Premium Cruiser Tone?

[Admiral_Thrawn_1]

Was looking though ships on the WOWs Wiki and noticed an IJN Cruiser in there called Tone and it says testing has been suspended until further notice. Is that because they have it rebalance it or something, has there been any word on if it will be released any time in the near future because its armor and weapon stats look nice.

 

[SireneRacker]

I have heard rumors that she broke the game, literally, causing the client to crash when being in a match.

[Lert]

It's on hold until they figure out how to do a CV/CA hybrid properly.

[SergeantHop]

It's a hybrid cruiser. All four of her turrets are forward of the superstructure, and the entire aft section of the ship is for seaplanes. 

 

As it stands, there's no reason to include the ship in the game other than it's different. When WG figures out how to make the hybrid ship design relevant, she will be worked into the game.

[Battlecruiser_Siegfried]

It's a hybrid cruiser. All four of her turrets are forward of the superstructure, and the entire aft section of the ship is for seaplanes. 

 

As it stands, there's no reason to include the ship in the game other than it's different. When WG figures out how to make the hybrid ship design relevant, she will be worked into the game.

 

By that reasoning, there's no need to include any new ship in the game. 

 

I expect we'll see Tone (and possibly Ise/Hyuga) sometime after the carrier rework. You're not going to introduce hybrids (or aircraft scouting cruisers, which is what Tone actually was; she wasn't a hybrid anything) to a game that can't even figure out what it wants from standard CVs.

[SergeantHop]

 

By that reasoning, there's no need to include any new ship in the game. 

 

I expect we'll see Tone (and possibly Ise/Hyuga) sometime after the carrier rework. You're not going to introduce hybrids (or aircraft scouting cruisers, which is what Tone actually was; she wasn't a hybrid anything) to a game that can't even figure out what it wants from standard CVs.

 

There wouldn't be anything special about the ship, other than it's less usable than the Myoko.

 

I'm all for putting her in the game, but the whole point of the ship is to be a hybrid cruiser. That doesn't exist yet, so they won't release her.

[Battlecruiser_Siegfried]

 

There wouldn't be anything special about the ship, other than it's less usable than the Myoko.

 

Is there something special about Prinz Eugen? Is there something special about Mutsu? Honestly, is there something special about Tirpitz? The argument that a ship has to bring something unique to the game ignores the fact that there are very few outstanding, extraordinary examples of one-off ships in WoWs to begin with. What you should care about is whether or not a boat performs; whether or not it's good - not that it's some kind of special flower.  

[Admiral_Thrawn_1]

I just see a heavy cruiser with decent AA and main guns lol, for now they could just have her be normal cruiser with spotter planes since they have spotter plane mechanics down.

So many cruisers in the game are Light Cruisers that any Heavy Cruiser would be welcome addition I would say lol.

[Battlecruiser_Siegfried]

I just see a heavy cruiser with decent AA and main guns lol, for now they could just have her be normal cruiser with spotter planes since they have spotter plane mechanics down.

So many cruisers in the game are Light Cruisers that any Heavy Cruiser would be welcome addition I would say lol.

 

Tone also had a very, very small magazine for a ship her size - because the main armament was all clustered together, it really lessened the vulnerability. I think she'd be a great tier 7... or tier 8 if they could figure out some way to convert her aircraft into a-historical defenses somehow. 

[Tzarevitch]

 

Is there something special about Prinz Eugen? Is there something special about Mutsu? Honestly, is there something special about Tirpitz? The argument that a ship has to bring something unique to the game ignores the fact that there are very few outstanding, extraordinary examples of one-off ships in WoWs to begin with. What you should care about is whether or not a boat performs; whether or not it's good - not that it's some kind of special flower.  

 

​The problem with the Tones is they don't work properly in the game right now. The game interface doesn't allow for acting as a gunship AND controlling planes. Without that she is a big heavy cruiser with only 8 guns in a bad turret layout and can launch float planes. Every Japanese CA from Myoko on up does the same thing but a lot better. Some people are fine with that just for the history of the ship, but that's not enough for them to release it into the game. That would be a waste of a programming asset without some decent assurance that people will buy it and it will be effective in some role. Prinz Eugen is special because she was famous. Mutsu is special because she is the only T6 BB with torpedoes and 16" guns. Tirpitz was famous historically AND she was the first BB in the game with torpedoes. Eugen was a poor decision on Wargaming's part in my opinion because she isn't really special for anything other than her name, but she is functionally no worse than an Admiral Hipper. , The others all have roles and playstyles that they serve. Tone has none of that AND isn't even functional in the game interface as it exists. It will stay on the shelf until they can find a way for her to work at least vaguely like the real ship did and provide some value to the game.   

