Jump to content
You need to play a total of 10 battles to post in this section.
CruiserZAO1999

ZAO need buff

41 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

4
[ADD1S]
Members
13 posts
4,262 battles

Nowadays, ZAO is too weak in tier X matches. Hindenburg has great HE and AP and 10000HP more than ZAO. De Moines has twice the rate of fire as ZAO. Minotaur has smoke, Henry IV has engine boost. Moskva has 65400 HP that is a battlecruiser. ZAO is too weak. Here are some ideas of buff.

1 increase the reloading time to 11.0s like Aoba

2 give ZAO two select of torps-----76knots of 8km or 66knots of 12km

3 increase ZAO's HP back to 44800 and increase ZAO's AA

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
665
[CAFE]
Members
1,393 posts
10,674 battles

Zao is strong enough right right and people playing it incorrectly does not mean it requires a buff. The Zao has great AA and the combination of good shell dispersion and low detection means it can out-play many ships.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,091
[SPTR]
Members
3,459 posts
5,674 battles

latest?cb=20140318153620

Spoiler

You have the trolliest armor and fire chance at tier 10 that trolls anyone and everyone!

 

Hindenburg's HE dpm is lower than Mogami, and the fire chance is trash! Zao's AP penetration and normalization value is much better! Plus Hindenburg got spotted half a map away while you can out spot Khabarovsk!

 

Des Moines catapult gun can never even touch you past 13km! Plus Des Moines loses 10k+ health every time a bb looks at it!

 

Minotaur's AP can't do crap against you if you have any idea where you are going and how to angle! Both your AP and HE murders Minotaur easily!

 

Henri and Moskva are both more easily spotted than light houses! Neither of them can tank battleships while you just laugh at the bounces and overpens! They can never even dream of being such a stealthy crazy fire starter as you are!

Git Gud!

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alpha Tester
3,666 posts
7,161 battles
15 minutes ago, CruiserZAO1999 said:

Nowadays, ZAO is too weak in tier X matches. Hindenburg has great HE and AP and 10000HP more than ZAO. De Moines has twice the rate of fire as ZAO. Minotaur has smoke, Henry IV has engine boost. Moskva has 65400 HP that is a battlecruiser. ZAO is too weak. Here are some ideas of buff.

1 increase the reloading time to 11.0s like Aoba

2 give ZAO two select of torps-----76knots of 8km or 66knots of 12km

3 increase ZAO's HP back to 44800 and increase ZAO's AA

d9da6d238c2a561aae562455bf2f50c34839f0b6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,374
[-K-]
Members
5,086 posts
8,967 battles

How to make Zao overpowered:

35 minutes ago, CruiserZAO1999 said:

1 increase the reloading time to 11.0s like Aoba

2 give ZAO two select of torps-----76knots of 8km or 66knots of 12km

3 increase ZAO's HP back to 44800 and increase ZAO's AA

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,708
[HINON]
WoWS Wiki Editor, In AlfaTesters, Beta Testers
6,498 posts
3,751 battles

Zaō is extremely powerful and is not in need of buffs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
8,065 posts
17,032 battles

Entire crews of a Zao could be dishonorably discharged, the ship scrapped, and the captain left alone in his gig, and it would STILL be too OP for my tastes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,309
[-TAB-]
Members
1,597 posts
5,126 battles
1 hour ago, The_first_harbinger said:

latest?cb=20140318153620

  Reveal hidden contents

You have the trolliest armor and fire chance at tier 10 that trolls anyone and everyone!

 

Hindenburg's HE dpm is lower than Mogami, and the fire chance is trash! Zao's AP penetration and normalization value is much better! Plus Hindenburg got spotted half a map away while you can out spot Khabarovsk!

 

Des Moines catapult gun can never even touch you past 13km! Plus Des Moines loses 10k+ health every time a bb looks at it!

 

Minotaur's AP can't do crap against you if you have any idea where you are going and how to angle! Both your AP and HE murders Minotaur easily!

 

Henri and Moskva are both more easily spotted than light houses! Neither of them can tank battleships while you just laugh at the bounces and overpens! They can never even dream of being such a stealthy crazy fire starter as you are!

Git Gud!

Git Less Stupid!

OP presents some suggestions, you display stupidity. I play Zao, like her as is, been struggling in her a bit lately, but it's not the ship, it's me.

NEED to be buffed? reluctantly, no, there are many other ships that NEED buffing badly, immediately. like the izumo. which is a coral home anchor, at best, right now.

would I LIKE to see her buffed? hell, yes. would not mind playing an OP ship at all.

