WarGaming why is the Enterprise so awfully designed?

[Madwolf05]

The most famous CV of the war for the USN, and a CV player base that feels as if your criminally bad thus far in balacing our CVs they're so unbelievably awful and this is what we get?

 

• Same gimmick as Kaga, but planes that scale much worse with AA. No thought was given to the fact that Tier 9 and 10 is exponentially better than 6, 7, and 8. Their survival is so bad beyond 8 that you'll have all your planes lost on most attacks.
• Since everyone KNEW 76 planes was a an awful idea, she gets 92, all fighters woopee. What's the feed back on AS again? Oh right, everyone hates it, and the USN despises it being crammed down our throats. It's not fun or rewarding. Just stop. Give it to Peru, may be they'll enjoy it on their Tier 10 CV.
• The Enterprise gets 10 TBs from 2 squads instead of 12 like the Kaga. Because clearly slower torpedoes are easier to hit with, and as we all know 12 slow diverging torpedoes are sooooo much harder to dodge than 12 converging ones. 
• About that drop pattern. You inverted the Kaga's pattern and made it diverge, which is so amazing it leaves GIGANTIC gaps for anything but a BB to EASILY dodge STACKED or cross drop attacks.
• Why is it easier to hit with REGULAR USN torpedo drops on other CVs?
• They get the USN DBs with super wide targetting because the best thing about having DBs as your specialty is not only that they're frustratingly subject to massive RNG, but you have a larger ring than the non-specialized opponents.
• Did mention their 500lbs? Aka they're terrible. Exactly what this pile of turds needed to make it an even bigger seller!

 

I just don't get it. Aren't you all tired of all the salt and abuse you all get over this? I just don't think it's that out there to believe that, knowing the angst surrounding the USN CV situation, that the guy in charge of thr Enterprise would treat the ship very delicately and carefully. Then we get the Kaga, which completely blows up the notion that 12 DBs in 2 squads was ever coming back, gives them a better drop pattern than thr standard USN CVs, and puts them at a Tier where they can actually function.

 

So I have to ask, what's the deal? How could the initial release of the Enterprise for testing be this bad? Why was it OK for the Kaga to get a TB setup that was removed from the USN for being OP, and made better? The contrast is stunning. Couldn't have this been avoided entirely with a little more forethought?

[Aschenblume]

isn't it still a work in progress?

[HellaCopterRescue]

Madwolf is MAD!

[MrDeaf]

so, like I said already

 

3rd premium CV and WG is already out of premium CV gimmick ideas and has reused Kaga's gimmick.

[Sovereigndawg]

I don't have many games in CV's because they kind of suck to learn. I will run out of other ships to get and will have to start playing them sometime. I hope that the most decorated ship in the USA isn't disgraced by WOWs.

[devastator5000]

There are a lot of bad ideas but I think the worst have to be the way the reserves are specced and the survivability of the planes, the rest can be dealt with but the survivability of the planes an Enterprise at T10 wont be doing much.

[TenguBlade]

Honestly, the community has nobody but themselves to blame for this, even if Enterprise doesn't end up like this on release.  Not just because of the sky cancer complaints about carriers in general, but because of how the community has made it clear that they know nothing about how to design a ship yet always know better than WG what it should do, especially with famous ships.  As this server demonstrated quite handily with the Alabama, our ability to throw a hissy fit over "muh historical ship isn't OP" is unmatched.

 

WG wants to avoid that again.  And so they start the Enterprise off in an underpowered configuration to avoid adding her in an OP state then having to nerf her and thus face the wrath of all the American fanboys who don't care how OP she is, just that nerfing her, even in the name of balance, is somehow an insult to her service record.

 

I doubt most people mean it like that.  But that's the image these kinds of complaints give off, especially the groundless accusations of about anti-American bias (Russian bias at least has evidence arguing for it - outside of CVs, WG has treated the USN quite well for being supposedly out to nerf them to the ground).  And it's ridiculous.  WG's treatment of USN CVs isn't justified, but this crap doesn't make people want to partake in discussion or support an opinion.

