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Conqueror needs to be nerfed asap

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This T10 BB is absolutely [edited]... virtually every volley sets fires, in most cases 2 at a time and 3 isn't uncommon at all.

The problem with this ship is that it requires no effort/skill to absolutely wreck any ship in the game.  T10 montanana no problem 5 salvos 100-0 a montana easy, because every salvo will set multiple salvos not to mention deal 10-15k damage...

Battleships at this tier are to heavily armored for HE to have any effect on them... the caliber actually makes zero difference when firing HE at a ship of this nature.  so why would the royal BB line have insane HE... makes no sense at all.

The other problem with this ship is that it cannot be countered... The conqueror has no weaknesses, speed, firing angles, armor, can't be citadel, guns are insane, the heal is beyond ridiculous.   I own this ship and I don't even like it, for the main reason its just stupid... no challenge at all to play, and its flat out over powered.. like 10 times the power of the yamato, at least the yamato has weakness where the conqueror does not..

Seen a pattern of very lazy ship design and flavor lately, where ships are just cloned or giving some insane abilities that no other ships in the game can match... As a T10 BB you shouldn't be able to burn a Grosser Kurfurst 100-0 in 6 salvos... and this GF didn't play bad, he angled stayed at range, used his repair wisely, it just didn't matter, each salvo I fired at him hit for at least 10k and in the course of 6 salvos I started 9 fires... and he burned to death.. Oh and I got arsonist and first blood 4 minutes into the game..... yeah that kind of over powered....

 

Please do not wait to nerf this ship, the longer you wait the worse the game play experience will be for the player base who plays and plays against this ship....

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here is an idea to consider, help keep your DDs alive, allow them to work to the target and kill the BB that offends you.

I have been the victim of other ships that are as deadly. But i am working my Yugumo up for the Shimakaze and I can tell you when supported I have Two Conquer Kills, one at full heath.

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I agree that Conqueror should be nerfed in some way. I'll leave to WG how because they have all the possible data.

 

But I think you forgot people can check your account.

"I own this ship and I don't even like it, for the main reason its just stupid..."

Your max RN BB is Queen Elizabeth, far from Conqueror. :/

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1 minute ago, PauloBR said:

I agree that Conqueror should be nerfed in some way. I'll leave to WG how because they have all the possible data.

 

But I think you forgot people can check your account.

"I own this ship and I don't even like it, for the main reason its just stupid..."

Your max RN BB is Queen Elizabeth, far from Conqueror. :/

And a total of two battles in Royal Navy Battleships. Not in a certain RN BB, overall, including PvE.

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While OP went overboard with the hyperbole, it's stupid that WG hasn't addressed this yet. 

 

Edited by Kombat_W0MBAT

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46 minutes ago, PauloBR said:

I agree that Conqueror should be nerfed in some way. I'll leave to WG how because they have all the possible data.

 

But I think you forgot people can check your account.

"I own this ship and I don't even like it, for the main reason its just stupid..."

Your max RN BB is Queen Elizabeth, far from Conqueror. :/

 

latest?cb=20121205194057

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Didn't Flamu just put out a rant video about the OP Conqueror? 

I really expected to see it linked here when I showed up. 

Oh what the heck I share it myself, just let me trudge down there and pick up the link.

.

.

.

.

Found it. 

 

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The problem with the ship is that it has the 12x419 configuration. If everyone were forced to use the 457s, and nothing else changed, it would be a much more fun, interesting, and balanced ship. 

 

The 457s require a brain to use and ammo choice. The 419s are just HERPDERPHEALLDAYERRDAY fire hoses. I've played both versions and actually prefer the larger guns. 

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Yeah, it's ridiculous. Flamu tends to be on the harsh side, but he's right. The high tier RN BBs were supposed to be fragile to offset their concealment and heal. Instead, they're virtually impossible to citadel. Raise the citadel, to pre-buff USN levels. That will help. Nerf the AA, vulnerable to CVs. If that's not enough, yank the 419s. Or, give them truly terrible dispersion. And a fire chance nerf wouldn't be excessive.

 

Otherwise the only BB in Clan Wars will be the HMS MegaZao.

