Ocean Tiers

[Quaffer]

Just for fun. What tier ships do you want to see on ocean?

[Crucis]

I love Ocean and want it back in the regular and fairly heavily used rotation. I don't want to see the standard variant of it because the meta was dreadful, i.e. let's circle the map around to the enemy cap.  There was no imagination in the strats and it took an act of god to even get people to go clockwise instead of counter-clockwise.

 

Play on the domination mode was much better.

 

Personally, I'd love to see an Encounter version of Ocean where one team spawned at about A7, the other at about G1, and there was a single cap in the southeast corner (about i9). This could be very interesting. Do you race to the cap, try to intercept the enemy team, or something else?

 

Oh, and tiers. Anything tier 4 or 5 up to tier 10.

[GhostSwordsman]

I don't mind ocean myself much. But the beef I have with it is the tiers that currently can see it.

Currently, only tiers 8, 9, and 10 can see ocean, and in my opinion, these are the worst tiers to play this map on. Everything at those tiers is hyper-lethal, and simultaneously made of glass. It's the glass-cannon nature of almost all the T8+ ships, due to offensive power way out-scaling defensive measures, that makes ocean so unbearable to play right now. Cruisers can't move up because they'll succumb to every enemy battleship targeting them as soon as they're spotted. Battleships can't show side without losing nearly all their HP, so a slow advance forward is the only real way to ensure that you don't get easily flanked. DDs get no support from their team because they have to take the advance position while the rest keep at arms length to avoid heavy damage.

Add on to this that at these tiers, radar that can spot concealed destroyers, torpedoes that can travel upwards of 16-20km away, and no hard cover to break LoS, and you have a poor combination resulting in uber campy gameplay due to the lethality of all the ships at the top tiers.

[Dictonary]

4 minutes ago, GhostSwordsman said:

I don't mind ocean myself much. But the beef I have with it is the tiers that currently can see it.

Currently, only tiers 8, 9, and 10 can see ocean, and in my opinion, these are the worst tiers to play this map on. Everything at those tiers is hyper-lethal, and simultaneously made of glass. It's the glass-cannon nature of almost all the T8+ ships, due to offensive power way out-scaling defensive measures, that makes ocean so unbearable to play right now. Cruisers can't move up because they'll succumb to every enemy battleships targeting them as soon as their spotted. Battleships can't show side without losing nearly all their HP, so a slow advance forward is the only real way to ensure that you don't get easily flanked. DDs get no support from their team because they have to take the advance position while the rest keep at arms length to avoid heavy damage.

Add on to this that at these tiers, radar that can spot concealed destroyers, torpedoes that can travel upwards of 16km away, and no hard cover to break LoS, and you have a poor combination resulting in uber campy gameplay due to the lethality of all the ships at the top tiers.

No wonder I don't see it anymore. Ocean, for tiers 8 and up? What is this? Why? Just why? (You can tell in Closed Beta what was my most hated map. Ocean.)

 

Mainly due to bad memories of it. I still have a grudge. I will thankfully have to wait for when I get that Amagi to ever see Ocean again. So why? No islands to funnel enemies. No way to predict where they would go. Unpredictablity. Yet again, it has been a year or more since I played it. Maybe it has changed. IDK.

[BrushWolf]

All tiers but it would need to be resized for the lower tiers.

[Quaffer]

4 minutes ago, BrushWolf said:

All tiers but it would need to be resized for the lower tiers.

Well you have to admit it would be the easiest map we have to resize.  Although it would be interesting to just set the locations of the spawn points and caps a little closer together.

[Xlap]

All tiers for me, BEST MAP EVER. And the most reallistic too. WG should make more maps with more open waters and less islands. Islands only estimulate camp meta and bad play. 

 

WG please more water and less land, more ocean please!!!

