Wreck of the Artigliere found

[vonKaiser]

If someone posted it sorry, I missed it. 

 

http://www.repubblica.it/esteri/2017/06/06/news/the_story_of_artigliere_his_wreckage_has_been_found_at_the_bottom_of_mediterranean_75_years_later-167377075/

 

Ship was discovered at a depth of 3,600 meters.  Cold water, low oxygen means it's remarkably well preserved.

 

"The 'Artigliere' was discovered last March by Paul Allen's team of oceanic explorers. Paul Allen, co-founder of Microsoft, is an underwater explorer enthusiast. "It was a real surprise", David Reams told Repubblica. He is responsible for marine operations at Vulcan, the foundation created by Paul Allen for philanthropic projects and the development of innovative technologies. Their ship-lab, the Petrel, was testing newly installed equipment. Devices that are almost sci-fi: "We had started testing the new sonar scanner when an abnormal shape appeared".

 

I'd post more info but the article does a far better job then I could hope to articulate lol

[CaptainKaitoGhost]

She would make a good premium.

[vonKaiser]

Italian DD with some history I wouldn't mind seeing it

[Phoenix_jz]

An interesting article, if a little flawed. Perhaps because it's a botched translation? I'd have to see the original article. It's cool to see they discovered her, however. Hopefully more images show up!

 

 

The Artigliere was a Soldati-class destroyer. At the time of her sinking, she was armed with two twin turrets, for a total of four 120mm/50's, as well as two triple torpedo mounts. The Battle of Cape Passero was a night action, in which four Italian destroyers and three torpedo boats, fought mainly against the light cruiser Ajax. The TBs found her first (Alcione spotting her at a range of 12 miles) and chose to engage. Btw, these were 800-ton Spica-class TBs (3x1 100mm guns, 4x1 450mm torpedo launchers).

 

About 13 minutes after the Italians TBs spotted and started closing with the cruiser, Ajax spotted two of the Italians boats, Airone and Ariel. Alcione had been able to close unnoticed off Ajax's port beam. Alcione dropped two torpedoes at a range of 2,000 yds as Ajax was challenging the other two boats, which also dropped torpedoes (Arione; Two off the port bow, Ariel; one off the starboard bow). However, Ajax's captain, after getting an improper responses from the spotted TBs, ordered flank speed and changed course, dodging the torpedoes. Airone rapidly brought her other tubes to bear, dropped another pair of fish at a range of only one thousand yards. She also opened up with her three 100mm guns with four quick broadsides, quickly scoring two detonating hits on Ajax's bridge, and another round penetrating the the belt and setting a small fire (which took three and a half hours to finally extinguish).  The other two TB's opened up as well, Alcione firing fifteen salvoes but failing to score any hits due to trying to maneuver for a second torpedo salvo, while Ariel was unfortunately the first victim of the British return fire, Ajax's 6" main guns opening up at only four thousand yards (less than 3.7 km) and shattering the bridge and hull structure of the fragile, unarmored boat, at the same time her 4" secondary guns on her portside firing at Airone (4 thousand yards). Ariel rapidly sank, most likely due to multiple hits below the waterline, and Ajax turned to port to allow all of her 6" guns to give Airone a similar treatment. Despite the TB's attempt to make smoke and disengage, Ajax still sent her 6" shells screaming into her aft at close range, immediately obliterating the aft 100mm mount, starting fires, and destroying the engines and rudder systems. Ajax then closed on the bonfire, and began raking the decks with her 12.7mm (.50 cal) MGs, and then dropped two torpedoes at point blank range. Both fish missed the conflagration, but that didn't matter as she was already sinking by her shattered stern. 

 

However, the four nearby Italian destroyers then finally arrived, although because of radio issues they came in piecemeal... and as if Ajax already being alert, and heavily outgunning them wasn't enough of an issue; the British cruiser also had radar... which negated the advantage of relative stealth the Italian would've enjoyed as they were lower-silhouette, and had fleshless ammunition, unlike the British. The destroyer Aviere made contact first, looking for a torpedo solution, and also tried opening up on the British cruiser with her guns. This wasn't a great idea, as the moon was right behind the destroyer, which silhouetted her perfectly for Ajax, who opened up at eight thousand yards with her 6" guns. Within six minutes, she scored two hits on the destroyer, on hit knocking her aft 120mm mount out of commission, and another causing large amounts of flooding forward. The destroyer broke contact and moved off with a list. The next destroyer to appear was the Geniere two minutes later, who opened fire with a few salvoes before withdrawing, as the British cruiser was moving off to the the south. 

 

Alcione had meanwhile gone in a long-winded circle in an attempt to line up for another spread, but by the time she had got to the seen her sisters were going down, and all she could do was pick up survivors.