[GrandAdmiral_2016]

I don't have many games in CV's because they kind of suck to learn. I will run out of other ships to get and will have to start playing them sometime. I hope that the most decorated ship in the USA isn't disgraced by WOWs.

 

 

It will. Trust WoWs to screw up USN ships, especially CVs.

[Kapitan_Wuff]

[Fog_Repair_Ship_Akashi]

Wargaming will probably change it because if they screw this up the hell will be worse than the Alabama shitstorm, also there is a mistake in the description, it says that there are 2 ship in her class but there were 3 Yorktown-class aircraft carriers.

[saru_richard]

its cause WG seems to hate the USN ships that are not DD's 

[MrSparkle]

Why was it OK for the Kaga to get a TB setup that was removed from the USN for being OP, and made better?

 

This bothered me too when I first read about the Kaga's setup. I mean wth.

[DerKrampus]

 

 

It will. Trust WoWs to screw up USN ships, especially CVs.

 

Basically.  The national flavor for usn cvs seems to be that (saipan aside) they get stomped by the competition at every single tier.

[F3MM_Zeka]

I'm just waiting for the stupid bastards to decide she's OP and arbitrarily cancel her manual attacks altogether like they did Tiers IV and V.... wth, R U serious???

 

...because artificial and arbitrary limits and stupid gimmicks are easier than actually fixing the damned problem.

 

I seriously hope you're being sarcastic here....and that this is a troll

[SuperNikoPower]

Please keep in mind that Enterprise is still in development and may or may not be representative of how she will be upon release.

[F3MM_Zeka]

The most famous CV of the war for the USN, and a CV player base that feels as if your criminally bad thus far in balacing our CVs they're so unbelievably awful and this is what we get?

 

• Same gimmick as Kaga, but planes that scale much worse with AA. No thought was given to the fact that Tier 9 and 10 is exponentially better than 6, 7, and 8. Their survival is so bad beyond 8 that you'll have all your planes lost on most attacks.
• Since everyone KNEW 76 planes was a an awful idea, she gets 92, all fighters woopee. What's the feed back on AS again? Oh right, everyone hates it, and the USN despises it being crammed down our throats. It's not fun or rewarding. Just stop. Give it to Peru, may be they'll enjoy it on their Tier 10 CV.
• The Enterprise gets 10 TBs from 2 squads instead of 12 like the Kaga. Because clearly slower torpedoes are easier to hit with, and as we all know 12 slow diverging torpedoes are sooooo much harder to dodge than 12 converging ones. 
• About that drop pattern. You inverted the Kaga's pattern and made it diverge, which is so amazing it leaves GIGANTIC gaps for anything but a BB to EASILY dodge STACKED or cross drop attacks.
• Why is it easier to hit with REGULAR USN torpedo drops on other CVs?
• They get the USN DBs with super wide targetting because the best thing about having DBs as your specialty is not only that they're frustratingly subject to massive RNG, but you have a larger ring than the non-specialized opponents.
• Did mention their 500lbs? Aka they're terrible. Exactly what this pile of turds needed to make it an even bigger seller!

 

I just don't get it. Aren't you all tired of all the salt and abuse you all get over this? I just don't think it's that out there to believe that, knowing the angst surrounding the USN CV situation, that the guy in charge of thr Enterprise would treat the ship very delicately and carefully. Then we get the Kaga, which completely blows up the notion that 12 DBs in 2 squads was ever coming back, gives them a better drop pattern than thr standard USN CVs, and puts them at a Tier where they can actually function.

 

So I have to ask, what's the deal? How could the initial release of the Enterprise for testing be this bad? Why was it OK for the Kaga to get a TB setup that was removed from the USN for being OP, and made better? The contrast is stunning. Couldn't have this been avoided entirely with a little more forethought?

 

Did you pay attention to all the (WIP) tags in all the e's preview videos? 

[Hot_tamale25]

They either need to lower Enterprise's tier to 7 and put her in her Midway configuration or give her her Cape Engaño configuration. I'll probably buy because it's the friggin Enterprise but the more I see the more I waffle on it.

[Estimated_Prophet]

Basically.  The national flavor for usn cvs seems to be that (saipan aside) they get stomped by the competition at every single tier.

