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So, having played through Monarch and bought the Lion, here's my review of the Monarch, the tier 8 RN tech tree BB.  For my reviews of the KGV and Queen Elizabeth, links below. 

Note: I am an average to a bit above average player who plays mostly solo, so this is from that perspective. Also, while I did consult numbers and stats, my reviews are primarily based on the feel of the ship and my performance in her. This is of course a limited sample size, and is affected by my playstyle (which is generally fairly aggressive leading to occasional overreaches and a low survival rate.) Your mileage may vary depending on your playstyle and skill level. 

 

My review: [SCREAMS IN COLONIAL FURY] "WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY"

 

I loved every ship in this line so far, so I guess I was overdue to hit the weak link that seems to be somewhere in every line, but really, WG? It's like you took tier 6 guns, put them on a tier 7 hull, buffed the reload to match the 14" guns on the KGV, and called it a day. REALLY? I have played every major line in the game up to t7, most up to t8 or 9, and this is the first time I have spent doubloons on free xp just to get out of a ship. Part of that was just pure frustration; I hit a bad 6-game losing streak where I had 4 of my best 5 games in Monarch (and my other two were at least ok) and lost every one of them due to unbearable potato teams. But part of it is...there is NOTHING fun about this ship IMO. She has zero carry capability even as top tier. 

 

It reminds me of the transition from Konigsberg to Nurnberg as it used to be (I played through them in early 2016, so the meta was a bit different, to be fair.) Konigsberg is my favorite t5 cruiser. But Nurnberg is basically a Konig with some extra HP and a marginally quicker reload, only a tier higher and facing much tougher foes. So where K-berg was very comfortable and excelled, I struggled mightily with N-berg. Monarch is just like that. She couldn't take a punch; I routinely got LOLrekt. She couldn't deliver a knockout blow; where Queen Elizabeth's AP was decisive at tier 6, at tier 8 she just couldn't deliver damage consistently. Even with IFHE, HE wasn't punchy enough to be workable. My average damage dropped significantly in Monarch; while my average damage improved significantly as I learned to use KGV, it just stayed consistently bad in Monarch. The accuracy is still there; you just are too undergunned for t8-10 games.

At t8, you're facing three BBs with big, 16" rifles (NorCar, Amagi, and Alabama) and the German siblings with 15" rifles that handle much better and are paired with very strong secondary guns. Also, the Germans can afford to expose their rear guns; Monarch rarely can do so. You will not win a 1v1 in your Monarch with an even remotely skilled player in any same tier or above BB. Her AA is garbage, her speed and maneuvering are mediocre, and her secondaries are ineffective. Her stealth is outstanding, and this did save me a few times when I needed to pull back and heal, but let's face it, a BB isn't helping the team much if she's not firing her guns. Going dark for a minute or two to heal and/or reposition is one thing, but to keep that stealth, obviously you can't be firing. A BB that can only list stealth as a positive trait isn't going to succeed in most players' hands. 

Basically, in transitioning from KGV to Monarch, you keep (roughly) the same armor and HP, about the same mediocre level olf AA relative to their respective tiers, about the same speed and handling, and roughly the same gunhandling and accuracy. In return for going up a tier, you get slightly bigger main guns (although you lose a barrel, with a 3x3 layout instead of KGV's 2x4, 1x2 layout) and better stealth. That's it. Yes, Lion also uses the same basic KGV hull and armor layout, but at least she gets the RN superheal and some more hp...Monarch has the regular repair party. 

Monarch lacks versatility in most early and mid game scenarios; you are very limited to sitting back and HE spamming until the opposing team has been thinned out significantly. Every time I would push without a lot of help, I would die badly. Maybe others do better, but I am way too aggressive to succeed with a ship that is so unsuited for aggressive play. 
 

Pros: 
Gunnery is just as accurate as accustomed.  She still wrecks DDs and lower to same tier cruisers. 
15" guns instead of 14" on KGV, but with the same traverse and ROF. 
Speed is still ok, but for her tier it's nothing special. 
She has OUTSTANDING stealth, allowing you to spring ugly surprises on occasion or back off and heal. 


Cons: 
Feels very undergunned relative to her tier. Struggles to do damage against her peers or higher tier ships. She can still stack fires like her lower-tier cousins, but she has difficulty dealing direct, penetration damage consistently.
Melts quickly. Angling ineffective against most higher tier BBs. The only way to survive long enough to do damage is to hang back and let other ships tank, which makes it very hard to win if you have a timid team as you cannot lead a push or brawl in this ship.

