Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
You need to play a total of 5 battles to post in this section.
steviemack62

Flags

22 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

0
[PENND]
Members
1 post
4,993 battles

Could you please put some of those -100% detonation flags (Juliet Charlie I think) in the premium store for sale ? I can never get enough of them LOL! :)

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
154
[FOXEH]
[FOXEH]
Members
1,194 posts
4,125 battles
2 minutes ago, Cruiser_Noshiro said:

No. It would be quite Pay2Win.

How so?  The claim is that only 1% or so is the chance of detonation, so if you sold the flag you would onlymremove a 1% change of a stupid game mechanic happening, which would be statistically insignificant to gameplay.  Just like if they removed the stupid mechanic altogether, you wouldn't notice it at all, and is certainly not game breaking.  

 

In fact, WG could farm more money from people by selling a flag that prevents such a low occurrence game mechanic from occurring and it's can only be a win/win for WG.  People will pay WG money for an item that has no practical use in reality.  

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,252
[RIPQP]
Members
3,706 posts
14,509 battles
7 minutes ago, Cruiser_Noshiro said:

No. It would be quite Pay2Win.

 

 

 What is your opinion on premium ships that have better tools than their tech tree counterparts? Pay2win or not?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12
[AGP]
Members
66 posts
3,670 battles
9 minutes ago, Cruiser_Noshiro said:

No. It would be quite Pay2Win.

LOL. All those xp, free xp, commander xp boosts are not? They should reconsider their strategy with them, don't you think?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,509
[O7]
Members
4,921 posts
8,751 battles
28 minutes ago, m373x said:

 

 

 What is your opinion on premium ships that have better tools than their tech tree counterparts? Pay2win or not?

Only one thing i can think that fits this description

belfast has things that fiji does not, and vise versa. It's not better because you perceive the consumable trade-offs are in it's favor.

25 minutes ago, AT_Velos said:

LOL. All those xp, free xp, commander xp boosts are not? They should reconsider their strategy with them, don't you think?

Progression acceleration is not the same thing as pay to win. When you pay to win, you are spending money to get access to something you can only get through spending said money, and this something is objectively better than it's free counterpart if there is one.

 

While selling det flags may not be quite pay to win due to it being such a rare chance, you could say that one game out of a hundred is p2w. It would also be like a gateway thing to selling the other flags, which are distinctly advantageous with the convenience of using them every match.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,391
[O_O]
Members
4,333 posts
9,274 battles
36 minutes ago, AT_Velos said:

LOL. All those xp, free xp, commander xp boosts are not? They should reconsider their strategy with them, don't you think?

No.  XP and credit flags are economy, only.  They don't give any advantage over you opponents in a match, so by definition, not pay to win.  Pay to advance, maybe, but not pay to win.

My definition of pay to win would be a premium ship, premium ammo, or some other purchased item that gives a player a clear advantage in battle.  Some premium ships may be stronger than some tech tree ships, but then again, some tech tree ships are stronger than some premium ships.  So, I am hesitant to say premium ships are pay to win just because some are very good.  However, I concede that a couple of premium ships are OP and playing them may earn you some P2W complaints.  Clemson is a beast, though...can you P2W with a tech tree ship?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,252
[RIPQP]
Members
3,706 posts
14,509 battles
5 minutes ago, Pulicat said:

Only one thing i can think that fits this description

belfast has things that fiji does not, and vise versa. It's not better because you perceive the consumable trade-offs are in it's favor.

 

 Belfast?!?! 

 What about Leningrad vs Minsk? No trade-offs there, straight up improved tools.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WoWS Wiki Editor
7,211 posts
6,433 battles
17 minutes ago, Pulicat said:

Only one thing i can think that fits this description

How about Chapayev vs Mikhail Kutuzow?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
2,437 posts
12,175 battles

Detonated on .8% of my matches. while I find it tinklepants funny when I detonate another player, I find it infuriating when I detonate. weird huh?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,509
[O7]
Members
4,921 posts
8,751 battles
39 minutes ago, m373x said:

 

 Belfast?!?! 

 What about Leningrad vs Minsk? No trade-offs there, straight up improved tools.

Even though Lenin was put in when it was with kiev at 7, in the rework yes minsk is deficient, but only notable in the torpedoes.

31 minutes ago, SireneRacker said:

How about Chapayev vs Mikhail Kutuzow?

 

Same thing with belfast/fiji applies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,252
[RIPQP]
Members
3,706 posts
14,509 battles
Just now, Pulicat said:

Even though Lenin was put in when it was with kiev at 7, in the rework yes minsk is deficient, but only notable in the torpedoes.

 

While the torpedoes are much better (day and night difference), the guns are also better. pay2win

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,509
[O7]
Members
4,921 posts
8,751 battles
12 minutes ago, m373x said:

 

While the torpedoes are much better (day and night difference), the guns are also better. pay2win

It's 2.5s for 180deg turn time and 5m of dispersion. The difference is very negligible.

