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Cirdane

Line trait for RN Bbs "professionalism"

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Well with all the "hoodness" flowing the last few days I see many comments about what trait the RN BBS line could have so The one I could see is something representing the history of professionalism the RN expressed in its operations. During WW2 RN ships often out fought, out mauve red ,our sailed, or even expressed supior logistics to their opponents. British designs were often first out and matched or passed by opponents seeking an edge. 

 

      Ways to express this are , higher rof, sharper turning, better repair (Ala warspite), reduced chance of fire. 

 

   Please add any idea for traits you have.

 

 

 

 

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Unprofessionalness.  Sir David Beatty royally screwed up at Jutland, and had to forge signatures and engage in a smear campaign to keep his name clear from the controversy.  Hardly professional.

Not only was ship safety not being followed, the sheer embarrassment of it meant it had to be covered up, since the Admiralty in their pride couldn't admit to the mistake.  The RN should be getting debuffs, not buffs for their "professionalism".

Edited by Sventex

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Unprofessionalness.  Sir David Beatty royally screwed up at Jutland, and had to forge signatures and engage in a smear campaign to keep his name clear from the controversy.  Hardly professional.

Not only was ship safety not being followed, the sheer embarrassment of it meant it had to be covered up, since the Admiralty in their pride couldn't admit to the mistake.  The RN should be getting debuffs, not buffs for their "professionalism".

Watched a really good documentary about this the other day where they're were also trying to find the exact locations of a lot of the sunken ships and trying to prove theories about the battle and see if Beatty was telling the truth.

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BBs are overpowered.

 

Why make the problem worse?

How could an idea as general and undefined as this be rubber stamped OP? I think your issues are showing.

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How could an idea as general and undefined as this be rubber stamped OP? I think your issues are showing.

 

 

The voices in my head are none of your concern.

 

 

And it can be stamped as OP because you're adding further buffs to a ship type that doesn't need them. More BB buffs means BBs as a result are even more OP.

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Unprofessionalness.  Sir David Beatty royally screwed up at Jutland, and had to forge signatures and engage in a smear campaign to keep his name clear from the controversy.  Hardly professional.

Not only was ship safety not being followed, the sheer embarrassment of it meant it had to be covered up, since the Admiralty in their pride couldn't admit to the mistake.  The RN should be getting debuffs, not buffs for their "professionalism".

Not in any way would I consider my self an expert but didn't Beatty cross the T on the German fleet twice?. Beatty job was #1 don't loose #2. Destroy the German fleet. The idea is called perfesionalism not perfection it doesn't mean they never made mistakes.

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The voices in my head are none of your concern.

 

 

And it can be stamped as OP because you're adding further buffs to a ship type that doesn't need them. More BB buffs means BBs as a result are even more OP.

Actually because they were often first out many British ships were either on par or subpar with the later ships built to match them. IF WG went this way one way to balance the line. Would be to use the fact the the British fleet is one of the most professional in history.

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Actually because they were often first out many British ships were either on par or subpar with the later ships built to match them. IF WG went this way one way to balance the line. Would be to use the fact the the British fleet is one of the most professional in history.

 

 

Because being first means they're automatically better, right?

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Not in any way would I consider my self an expert but didn't Beatty cross the T on the German fleet twice?. Beatty job was #1 don't loose #2. Destroy the German fleet. The idea is called perfesionalism not perfection it doesn't mean they never made mistakes.

 

Uhh, I don't think Beatty's job was to destroy the German Fleet, his job was to rendezvous with the Grand Fleet and scout for the fleet.  If Beatty did cross the Hipper's fleet T, it was a moot point, because he engage Hipper's squadron on a parallel course that gave him poor visibility, and if he had cross the T of Scheer's High Seas Fleet, it was even more a moot point because he let himself be ambushed and was heavily outnumbered.  If anything, it was part of Beatty's escape maneuvers.  In his incompetence, he left the 5th Battle Squadron behind, and they were badly damaged, and he failed to report the position of the German fleet, thus failing in his duties.  Beatty would later forge documents to clear his name of his incompetence at Jutland.