Edited by not_acceptable
  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,091
[SPTR]
Members
3,459 posts
5,674 battles
5 minutes ago, not_acceptable said:

Git Less Stupid!

OP presents some suggestions, you display stupidity. I play Zao, like her as is, been struggling in her a bit lately, but it's not the ship, it's me.

NEED to be buffed? reluctantly, no, there are many other ships that NEED buffing badly, immediately. like the izumo. which is a coral home anchor, at best, right now.

would I LIKE to see her buffed? hell, yes. would not mind playing an OP ship at all.

Git literacy!

The title of this thread is ZAO NEED BUFF. OP whines about the shortcomings of the Zao with unreasonable comparisons, I provide rebuttals, while you resort of ad hominem and unsupported name calling!

-*SALT ALERT*-

Spoiler

Of course it's not the ship, it's you! Who else can it be?

Heck no, Zao need to be fixed, not buffed, a heavy cruiser bouncing a full 12 gun salvo of 420mm shells at point blank is neither realistic nor adequate.

Heck yeah, you would love to drive an OP ship given how you already struggle with a ship like the Zao.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
104
[GRRR]
[GRRR]
Members
586 posts
20,673 battles

I have Henri, Moskva, Des Moines and Zao; Zao is fine, she just has her own set set of advantages and disadvantages and never really needed stealth fire to begin with either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,309
[-TAB-]
Members
1,597 posts
5,126 battles
11 minutes ago, The_first_harbinger said:

Git literacy!

The title of this thread is ZAO NEED BUFF. OP whines about the shortcomings of the Zao with unreasonable comparisons, I provide rebuttals, while you resort of ad hominem and unsupported name calling!

-*SALT ALERT*-

  Hide contents

Of course it's not the ship, it's you! Who else can it be?

Heck no, Zao need to be fixed, not buffed, a heavy cruiser bouncing a full 12 gun salvo of 420mm shells at point blank is neither realistic nor adequate.

Heck yeah, you would love to drive an OP ship given how you already struggle with a ship like the Zao.

 

duh, gee, me already gots some o' dat litturasee you goin off bout, spanky. still gots myself a pretty good set o eyes, and a brain good enuff to spot a dumb troll posts when I read them.

the OP compared zao to other high tier cruisers. that's unreasonable? huh.

the post of yours I quoted is "Get Gud!"  this is not a rebuttal, it is the very personification of troll based stupidity in this forum. do I need to explain that to you as well??

unsupported name calling? I did not call you a name, in my 'ad hominem' remark I referenced your stupid post. you may be very intelligent, your post certainly was not. you are not your post, are you? if you believe so, I can see why you feel I called you stupid. i'm ok with that.

I then went on to discuss my take on the Zao, which, since I just ground my way up to her, I have some interest in. 

if I didn't own my errors and weakness in game play, specifically this time in the zao, you would be all over that, wouldn't you. heck (hell) by me owning my shortcomings, it gave you fuel for more stupid comments anyway. well, if stupid is as stupid does, I guess I just called you stupid again. again, i'm ok with that.

obliquely attempting to stat shame me is pretty lame. been working on improving my game play and stats, with some decent results, prior to this weekend anyway. 

I've bounced a main battery shell from my kurfust off a DD, much less T10 CAs. you actually promoting realism in the game? L M A O

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,091
[SPTR]
Members
3,459 posts
5,674 battles
2 hours ago, not_acceptable said:

duh, gee, me already gots some o' dat litturasee you goin off bout, spanky. still gots myself a pretty good set o eyes, and a brain good enuff to spot a dumb troll posts when I read them.

the OP compared zao to other high tier cruisers. that's unreasonable? huh.

the post of yours I quoted is "Get Gud!"  this is not a rebuttal, it is the very personification of troll based stupidity in this forum. do I need to explain that to you as well??

unsupported name calling? I did not call you a name, in my 'ad hominem' remark I referenced your stupid post. you may be very intelligent, your post certainly was not. you are not your post, are you? if you believe so, I can see why you feel I called you stupid. i'm ok with that.

I then went on to discuss my take on the Zao, which, since I just ground my way up to her, I have some interest in. 

if I didn't own my errors and weakness in game play, specifically this time in the zao, you would be all over that, wouldn't you. heck (hell) by me owning my shortcomings, it gave you fuel for more stupid comments anyway. well, if stupid is as stupid does, I guess I just called you stupid again. again, i'm ok with that.

obliquely attempting to stat shame me is pretty lame. been working on improving my game play and stats, with some decent results, prior to this weekend anyway. 

