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Jonesyrules15

How do you feel about RN BB HE fire chance

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Wondering how everybody feels about the RN BB flamethrowers?  I have been getting a lot of 2 fire salvos out on the low tier ships.  Finishing rounds with 10-14 fires started.

 

Feels like maybe a lower fire % is in order.  

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Seems absolutely essential on the KGV.

 

First tried out playing like I normally did firing primarily AP, but now that I switched to a Scharnhorst style of primarily HE, I have been doing a lot better. 

 

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3 minutes ago, BadlyBrowned said:

Seems absolutely essential on the KGV.

 

First tried out playing like I normally did firing primarily AP, but now that I switched to a Scharnhorst style of primarily HE, I have been doing a lot better. 

 

Interesting I almost never use HE on my scharn and I have above average stats in it across the board.

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I've used it and it is ridiculous.

KGV and similar fire chance in the forties?

Mega Zao? Sheesh!

Way overdone IMO.

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Get the 4 point skill where only 1 super structure fire can be started and then run damage control mod with fire reduction flag... Problem solved. 

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I think that the thing is this...

The Devs of WoWS just can't accept that ships are ships.  And that there really aren't and weren't any national flavors in real life ... mostly.  Oh, navies of different nations has some different design philosophies, which is why there are the ships of different nations have certain looks to them, like the smokestacks on IJN ships, vs. those of other navies.  Or the different turret looks of different navies.  And so on.  But overall, naval ships did essentially the same thing.  They fired AP shells at each other.  HE rounds were used for shooting at soft land based targets, by and large.  Navies didn't lob HE shells at each other trying to start fires on the enemy.  They fired AP rounds, trying to inflict major damage to enemy ships, trying to knock out key systems, like main gun turrets, gun directors, engines, boilers, and so on.  And IIRC, real life AP rounds exploded and could cause their own fires.  You didn't need to fire HE to start fires.

But for some reason, the devs don't want this kind of realism.  They want some sort of arcade fantasy.  And, boy, are they in love with fire!

 

Edited by Crucis
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They're balanced around it, If they lowered it they would have to do something to compensate.

 

The ships have no health so they feel like they eat tons of damage, but really, it's just be cause of how little health they have.

 

Their AP is also very meh at anything but close range.

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18 minutes ago, Jonesyrules15 said:

Interesting I almost never use HE on my scharn and I have above average stats in it across the board.

 

/shrug

 

Main point being that the KGV plays more like a large cruiser than a BB. I personally play my Scharn like that, but the Scharndoes have good muzzle velocity and a 20sec reload that makes AP more viable than on the KGV.

 

So my initial impression is that the KGV is an odd ship. It has 14in guns with muzzle velocities slower even than the USN 14in guns, and a 25sec reload that doesn't feel like a good enough compromise for the smaller and slower shells compared to most other Tier 7 BBs Thus, spam HE in the KGV.

 

I'm not a fan of BB HE spam overall, but in terms of the KGV, it seems necessary. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Prkl8r said:

They're balanced around it, If they lowered it they would have to do something to compensate.

 

The ships have no health so they feel like they eat tons of damage, but really, it's just be cause of how little health they have.

 

Their AP is also very meh at anything but close range.

 

I would give them the most accurate BB guns in game, keep the AP stats and lower the HE fire %.  A better real world flavor IMO.

1 minute ago, BadlyBrowned said:

 

/shrug

 

Main point being that the KGV plays more like a large cruiser than a BB. I personally play my Scharn like that, but the Scharndoes have good muzzle velocity and a 20sec reload that makes AP more viable than on the KGV.

 

So my initial impression is that the KGV is an odd ship. It has 14in guns with muzzle velocities slower even than the USN 14in guns, and a 25sec reload that doesn't feel like a good enough compromise for the smaller and slower shells compared to most other Tier 7 BBs Thus, spam HE in the KGV.

 

I'm not a fan of BB HE spam overall, but in terms of the KGV, it seems necessary. 

 

 

Thanks for taking the time to explain your reasoning.  

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1 minute ago, Crucis said:

I think that the thing is this...

The Devs of WoWS just can't accept that ships are ships.  And that there really aren't and weren't any national flavors in real life ... mostly.  Oh, navies of different nations has some different design philosophies, which is why there are the ships of different nations have certain looks to them, like the smokestacks on IJN ships, vs. those of other navies.  Or the different turret looks of different navies.  And so on.  But overall, naval ships did essentially the same thing.  They fired AP shells at each other.  HE rounds were used for shooting at soft land based targets, by and large.  Navies didn't lob HE shells at each other trying to start fires on the enemy.  They fired AP rounds, trying to inflict major damage to enemy ships, trying to knock out key systems, like main gun turrets, gun directors, engines, boilers, and so on.  And IIRC, real life AP rounds exploded and could cause their own fires.  You didn't need to fire HE to start fires.

Bu for some reason, the devs don't want this kind of realism.  They want some sort of arcade fantasy.  And, boy, are they in love with fire!

 

This, I really wish they didn't feel like every new line of ships needs a gimmick that makes them vastly different.

 

I mean WoT doesn't do this, sure all the lines have some quirks but they are more exaggeration of the real life design quirks of tanks rather than fake gameplay gimmicks.

 

I actually feel like they made RN BBs good at HE based on British Tanks in WoT being the line that uses HESH, so they thought that would be intuitive for WoT players.

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3 minutes ago, Prkl8r said:

This, I really wish they didn't feel like every new line of ships needs a gimmick that makes them vastly different.

 

I mean WoT doesn't do this, sure all the lines have some quirks but they are more exaggeration of the real life design quirks of tanks rather than fake gameplay gimmicks.

