetic energy projectile.  It would be a non-explosive bombardment tool using the kinetic energy of the projectile (because of its hyper velocity) instead of an explosive charge to hit targets at extended ranges compared to current naval gun systems.

 

The laser systems target options are a function of the power of these systems.  The first operational laser system (LaWS) was deployed on the USS Ponce - it was a ~30kw laser system comprised of a number of commercial industrial lasers focused into a single beam.  At this power level, the laser system was capable of shooting down drones and discouraging small boat attacks.

 

Unlike the aborted ABL project (the modified 747 which used volatile chemical lasers which was designed to shoot down ballistic missiles in their boost phase), the current military laser systems are based on fiber lasers that have their roots in industrial laser technology.

 

This is still a way from a anti-missile system, but the Navy is planning for it’s next phase a system in the 100-150 kw range for deployment in a couple of years.

 

The army, too is running laser trials for vehicle mounted systems in this type of power range designed to shoot down drones, but could also probably be nasty for helicopters.  Lockheed-Martin recently ran a test of its ATHENA experimental system that shot down 5 drones.  The army would like to see these systems compacted enough to be placed on truck sized vehicles or armored vehicles such as its Stryker.  Lockheed’s press PR shows a integrated 3 vehicle system comprised of a laser unit, radar/sensor unit and Command & Control unit.

 

You can easily find some videos of the systems I’ve mentioned on YouTube.

Edited by hangglide42

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Thank you for your response. I will need to do a little more investigating. Thank you for the information and direction. I have read a bit about the laser tech but have seen only, early demo on the railgun. 

Thought maybe project was terminated. I saw JPL was working on EM drive for propulsive units on space vehicles, and this is similar to the railgun function just accelerating very low mass to extreme velocity. 

which made me remember the Railgun the USA was working on. 

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On 10/7/2017 at 11:34 AM, sutekina_akuma said:

Will this technology, ever make it to a naval vessel? 

personally i don't think we'll see it on a test ship until the late 20's, and probably not in a deployable status until 2030 at the very earliest in my opinion.

but some fairly small revelation in the next few years could speed up the process to mid 20's an deployable status by 2030. 

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Amazing. Well just have to see if you are correct. Think the system would be amazing. In the Physics lab here we set up different low powered laser systems and I find it interesting. But not like the railgun. thank you for all the information everyone has given me it is very kind of you all to take the time to educate me.

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The US project is now basically dead as a result of some sort of funding project being cut, so we may never see a rail gun now 

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On 12/11/2017 at 8:11 AM, JohnPJones said:

The US project is now basically dead as a result of some sort of funding project being cut, so we may never see a rail gun now 

 

Yup - the recent budget proposals put the navy railgun project on life-support-soon to be killed status, but on the bright side, the funds are being diverted into the laser technology under development - I.e. the successors to LaWS, etc.

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21 hours ago, hangglide42 said:

 

Yup - the recent budget proposals put the navy railgun project on life-support-soon to be killed status, but on the bright side, the funds are being diverted into the laser technology under development - I.e. the successors to LaWS, etc.

I’m very skeptical of new/fancy technology, so I’m not holding my breath even for the new laser tech to make any sort of serious deployment.

 

i know the laser had an experimental/prototype deployments but the mk71 died while the prototype was installed on a destroyer

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14 hours ago, JohnPJones said:

I’m very skeptical of new/fancy technology, so I’m not holding my breath even for the new laser tech to make any sort of serious deployment.

 

i know the laser had an experimental/prototype deployments but the mk71 died while the prototype was installed on a destroyer

 

The LaWs was an actual operational system deployed on the USS Ponce in 2014.  The technology is based on using multiple industrial lasers to produce a ~30 kw beam and it was capable of hitting drones & was intended for use against small boat attacks.   The navy is scaling up this type of system & is expecting to field a system in the 100-150 kw range to give it more  robust capability in a couple of years.

 

The Army, too, is evaluating systems in a similar power range.   Google “Athena” which recently shot down 5 drones in a test.

 

The laser systems are actually closer to fielding than the railgun tech and are far from science fiction and have been actually deployed.

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7 hours ago, hangglide42 said:

 

The LaWs was an actual operational system deployed on the USS Ponce in 2014.  The technology is based on using multiple industrial lasers to produce a ~30 kw beam and it was capable of hitting drones & was intended for use against small boat attacks.   The navy is scaling up this type of system & is expecting to field a system in the 100-150 kw range to give it more  robust capability in a couple of years.

 

The Army, too, is evaluating systems in a similar power range.   Google “Athena” which recently shot down 5 drones in a test.

 

The laser systems are actually closer to fielding than the railgun tech and are far from science fiction and have been actually deployed.

Thank you for telling me what I just said I knew. I appreciate it.

like I said none of that actually means anything. The mk71 gun was installed on a ship for testing and evaluation. the gun system performed very well, guided munitions destroying moving targets and holing a target hulk below the waterline causing it to begin flooding, but despite how well it performed and operated it was still shelved. The same thing could happen to the lasers...didn’t that plane with the laser in the nose get shelved as well?

Heck the early designs for the Burke class included putting the mk71 on at least a few. Until ships are designed with the system and manufactured with it, it’s very much a possibility the project is canceled outright 

its simply too early to say

Edited by JohnPJones

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On 12/14/2017 at 6:22 AM, JohnPJones said:

Thank you for telling me what I just said I knew. I appreciate it.

like I said none of that actually means anything. The mk71 gun was installed on a ship for testing and evaluation. the gun system performed very well, guided munitions destroying moving targets and holing a target hulk below the waterline causing it to begin flooding, but despite how well it performed and operated it was still shelved. The same thing could happen to the lasers...didn’t that plane with the laser in the nose get shelved as well?

Heck the early designs for the Burke class included putting the mk71 on at least a few. Until ships are designed with the system and manufactured with it, it’s very much a possibility the project is canceled outright 

its simply too early to say

The reason the Airborne Laser PLatform was canceled is that it used a chemical laser which is hugely expensive to operate and the aircraft had a limited number of shots. The new laser systems are solid state lasers. Much more efficient and only limited by power generation. The MK-71 was a success as a program, however, it produced to much recoil and the Spruance and Ticonderoga's could not handle the strain. It did not have guided rounds and it had accuracy problems which was another major factor in its cancellation.

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3 hours ago, Belthorian said:

The reason the Airborne Laser PLatform was canceled is that it used a chemical laser which is hugely expensive to operate and the aircraft had a limited number of shots. The new laser systems are solid state lasers. Much more efficient and only limited by power generation. The MK-71 was a success as a program, however, it produced to much recoil and the Spruance and Ticonderoga's could not handle the strain. It did not have guided rounds and it had accuracy problems which was another major factor in its cancellation.

It did have guided rounds, laser guided rounds and the ‘strain’ is a myth.

 

http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNUS_8-55_mk71.php

Edited by JohnPJones

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