Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
You need to play a total of 5 battles to post in this section.
Bronco

A suggestion to encourage mobile game play

26 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

108
[DETN8]
Beta Testers
760 posts
5,807 battles

I believe the general consensus regarding the upcoming changes to the smoke mechanics in 0.6.11 is to encourage mobile game play, especially among BB. With these changes, a lot of players have express their concern that it may in fact have the opposite effect thereby encouraging BBs to kite/bow tank behind the main engagement zones. Consequently, I started to think of a way that would encourage not only BBs but all classes to remain mobile. Since in real life, mobility is a form of defense, why not include this into the game. 

I suggest that a dispersion modifier is applied to your ship based on your movement. The longer you sit still, the more it increments up to a maximum say -10% (or perhaps each class could have its own maximum). Therefore, if a BB is sitting still, bow tanking, it wouldn't take long for this modifier to reach its maximum thereby making it easier for anyone to land shells on the sitting duck. 

This modifier could be made visible to the player as part of their UI as an indication of how susceptible he/she is to more accurate incoming fire. I would also stipulate that this modifier would only increase while the player is spotted. Once you start moving, it would decrease proportionally to your speed until it reaches 0. Also, once you go dark, it would also decrease if you remain stationary but at a slower rate. Upon being re-detected, it would continue to increase if you're still reasonably stationary. 

This modifier would also come into effect when a player beaches themselves or when their engine is knocked out. Essentially, whenever your speed descends below a certain threshold (say 4-5 kts), you risk becoming a easy target. The need for a threshold is needed to discourage player's from bow tanking in reverse (or similar game play).

Any thoughts? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
900
Members
5,579 posts
3,952 battles

It's an interesting idea, but I have to disagree. I mean, sometimes I just like to relax and cruise at a low speed.

B2Hwy3v.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,085
[SIM]
Members
2,439 posts
4,080 battles

Nevermind, misread.

Edited by SkaerKrow

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
108
[DETN8]
Beta Testers
760 posts
5,807 battles
2 minutes ago, SkaerKrow said:

I understand the sentiment and appreciate the idea, but to say that ships are less accurate when stationary would require an insurmountable leap in logic for most people. You can only abstract things so much before your audience loses its ability to mentally subscribe to the trappings of the game experience that you're offering. It's not a bad idea from a purely numeric standpoint, but at the end of the day the game still hangs its hat on being a recreation of naval warfare. Flip it around perhaps, and decrease dispersion when ships fire at a stationary target?

The other way around, the slow moving ship becomes easier to hit meaning the modifier is applied to anyone who is targeting that ship. Sorry if I didn't make that clear in my original post.

 

For example: A ship with 150m dispersion with have 135m dispersion when shooting at a stationary target with a -10% dispersion modifier. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,681
[TBW]
Members
6,349 posts
11,894 battles

Same as above thought you were talking about blitz playing on mobile phone, don't blitz and drive.  Although that is an interesting idea, I don't think that adding another mechanic is going to help potatoes, add keep moving to the list of things they don't do already.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
108
[DETN8]
Beta Testers
760 posts
5,807 battles

It's not only potatoes that don't move. This modifier may also discourage the island campers as well. I see a lot of players (some quite experienced) who spend nearly their entire match hugging a corner of an island, popping out occasionally to fire on a target. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
666
[USCC2]
Members
3,432 posts

Like the thought of keeping things mobile, but won't those that stay at the back still do so (and just move around more)?

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
108
[DETN8]
Beta Testers
760 posts
5,807 battles
33 minutes ago, _WaveRider_ said:

Like the thought of keeping things mobile, but won't those that stay at the back still do so (and just move around more)?

 

The spirit of this suggestion is to discourage those who bow tank or island camp.

 

Something else would be needed to encourage players to close the distance. Perhaps add some kind of beneficial modifier that increases with the number of targets in range based on the target's range relative to their player's firing range. Meaning the modifier would be very small (or zero) if you had a single target near your max range as opposed to having several targets at short to mid-range. The benefit could be increased XP earned for damage inflicted while in melee range.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
666
[USCC2]
Members
3,432 posts
2 minutes ago, Bronco said:

 

The spirit of this suggestion is to discourage those who bow tank or island camp.

 

Something else would be needed to encourage players to close the distance. Perhaps add some kind of beneficial modifier that increases with the number of targets in range based on their range relative to their firing range. Meaning the modifier would be very small (or zero) if you had a single target at your max range as opposed to having several targets at short to mid-range. The benefit could be increased XP so as to not upset the balance of the game. 

Sorry, I believe that even with bow tanking, players are still moving - if only to keep  the ship bow on.

 

With certain ships, RN CAs for instance, they may shuffle around in their 2 puffs, but it seems harsh to penalise when I believe part of their play is centred around using their smoke offensively (as 2 puffs isn't going to cover you for long if you are running). 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
108
[DETN8]
Beta Testers
760 posts
5,807 battles

While in smoke, you are no longer spotted therefore the modifier would fall off. As I stated earlier, the modifier only increases when your speed drops below a certain threshold and the max at the speed would be capped as well.