Her AA envelope is small and, while reasonably strong, pretty much only suited to a battle of attrition with enemy CVs. They are going to get their drops off; at best, you might take out one plane from a squadron prior to their drop and hope to get a couple more before they're out of range. 

 

TL;DR: Basically, they tried to take a KGV variant and make her a t8, but she is at best a t7.5. She wouldn't be a bad t7 at all. although she's a bit boring. But she's just not strong enough for tier 8. The increase in gun size isn't enough to compensate for the stronger ships she faces, and she gets the crap kicked out of her very easily. I think she's fixable, though. I think she'd be far less frustrating to play if she was a bit more survivable, so I'd give her a downtuned version of the RN superheal that Lion and Conqueror have; Lion has 7k more hp upgraded and a 1000hp per second heal; KGV heals roughly 250hp per second...Monarch should get a heal that is at least midway between those two. Also, while I admit the gunnery issue could be me and this is a small sample size, my gut feeling is they need to massage the guns and get her a bit more powerful. I'd suggest nudging the reload time down to 22 or 23 seconds, but it would seem really weird to go both up in gun size and down in reload time from KGV. I think it may be worth adjusting the penetration power somehow, or giving her the Lion's 406mms as an upgrade option (with, obviously, a lower ROF than her current 381mm guns.)  That being said, her average damage on Warships Today is fine (and a lot higher than my personal average damage) so I think the survivability needs buffing more. 

Final verdict: After two games in,  I like Lion a lot more, and after trying Conqueror on the public test server she's also amazing, so I think I can safely say that Monarch is the low point of the RN BB line. Be prepared for a really crappy grind through this ship unless you feel like free-XPing your way through her. 

Edited by poeticmotion
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A good review +1.

I was entirely inclined to give every British BB a fair shake as I went up the tiers, but this ship felt so 'off'' I sold her after just 8 battles  which I almost never do as I am a firm believer in the unique synergy that is created between Player X and Ship Y; you can bomb on ships everyone thinks are OP, and you can do well on ships that are not liked at all. The latter was not going to happen on the Monarch it was clear.

So I shelled out for the Lion which is a fine ship indeed; the contrast could not be more obvious between the two.

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Personally I found the Monarch to be just fine. You have to angle properly and be at a decent mid-range. That doesn't mean get in and brawl nor does it mean you should be trying to snipe. Monarch requires a good mix of using the correct ammo types too. I have found the placement of your shots also makes a huge difference. Here is the difference of how I used my Monarch vs how you used yours.

 

 

monarch bratas.JPG

monarch peoticmotion.JPG

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Interesting review I also sense something not quite right with the Monarch ... 

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I'm supprised you found the guns handle as well as KVG. In my experience the dispersion was far greater, and I landed fewer shells per volley.

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I'm going to approve of this review.. as while I'm playing the hell out of it to grind it's captain for competitive, it really is worse than KGV at it's tier. Eat damage with a normal feeling repair, and a damage control that takes forever to come back.. take 1 torpedo and it can almost be dam near game if you get flooded. 

 

The Monarch leaves A LOT to be desired... I hope these ships get hit with a buff bat.. I 1v1'ed an Amagii... and in my NC, or my Bama, or even a cruiser I feel I would have won.,.. but not the monarch. You are absolutely correct about the consistency of AP... it's absolute crap.  How the [edited] am I supposed to defend my self in a BB at mid to low ranges when my ship can either A) not hit anything, or B)land hits and either shatter, or pen for barely any damage... 

 

This ship is even more frustrating than the KGV.  I'm not excited about the Lion, or Conq. 

 

My WTR is tanking because these ships can't carry... plus the fact that I have not mastered them yet.. Super cruiser Monarch... ready and standing by..pea shooter with a glass hull.. 

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  I too was all set to like the Monarch after really liking the KGV, and initially, with the high velocity arcs and decent groupings, I really thought this stealthy BB was the one. But her guns actually seem weak; it seems I saw a pen chart somewhere around here recently that had her guns as by far the weakest penning guns at tier 8. That combined with their very short fusing means hits on BB's at range or cruisers with armor layering have little chance for a citadel. HE tactics are viable but with only a normal % fire chance compared to other BB's at her tier HE is best mixed about 50/50 with AP ( I actually did that with KGV and did well with her.) Monarch seems to need time, to survive and just keep dealing medium sized chunks of damage at medium ranges to be effective. Monarch can brawl, but compare her brawling skills to a Bis or 'Bama and you'll see it's situational.