[Xlap]

1 hour ago, Apaosha said:

Ocean is a great map I wish people would quit crying because they don't like it.  I've seen a lot of players on the forums saying that they actually liked Ocean.  Personally I agree I love that map.  No where to hide.  Personally I think that Ocean should be available for tier 5 and above because of the protection bias placed on tiers 1 to 4 it would not be a very good map for them to start on.  Not to mention I can remember when Ocean would repeat itself almost every other match back when we had 7 km torpedoes on Minekaze at tier 5 l m f a o.

 

Its because Ocean is a high skill map, no islands to save players from positioning mistakes. Its just straight gunnery and manouvering skill and team play. Potato players and solo warriors dont do well on this map. 

 

But IMO is the best map ever, and the most reallistic too.

[Psycodiver]

I think Ocean is a good mid tier map but a bad high tier map, at high tier all the ships are so potent that all mistakes are punished quickly and all thats left is a stand off with no one making any moves. In mid tiers ships are inaccurate enough to not really punish small mistakes while still ruining big mistakes.

[BrushWolf]

3 hours ago, Quaffer said:

Well you have to admit it would be the easiest map we have to resize.  Although it would be interesting to just set the locations of the spawn points and caps a little closer together.

 

That would work too.

[KalishniKat]

I've never seen Ocean but would really like to..hate all the giant mountainous island maps. Solomon Islands and Strait are favorites because of all the open sea in them. 

[aethervox]

+1 for you, Quaffer.  You know my sentiments about maps - leave them all alone & don't artificially restrict them to small numbers of tiers. I voted here for T4 & +, btw.

[Taylor3006]

They need to add Ocean into the rotation, people complaining about it just need to suck it up a bit. Players complain about almost every map in game, they shouldn't exclude Ocean from the mix. I suppose tiers 1 & 2 don't really need the Ocean map but it works well with all others IMHO. 

[Canadatron]

I don't like it, though I've had lots of fun on it and don't seem to struggle like some. Issue is that in a ship like Atlanta, or other short ranged 'soft' ships the game is AFK worthy levels of not fun. If you're in a RU DD, it's good times to be sure. We already do enough in this game for BB centric players that pushing this map onto people more than it already is might be asking a bit too much.

[Taylor3006]

28 minutes ago, Canadatron said:

I don't like it, though I've had lots of fun on it and don't seem to struggle like some. Issue is that in a ship like Atlanta, or other short ranged 'soft' ships the game is AFK worthy levels of not fun. If you're in a RU DD, it's good times to be sure. We already do enough in this game for BB centric players that pushing this map onto people more than it already is might be asking a bit too much.

I prefer Ocean map when running a CA. I can wiggle and maneuver without running into rocks. No turning broadside because you got an island in your way. No chasing a DD around an island while eating torps. The ability to maneuver is of greater importance to me than cover. I am still astounded that people playing a naval combat game don't like the Ocean map. The addition of islands/rocks just turns the game into a first person shooter with boats. Ocean map promotes team play IMHO, you have to work together in order to get anything done. One of the reasons I hate PvP play is you always get a group of ships hiding behind an island, popping out to shoot and fall back behind the rock..... It leads to boring, stagnant game play. 

[Sabot_100]

On 9/17/2017 at 11:36 AM, Taylor3006 said:

I am still astounded that people playing a naval combat game don't like the Ocean map.

But in real naval combat you sailed broadside in straight lines hoping to damage the enemy with the volume of fire. If you maneuvered, you couldn't hit anything. In this arcade version, guns are way too accurate for that so ships go bow-on or angle, voluntarily taking half their guns out of action to lessen the chance of a penetrating hit.  IRL, collisions and running aground took you out of the combat even if you didn't sink so fighting near islands was dangerous. In game, it has been factored into the survival of many of the ships. In game, certain ships will do very well on Ocean and others will become trash (the previously mentioned Atlanta being the poster child but there are others). I too believe that many players of these now trash ships would afk when getting this map. 

