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Vasily_Zaytsev_

Do the right thing Wargaming!!

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You guys need to address the ridiculousness of strafing....If you can find my ONE WW2 pilot who shot down a whole squadron for planes in ONE strafe, i'll retract this completely. I know this game isn't totally historical, but what kinda arcade [edited] are you trying to make here. A full squad of 6 planes gets wiped out by WG's "strafe". Imagine if in WOT you could call in an A10 strafe, and take out 6 tanks. Your server would blow up from all the players on the server's heads exploding. Fix it, do the right thing. It's time.....really. And for all you incoming trolls...Get bent. You're probably the ones who exploit the crap out of this broken mechanic. Ya you are, that's cause that's what trolls do...be trolly.

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10 minutes ago, Lew19 said:

You guys need to address the ridiculousness of strafing....If you can find my ONE WW2 pilot who shot down a whole squadron for planes in ONE strafe, i'll retract this completely. I know this game isn't totally historical, but what kinda arcade [edited] are you trying to make here. A full squad of 6 planes gets wiped out by WG's "strafe". Imagine if in WOT you could call in an A10 strafe, and take out 6 tanks. Your server would blow up from all the players on the server's heads exploding. Fix it, do the right thing. It's time.....really. And for all you incoming trolls...Get bent. You're probably the ones who exploit the crap out of this broken mechanic. Ya you are, that's cause that's what trolls do...be trolly.

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You squadron is not getting strafed by a single plane , it is getting strafed by a squadron of fighters so its not so unbelievable. Also you may be up against higher tier planes, you just need to learn the mechanics of the gameplay. There are plenty of good youtube videos out there that explain how to play cv.

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It doesn't matter how many planes, who's flying, what tier, what planes, the temperature of the air, the brightness of the sun. The strafing mechanic is stupid and should be removed from the game. Or Obj268 / Foch 155 nerfed into oblivion.

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On a related note. Do bomber tail gunners target fighters that are strafing or just around their area? Or only when being actively attacked?

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So you're saying that it is unrealistic for a group of fighters to drop out of elevation from an unexpected or unspotted angle and use their speed, elevation and fire power to drop multiple enemy fighters out of the air in one pass? You're saying that never happened?

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4 minutes ago, Stonehammers said:

On a related note. Do bomber tail gunners target fighters that are strafing or just around their area? Or only when being actively attacked?

Only when actively being attacked.

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12 minutes ago, smf117 said:

So you're saying that it is unrealistic for a group of fighters to drop out of elevation from an unexpected or unspotted angle and use their speed, elevation and fire power to drop multiple enemy fighters out of the air in one pass? You're saying that never happened?

Submit some proof that this happened....please. be useful for us

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9 minutes ago, Lew19 said:

Submit some proof that this happened....please. be useful for us

It was a common tactic of WWII fighter sweeps. The Brits did it with Spitfires and the Americans did it with the P51s and P38s with great efficiency.  The German fighters, specifically the FW 190 and BF 109 were known for dropping out of cloud cover seemingly out of nowhere and taking Allied fighters out and vanishing before anyone even knew what hit them. It is known that the majority of pilots shot down in this manner didn't even know what plane hit them or from where. This was often the opening move of many dog fights.

 

I am not your librarian. You go do your own research.

 

Edit: I understand the mechanic is not an entirely accurate representation of this tactic but as you said and as we all know...this is an arcade game.

Edited by smf117

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Okay... let me have my (poor) way with words...

Spoiler

Back then in WWII, USN pilots were considerably trained to a much higher degree than IJN pilots. Meaning that yes they could outright wipeout a strike wing in one go...

Where's my proof...

https://youtu.be/ehCEciDKF5E

The first clip is a fighter behind a plane...

You fail to acknowledge the threat of having guns trained on you and shooting at you from behind where the only thing to protect you is the plane's armor. That same video also shows strafing on ground targets. Strafing was also used to force AA gun crews down...

You really have no reason to complain...

Unless you want things to be historically accurate... 

 

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Without strafes fighter combat is incredibly boring. Just an auto-win to the CV player with better planes/captain skills. It's also just Plane Clicker 2017. Strafes are the skill shot in the game for fighters. It allows for more dynamic air combat for the game. If we take out strafes completely we need some other new mechanics to make fighter combat actually interesting.

 

Strafes don't need to go. It's a game, so realism takes a back seat to game play. Deal with it.

 

What does need to be changed is the UI and how strafes work. Sometimes a squad that looks like it should execute the strafe just doesn't and has to do a 360, missing your chance and wasting ammo i you didn't back out in time. Further, the 90 degree sideways strafes are not intuitive at all whatsoever.

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Strafing has a historical precedent.  It's called "bouncing" -- where one side surprises the enemy.  Many pilots never saw the plane that killed them.  Dogfighting is for suckers.

Spoiler

 

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I'm not outright agreeing with this guy but the strafe mechanic needs some tweaks IMO. I think that you shouldn't be able to strafe your own fighters (the tactic of pinning your opponents fighters with your own then strafing them and your own fighters) while i will not deny that friendly fire did occur in the game it makes the CV with more fighter squadrons have an unfair advantage. Don't outright remove them but tweak them a little. that's my

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2 hours ago, Final_Spark said:

Without strafes fighter combat is incredibly boring. Just an auto-win to the CV player with better planes/captain skills. It's also just Plane Clicker 2017. Strafes are the skill shot in the game for fighters. It allows for more dynamic air combat for the game. If we take out strafes completely we need some other new mechanics to make fighter combat actually interesting.