 

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I'm seriously having issues with this ship.. Below is me attacking a Baltimore that is giving me no angle... and my salvo looks pretty dam solid.. I walk away with 7500K damage.. while thats not bad per say... it's terrible in this situation... considering the Baltimore can fire both AP and HE at me faster and cause good damage, and at this point is able to tank damage...  My shot placement was good. I am a BB main, and cruiser second. The Monarch is truly letting me down. This whole idea that I'm supposed to be able to have my AP shells detonate faster causing less overpens... this is not the case. This is constant with these RNBB's . These ships are under performing unless I'm doing something wrong, but this makes no sense.   You can see 4  shells that are about to strike the hull of the ship. The shells dip down perhaps 1 more meter before impact. While this is towards the thicker part of the armor, I was 1 shocked I didn't citadel this ship, and 2 how in the hell did these shells overpen?  These ships are under performing IMO.. and I see most RNBB's just using HE. I am switching between both, and with these kinds of AP damage... it's really putting me off of the RNBBs. 

Aiming.jpg

Shot placement.jpg

damage dealt.jpg

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On 9/11/2017 at 9:41 AM, bratas said:

Personally I found the Monarch to be just fine. You have to angle properly and be at a decent mid-range. That doesn't mean get in and brawl nor does it mean you should be trying to snipe. Monarch requires a good mix of using the correct ammo types too. I have found the placement of your shots also makes a huge difference. Here is the difference of how I used my Monarch vs how you used yours.

 

 

monarch bratas.JPG

monarch peoticmotion.JPG

I agree; my average damage was so much lower than the average damage on warships today that even when accounting for the fact that it's a new line and most of the players that have her already are better than me, it's pretty clear that I'm doing something wrong. She just didn't click for me the way KGV or Lion did. I think she could definitely use a bit of a survivability buff as I outlined in my OP, but I can't justify stating definitively it needs a firepower buff when I compare my damage numbers in her to the server average.

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On 9/12/2017 at 6:08 PM, Neighbor_Kid said:

I'm seriously having issues with this ship.. Below is me attacking a Baltimore that is giving me no angle... and my salvo looks pretty dam solid.. I walk away with 7500K damage.. while thats not bad per say... it's terrible in this situation... considering the Baltimore can fire both AP and HE at me faster and cause good damage, and at this point is able to tank damage...  My shot placement was good. I am a BB main, and cruiser second. The Monarch is truly letting me down. This whole idea that I'm supposed to be able to have my AP shells detonate faster causing less overpens... this is not the case. This is constant with these RNBB's . These ships are under performing unless I'm doing something wrong, but this makes no sense.   You can see 4  shells that are about to strike the hull of the ship. The shells dip down perhaps 1 more meter before impact. While this is towards the thicker part of the armor, I was 1 shocked I didn't citadel this ship, and 2 how in the hell did these shells overpen?  These ships are under performing IMO.. and I see most RNBB's just using HE. I am switching between both, and with these kinds of AP damage... it's really putting me off of the RNBBs. 

Aiming.jpg

Shot placement.jpg

damage dealt.jpg

Yeah at 6.2 km seems that should've been better damage....love my 381's on Warspite...(at T6)!

Edited by chopshop64

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4 minutes ago, chopshop64 said:

Yeah at 6.2 km seems that should've been better damage....love my 381's on Warspite...(at T6)!

Yeah, at tier 6 381mm are tied for the biggest guns at tier (for researchable ships...Mutsu has 406mm guns, I believe) so you've got very solid punch. At tier 8, 381mm is mediocre to bad, especially without the incredible secondaries and stronk survivability of the Bismarck and Tirpitz (that share her 381mm gun size). 

 

Like all the British BBs, Monarch needs time to deal damage.. she's very consistent at taking off small to medium chunks of hp and stacking fire damage, but delivers fewer of the massive devstrikes you get with USN or IJN battleships. Giving her a slightly nerfed version of the Lion/Conqueror superheal would keep her alive long enough to stack that damage and be competitive, when managed well.

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The heal on the Monarch is trash.  It has no staying power.  And that for me is why it fails.  When a single fire burns you for more than you can heal...that is problematic.  I also found the guns and armor a bit underwhelming.  

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better heal and 5k more hp would do wonders for this ship. i unlike you, like this ship alot and do pretty good in her. shes an easy fix if wg should choose to do so.

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She is a Beautiful Warship - Sold It  -  as the Fine Gentlemen before me have explained - she's just not a keeper -

Monarch.jpg

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Well I despised it....until the end of the grind when I learned to primarily use AP and make maximum use of terrain and concealment.  Suddenly started having awesome games, i.e. three or more consecutive matches top score and bottom tier, charging in and taking out multiple ships at the right moment, etc.  Still sold it but, strangely, the temptation was there not to.  Keep shooting that AP regardless of tier, and of course run the dispersion module.  It works.