Edited by Sventex
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Because being first means they're automatically better, right?

No it often ment they were inferior to ships built after them. The tier system used in wows could often mean RN ships could face ships built after they set the mark and later built ship took advantage of the lessons learned and produced improved versions of the RN original ie dreadnought was surpassed within just a few years of being launched 

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Uhh, I don't think Beatty's job was to destroy the German Fleet, his job was to rendezvous with the Grand Fleet and scout for the fleet.  If Beatty did cross the Hipper's fleet T, it was a moot point, because he engage Hipper's squadron on a parallel course that gave him poor visibility, and if he had cross the T of Scheer's High Seas Fleet, it was even more a moot point because he let himself be ambushed and was heavily outnumbered.  If anything, it was part of Beatty's escape maneuvers.  In his incompetence, he left the 5th Battle Squadron behind, and they were badly damaged, and he failed to report to position of the German fleet, thus failing in his duties.  Beatty would later forge documents to clear his name of his incompetence at Jutland.

Ah right it was Adm Jellicoe I was thinking of not Beatty yes Beatty did boob it up badly. ,but over all the large supply of competent and talented officers was a major strength of the RN

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Ah right it was Adm Jellicoe I was thinking of not Beatty yes Beatty did boob it up badly. ,but over all the large supply of competent and talented officers was a major strength of the RN

 

No...Their "professionalism" was a glaring weakness of the RN.  At Jutland, with the German fleet damaged and boxed in, they were allowed to escape despite being spotted, because no RN captain was willing to take initiative.  In both world wars, the KM managed to do more with less because of their officers, while the RN had to rely too often on their superior numbers for survival. 

 

Just look at what happened to HMS Glorious.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Glorious

And see an example of incredible incompetence of a Royal Navy Captain costing the Royal Naval of a CV over a petty feud.

Beatty was incredibility incompetent at Jutland, and yet he still ascended to First Sea Lord.  Churchill as First Lord of the Admirality, whom despite knowing the Gallipoli invasion would fail, send the invasion force anyway.

Edited by Sventex

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Well, seems professionalism is a bridge too far. But perhaps British BBs could be a tier lower than they otherwise would be to represent that they were often the innovative design leaders (eg, first dreadnought, aircraft carrier, etc). 

 

Surely, that would be less controversial!!

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Because being first means they're automatically better, right?

 

I believe the point he is making in the opening post, and the one you quoted, is that yes, the RN ships would be slightly lacking on the tech end because there ships were first, and then improved on by the others. But, things that could be determined by the crews ability could be buffed to compensate for the ship itself possibly lacking, such as rate of fire on all weapons that require shell loading (so generally not MG's and I think some auto cannons), ship repair/heal, Damage control (lower cool down?), faster flooding repair/fire extinguishing, lower chance of fire, even possibly accuracy. Rudder shift time is a bit more of a debatable thing.

 

In which case, I find the concept interesting. Ships that may end up slightly lacking in tech and all because the ship was built and everyone built to beat it but have stats/abilities/traits that are cancelling it out based on the abilities of the crew (as professionalism is somewhat open to interpretation ala the debate were having over Jutland) and their training. It would to say the least be a unique flavour.

 

Also, of all the classes I'd say BB's is argualy one of the more balanced ones and that it's issues with other classes, or bad players, that make them seem OP. CV's are out right broken. They can decimate a BB, assuming it's AA doesn't decimate it's planes, but are too OP in some areas and UP in others. Cruisers can verge into OP because unless they give an angle a BB can score a citadel, they have some mobility to dodge or just take over pens, and rate of fire that, except for the AP only UK ships, literally burn a BB down. And DD's will wreck most any BB that forgets to maneuver or lets them in to torp range for those with shorter torp ranges. But while DD's are in an odd place till hey reduce bloom on them to give them some stealth back, IJN and German DD's can still be pretty efficient BB killers as they can stealth torp tier 5 and up.