 

Ex: Max dispersion penalty would be -10% while standing still, 0% at say 5 kts or more. Therefore, at 3 kts, your penalty could reach -4% if you maintain that speed.

 

Once you smoke up, the penalty is removed instantly.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
134
[CAPGO]
Members
513 posts
3,264 battles

interesting idea, hard to execute. Introducing new mechanics to the game always causes problems. We already have the game mechanic to punish people who is sitting still, a torpedo. Problem is that the torpedo boats are a dying breed. Reward for torpedo boats are too inconsistent. 

Edited by 0806sung

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
108
[DETN8]
Beta Testers
760 posts
5,807 battles
Just now, 0806sung said:

interesting idea, hard to execute. Introducing new mechanics to the game always causes problems. We already have the game mechanic to punish people who is sitting still, a torpedo. Problem is that torpedo boats are a dying breed. Reward for torpedo boats are too inconsistent. 

It can be hard to torpedo bow tankers who sit far behind their cruisers and DDs who effectively spot all incoming torps in time to avoid. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
134
[CAPGO]
Members
513 posts
3,264 battles
4 minutes ago, Bronco said:

It can be hard to torpedo bow tankers who sit far behind their cruisers and DDs who effectively spot all incoming torps in time to avoid. 

 

CV was suppose to be the solution for WG in that case but only problem is that they don't know how to fix the CV play

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
108
[DETN8]
Beta Testers
760 posts
5,807 battles
7 minutes ago, 0806sung said:

 

CV was suppose to be the solution for WG in that case but only problem is that they don't know how to fix the CV play

 

Good point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
666
[USCC2]
Members
3,432 posts
22 minutes ago, Bronco said:

While in smoke, you are no longer spotted therefore the modifier would fall off. As I stated earlier, the modifier only increases when your speed drops below a certain threshold and the max at the speed would be capped as well.

 

Ex: Max dispersion penalty would be -10% while standing still, 0% at say 5 kts or more. Therefore, at 3 kts, your penalty could reach -4% if you maintain that speed.

 

Once you smoke up, the penalty is removed instantly.

Thank you for explaining it clearer for me.

 

Again, I think the thought process of getting people mobile is great but some ships really do their damage by darting around the map but then finding places to hold up and fire away, before they need to move again. Still a positive suggestion though! :Smile_honoring:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Testers
2,989 posts
4,192 battles

Model the fastest shell flight time off of Cleveland's shell flight time.

 

Won't completely fix it but will definitely be a huge fix for camping. Reason is regardless of how much you buff Cleveland's gun stats, past a certain range hit rate is just bonkers.

 

Same example can be found in USN DDs, where you can give them 60 RPM and they would still be near harmless past 10km.

 

Proper fix would be to remove all buffs to guns unrelated to gun amount and caliber. Aka accuracy does not get buffed per tier (most important of the miscellaneous buffs to remove.)

 

Guns don't need a smorgasboard of improvements per tier when defensive options like armor and mobility advance at a snail's pace. More guns and higher caliber (more alpha essentially) is all that is required when bumping up a ship per tier.

 

If that means Yamato is as accurate as Kawachi, all the better.

 

These two methods are much simplier and more intuitive to players, rather than some weird scaling of accuracy depending on movement.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
108
[DETN8]
Beta Testers
760 posts
5,807 battles

I agree there are good time to slow down (to throw off the opponent's lead) or even stop such as when you need to go dark to repair/heal or setting up for a torp ambush. In most of these cases, you're usually in stealth mode anyways therefore your penalty is decreasing or reset despite being stationary.

 

I guess it boils down to identifying which problem we're trying to fix. I thought this would be a good thing to counter the bow tankers in the back.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
418
[NATO]
Beta Testers
1,767 posts
5,806 battles
1 hour ago, Bronco said:

I agree there are good time to slow down (to throw off the opponent's lead) or even stop such as when you need to go dark to repair/heal or setting up for a torp ambush. In most of these cases, you're usually in stealth mode anyways therefore your penalty is decreasing or reset despite being stationary.

 

I guess it boils down to identifying which problem we're trying to fix. I thought this would be a good thing to counter the bow tankers in the back.

There is a reality based argument (I know....boo....reality has no place yadda yadda....) to favour inaccurate guns fired from a stationary ship. Most warships run at near top speed when in a battle as it brings stability in rough waters. Stability = better accuracy. Ive mentioned this a few times before but people ignore it or prefer more complicated solutions lol.

 

Slower moving ships should suffer an accuracy penalty.

