It's time to de-gimmick everything, and I mean everything

[31KnotBurke]

 

 

Hey guys:

 

I'm really looking forward to French cruisers, but all the discussion has me very concerned. Speed boost seems highly underwhelming and the ships seem like dogs. With that in mind, I think it's time to discuss "de-gimmicking" everything.

 

Keep it simple. Remove smoke from cruisers. EVERY cruiser gets DFAA and hydro on the same platform(observing tier restrictions). Cat fighters (for catapult cruisers) become cat spotters, with a weak tail gun and a 0.1 sigma bonus for their duration. Radars need to be severely limited. DDs get speed boost, smoke, and short-range hydro. Spec out the ships to near-historic levels and tweak as needed. BBs are mostly OK as they are, since they mostly all have the same consumeables across the board.

 

I just think its time to level the playing field. Yes, some ships will get nerfed (I'm looking at you, smoke meta), and some buffed, but this will encourage better play and more teamwork. Ships parked in smoke pumping out 60 shells a second is just a load of crap. Speed boost on cruisers: crap. Cat FIGHTERS: crap. Only the Japanese had anything resembling a float FIGHTER.  My point is simple: anyone should be able to play their favorite country/line/ship and not have such a severe disadvantage to ships of the same class that one of forced to play something they would rather not.

 

OMG Fox the British CLs will SUCK. Really? They did fine in World War II against a variety of threats, when they worked as a task force. This game should encourage teamplay in any nations ships. Yoloing off or charging in solo in a paper cruiser should reward you with deletion.

 

(Fire-retardant suit: on)

[tcbaker777]

 

 

Hey guys:

 

I'm really looking forward to French cruisers, but all the discussion has me very concerned. Speed boost seems highly underwhelming and the ships seem like dogs. With that in mind, I think it's time to discuss "de-gimmicking" everything.

 

Keep it simple. Remove smoke from cruisers. EVERY cruiser gets DFAA and hydro on the same platform(observing tier restrictions). Cat fighters (for catapult cruisers) become cat spotters, with a weak tail gun and a 0.1 sigma bonus for their duration. Radars need to be severely limited. DDs get speed boost, smoke, and short-range hydro. Spec out the ships to near-historic levels and tweak as needed. BBs are mostly OK as they are, since they mostly all have the same consumeables across the board.

 

I just think its time to level the playing field. Yes, some ships will get nerfed (I'm looking at you, smoke meta), and some buffed, but this will encourage better play and more teamwork. Ships parked in smoke pumping out 60 shells a second is just a load of crap. Speed boost on cruisers: crap. Cat FIGHTERS: crap. Only the Japanese had anything resembling a float FIGHTER.  My point is simple: anyone should be able to play their favorite country/line/ship and not have such a severe disadvantage to ships of the same class that one of forced to play something they would rather not.

 

OMG Fox the British CLs will SUCK. Really? They did fine in World War II against a variety of threats, when they worked as a task force. This game should encourage teamplay in any nations ships. Yoloing off or charging in solo in a paper cruiser should reward you with deletion.

 

(Fire-retardant suit: on)

 

my studies say this will not end well sir, should i batten down the hatches?

[Raptor_alcor]

Yeah no, you're suggesting a complete rebuild of the game in terms of balance. Not going to happen. 

[31KnotBurke]

Yup! I ain't skereed.

[beachbronco]

Good luck with this thread.....

 

I think you would have gotten more sympathy had you gone with "Why I like cancer"

[31KnotBurke]

Yeah no, you're suggesting a complete rebuild of the game in terms of balance. Not going to happen. 

 

Rebuild in what respect? The goods are all there, just remove the excess garbage. I'm not asking for a simulator, just less of this "it has to have a gimmick to succeed" garbage.

[Francois424]

Not going to happen, but I agree.

I'd much rather have ships balanced with base stats than throwing gimmicks on them.

The occasional gimmick (ie: premiums) is good enough.

PS: Not sure removing repairs from cruisers would EVER pass, but it's starting to creep far too much in there IMHO

[renegadestatuz]

 

Rebuild in what respect? The goods are all there, just remove the excess garbage. I'm not asking for a simulator, just less of this "it has to have a gimmick to succeed" garbage.