 

Artigliere was closing in, arriving late to the party when Ajax caught her on her radar a few thousand miles to the north, positioned so as to not be visible in the moonlight from the perspective of the Italy destroyer. The destroyer was rapidly straddled, but her commander kept cool and quickly responded, engaging in a short gunnery duel with the cruiser, four 4.7" guns on eight 6" guns, unarmored destroyer on armored light cruiser, which ended predictably. The destroyer managed to get off only a single torpedo before a 6" shell slammed into the bridge and killed Carlo Margottini, the squadron commander and captain of the Artigliere. Another hit of the same caliber hit and detonated the ready ammunition for the forward 120mm guns, sparking a huge blaze on the destroyer. However, Artigliere also gave as good as she got, striking Ajax repeatedly. Her hits knocked out a 4" mount, damaged the bridge, and also put her radar out of action. However, the Ajax was not done yet and punished the destroyer, a further three 6" shells hitting her forward engine room, and another taking out her central boiler. Ajax finally left the destroyer to it's fate, moving off to the east.

 

The last Italian destroyer, Camica Nera, would show up just as Ajax was turning to head east, and opened fire at five thousand yards. ​Ajax responded in kind, but lacking the spotting advantage, especially as the lack of fleshless powder was starting to make it's effects felt, she broke off the action and moved to find the safety of the rest of the cruiser squadron. The Camica Nera at first gave chase, but then decided against it and went to the aid of the heavily damaged Artigliere. With mammoth effort, the fires were put out, but the boilers wouldn't cooperate (one was initially brought online, but it failed an hour later). At 0500 hours Camica Nera began to tow the crippled destroyer, but about two hours later they were discovered by a British flying boat. And hour and a half after that, three British cruisers appeared, the heavy cruiser York, and the light cruisers Gloucester and Liverpool. As sticking by a crippled is not worth loosing an undamaged destroyer, Camica Nera detached the tow and made good her escape. Meanwhile, York attempted to finish off the stricken Artigliere, but after repeatedly missing the drifting hull with her 8" guns, she shifted to using torpedoes, hitting the destroyer and blowing her out of the water in a colorful display of overkill.

 

Ironically enough, Camica Nera would be renamed Artigliere after the 1943 armistice (Having a ship being named after the Blackshirts was a no-no for the free fleet). York would be struck down seven months later by Italian MAS boats off Crete, where ​Gloucester would also succumb to Axis air strikes. Liverpool, meanwhile, would be torpedoed a few months later by a Sparviero, and lose her bow. It would be repaired, but another Sparviero would cripple her during Operation Harpoon, knocking her out of the war for good. The third member of the unfortunate Gloucester-class was the Manchester, who would be sunk by two Italian MTB's during Operation Pedestal, the largest kill by MTB's of the war.

 

 

 

Anyways.... WG, Ajax for British cruiser premium? I'll take her at tier V without smoke and special AP! Seriously, although there were plenty of errors on the Italians part that I could go into detail about that allowed Ajax to survive, it was in no small part due to the excellent way Captain McCarthy handled his ship. It'd be cool to seem him as a heroic captain, perhaps with a bonus to the 'Vigilance' skill?

 

 

Artigliere would make a cool premium, perhaps tier VI as opposed to tier VII for the rest of the Soldati-class destroyers, as she was sunk before most of them were given their fifth 120mm mount? It'd be cool to see those big red 'AR' on the bows of the ship!

 

Then again, she's one of many Italian destroyers that went down with guns blazing... there's also Folgore (only went down after firing every last shell, torpedo, and bullet on the ship), and Espero (1v5'd a British cruiser squadron to save the rest of her convoy, fighting the five cruisers for over three hours before finally being sunk. The action had the disproportionate effect of cancelling two Malta convoys, as the action had consumed 86% of all British 6" shells in the theater, some 5000 rounds being fired at the old destroyer). For any of these ships to come as a premium, it'd be cool to see them with a heroic captain... for Folgore, some kind of better 'Last Stand,' of Espero perhaps some kind of (useful) 'Incoming Fire Alert'? I'm not sure what you'd give Artigliere's captain... maybe a better 'Adrenaline Rush?'

 

 

[SinqueScheiDeMona]

I'm leery of these legendary commanders as they become simply mandatory to even the field with others. Nothing legendary about them after that.

 

 

[WolfofWarship]

I can't believe how good it looks, definitely doesn't look like it has been done there for so long!

 

Sunken ships both fancinate me and terrify me. They look so awesome but I'm always aware of how many poor souls lost their lives fighting to keep it afloat. 

