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danojaye

Asking for balance once again..

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Every day, I get into games where this happens. One team has 4 or 5 radar ships and the other has 1 ( or none in a couple of instances ).

MatchMaker needs to account for the ' gimmicks '. Theres a Baltimore on the other team but its covered.

 

toomanyradar.jpg

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I hear ya man especially when I'm in a dd.  Not much you can do when a radar cruiser is near every cap or bb your trying to torp  And now with the new pan Asian line testing radar or hydro, radar will be even more prevalent.  Makes for passive gameplay.

1 hour ago, danojaye said:

Every day, I get into games where this happens. One team has 4 or 5 radar ships and the other has 1 ( or none in a couple of instances ).

MatchMaker needs to account for the ' gimmicks '. Theres a Baltimore on the other team but its covered.

 

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But does the cruiser have a Radar?

 

I was in a match the other day were a Tirpitz raged because the Baltimore sailing with him did not have radar on his ship.

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1 hour ago, Lord_Slayer said:

But does the cruiser have a Radar?

 

I was in a match the other day were a Tirpitz raged because the Baltimore sailing with him did not have radar on his ship.

 

TBH, IMO if you don't know how to use your radar properly, the fighter plane might be a better choice. It doesn't provide the range and guaranteed spotting that radar does, but can give early warning for torps, (ability can be improved with a 1-point captain skill) still let you "see through" islands, (albeit at shorter range) plus it can disrupt enemy air attacks. And it has a 6-minute duration.

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16 minutes ago, Skpstr said:

 

TBH, IMO if you don't know how to use your radar properly, the fighter plane might be a better choice. It doesn't provide the range and guaranteed spotting that radar does, but can give early warning for torps, (ability can be improved with a 1-point captain skill) still let you "see through" islands, (albeit at shorter range) plus it can disrupt enemy air attacks. And it has a 6-minute duration.

Radar is such a zero-skill ability though. All someone needs to do is press a button when in range of a smoke screen and they ruin some poor DD's game. 

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7 minutes ago, _Fantomex_ said:

Radar is such a zero-skill ability though. All someone needs to do is press a button when in range of a smoke screen and they ruin some poor DD's game. 

 

Maybe not so much "don't know how to use your radar", as "don't know when to use it".

 

I don't have a lot of experience with DDs or radar TBH, but it seems to me that when I do play a DD in a match with radar, if I get lit, it's pretty common that only the radar ship shoots at me, or perhaps one additional ship.

 

They aren't checking that they have teammates who can actually shoot at me, or aren't busy shooting at someone else before hitting the radar. When that happens, I just GTFO and come back after the radar has gone on cooldown.

 

Heck, I've been lit by radar and had nobody shoot at me lol. (guessing cruiser was behind island, and nobody else in position)

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1 hour ago, Skpstr said:

 

Maybe not so much "don't know how to use your radar", as "don't know when to use it".

 

I don't have a lot of experience with DDs or radar TBH, but it seems to me that when I do play a DD in a match with radar, if I get lit, it's pretty common that only the radar ship shoots at me, or perhaps one additional ship.

 

They aren't checking that they have teammates who can actually shoot at me, or aren't busy shooting at someone else before hitting the radar. When that happens, I just GTFO and come back after the radar has gone on cooldown.

 

Heck, I've been lit by radar and had nobody shoot at me lol. (guessing cruiser was behind island, and nobody else in position)

 

Yep.  Folks just think it's a "hit the button" solution.  But to truly take advantage of radar, it requires team play...and a good degree of coordination.  Cruisers that are close enough to ping a smoke screen are often close enough to get insta-deleted by BBs.  The one BB that has radar is spotted well in advance of getting into radar range...and often becomes a focus fire target.

 

And the strategy gets a bit more subtle.  One of my goals when I push my BB (in support of DDs) is to force the radar CA to either turn away or hide.  In the former, no radar.  In the latter, they might radar but not from a position to shoot.  Sometimes, the CA will turn without even getting shot at.  The mere presence of a BB in cap support can help a DD cap in a radar-free zone.

 

There is a game within the game when it comes to radar, smoke, and positioning.  Whether you are the DD guy, or the radar guy, the CA or the BB...there is a lot more than meets the eye...figuratively and and literally..when it comes to game play.  Those who only see the one dimensional aspects of it are missing out on a lot of what the game has to offer.  

 

 

Edited by Soshi_Sone
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It really is a one-button victory condition if you're not an idiot about it. Proponents love to bring up the cruiser's reloads compared to Radar's duration, while conveniently ignoring the fact that the number of salvos fired by the radar ship while radar is active is irrelevant: What has the most impact is how many salvos are fired at the revealed ship by the radar ship's team.

 

If 10 games in Kagero are enough for a BB main to tell me how to play Shimakaze, than my 40+ games in Atlanta should be enough to give me an idea how to use radar.

 

And it's a pretty stupid, binary mechanic.

Edited by AraAragami
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11 minutes ago, AraAragami said:

It really is a one-button victory condition if you're not an idiot about it. Proponents love to bring up the cruiser's reloads compared to Radar's duration, while conveniently ignoring the fact that the number of salvos fired by the radar ship while radar is active is irrelevant: What has the most impact is how many salvos are fired at the revealed ship by the radar ship's team.

 

Agreed. And until I'm comfy with playing the NO in Tier 9-10 matches the same way I was the Hipper, I'll hold off learning radar play, and stick with the plane (that I have plenty of experience using) for now.

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Radar isn't a hit the button and win. You do need to knw when to hit that button. If you hit radar at the wrong time we'll u wasted that radar. Now if hit the button at the right you will ruin and smoking camping ships day. But you still have to knw when to hit that button. I do have some experience playing dd's and using radar. 

 

If I see radar ships on the other team I'll play alittle more cautious and hope that those radar ships get spotted so I knw what I can do.  I took a cap on one game with 2 radar ships near the same cap but I was able to stay out of there radar range. I also wasn't alone so it kept them from pushing closer to me. Radar just encourages team play. 

 

If your not smart about then you will get [edited] up.

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Once again, the topic takes a turn.

 

The subject wasnt about how to play radar, its about putting it all on one team and leaving the other with few to NONE.

 

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Hello @danojaye thank you for bringing the issue of radars in team balance to our attention. This is something we will need to investigate thoroughly. Thank you for making us aware of this area of concern

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I gotta say, that is something awkward. 

 

@WolfofWarship, there's a lot to be said about this. Some of the more difficult ways to hear it are:

1.Generally, the Missouri is overpowered by most metrics, winrate, utility and comparison to its tech-tree counterpart. Hard to swallow, because it is an awesome ship. 

2. Radar and the vision game is far too influential in this game. Most of the MM screaming and other balance complaints in the forum are about radar. (And a lesser extent, the boats that are strong right now are the ones with radar and hydro)

3. Smaller ships need to be able to do things against larger ships.  By do things I mean deal substantial damage, make them fear, do something beyond non-direct-influential activities like spotting, or capping empty places.

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On 05/10/2017 at 4:02 AM, danojaye said:

Every day, I get into games where this happens. One team has 4 or 5 radar ships and the other has 1 ( or none in a couple of instances ).

MatchMaker needs to account for the ' gimmicks '. Theres a Baltimore on the other team but its covered.

 

toomanyradar.jpg

And the Haven Map is a nightmare for dds with all that radar as the caps are so close together. 

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