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I was chastised in another post for saying I'm incapable of citadeling and don't know how to BB (I've got about 2500 battles between my GK,yam,monty), but he conveniently shut up and ignored my post when I came back with hard data on citadel rates on a conq. It's about 1% at 6km in GK at perfect broadside.

 

That ship is seriously broken. Eliminate all AA in one salvo, 3+ fires in one salvo and voila. Oh, and you can't brawl one without losing. I've stopped playing certain boats entirely because of it and am no longer interested in purchasing any doubloons or renewing my premium time. 

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On 04/10/2017 at 4:53 PM, AJTP89 said:

Yeah, it's ridiculous. Flamu tends to be on the harsh side, but he's right. The high tier RN BBs were supposed to be fragile to offset their concealment and heal. Instead, they're virtually impossible to citadel. Raise the citadel, to pre-buff USN levels. That will help. Nerf the AA, vulnerable to CVs. If that's not enough, yank the 419s. Or, give them truly terrible dispersion. And a fire chance nerf wouldn't be excessive.

 

Otherwise the only BB in Clan Wars will be the HMS MegaZao.

Why does everyone keep saying "HERP DERP RAISE DUR CITADEL!!"? That will take the ship and WG-Sledgehammer nerf it into oblivion, it will go from best ship to pile of garbage overnight because it will now be stuck sniping in the back, and every hit... Yes every hit,  will be a citadel. Have you played the CQ? Do you know how many wonky angle full pens it eats? A lot. Those would all be citadels and the thing would be about as fragile as an Omaha, except worse because the armor in the other side would not allow citadel over pens. 

 

Is there something wrong with the ship? Yes. It's the 12x419 fire hoses. Get rid of them, or nerf them heavily, and it becomes pretty dang balanced. When I play with those 457s, I say "Hm, this is pretty fun, and not broken." When I play with the 419s, I say "Wow, this is pants on head [edited]. Nerf when WG?" 

 

The ship is great. The survivability is awesome, and what gives the ship its character. What it doesn't need, is to be the most efficient damage dealer on tier as well that can completely ignore all armor. Fix that, the ship is fixed, and everyone is happy. 

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4 minutes ago, Show_Me_Your_Cits said:

Why does everyone keep saying "HERP DERP RAISE DUR CITADEL!!"? That will take the ship and WG-Sledgehammer nerf it into oblivion, it will go from best ship to pile of garbage overnight because it will now be stuck sniping in the back, and every hit... Yes every hit,  will be a citadel. Have you played the CQ? Do you know how many wonky angle full pens it eats? A lot. Those would all be citadels and the thing would be about as fragile as an Omaha, except worse because the armor in the other side would not allow citadel over pens. 

 

Is there something wrong with the ship? Yes. It's the 12x419 fire hoses. Get rid of them, or nerf them heavily, and it becomes pretty dang balanced. When I play with those 457s, I say "Hm, this is pretty fun, and not broken." When I play with the 419s, I say "Wow, this is pants on head retarded. Nerf when WG?" 

 

The ship is great. The survivability is awesome, and what gives the ship its character. What it doesn't need, is to be the most efficient damage dealer on tier as well that can completely ignore all armor. Fix that, the ship is fixed, and everyone is happy. 

 

I think that's the way they should go.

Nerf the guns but not the armor/hp. She's really squishy and that heal really saves her.

Her AA is far from great too and torpedoes destroy her day.

 

My idea would be mostly nerfing the 419mm (and maybe a little bit of the heal, like a little longer time but less hp per sec).

For the 419mm: nerf the fire chance a little (it's the same as Lion with 4 more guns), nerf turret rotation might be good too (like they did with Mogami 155mm), and maybe reduce a little her max turret turning angle?

I won't talk about the 479mm because I need to actually use them =p

 

What I like about Conqueror is that she is some kind of "bow on meta destroyer" since she can just lit other BBs on fire and deal a good damage with HE.

And she counters fire with her heal right now, torpedoes are really more reliable to take her down.

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1 hour ago, Show_Me_Your_Cits said:

Why does everyone keep saying "HERP DERP RAISE DUR CITADEL!!"? That will take the ship and WG-Sledgehammer nerf it into oblivion, it will go from best ship to pile of garbage overnight because it will now be stuck sniping in the back, and every hit... Yes every hit,  will be a citadel. Have you played the CQ? Do you know how many wonky angle full pens it eats? A lot. Those would all be citadels and the thing would be about as fragile as an Omaha, except worse because the armor in the other side would not allow citadel over pens. 