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I believe the point he is making in the opening post, and the one you quoted, is that yes, the RN ships would be slightly lacking on the tech end because there ships were first, and then improved on by the others. But, things that could be determined by the crews ability could be buffed to compensate for the ship itself possibly lacking, such as rate of fire on all weapons that require shell loading (so generally not MG's and I think some auto cannons), ship repair/heal, Damage control (lower cool down?), faster flooding repair/fire extinguishing, lower chance of fire, even possibly accuracy. Rudder shift time is a bit more of a debatable thing.

 

In which case, I find the concept interesting. Ships that may end up slightly lacking in tech and all because the ship was built and everyone built to beat it but have stats/abilities/traits that are cancelling it out based on the abilities of the crew (as professionalism is somewhat open to interpretation ala the debate were having over Jutland) and their training. It would to say the least be a unique flavour.

 

 

 

"Slightly lacking" in reality is "actually balanced," something this game desperately struggles with these days.

 

Why do people insist on ruining perfectly balanced lines with more OP "unique flavors"? I'm taking "unique flavor" to be just a buzzword for "Gimmick".

 

Look, I get that people enjoy BBs a lot, because "big guns, boom, lulz," but that doesn't change the fact that BATTLESHIPS RUIN EVERYTHING.

 

They're fun to play, but they ruin everything in their current state.

 

Their radar ruined stealth, their AA ruined CVs, and Arizona's red turrets ruined Christmas.

Edited by Zero_Kelvin

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Edited by _Caliph_

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"Slightly lacking" in reality is "actually balanced," something this game desperately struggles with these days.

 

Why do people insist on ruining perfectly balanced lines with more OP "unique flavors"? I'm taking "unique flavor" to be just a buzzword for "Gimmick".

 

Look, I get that people enjoy BBs a lot, because "big guns, boom, lulz," but that doesn't change the fact that BATTLESHIPS RUIN EVERYTHING.

 

They're fun to play, but they ruin everything in their current state.

 

Their radar ruined stealth, their AA ruined CVs, and Arizona's red turrets ruined Christmas.

Only 1 BB has radar. And she came long after radar was already in the game.

 

Cruiser AA will chew up more planes than BB AA will, so how did BB AA ruin CVs?

 

How did AZ's red turret tops ruin Christmas?

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BBs are overpowered.

 

Why make the problem worse?

 

So OP that outside of Gift BBs and known OP premiums (The RU BB) none of them actually have great W/Rs.

 

DDs do though 

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Not in any way would I consider my self an expert but didn't Beatty cross the T on the German fleet twice?. Beatty job was #1 don't loose #2. Destroy the German fleet. The idea is called perfesionalism not perfection it doesn't mean they never made mistakes.

 

Jellicoe crossed the T twice.

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Only 1 BB has radar. And she came long after radar was already in the game.

 

Cruiser AA will chew up more planes than BB AA will, so how did BB AA ruin CVs?

 

How did AZ's red turret tops ruin Christmas?

 

 

Putting radar on a battleship is OP period. Should not be there.

 

Battleships can one shot cruisers, so cruiser AA might as well not exist until battleship AA is rightfully nerfed into oblivion.

 

And they just had to put red on a BATTLESHIP. Now every time I see red, all I can think is the Arizona, rather than the beautiful festivities of the holidays.

 

And they just had to put Arizona on sale this past Christmas just to torture me further.

 

Battleships just need to go away, nobody will miss them and we'll be better off without them.

 

Remove them. Incite the riot, kill the phoenix, burn the rainbow.

 

Edited by Zero_Kelvin

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Putting radar on a battleship is OP period. Should not be there.

 

Battleships can one shot cruisers, so cruiser AA might as well not exist until battleship AA is rightfully nerfed into oblivion.

 

And they just had to put red on a BATTLESHIP. Now every time I see red, all I can think is the Arizona, rather than the beautiful festivities of the holidays.

 

And they just had to put Arizona on sale this past Christmas just to torture me further.

 

Battleships just need to go away, nobody will miss them and we'll be better off without them.

 

A DD has radar as well.

 

And Arizona had red turret tops. There's a reason she has them in game.

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