 

Never have any trouble with Hosho's when using Langley, but I suppose that may just be a personal thing...

[devastator5000]

They either need to lower Enterprise's tier to 7 and put her in her Midway configuration or give her her Cape Engaño configuration. I'll probably buy because it's the friggin Enterprise but the more I see the more I waffle on it.

 

She could go their but he size and hanger would make her good at T8, so its up to WG to figure out how to balance the planes

[Hot_tamale25]

 

She could go their but he size and hanger would make her good at T8, so its up to WG to figure out how to balance the planes

 

At tier 8 they should be using Air Group 20 which was deployed on Enterprise from August 16-November 23, 1944. It had F6F-5, SB2Cs and TBMs. 

 

http://www.cv6.org/company/airgroups.htm

 

 

[devastator5000]

 

At tier 8 they should be using Air Group 20 which was deployed on Enterprise from August 16-November 23, 1944. It had F6F-5, SB2Cs and TBMs. 

 

http://www.cv6.org/company/airgroups.htm

 

 

 

Thats an interesting Idea, T8 Bombers (maybe just DBs but could be TBs as well) and then T7 Fighters could balance the 96 plane loadout and with that I would not be as opposed to the way the Reserves are set up currently

[Anumati]

Gonna have to agree on this. WG completely and utterly screwed the pooch when it comes to BIG E so far. The most decorated ship in US history. I get it, its a "work in progress" but being at THIS stage in development with THESE kind of stats means the devs literally sat down for days, if not weeks at a time and thought that. "Yes this piece of $hit is worth it." Lets make it and market it in a bundle only for 70 dollars and sell it on name only.

 

Please keep in mind that Enterprise is still in development and may or may not be representative of how she will be upon release.

 

 

 

It can be in development hell as long as it needs to be. Pushing out a ship like this on the NA server might cause a bigger amount of unrest than Alabama. Right now this is a hot mess that would be laughed at in most of the games it would be in.

[aethervox]

Is because, Comrade, we (us Rooskies) steel angry that US has 'stalinium' CVs and we dontskis.

[StoneRhino]

There are a lot of bad ideas but I think the worst have to be the way the reserves are specced and the survivability of the planes, the rest can be dealt with but the survivability of the planes an Enterprise at T10 wont be doing much.

 

Do you really believe that a 13-14% hp decrease (vs Shokaku's bombers) is that game breaking?  If they do something easy like give her access to the t9 +hp bomber module she'll actually have tougher bombers than Shokaku.

 

As she is right now she is a slightly nerfed AS Lexington with 10 torpedo bombers.  Better fighters vs 2-2-2 Shokaku squadron vs squadron and better strike ability than an AS Lexington.  Can make life hell for a strike Lexington and hold it's own against an AS shokaku while having a better strike package.  If anything she is in a good starting place.  Given the module upgrade mentioned earlier she might beat out Shokaku's 2-2-2 for most versatile CV at T8.  That's not taking into account any additional buffs she gets before release.

 

Besides for all we know there might be a +/-1 mm in the works for CVs that would make this whole argument mute.

[Madwolf05]

Please keep in mind that Enterprise is still in development and may or may not be representative of how she will be upon release.

 

Trust me Niko, I don't mean any offense to you, and I completely understand it's a WIP, that's not what I'm complaining about.

 

I'm upset because the only conclusion that can be drawn from this ship is that WarGaming is either deaf to the realities of the USN CV situation, or they simply don't care.

 

Be honest with me Niko, how do you think that drop pattern for the torpedoes got out of initial testing the way it works right now? Can you tell me that anyone wouldn't see the obvious massive flaw in that drop right away? How does no one notice how poorly the planes fair at Tier 10? It seems to me very little thought or testing was done before this was released to the CCs and Super Testers. 

 

For Captains of a neglected line that has been promised changes, this is not a good sign. How do you look at the results of the first Enterprise test and have any faith that real thought is being put into how to adjust this ship line to make it work properly?

 

Also why the fudge does it retain the GOD AWFUL USN CV reload rates? That's completely inexcusable. How the crap does the Kaga get faster reloads and MORE planes? The contradiction between the Kaga, the USN CV line, and the WIP Enterprise is unbelievable.