 

Is there something wrong with the ship? Yes. It's the 12x419 fire hoses. Get rid of them, or nerf them heavily, and it becomes pretty dang balanced. When I play with those 457s, I say "Hm, this is pretty fun, and not broken." When I play with the 419s, I say "Wow, this is pants on head retarded. Nerf when WG?" 

 

The ship is great. The survivability is awesome, and what gives the ship its character. What it doesn't need, is to be the most efficient damage dealer on tier as well that can completely ignore all armor. Fix that, the ship is fixed, and everyone is happy. 

OK, I've only played her on the PTS (it was stupid easy). I thought that she was supposed to be stealthy because the armor was trash. But it's on the same level as the Germans. 

 

However, you do have a point with the guns, they are the problem. Would they go away with the 18 inchers? Guess that's what testing is for.

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3 hours ago, AJTP89 said:

OK, I've only played her on the PTS (it was stupid easy). I thought that she was supposed to be stealthy because the armor was trash. But it's on the same level as the Germans. 

 

However, you do have a point with the guns, they are the problem. Would they go away with the 18 inchers? Guess that's what testing is for.

What? If you use CE and the slot 6 concealment mod, she comes in at something like 11.2km. that's insane for a t10 BB (also necessary, because it allows her to pull back and buy time to heal since she's very squishy.)

 

I agree that her firepower might deserve a nerf; Conqueror makes me look like a much better player than I am. I'm not a BB main; my Bismarck and GK average damage is on the low side compared to others. I'm just not as strong in them as I am DDs. But Conqueror, if I can survive the first five minutes (I tend to be too aggressive), makes it easy to rack up 100k+ damage without breaking a sweat. On the other hand, the fact that it's mostly fully healable fire dmg does mitigate that a bit.

 

Thing is, though, Conqueror will not be as OP in competitive play as she is in random battles, because there is far better coordination (although having no CVs in clan battles will help her). And she isn't OP in random battles when facing a few smart players, especially in DDs or CVs. Conqueror is very vulnerable to torps. Her sheer length makes it very difficult to avoid them or turn into them without eating them, she floods easily, and she doesn't mitigate torpedo damage well (I haven't checked numbers, this is based on the twenty or so games I've played on mine so far.) And this goes double for torp bombers... Out of the three bad games I've had in Conqueror so far, two of them were because I got focused early by enemy CV. Her AA isn't good enough to thin out enemy squadrons, and a solid double or triple drop from a Hakuryu will delete her. Especially if the red CV lets my damage control run out before he hits me with another torp drop to flood me again.

 

The hard counter to any BB is either torps, or focused fire. This goes double for Conqueror. She's sort of a BB version of Minotaur....a glass cannon who will rack up huge damage if left unchecked, but who is hideously vulnerable to high-alpha strikes (such as a 12-gun strike to her flanks from GK or Monty), focused fire to overwhelm her stellar repair and damage control, or in Conqueror's case, smart DD players or the full attention of a strike loadout CV.

Edited by poeticmotion

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14 hours ago, Rusicaa said:

All RN BBs need to be nerfed.

 

Really my dude? All of them?

 

Even the Bellerophon which is last among BB's at its tier in WR? 

 

How about Iron Duke which is 4th out of 6?

 

Queen Elizabeth that's 6th out of 7? 

 

Monarch that's 4th out of 7 and is widely derided as being just an ill-conceived, half-assed attempt to satisfy both sides of the debate over what tier King George V should be? 

 

Come on now. Scale back the hyperbole. The British BB's that should be considered for nerfs are Orion, Conqueror, and -possibly- Lion and King George (BB WR stats at T9 are very odd so it's hard to tell with Lion, and KGV and Scharnhorst are neck and neck at T7). The others are perfectly fine, in fact some of them like Monarch could be worthy of small buffs. 

Edited by Middcore

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1 minute ago, Middcore said:

Come on now. Scale back the hyperbole. The British BB's that should be considered for nerfs are Orion, Conqueror, and -possibly- Lion and King George (BB WR stats at T9 are very odd so it's hard to tell, and KGV and Scharnhorst are neck and neck at T7). 