I've bounced a main battery shell from my kurfust off a DD, much less T10 CAs. you actually promoting realism in the game? L M A O

Excellent, another tempting bait, dangling about and fro. Well, stupid as I am, I'll take it with an exquisite savor.

I have no problem with OP comparing Zao with other high tier cruisers, if it's a fair comparison including both shortcomings and advantages of all ships. Nominating only the weaknesses of the Zao and comparing them with other cruisers strong suits, hehe, no thanks.

The post you quoted includes my spoilers, in which I included my reasonable arguments with a touch of satire and mockery. I spent minutes coming up with arguments, it takes seconds to write up "Git Gud" for a flavor of cynical humor. Now, don't tell me you don't know how spoilers and forums work, that would be lame. If you just so happened to be too careless or illiterate to read inside my spoilers, I would gladly accept an apology.

I put into my post my arguments, my logics and my ego, and I do not take insults to my intellect lightly.

Funny enough, I didn't even bother to look at your stats. I based my vague estimation upon the fact that you stated that you struggled on the Zao. Tier X gameplay couldn't have been more forgiving and intuitive with the Zao. 

As for bouncing bb shells on a dd, heh. It's a very very very unlikely event that can only happen if you hit sharply on a turret or bounces off the 50mm stalinium of Khabarovsk, everywhere else it will just overmatch. You get overmatched on bow, stern, hull and deck with your Moskva, Henri, and Des Moines, but somehow Zao alone can get away with it! Fair and Balanced.

I called this phenomenon "is neither realistic nor adequate." Guess I couldn't afford to make a single mistake, can't I? Fine. This situation isn't adequate, how sad I've created a straw man for you to exploit in my argument so that you may ignore the immediate following phrase.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,309
[-TAB-]
Members
1,597 posts
5,126 battles
1 hour ago, The_first_harbinger said:

Excellent, another tempting bait, dangling about and fro. Well, stupid as I am, I'll take it with an exquisite savor.

I have no problem with OP comparing Zao with other high tier cruisers, if it's a fair comparison including both shortcomings and advantages of all ships. Nominating only the weaknesses of the Zao and comparing them with other cruisers strong suits, hehe, no thanks.

The post you quoted includes my spoilers, in which I included my reasonable arguments with a touch of satire and mockery. I spent minutes coming up with arguments, it takes seconds to write up "Git Gud" for a flavor of cynical humor. Now, don't tell me you don't know how spoilers and forums work, that would be lame. If you just so happened to be too careless or illiterate to read inside my spoilers, I would gladly accept an apology.

I put into my post my arguments, my logics and my ego, and I do not take insults to my intellect lightly.

Funny enough, I didn't even bother to look at your stats. I based my vague estimation upon the fact that you stated that you struggled on the Zao. Tier X gameplay couldn't have been more forgiving and intuitive with the Zao. 

As for bouncing bb shells on a dd, heh. It's a very very very unlikely event that can only happen if you hit sharply on a turret or bounces off the 50mm stalinium of Khabarovsk, everywhere else it will just overmatch. You get overmatched on bow, stern, hull and deck with your Moskva, Henri, and Des Moines, but somehow Zao alone can get away with it! Fair and Balanced.

I called this phenomenon "is neither realistic nor adequate." Guess I couldn't afford to make a single mistake, can't I? Fine. This situation isn't adequate, how sad I've created a straw man for you to exploit in my argument so that you may ignore the immediate following phrase.

 

dear TFH,

typically I enjoy your posts. when you put effort into stating whatever you're saying with some eloquence, like you just did, I find myself in agreement more times than not. not a fan of thoughtless, sloppy, fast troll posts, normally will go after anybody writing those without bothering to read the spoilers or between the lines in other posts, by the same author, in the same thread. that was not the case this time, I read your other posts first. pretty much every time I see 'git gud' by one of the better players apparently in possession of a functional brain, it tends to trigger my [edited] side.

yup, it was a khab that bounced it. have not bounced many (if any) in my zao, but have not played much in her yet either. nor have I played that intelligently in her either, still finding myself at the wrong spot, at the wrong time. seem to have this amazing skill at knowing just where the red main fleet is headed, and put myself in range. let's kite for a while. derp.