[Admiral_Thrawn_1]

 

​The problem with the Tones is they don't work properly in the game right now. The game interface doesn't allow for acting as a gunship AND controlling planes. Without that she is a big heavy cruiser with only 8 guns in a bad turret layout and can launch float planes. Every Japanese CA from Myoko on up does the same thing but a lot better. Some people are fine with that just for the history of the ship, but that's not enough for them to release it into the game. That would be a waste of a programming asset without some decent assurance that people will buy it and it will be effective in some role. Prinz Eugen is special because she was famous. Mutsu is special because she is the only T6 BB with torpedoes and 16" guns. Tirpitz was famous historically AND she was the first BB in the game with torpedoes. Eugen was a poor decision on Wargaming's part in my opinion because she isn't really special for anything other than her name, but she is functionally no worse than an Admiral Hipper. , The others all have roles and playstyles that they serve. Tone has none of that AND isn't even functional in the game interface as it exists. It will stay on the shelf until they can find a way for her to work at least vaguely like the real ship did and provide some value to the game.   

 

then don't control the planes, just give her catapult fighters with either full squadron of them or relatively fast cooldown on the single fighter consumable and problem solved.

Also are we all talking about the same IJN tier 7 premium Cruiser Tone? Because no mention of aircraft on her, just good stats for heavy cruiser.

[GhostSwordsman]

Hmm... I was just thinking, Wargaming appears to be trying out super small strike squadron sizes with Kaga(based on the leaked stats and loadouts). I'm wondering if they'll use that to give Tone the capability to use small DB squads along with spotter planes and float 'fighters' if it's successful.

[Tzarevitch]

 

Tone also had a very, very small magazine for a ship her size - because the main armament was all clustered together, it really lessened the vulnerability. I think she'd be a great tier 7... or tier 8 if they could figure out some way to convert her aircraft into a-historical defenses somehow. 

 

​That is exactly what people have been saying. Her only real-world special ability doesn't translate into the game right now. Unless and until they can find a way to give her one, she will never be released. Also, her historical aircraft had nothing to do with defense. She and Chikuma were hybrid scoutplane tenders to provide scouting services for cruiser squadrons. They did not do anything different from any other IJN CA in terms of float planes other than carry more of them. Cruisers in game can already keep floatplanes up for a long time and launch 2 of them with inexpensive captain skills. They would have to figure out some special role for them that is different from what already exists in better gunboats or there is no purpose to releasing her. AS she stands right now, she is barely a T7, she is nowhere near Tier 8. She has less combat capability than Myoko which was her ancestor by 3 generations.  

[KyourakuShunsui]

And Wargaming said they would implement multiple turrets in World of Tanks. I wouldn't expect the Tone any time in the near future if ever.

[Battlecruiser_Siegfried]

 

​That is exactly what people have been saying. Her only real-world special ability doesn't translate into the game right now. Unless and until they can find a way to give her one, she will never be released. Also, her historical aircraft had nothing to do with defense. She and Chikuma were hybrid scoutplane tenders to provide scouting services for cruiser squadrons. They did not do anything different from any other IJN CA in terms of float planes other than carry more of them. Cruisers in game can already keep floatplanes up for a long time and launch 2 of them with inexpensive captain skills. They would have to figure out some special role for them that is different from what already exists in better gunboats or there is no purpose to releasing her. AS she stands right now, she is barely a T7, she is nowhere near Tier 8. She has less combat capability than Myoko which was her ancestor by 3 generations.  

 

What is with people on these forums? I said a-historical, also known as ahistorical - as in, with no basis or foundation in history as it happened. Jesus. 

 

Also, I have no idea where you're coming from with 'barely a tier 7' - bare-table, with no aircraft whatsoever, Tone is more than a match for an Admiral Hipper. She's faster, carries the exact same number of guns, possesses a thicker belt, has more AA, and far better torpedoes. Please feel free to justify yourself.

[CaptainMrEpic]

She might be coming in the future, but when she does I'm getting her I like all guns in the front.

[Tzarevitch]

Hmm... I was just thinking, Wargaming appears to be trying out super small strike squadron sizes with Kaga(based on the leaked stats and loadouts). I'm wondering if they'll use that to give Tone the capability to use small DB squads along with spotter planes and float 'fighters' if it's successful.

 

​People seem to be misunderstanding what Tone and Chikuma were. They were cruiser-floatplane tenders. They carried floatplane scouts so they could centralize scouting resources for the fleet they were attached to. They were not hybrid cruiser-carriers. The float planes have light self-defense gun armaments and could also carry a couple of bombs if necessary but that does not make them fighters or bombers. Using them in that role usually got them slaughtered. Each one carried five planes total.

 

Take Myoko, remove its #3 turret, place #4 and #5 right behind #1 and #2, and fill the space in the back with floatplane launch rails, and you have Tone.