Most of the ships in game that have gimmicks were balanced AROUND those gimmicks. Removing their gimmicks would mean having to go back and rebalance all those ships. That's what he means. Yeah, no. That would pretty much put a pause on all things and everything moving forward and bringing new lines in until they rebalanced everything.

 

Edit: I'm not saying that all ship lines moving forward should have gimmicks, because I honestly think they should just be well balanced without them.

[Raptor_alcor]

Most of the ships in game that have gimmicks were balanced AROUND those gimmicks. Removing their gimmicks would mean having to go back and rebalance all those ships. That's what he means. Yeah, no. That would pretty much put a pause on all things and everything moving forward and bringing new lines in until they rebalanced everything.

 

Very much this. 

[31KnotBurke]

Not going to happen, but I agree.

I'd much rather have ships balanced with base stats than throwing gimmicks on them.

 

The occasional gimmick (ie: premiums) is good enough.

PS: Not sure removing repairs from cruisers would EVER pass, but it's starting to creep far too much in there IMHO

Have an upvote. Agree with you on premium gimmicks.

[Macabe]

 

Spec out the ships to near-historic levels and tweak as needed

You lost me here. This is a terrible idea and would require a full rework of everything. History/realism doesnt matter. I do agree that gimmicks shouldnt be thrown at every other ship however.

[Captain_Dorja]

The idea that things would work out if people were a group isn't actually true. Your specific example of Brit Cruisers... they would be dead sluaghtered without their stupid smoke. Yes - it is stupid, but you want to talk about playing ships you like without a severe handicap... yeah Britbong CLs perma-spotted would be completely pointless. They would be the first of about 5 lines that would be best described as "Just play Soviet DDs intead" if this suggestion happened

[31KnotBurke]

Most of the ships in game that have gimmicks were balanced AROUND those gimmicks. Removing their gimmicks would mean having to go back and rebalance all those ships. That's what he means. Yeah, no. That would pretty much put a pause on all things and everything moving forward and bringing new lines in until they rebalanced everything.

 

To counterpoint: the REAL ships didn't balance around "gimmicks". Most of the ships in the game use close-to-historical models and stats. Isn't the whole beauty of World of Warships tossing a bunch of nations vessels together and see who outplays the other? In real history, these guys signed treatys to keep the balance.

[31KnotBurke]

The idea that things would work out if people were a group isn't actually true. Your specific example of Brit Cruisers... they would be dead sluaghtered without their stupid smoke. Yes - it is stupid, but you want to talk about playing ships you like without a severe handicap... yeah Britbong CLs perma-spotted would be completely pointless. They would be the first of about 5 lines that would be best described as "Just play Soviet DDs intead" if this suggestion happened

 

Patently false. I am one of the best Danae drivers on NA and she has zero smoke and zero armor. Rather than smoke, maybe reduce their concealment to just-above-DD levels. Just spitballing.

[renegadestatuz]

 

To counterpoint: the REAL ships didn't balance around "gimmicks". Most of the ships in the game use close-to-historical models and stats. Isn't the whole beauty of World of Warships tossing a bunch of nations vessels together and see who outplays the other? In real history, these guys signed treatys to keep the balance.

The point is though that this is not a sim and it's not supposed to be like real life, it's an arcade game. It's not supposed to be historically accurate. The closest it's supposed to get to historically accurate is the way ships look and somewhat their stats. And half the time the ships arent even designed historically accurate. If it was, then we would have half the ships in game that we do. And because it's an arcade game, balance will always trump historical accuracy.

[31KnotBurke]

The point is though that this is not a sim and it's not supposed to be like real life, it's an arcade game. It's not supposed to be historically accurate. The closest it's supposed to get to historically accurate is the way ships looks and somewhat their stats. And half the time the ships are r even designed historically accurate. If it was, then we would have half the ships in game that we do. And because it's an arcade game, balance will always trump historical accuracy.

 

I know. Its just frustrating. +1.

[m373x]

 

 

Hey guys:

 

I'm really looking forward to French cruisers, but all the discussion has me very concerned. Speed boost seems highly underwhelming and the ships seem like dogs. With that in mind, I think it's time to discuss "de-gimmicking" everything.