 

I actually feel like they made RN BBs good at HE based on British Tanks in WoT being the line that uses HESH, so they thought that would be intuitive for WoT players.

I agree.  WoT really doesn't gimmick up different nation's tanks.  And perhaps HESH rounds are the closest thing to a "gimmick", but it only exists on high tier tanks.

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24 minutes ago, Jonesyrules15 said:

Interesting I almost never use HE on my scharn and I have above average stats in it across the board.

 

Hooray for you not getting the usual garbage overpens and/or shatters.

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2 hours ago, Estimated_Prophet said:

 

Hooray for you not getting the usual garbage overpens and/or shatters.

Oh they still happen from time to time just not enough for me to load HE.

 

I think it is going to be very interesting to see how these RN BBs fit.  I think they are going to cause more conservative BB play because a division of RN BBs could literally melt anything it sees.  

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Just shoot high caliber AP at them, basically BB AP, as they seem to eat a lot of normal pens similar to the German BBs. I was shooting at the tier 8 with my Alabama earlier today, and was getting easy 8k to 12 damage rolls almost every salvo. As for the HE, just do what @MorbidGamer said and go for fire prevention and suitability on your ships and you're golden. Also, remember to stay angled incase they try to hit you with AP.

Edited by Kitsunelegend

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The new HE spam meta is a turd so vast that properly composted, it could fertilize California for a year.

Played a half dozen games today. Spent it on fire. Zero fun. 

People always complained that any idiot can play a BB. Well, now we are seeing what happens when any idiot does, and it isn't pretty. The game sucks. That fire chance will have to be reduced to normal levels.

Fortunately, my son just introduced me to Cities Skylines. 

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Just now, Kitsunelegend said:

Just shoot high caliber AP at them, basically BB AP, as they seem to eat a lot of normal pens similar to the German BBs. I was shooting at the tier 8 with my Alabama earlier today, and was getting easy 8k to 12 damage rolls almost every salvo. As for the HE, just do what @MorbidGamer said and go for fire prevention and suitability on your ships and you're golden. Also, remember to stay angled incase they try to hit you with AP.

 

No, you're not. I have 19 pt captain with all the skills including the lvl 4 fire reduction skill. Zero effect, spent every match on fire. The meta is garbage now. 
 

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1 minute ago, Taichunger said:

 

No, you're not. I have 19 pt captain with all the skills including the lvl 4 fire reduction skill. Zero effect, spent every match on fire. The meta is garbage now. 
 

I meant you're golden against the RNBBs. Cruiser HE, with their rof, is a whole other can of worms...

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Their AP is doesn't pen BBs. It works great against Cruisers though. Necessary mechanic if they are going to use the historical AP fuses.

Overall I think it is going to be good for the game. Bow on tanking is the worst thing a BB can do against British BBs and Cruisers will live longer because most of the time the British BBs are going to have the wrong ammo loaded to delete them.

 

 

Edited by CaptainTeddybear

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It's slightly OP; but nothing that a slight buff to the 4pt Fire Prevention Skill can't bring in line. Just increase the Fire Resistance by an additional 2%.

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There has been so much pre-launch buzz about the British BBs being flamethrowers that players are likely defaulting to the use of HE. Since you are unlikely to use HE in German, IJN, or US BBs nearly as often, it makes sense that British BBs will set so many fires since that's the only ammo type that they are using. If any non-British BB drivers want to check this out, feel free to only load HE and see how many fires you set. It would be interesting to see how things compare.

 

As someone who tried out DDs today, I can say that British BBs only loading HE has made my day way less safe. 

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7 minutes ago, CaptainTeddybear said:

Their AP is doesn't pen BBs. It works great against Cruisers though. Necessary mechanic if they are going to use the historical AP fuses.

Overall I think it is going to be good for the game. Bow on tanking is the worst thing a BB can do against British BBs and Cruisers will live longer because most of the time the British BBs are going to have the wrong ammo loaded to delete them.

 

 

 

It's going to be very bad for the game. It is not fun to be on fire all. the. time.

 

Bow tanking BBs? There was nothing to stop you from firing HE at bow tanking BBs from any BB, and I frequently did so. This isn't going to make them not bow tank -- some BBs, like Yammy, N Carolina, Nelson, and Izumo can't show their sides. 

Edited by Taichunger

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Just now, guns_at_last_light said:

There has been so much pre-launch buzz about the British BBs being flamethrowers that players are likely defaulting to the use of HE. Since you are unlikely to use HE in German, IJN, or US BBs nearly as often, it makes sense that British BBs will set so many fires since that's the only ammo type that they are using. If any non-British BB drivers want to check this out, feel free to only load HE and see how many fires you set. It would be interesting to see how things compare.

 

As someone who tried out DDs today, I can say that British BBs only loading HE has made my day way less safe. 

 

I tested HE with Iowa in Coop the other day to finish out the UK Fire MIssion. The number of 2 fire salvos I had was terrifying. 

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3 minutes ago, Taichunger said:

 

It's going to be very bad for the game. It is not fun to be on fire all. the. time.

 

Bow tanking BBs? There was nothing to stop you from firing HE at bow tanking BBs from any BB, and I frequently did so. This isn't going to make them not bow tank -- some BBs, like Yammy, N Carolina, Nelson, and Izumo can't show their sides. 

 

People probably should have been firing HE more, however the difference in fire chance isn't trivial. I'll probably still use AP in the other BBs in case a broadside pops up.

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5 minutes ago, Taichunger said:

 

I tested HE with Iowa in Coop the other day to finish out the UK Fire MIssion. The number of 2 fire salvos I had was terrifying. 

 

That makes a lot of sense. BBs have a pretty decent fire chance to begin with, but in most cases you aren't going to get the same damage as you would if you only fired AP rounds. Thanks for the anecdote.

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