 

However, the US BB's at tier 8 and 9 would need some slight improvements to make up for this due to the nature of the 'box' we sail in and the fact they still get clobbered when showing their flanks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
108
[DETN8]
Beta Testers
760 posts
5,807 battles
41 minutes ago, hipcanuck said:

There is a reality based argument (I know....boo....reality has no place yadda yadda....) to favour inaccurate guns fired from a stationary ship. Most warships run at near top speed when in a battle as it brings stability in rough waters. Stability = better accuracy. Ive mentioned this a few times before but people ignore it or prefer more complicated solutions lol.

 

Slower moving ships should suffer an accuracy penalty.

 

However, the US BB's at tier 8 and 9 would need some slight improvements to make up for this due to the nature of the 'box' we sail in and the fact they still get clobbered when showing their flanks.

 

Once again, the dispersion modifier that I'm proposing is being applied to the person who is shooting the stationary target. The dispersion of the stationary target is unaffected.

 

Ex; If I see a target that isn't moving either by choice (bow tank), by accident (beached) or inattention (sitting duck after smoke runs out), my dispersion is improved only if that target is my selected target. The longer that target remains stationary, the more accurate I get to shoot at him. So if someone wants to bow tank, then they place themselves in greater danger. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,353
[SYN]
Members
4,530 posts
11,434 battles

Wanna encourage mobile gameplay?  Put the Ocean map on regular rotation at all tiers.  The most mobile gameplay you'll ever see in this game is on that map.  Other than stealth and smoke, there is nowhere to camp or hide behind.  You move and you fight, or you die.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
107
[NGUNS]
Beta Testers
526 posts
3,027 battles

To encourage mobile game play, they just need to give everyone new phones.

...

I'll see myself out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
108
[DETN8]
Beta Testers
760 posts
5,807 battles
10 minutes ago, Kuckoo said:

Wanna encourage mobile gameplay?  Put the Ocean map on regular rotation at all tiers.  The most mobile gameplay you'll ever see in this game is on that map.  Other than stealth and smoke, there is nowhere to camp or hide behind.  You move and you fight, or you die.

 

True enough and yet I haven't heard too many people confess their love for that map. Played it twice last night in a row with some div mates. None of us enjoy playing that map. There's no where to hide because DDs are constantly stealth detecting everyone else. There's no possibility to go dark for heals (unless your lucky to be close to smoke) or break the line of sight with an island in order to turn safely. 

 

Yet it never fails to see 1-2 BBs bow tank in each match, or worst just yolo in hopes of getting a different map. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,824
[ARRGG]
[ARRGG]
Members
5,770 posts

Nice thought but it is ONE Sided Wouldn't a stationary gun be more accurate as well? Firing a gun while moving your accuracy declines "Fact"   Try shooting a deer while walking not stopping. not impossible but VERY Difficult. now stop and shoot the deer. DEAD Deer. So that said when you become the deer mobility is important your own and the shooters and vice versa

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
418
[NATO]
Beta Testers
1,767 posts
5,806 battles
2 hours ago, CLUCH_CARGO said:

Nice thought but it is ONE Sided Wouldn't a stationary gun be more accurate as well? Firing a gun while moving your accuracy declines "Fact"   Try shooting a deer while walking not stopping. not impossible but VERY Difficult. now stop and shoot the deer. DEAD Deer. So that said when you become the deer mobility is important your own and the shooters and vice versa

 

Not on a ship. Having served in the navy on a DD I can tell you that ships roll like a [edited] when they stop forward motion and the bigger the ship, the more they roll. Not to mention the waves instantly turn you sideways to the prevailing winds....and you roll even more.  The guns on a BB can correct for motion of the ship, but the goal is to minimize the motion and the only way to do that in 15' seas is to move...faster is better. Somewhat like WoWs, positioning is important, getting the wind at your back is best to stop the ocean spray from getting on the rangefinders.

 

It would be more accurate if you were tied to a dock, but on a rolling wind swept ocean, you need to move.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,824
[ARRGG]
[ARRGG]
Members
5,770 posts
22 hours ago, hipcanuck said:

 

Not on a ship. Having served in the navy on a DD I can tell you that ships roll like a [edited] when they stop forward motion and the bigger the ship, the more they roll. Not to mention the waves instantly turn you sideways to the prevailing winds....and you roll even more.  The guns on a BB can correct for motion of the ship, but the goal is to minimize the motion and the only way to do that in 15' seas is to move...faster is better. Somewhat like WoWs, positioning is important, getting the wind at your back is best to stop the ocean spray from getting on the rangefinders.

 

It would be more accurate if you were tied to a dock, but on a rolling wind swept ocean, you need to move.

In the real Oceans and Seas of the world you will get no argument. In WoWs even during a cyclone the water is calm. The deer analogy was only placed in to show that steady aim kills. Movement is a defence and an offence. In WoWs ships park near Islands and in smoke "Deer stand" "Duck Blind" "Ghillie Suits" All designed for stationary steadfast Firing. You Have to remember this game is a 1st person shooter arcade style game not a sim. As such the the stopped ship should become more accurate only having to compensate the turret movement and elevations. A sitting duck is an easy kill only if the duck is unarmed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×