 

Strafes don't need to go. It's a game, so realism takes a back seat to game play. Deal with it.

 

What does need to be changed is the UI and how strafes work. Sometimes a squad that looks like it should execute the strafe just doesn't and has to do a 360, missing your chance and wasting ammo i you didn't back out in time. Further, the 90 degree sideways strafes are not intuitive at all whatsoever.

 

While I don't think fighters should be the focus of if the ship is boring or not, what strafing has become is flat out wrong. But I get the argument, but that's why it needs to go back to it's original intent, a debuff. It needs the DPS buff it gives dramatically reduced to not be capable of simply obliterating 30 planes in a single go, it needs to be reworked that fighters caught in it take a temporary DPS loss in their attempts at strafe/locked dog fighting giving it still a tactical use against fighters to try and give yourself an edge, while removing the issue of auto deleting swaths of planes with ease and reducing the skill gap issues among players. Because as you yourself say "Realism takes a back seat", if it's only maybe shooting down a couple, but accomplishing what it did in reality of often breaking up squadrons to reduce effectiveness, that is far more balanced and reasonable for everyone.

 

Also @Lew19 - It was actually used, though not always to the maximum devastating effect we see in game. Only pilots/crews not paying attention usually fell to this, and I do believe within a game, it is reasonable to assume that all pilots would be trained enough to keep their head on a swivel, as would pilots and gunners of attack aircraft. One case in point, can't find the episode of dogfights, 3-4 A6M's jumped some DB's actually serving as CAP that only 1 of the DB's survived the initial attack because they spotted them and the others did not or didn't react when it was called out, to which the lone DB did actually down 3 A6M's after the fact. Historically, it is a thing, that had varying effectiveness, but the game does need to tone it down for healthy CV play.

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That's a skilled pilot using the Polikarpov I-5 with ShKAS machine guns...........

In WoWS, strafe is like a squad of planes blazing all guns in a straight line and all those bullets magically hit............that's as fiction as the above example...

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.http://warfarehistorynetwork.com/daily/wwii/the-great-marianas-turkey-shoot/

You mean like that time formations of Hellcats ambushed and cut through formations of Japanese fighters and bombers during the Battle of the Phillipine Sea, an aerial massacre known as the Great Marianas Turkey Shoot? 

Now, arguably everything about CVs needs rework, strafe included (personally, I'm partial to removing them from the game altogether). But the existence of a formation ambush mechanic isn't part of the problem in principle, either from a gameplay or historical perspective. 

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5 hours ago, Lew19 said:

You guys need to address the ridiculousness of strafing....If you can find my ONE WW2 pilot who shot down a whole squadron for planes in ONE strafe, i'll retract this completely. I know this game isn't totally historical, but what kinda arcade [edited] are you trying to make here. A full squad of 6 planes gets wiped out by WG's "strafe". Imagine if in WOT you could call in an A10 strafe, and take out 6 tanks. Your server would blow up from all the players on the server's heads exploding. Fix it, do the right thing. It's time.....really. And for all you incoming trolls...Get bent. You're probably the ones who exploit the crap out of this broken mechanic. Ya you are, that's cause that's what trolls do...be trolly.

Hate to burst your bubble, but:   

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aviators_who_became_ace_in_a_day

  • On 6 January 1940 the Finnish pilot, Lieutenant Jorma Sarvanto destroyed six Soviet DB-3 bombers in four minutes on one flight. Sarvanto was the top scoring pilot in the Winter War with 12.83 kills. The wrecks of the bombers were found near Kuopio.[17]
  • On 17 May 1940, Oberleutnant Max Buscholz of 1./JG 3 shot down four RAF Bristol Blenheims and 2 French Curtis Hawk 75A. These were his first victories.
  • On 29 May 1940 Corporal Albert Lippett and his pilot, Flight Lieutenant Nicholas Gresham Cooke, claimed five Junkers Ju 87 bombers in their Boulton Paul Defiant during their second mission that day Dunkirk evacuation. During their earlier mission that same afternoon they had shot down two Messerschmitt Bf 109 fighters and a Messerschmitt Bf 110 fighter and that same day also contributed to the destruction of two Junkers Ju 88 bombers over the Dunkirk beaches.[18]
  • On 15 June 1940 the French pilot Pierre Le Gloan destroyed 5 Italian aircraft in one flight.[19]
  • On 24 August 1940 Polish pilot Antoni Głowacki shot down three Bf 109s and two Junkers Ju 88 bombers over Ramsgate, to become the first "One-day Ace" of the Battle of Britain.[20]
  • Also on the 24th August 1940,Yorkshire born RAF pilot Ronald Hamlyn shot down 5 aircraft in a day,flying a Spitfire with 610 Squadron.
  • Flying Officer Brian Carbury of New Zealand claimed three Bf 109s and two He 113s(presumably Bf 109s) in two sorties on 31 August 1940.
  • On 27 September South African Pilot Officer Albert Gerald Lewis claimed six German aircraft (three Bf 109s, two Bf 110s and one Ju 88) destroyed, along with two probables and one damaged.
  • British ace Archie McKellar shot down five Messerschmitt Bf 109s in one day on 7 October 1940 during the Battle of Britain.
  • On 11 December 1940, Flying Officer Charles Dyson of No 33 Squadron destroyed six Italian Cr42s in a single sortie within 6 minutes.[21]125px-AWM_SUK12082_Clive_Caldwell.jpg
Clive Caldwell.
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Most of those are single-sortie and likely in dogfights...how about in a single pass, guns-blazing?

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