They are also both terrible because of said turret rotation. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,252
[RIPQP]
Members
3,706 posts
14,509 battles
12 minutes ago, Pulicat said:

It's 2.5s for 180deg turn time and 5m of dispersion.  

 

Yes, better guns. That's what I said.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WoWS Wiki Editor
7,211 posts
6,433 battles
55 minutes ago, Pulicat said:

Same thing with belfast/fiji applies.

Let's see...

I can live with the Consumables being roughly equal in value, both Radar or Smoke can have their own strong points but I'll regard that aspect as a tie.

What are the other differences?

Speed difference is insignificant, but the turning is way better on the Kutuzow.

Kutuzow has almost two Kilometers more gun range.

Chapayev's AA is barely average for a T8 Cruiser, Kutuzow has the best AA of all the Cruisers at her Tier.

3.7k more HP on Kutuzow, armor is pathetic on both ships

Kutuzow has more Torpedoes with twice the range, reload barely matters and the Speed is also not that different

So you want to tell me that that little bit of Concealment Advantage that the Chapayev has is enough to balance all these downsides?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,696
[YORHA]
Members
3,247 posts

Texas >New York.

 

(Slightly) better gun arcs.  Much better AA.

 

And Tier 5 is where CVs start to become a real pain in the a** so it does make a big difference in survivability.

Edited by JCC45

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,252
[RIPQP]
Members
3,706 posts
14,509 battles

 I like where this thread is going.

 

 Saipan > Ranger

 De Grasse > La Galissoniere

 

 -100% detonation flags could easily be sold in the premium shop without too much hassle . WoWs has too many "p2w" ships to stay shy of selling combat flags.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,509
[O7]
Members
4,921 posts
8,751 battles
14 hours ago, SireneRacker said:

Let's see...

I can live with the Consumables being roughly equal in value, both Radar or Smoke can have their own strong points but I'll regard that aspect as a tie.

What are the other differences?

Speed difference is insignificant, but the turning is way better on the Kutuzow.

Kutuzow has almost two Kilometers more gun range.

Chapayev's AA is barely average for a T8 Cruiser, Kutuzow has the best AA of all the Cruisers at her Tier.

3.7k more HP on Kutuzow, armor is pathetic on both ships

Kutuzow has more Torpedoes with twice the range, reload barely matters and the Speed is also not that different

So you want to tell me that that little bit of Concealment Advantage that the Chapayev has is enough to balance all these downsides?

Chapayev had range on par with kut back when aft affected 155s. They got rid of this for cruisers but since the change happened very soon after kut release they felt it wasn't appropriate for kut to be hit by this sweeping change since it's a premium. This difference can be disregarded. 

 

Torp range difference has even less importance than it would for previously mentioned Minsk/Lenin, since they are cruisers. Kut is a smoke cruiser that can't smoke close up safely, so using its torps are pretty rare. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,509
[O7]
Members
4,921 posts
8,751 battles
14 hours ago, m373x said:

 I like where this thread is going.

 

 Saipan > Ranger

 De Grasse > La Galissoniere

 

 -100% detonation flags could easily be sold in the premium shop without too much hassle . WoWs has too many "p2w" ships to stay shy of selling combat flags.

Yeah, just erase the line. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
608
[NMKJT]
Members
2,677 posts
16 hours ago, Pulicat said:

Only one thing i can think that fits this description

belfast has things that fiji does not, and vise versa. It's not better because you perceive the consumable trade-offs are in it's favor.

Progression acceleration is not the same thing as pay to win. When you pay to win, you are spending money to get access to something you can only get through spending said money, and this something is objectively better than it's free counterpart if there is one.

 

While selling det flags may not be quite pay to win due to it being such a rare chance, you could say that one game out of a hundred is p2w. It would also be like a gateway thing to selling the other flags, which are distinctly advantageous with the convenience of using them every match.

In the gaming  world, anything that can speed advancement is considered pay to win. What  is not P2W is cosmetic stuff. The definition of this game is a little different, but its fair to say its a P2W game

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WoWS Wiki Editor
7,211 posts
6,433 battles
56 minutes ago, Pulicat said:

Chapayev had range on par with kut back when aft affected 155s. They got rid of this for cruisers but since the change happened very soon after kut release they felt it wasn't appropriate for kut to be hit by this sweeping change since it's a premium. This difference can be disregarded. 

 

Torp range difference has even less importance than it would for previously mentioned Minsk/Lenin, since they are cruisers. Kut is a smoke cruiser that can't smoke close up safely, so using its torps are pretty rare. 

 

What happened in the past is long gone, what matters is that Kutuzow is right now a better ship than Chapayev. This is a balance issue, not a game history issue.

 

No matter how you put it, Chapayev's Torpedoes are suicidal range and a lot less useful than the ones on the Kutuzow. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×