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Ditto. I am fond of BBs, but Monarch is a rare turd in a punch bowl. I hit an Amagi with 7 shells, @ 7.7KM, when she was full broadside and I was angled just enough to bring the rear turret into play. 7 Shells into her Citadel Area got me 2800 points. Amagi fired back at me, while I was angled and did 17000 damage to me. Rinse and repeat. Match after match. I am only keeping this ship hoping they fix her. I get her and started ranked thinking I would grow into her. WRONG. I got killed in 7 straight matches and finally gave up on her. She consistently shot low. If you are aiming at the gunwales for a citadel,  you are going to get shells in the water pretty consistently. I find I have to aim for the main deck and hope they find the side of the ship. The Alabama/NC contest with Monarch is going to go to them every time. The only scenario in which she excels mildly is as a contributor in an over match situation. Even in co-op, while trying to adjust my play in her I went to co-op, she is s loser. AL/NC/Tirp she is no match for either. God help you against any T9 or T10. It is nowhere near a fair fight. I got the Nelson at T7 and love her. I love the Hood. I joined the game playing the Warspite. But Monarch, the only reason I will keep this ship, if I keep her, will be to wait for the rebalance. She is just awful at T8. I live for citadels. I time my play to catch an opponent coming out of a turn etc. In the Monarch, it just doesnt matter. Citadelling even a weak cruiser it just so rare that you soon just want to place shells on target and forget even trying in her.

WG...FIX THIS...

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I'm quite torn about this ship, I hate what she is and how she was added to the tree. She is, in effect a lazy attempt at a 15" armed KGV, if you look at the actual design studies the proposed ship was a very different beast indeed. That said I actually enjoy the game play, she is the only RN BB tech tree ship where I primarily use AP over HE. It's deceptively powerful and if you aim in the right spots you can consistently farm 10-15k hits off enemies. Her AA isn't amazing but it's hardly garbage either and you can use it to defend yourself, he stealth is trolly and is great for surprising cruisers and Destroyers. The only thing I don't like about it is that it's dispersion seems very iffy. 

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The Monarch idea was to build a KGV with a 'new' 15in gun.  The main BB gun of the Royal Navy through out WW2 was the pre-WW1 15in/42 Mk I BL.  This gun was hugely successful but old as sin by 1936.  The 15in gun on the Monarch is supposed to be the new 15in/45 Mk II BL.  This never happened in real life because of the Washington Naval Treaty.  Britain's experience with high velocity naval canon was badly effected by how absolutely terrible the 16in guns of the Nelson and Rodney performed, which was really a result of how Britain's continued use of cordite.

Britain decided to go back to lower velocity naval canon.  They were cheaper to make and had a longer life expectancy which helped the Royal Navy when dealing the Parliament's penny pinching.  The 14in/45 is a development of the 12in/50 Mk XIV, and this line would have been followed with the 18in/45 Mk II we are supposed to get on Conqueror.  Unfortunately the Lion and Conqueror were never built because Britain rightly decided that small hull ships such as 5,000t-8,000t light cruisers could be built a lot faster and cheaper than more battleships.

We are lucky we got the Vanguard, and that was only because the turrets and guns pulled from Courageous and Glorious from their conversions the CVs were wasting away in storage until DNC Stanley Goodall decided to put them to good use.  And don't forget the Vanguard had the same guns as the Queen Elizabeth class from 40 years earlier.

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On 11/09/2017 at 2:41 PM, bratas said:

Personally I found the Monarch to be just fine. You have to angle properly and be at a decent mid-range. That doesn't mean get in and brawl nor does it mean you should be trying to snipe. Monarch requires a good mix of using the correct ammo types too. I have found the placement of your shots also makes a huge difference. Here is the difference of how I used my Monarch vs how you used yours.

 

 

monarch bratas.JPG

monarch peoticmotion.JPG

This made me think as did the OP's review.... To be honest Pre Monarch I detested playing T8 battles, I own plenty of 8's but some are dull (looking at you... long range HE spammers) or dull (aka Tirp/Bizzy).... Monarch is more like Ali....  Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee... seems to be the way to play Monarch.... her sAP is very very good against KM BB's using the flat arcs and High velocity into THAT well known weak area and you will see regular 15k salvoes going in ... dispersion has its' moments but no better or worse than many other T8 BB's.... the art is in the use of its epic concealment to drop in and out of view between salvoes.... go quiet at edge of detection wait for enemy to make a turn and BAM!

 

Monarch works best with FULL concealment and dual Fighters.... It is my go to ship for Tier 8 as I said before... anyway hope my observations help to further the discussion....

 

 

monarch NA.jpg

 

Edited by cherry2blost

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