[Seraphil]

 

​People seem to be misunderstanding what Tone and Chikuma were. They were cruiser-floatplane tenders. They carried floatplane scouts so they could centralize scouting resources for the fleet they were attached to. They were not hybrid cruiser-carriers. The float planes have light self-defense gun armaments and could also carry a couple of bombs if necessary but that does not make them fighters or bombers. Using them in that role usually got them slaughtered. Each one carried five planes total.

 

Take Myoko, remove its #3 turret, place #4 and #5 right behind #1 and #2, and fill the space in the back with floatplane launch rails, and you have Tone.

 

I presume the reason people want a catapult fighter carrier Tone is because Wargaming gave ships the ability to carry ahistorical catapult fighters instead of reconnaissance floatplanes in the first place.

[Battlecruiser_Siegfried]

 

​People seem to be misunderstanding what Tone and Chikuma were. They were cruiser-floatplane tenders. They carried floatplane scouts so they could centralize scouting resources for the fleet they were attached to. They were not hybrid cruiser-carriers. The float planes have light self-defense gun armaments and could also carry a couple of bombs if necessary but that does not make them fighters or bombers. Using them in that role usually got them slaughtered. Each one carried five planes total.

 

Take Myoko, remove its #3 turret, place #4 and #5 right behind #1 and #2, and fill the space in the back with floatplane launch rails, and you have Tone.

 

That doesn't negate the fact that they were powerful cruisers in their own right. Because you lop a turret off of IJN Maya and outfit her with better AA, does that somehow no longer make her a heavy cruiser? Yes, the Japanese cruisers carried scout planes - they all did. That is because the Japanese carriers didn't have designated scout forces on-board - those duties were dropped to the escorting cruiser. It was a stupid doctrine, but that's how it worked for their military. But to argue that Tone and Chikuma were just float plane tenders makes it obvious that you're doing nothing but trying to denigrate the ships in the eyes of the uninformed. Hyperbole will not score you points against people who know what the hell they're talking about.

[GhostSwordsman]

 

​People seem to be misunderstanding what Tone and Chikuma were. They were cruiser-floatplane tenders. They carried floatplane scouts so they could centralize scouting resources for the fleet they were attached to. They were not hybrid cruiser-carriers. The float planes have light self-defense gun armaments and could also carry a couple of bombs if necessary but that does not make them fighters or bombers. Using them in that role usually got them slaughtered. Each one carried five planes total.

 

Take Myoko, remove its #3 turret, place #4 and #5 right behind #1 and #2, and fill the space in the back with floatplane launch rails, and you have Tone.

 

I fully understand what Tone was historically, but that won't cut it from a gameplay standpoint, otherwise, we'd have Tone already with a larger than normal float plane compliment and the ability to send out more than two planes at once.

[Battlecruiser_Siegfried]

 

I presume the reason people want a catapult fighter carrier Tone is because Wargaming gave ships the ability to carry ahistorical catapult fighters instead of reconnaissance floatplanes in the first place.

 

This. Plus the fact that we can't control any scout planes. If the maps were bigger, and scouts could be directed, things would obviously be very different - nobody would be calling for Tone and Chikuma to mount fighters. But that's not the game we got. I frankly think having an automated squadron of fighters circle the cruiser in much the same way as a lone catapult fighter would would be quite a powerful timed ability.

[Tzarevitch]

 

What is with people on these forums? I said a-historical, also known as ahistorical - as in, with no basis or foundation in history as it happened. Jesus. 

 

Also, I have no idea where you're coming from with 'barely a tier 7' - bare-table, with no aircraft whatsoever, Tone is more than a match for an Admiral Hipper. She's faster, carries the exact same number of guns, possesses a thicker belt, has more AA, and far better torpedoes. Please feel free to justify yourself.

 

​It's basically a Myoko or Atago with one fewer turret and more floatplanes, which have no real game combat value. How does that get to T8?

[Tzarevitch]

 

I fully understand what Tone was historically, but that won't cut it from a gameplay standpoint, otherwise, we'd have Tone already with a larger than normal float plane compliment and the ability to send out more than two planes at once.

 

​Exactly. And that's not enough for them to release the ship. Each ship they make is a programming asset. They want them to generate revenue. They won't release her until they come up with something to make Tone different enough from say, Myoko, to put her in. Right now she is a Myoko with 1 fewer turret.

[Battlecruiser_Siegfried]

 

​It's basically a Myoko or Atago with one fewer turret and more floatplanes, which have no real game combat value. How does that get to T8?

 

Please explain to me how Hipper is a tier 8 by those standards. Please. Please tell me how it's stronger than Tone. Other than about 1,500 tons, where is the advantage?

[crzyhawk]

ROF.

 

Tone should be a T7.