 

 

[Sparviero]

Useless trivia. The ship name for the Comandanti Medaglie d'Oro class may be named after the captain of the Artigliere.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlo_Margottini

http://www.marina.difesa.it/storiacultura/storia/almanacco/Pagine/ABCD/cte_margottini.aspx

Quote

Il cacciatorpediniere Comandante Margottini era l'unità capoclasse, denominata "Comandanti Medaglie d'Oro", di 20 unità, assieme alle gemelle Comandante Baroni (O.T.O. - Livorno), Comandante Borsini (O.T.O. - Livorno), Comandante Botti (C.R.D.A. - Monfalcone), Comandante Casana (C.N.R. - Ancona), Comandante Corsi (C.R.D.A. - Monfalcone), Comandante De Cristofaro (Cantieri del Tirreno - Riva Trigoso), Comandante Dell'Anno (C.N.R. - Ancona), Comandante Esposito (C.R.D.A. - Monfalcone), Comandante Fiorelli (C.R.D.A. - Monfalcone), Comandante Fontana (O.T.O. - Livorno), Comandante Giannattasio (C.R.D.A. - Monfalcone), Comandante Giobbe (Cantieri del Tirreno - Riva Trigoso), Comandante Giorgis (Cantieri del Tirreno - Riva Trigoso), Comandante Milano (C.R.D.A. - Monfalcone), Comandante Moccagatta (O.T.O. - Livorno), Comandante Novaro (C.R.D.A. - Monfalcone), Comandante Rodocanacchi (O.T.O. - Livorno), Comandante Ruta (C.R.D.A. - Monfalcone) e Comandante Toscano (Cantieri del Tirreno - Riva Trigoso).

Avrebbero dovuto rappresentare un notevole potensiamento della classe Soldati, più robusti, meglio armati e con migliori qualità marine. Nessuno di questi caccia fu terminato o varato tranne il Margottini che fu varato dai tedeschi nel 1944. Undici unità non furono mai impostate.

 

[Edselman]

A lot of reviving dead threads lately

I went through reading the article assuming it was new.

[DonKarnage2]

On 7/6/2017 at 4:34 AM, WolfofWarship said:

I can't believe how good it looks, definitely doesn't look like it has been done there for so long!

 

Sunken ships both fancinate me and terrify me. They look so awesome but I'm always aware of how many poor souls lost their lives fighting to keep it afloat. 

 

 

Hoping to dive on the Oriskany this summer. Nobody died there, it was sunk as an artificial reef.

[WolfofWarship]

1 hour ago, DonKarnage2 said:

Hoping to dive on the Oriskany this summer. Nobody died there, it was sunk as an artificial reef.

That is pretty cool Don! I'd ask you to take photos but, can you take shots underwater with anything other than super expensive equipment? 

[DonKarnage2]

1 hour ago, WolfofWarship said:

That is pretty cool Don! I'd ask you to take photos but, can you take shots underwater with anything other than super expensive equipment? 

I had a camera case at one point that was waterproof. It was SUPER CHEAP though and broke, but it did work. Most of the cheapest waterproof cameras, which are surprisingly affordable, are only waterproof to 15-30 meters (about a max of 100 feet). That would get me to the conning tower of Oriskany but not to the flight deck. For that, I'd need a dive camera good to 50 meters, minimum. But, 100 meters would be better. I don't have such a camera. It's not just the water, but water pressure that also has to be considered. However, I do have a friend who is a professional photographer and he might have one or at least know how to get one on the cheap. If I can get one, and if I get the time to make the trip this year, I will take photos.

I'd also like to try and dive the USS Mullinix at some point. It was sunk as a target ship in the 90's not too far from St. Croix and Puerto Rico. Dad served on the Mux, so I'd like to see it. Was a Forrest Sherman-Class Destroyer. I'm also not sure on the depth of the Mux's wreck either.

[WolfofWarship]

22 hours ago, DonKarnage2 said:

I had a camera case at one point that was waterproof. It was SUPER CHEAP though and broke, but it did work. Most of the cheapest waterproof cameras, which are surprisingly affordable, are only waterproof to 15-30 meters (about a max of 100 feet). That would get me to the conning tower of Oriskany but not to the flight deck. For that, I'd need a dive camera good to 50 meters, minimum. But, 100 meters would be better. I don't have such a camera. It's not just the water, but water pressure that also has to be considered. However, I do have a friend who is a professional photographer and he might have one or at least know how to get one on the cheap. If I can get one, and if I get the time to make the trip this year, I will take photos.

I'd also like to try and dive the USS Mullinix at some point. It was sunk as a target ship in the 90's not too far from St. Croix and Puerto Rico. Dad served on the Mux, so I'd like to see it. Was a Forrest Sherman-Class Destroyer. I'm also not sure on the depth of the Mux's wreck either.

It must be an incredible experience. I just started open water swimming myself but so far have only roamed a few reservoirs. I can't image how amazing it would be to see a sunken ship up close. I think I would get very choked up at the sight