can't make a single mistake? well, mostly in this game it would appear most players can't make a single mistakes in a random match, unless you're better than me. in the forum, I've noticed there's a bit more tolerance, for some people. the post you just wrote was well received by me, and I appreciate your effort to write it. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,091
[SPTR]
Members
3,459 posts
5,674 battles
16 minutes ago, not_acceptable said:

dear TFH,

typically I enjoy your posts. when you put effort into stating whatever you're saying with some eloquence, like you just did, I find myself in agreement more times than not. not a fan of thoughtless, sloppy, fast troll posts, normally will go after anybody writing those without bothering to read the spoilers or between the lines in other posts, by the same author, in the same thread. that was not the case this time, I read your other posts first. pretty much every time I see 'git gud' by one of the better players apparently in possession of a functional brain, it tends to trigger my [edited] side.

yup, it was a khab that bounced it. have not bounced many (if any) in my zao, but have not played much in her yet either. nor have I played that intelligently in her either, still finding myself at the wrong spot, at the wrong time. seem to have this amazing skill at knowing just where the red main fleet is headed, and put myself in range. let's kite for a while. derp.

can't make a single mistake? well, mostly in this game it would appear most players can't make a single mistakes in a random match, unless you're better than me. in the forum, I've noticed there's a bit more tolerance, for some people. the post you just wrote was well received by me, and I appreciate your effort to write it. 

 

It is to my great relief that our disagreements was due to careless mistakes instead of means of senseless harm and insults, and I'm more than relieved with the fact that this small exchange ended with understanding and tolerance. Now that you have stated this little misunderstanding I came to empathize with your hatred against cheap and irresponsible remarks, and I apologize in advance should my impulsive language have caused unnecessary offends. 

As you progress with mastering the Zao, you will gradually discover its amazing survivability hidden in the details of its armor scheme, and I'm sure a respectable player like you would soon to exploit it efficiently.

 

I'm young, dense, rude and impulsive, and I have a severe deficit of respect and tolerance toward anyone that dares to cheat logic with insults and refuses to acknowledge so as a fatal error. It seems that my means of harm has been misplaced, and I appreciate your understanding and your effort in vindicating your point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4,618
[E-E]
[E-E]
Members
15,648 posts
14,025 battles

Zao is fine, if anything the competition at Tier X Cruisers is much more even.  IMO, tier for tier, these are the best, most balanced Cruisers in the game.  All Tier X Cruisers have some sort of useful traits to them.  They are all great.

Edited by HazeGrayUnderway

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
41 posts
4,094 battles

The Zao is fine, in fact she is perfect.  Perfect balance of firepower, speed durability with the drawbacks of DPM, turret angles, and lack of AA...  

 

she is still one of my favorite ships in the game and a true beauty to play once you master her play style

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
842 posts

Agreed. I'd leave the Zao alone.

If anything needs to change, it's the ROF on the opposition CAs. Particularly the DM and especially the Mino really have ridiculously high ROF, and that's bad all around (not just for Zao folks). Both of those ships should really have at least a 25% or more DECREASE in ROF.  3.2 seconds for the Mino is insanely stupid and should be reduced down back to the Neptune-level of 5s, and the DM should have a 7s rather than a 5.5s reload.

If T10s were only ever fighting T10s, then I'd be happy to keep the DM and Mino where they are. As it currently stands, with T8s being dragged in with T10s virtually every match, they're really OP, and even T9s struggle not to be murdered in the face of that much high-volume firepower.  Not to mention the virtual annihilation of any DD that gets spotted inside gun range of a Mino or DM, due to the fact that in a pretty typical 15 seconds it takes for a DD to react and try to run or smoke or hide, a DM can put 36 shells, and a Mino 50 shells on target, and they seldom need more than 5 or 6 hits to kill a full-health DD.

Edited by EAnybody
  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
878 posts
8,962 battles

On a lot of my (nine) T-X ships, I get to the end of the line then stop "grinding" and lose my edge on the ship.  Zao was my first or second T-X and I never got great at it.  I feel like it needs a ROF buff, but after reading above I will give it some more love/grind.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
3,302 posts
8,040 battles

I just had my first 5 battles in Zao tonight.  She seems pretty freaking strong to me!  The difference in terms of tankiness of armor between Ibuki and Zao is like freaking night and day.  Way more tough than DM and Mino and at least as tough as Hindenburg.  It seems like Zao was made to nuke Minos caught out in the middle of the water where they ought not be.  Twice tonight I snuck up on loner Minos hiding in smoke out in open, unprotected water and nuked them.  I patiently waited for their smoke to expire... then BLAP!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,943
[SYN]
Members
14,379 posts
10,239 battles

How to buff Zao without making it OP.

  • Buff turret traverse rate by 1d/s
  • Return HP to what it once had
  • Option to equip a quad launcher with better firing arcs
  • Option to equip Ibuki's 10km torps

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×