 

I would agree - I'm not a good BB player (DD main) but I find the low tiers to be average or slightly above. You can even wreck an Orion in a Ishizuchi (Just did it last night) if you play correctly. You get above tier 6 they start getting a bit on the OP side. In my previous post I showed killing 2 Conqueror's kind of as a joke because I can to the same to Yamato and GK (Montana is a bit tough but can be done). The issue I think WG may have is that most players that have these ships are not Noobs or Average players so they are afraid to nerf. I would be interested to see how the bottom 10% are doing on Conqueror. Right now it's top for the tier 10's on the NA server but not by a huge margin. By measuring the bottom 10% and the top 10%, in each nation, you can see how easy it is to play and how powerful it can be. 

 

14 hours ago, Rusicaa said:

All RN BBs need to be nerfed.

 

The issue some of the RN BB's is they have one counter, DD's, and they have to be focused or they can wreck your team. That takes the DD's away from the objective or allows the RN BB free rein. The interesting thing is you learn what these ships can do they are not that hard to counter with a good team. If you played during the KMS BB release everyone thought "OMG" but you started to understand what you could do to counter and it was "Yea you aren't so tough" Only the high tiers RN BB's are a bit OP due to the High Fire chance and Super Heal. 

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On 10/5/2017 at 4:23 PM, Middcore said:

 

Really my dude? All of them?

 

Even the Bellerophon which is last among BB's at its tier in WR? 

 

How about Iron Duke which is 4th out of 6?

 

Queen Elizabeth that's 6th out of 7? 

 

Monarch that's 4th out of 7 and is widely derided as being just an ill-conceived, half-assed attempt to satisfy both sides of the debate over what tier King George V should be? 

 

Come on now. Scale back the hyperbole. The British BB's that should be considered for nerfs are Orion, Conqueror, and -possibly- Lion and King George (BB WR stats at T9 are very odd so it's hard to tell with Lion, and KGV and Scharnhorst are neck and neck at T7). The others are perfectly fine, in fact some of them like Monarch could be worthy of small buffs. 

If I recall in the design notes, the RN BB line was designed as a counter for those who like to bow tank or hide behind islands. Passive play in short. To force ships to act like ships rather than act like tanks. Sure, you can keep doing it, but be aware that you're now a sitting target.

I find it interesting that every time WG tries to break the meta, there are folks who want the status quo.

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I will say this again since clearly there's a lot of people unwilling to engage their brains.

It is not the ship nor entire line that needs addressing.

The problem lies solely with fire.  This absolutely failtarded mentality that WG has instilled into the populace of 'oh just spam HE, no skill required!' is crap; its more abused at this point than cloaking infini-spam torps.

The simple answer is damage caused by fire needs to be beaten to a bloody pulp with the nerf bat.That is to say, sure you can lite 4 fires - but none of those fires do more than 100HP every few seconds. Fixing that would INSTANTLY fix the immense imbalance of this game between those wanting to show their skill by actually aiming their shots; and the $h!tters that just spam HE all day long like so many Atlanta/Kutuzov twits out there.

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1 hour ago, YukonHunter said:

I will say this again since clearly there's a lot of people unwilling to engage their brains.

It is not the ship nor entire line that needs addressing.

The problem lies solely with fire.  This absolutely failtarded mentality that WG has instilled into the populace of 'oh just spam HE, no skill required!' is crap; its more abused at this point than cloaking infini-spam torps.

The simple answer is damage caused by fire needs to be beaten to a bloody pulp with the nerf bat.That is to say, sure you can lite 4 fires - but none of those fires do more than 100HP every few seconds. Fixing that would INSTANTLY fix the immense imbalance of this game between those wanting to show their skill by actually aiming their shots; and the $h!tters that just spam HE all day long like so many Atlanta/Kutuzov twits out there.

 

Sounds like solving a result and not the cause. "So WG lets ensure no ship can be on fire so HE spammers can't set me on fire and all other ships that have experience can't either so I take less damage because I can't manage HE spam"

 

There are ships that can and will HE spam and that is what they do, you have to know that when you go into a battle. HE needs no nerf only the fire % of a few ships not all as you suggest. 