[Psycodiver]

1 hour ago, Sabot_100 said:

But in real naval combat you sailed broadside in straight lines hoping to damage the enemy with the volume of fire. If you maneuvered, you couldn't hit anything. In this arcade version, guns are way too accurate for that so ships go bow-on or angle, voluntarily taking half their guns out of action to lessen the chance of a penetrating hit.  IRL, collisions and running aground took you out of the combat even if you didn't sink so fighting near islands was dangerous. In game, it has been factored into the survival of many of the ships. In game, certain ships will do very well on Ocean and others will become trash (the previously mentioned Atlanta being the poster child but there are others). I too believe that many players of these now trash ships would afk when getting this map. 

 

That's why I think if it's limited to T4-T6 it would be fine, BB guns aren't actuate enough to constantly delete cruisers and walls of skill would be limited

[Fletcher7_1944]

I kinda like this map- BUT: like others have said- not for high tier ships.  Same arguments as everyone else: too much accuracy, too little protection, too much range, and too many long range torpedoes.

  In the lower tiers, it's pretty fun- esp when driving those barge-like ships that take forever to turn...   Lol- I'm WAY too good at ramming islands, or getting rump humped for turning to avoid ramming one.   In ships like Nor-Cal, Gneiesnau, etc it's even worse, they're HUGE and take forever to stop, change direction or turn, making island heavy maps irritating to play. 

  For instance, your group went West, and smashed all red ships over there.  The other portion of your team was not so lucky- they either got annihilated or are very hard pressed and need help asap.  On many maps, the sheer number of islands in the way means that any help will be very long in coming, and/or reaching those last few reds wayyy over there will require a long break in the action as you have to sail the long way around.  North is a great example of this, so is 2 Brothers.  Also, ever chased that last enemy round and round Solomons??

 Additionally, the shorter range (and worse aim at long range) of lower tier ships actually encourages players to move up and engage in closer encounters with the other team- which is where most of these ships shine!

  As far as cap placement goes, I would prefer they kept them far enough apart so that a long ranged ship or group of ships in A or C cannot command all 3 caps.  And there should be a very small area in B where you can shoot into both A and C.   Otherwise tactics would get stale and one dimensional.

 Scaling it down for the low tiers also sounds reasonable, too many ships are way too slow for a map that big.

[Quaffer]

With the loss of the maps discussion forum, and the recent Ocean posts, I feel it's time to bring this one back.

BUMP!

 

In case you missed it, I recreated the current maps thread in the players guide forum. You can find it as Maps found in Random Battles.

[Quaffer]

Bump do to interest.

[monpetitloup]

On 7/3/2017 at 12:49 AM, Quaffer said:

Just for fun. What tier ships do you want to see on ocean?

All tiers.

[Counter_Gambit]

I want all 10 tiers to see the map, and have it back in regular rotation. Players needs to learn how to play their favorite ship in open waters.

Just remember: Diverting from the Meta =/= Imbalance.

[Navalpride33]

17 minutes ago, Counter_Gambit said:

I want all 10 tiers to see the map, and have it back in regular rotation. Players needs to learn how to play their favorite ship in open waters.

^^^^^ Make it happen WOWS Gods of the forum. Forward the word out to the motherland of Stalin, the needs of the people to have the ocean map in all tiers. An update on this request would be appreciated

[Landsraad]

I mean... I want to say that I don't have anything really against the map, but then again I'm a waifu-hugging CL main that likes skulking around islands and having an escape route should that Benson I'm chasing have friends with them. Like a Kurfurst. I don't really have a logical reason to say "no" to the idea of having ocean back, but at the same time I'm perfectly happy without it and every single time I hear it brought up I get 'Nam flashbacks of Kitakamis spamming unholy torp salvos out of smoke clouds and vaporizing entire flotillas. No, they're not in game and even if they were that would hardly be the ONLY map they'd unleash hell upon, but it's the first thing that pops into my head when I hear "Ocean (as in the map)".

I guess that makes my vote less a "yes" than a "okay fine, just get it over with before I regret agreeing to this."

[Flashtirade]

Preferably mid-tiers. Many ships are starting to get significant range at this tier, but they are lacking the firepower and/or accuracy to render most of the map unsafe at any time.