Edited by Pete_Darling

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On 07/10/2017 at 4:02 AM, Pete_Darling said:

 

Sounds like solving a result and not the cause. "So WG lets ensure no ship can be on fire so HE spammers can't set me on fire and all other ships that have experience can't either so I take less damage because I can't manage HE spam"

 

There are ships that can and will HE spam and that is what they do, you have to know that when you go into a battle. HE needs no nerf only the fire % of a few ships not all as you suggest. 

And WRONG. This problem of fire has existed since beta -  be it wallet warrior [edited] such as Kutuzov or Atlanta or Belfast, or any of the tech line spammers, the simple fact remains that spamming HE from warships to sink other *warships* and not carriers or tankers is just plain stupid. It never happened. HE was historically used as a last resort and/or bluff, but not as a combat-line weapon from one warship to another.  WG has consistently dropped the ball in this issue - and others, of course - but refuses to own up to the mess they created.

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1 hour ago, YukonHunter said:

And WRONG. This problem of fire has existed since beta -  be it wallet warrior $h!tters such as Kutuzov or Atlanta or Belfast, or any of the tech line spammers, the simple fact remains that spamming HE from warships to sink other *warships* and not carriers or tankers is just plain stupid. It never happened. HE was historically used as a last resort and/or bluff, but not as a combat-line weapon from one warship to another.  WG has consistently dropped the ball in this issue - and others, of course - but refuses to own up to the mess they created.

 

Actually the shell type was selected based on the "Hardness of the target" AP and HE rounds were both used on other ships as well as on shore bombardments. When I asked a WWII Battleship Vet "We shot what was loaded" He actually went on and on about gun type and target type and the different rounds they carried and why they had them but he never circled back around to tell me what battleship he served on (I'll ask his grandson later). That being said on to the game:

 

This is where I disagree with you - You are saying that HE needs to be nerf'd Globally (reduction in fire damage) and that is what is WRONG. My main is IJN DD's and second is USN DD's but I play all classes and nations. If you nerf fire in general you hurt ships that are within a balance of the current play. Each ship has its own resistance to fire as well as each HE shell having a fire chance so you have a limited chance of starting fires unless the HE has a high % and or the ship has a low % resistance. I understand some ships need to be change but you should not change fire damage globally. 

 

There have been posts and comments as well as videos on other issues people see in the game similar to your complaint, BB AP shouldn't Pen  DD's, Floods are too powerful, IJN torps do too much damage but yea. If WG changed everything that was put out there we would all sail around for 20 minutes doing no damage to each other. The earlier post I made that I later called a joke it really wasn't. You see a ship that is causing issues you or your teammate just sink it and it can cause no more issues.

 

The OP's point is Conqueror needs to be nerf'd and it does, at least the 416's 

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1 minute ago, Pete_Darling said:

 

Actually the shell type was selected based on the "Hardness of the target" AP and HE rounds were both used on other ships as well as on shore bombardments. When I asked a WWII Battleship Vet "We shot what was loaded" He actually went on and on about gun type and target type and the different rounds they carried and why they had them but he never circled back around to tell me what battleship he served on (I'll ask his grandson later). That being said on to the game:

 

This is where I disagree with you - You are saying that HE needs to be nerf'd Globally (reduction in fire damage) and that is what is WRONG. My main is IJN DD's and second is USN DD's but I play all classes and nations. If you nerf fire in general you hurt ships that are within a balance of the current play. Each ship has its own resistance to fire as well as each HE shell having a fire chance so you have a limited chance of starting fires unless the HE has a high % and or the ship has a low % resistance. I understand some ships need to be change but you should not change fire damage globally. 

 

There have been posts and comments as well as videos on other issues people see in the game similar to your complaint, BB AP shouldn't Pen  DD's, Floods are too powerful, IJN torps do too much damage but yea. If WG changed everything that was put out there we would all sail around for 20 minutes doing no damage to each other. The earlier post I made that I later called a joke it really wasn't. You see a ship that is causing issues you or your teammate just sink it and it can cause no more issues.

 

The OP's point is Conqueror needs to be nerf'd and it does, at least the 416's 

Which, of course, is total crap; not surprising coming from an IJN DD main whose still p!$$ed about the nerf bat barely grazing your stern.

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