 

Keep it simple. Remove smoke from cruisers. EVERY cruiser gets DFAA and hydro on the same platform(observing tier restrictions). Cat fighters (for catapult cruisers) become cat spotters, with a weak tail gun and a 0.1 sigma bonus for their duration. Radars need to be severely limited. DDs get speed boost, smoke, and short-range hydro. Spec out the ships to near-historic levels and tweak as needed. BBs are mostly OK as they are, since they mostly all have the same consumeables across the board.

 

I just think its time to level the playing field. Yes, some ships will get nerfed (I'm looking at you, smoke meta), and some buffed, but this will encourage better play and more teamwork. Ships parked in smoke pumping out 60 shells a second is just a load of crap. Speed boost on cruisers: crap. Cat FIGHTERS: crap. Only the Japanese had anything resembling a float FIGHTER.  My point is simple: anyone should be able to play their favorite country/line/ship and not have such a severe disadvantage to ships of the same class that one of forced to play something they would rather not.

 

OMG Fox the British CLs will SUCK. Really? They did fine in World War II against a variety of threats, when they worked as a task force. This game should encourage teamplay in any nations ships. Yoloing off or charging in solo in a paper cruiser should reward you with deletion.

 

(Fire-retardant suit: on)

 

The fact that you completely ignored CVs is enough to show how bad this thread is.

[renegadestatuz]

 

I know. Its just frustrating. +1.

And I'm honestly not trying to get onto you. I also agree that most ships shouldn't have gimmicks. It's just that it would take too much time and effort to remove the gimmicks from most ships and rebalance them. It would literally put a stand still on all future line and premium and gameplay development until they were done rebalancing everything. I do believe though that future lines should not be based and balanced around gimmicks and should just be correctly and pretty well balanced by themselves.

[Raptor_alcor]

 

To counterpoint: the REAL ships didn't balance around "gimmicks". Most of the ships in the game use close-to-historical models and stats. Isn't the whole beauty of World of Warships tossing a bunch of nations vessels together and see who outplays the other? In real history, these guys signed treatys to keep the balance.

 

Counterpoint is invalid, if you want your little "EVERYTHING REAL" [edited]then how about you grow a brain, get some money and make your own SIMULATOR competator to the ARCADE world of warships. (spoilers you're wrong even with your realism example, japan broke the treaties with both the mogami and myoko class cruisers, the former was WELL beyond treaty limitations)

[31KnotBurke]

 

The fact that you completely ignored CVs is enough to show how bad this thread is.

 

CVs aren't gimmicky. They're just in a bad place, and I don't have the answer for them.

[renegadestatuz]

 

CVs are gimmicky. They're just in a bad place, and I don't have the answer for them.

WG doesn't even have an answer for them yet when it comes to balancing lol.

[RogueFlameHaze]

So basically.. make everything basically the same per gameplay so that nobody needs to grind any lines other than yo have a different flag.

[31KnotBurke]

 

Counterpoint is invalid, if you want your little "EVERYTHING REAL" [edited]then how about you grow a brain, get some money and make your own SIMULATOR competator to the ARCADE world of warships. (spoilers you're wrong even with your realism example, japan broke the treaties with both the mogami and myoko class cruisers, the former was WELL beyond treaty limitations)

 

I never said I wanted "real", but I do want a level playing field. Yes, the Japanese broke the treaty, but their gimmick was speed and torpedoes, and along came the Americans and clubbed their poor AA with planes (after being clubbed hard by these ships early).

[renegadestatuz]

So basically.. make everything basically the same per gameplay so that nobody needs to grind any lines other than yo have a different flag.

I remember when the french autoloaders came to tanks and a chunk of players went bonkers crying they weren't fair and just about demanded this happen lol.

[Zim_Xero]

 

 

Hey guys:

 

I'm really looking forward to French cruisers, but all the discussion has me very concerned. Speed boost seems highly underwhelming and the ships seem like dogs. With that in mind, I think it's time to discuss "de-gimmicking" everything.

 

Keep it simple. Remove smoke from cruisers. EVERY cruiser gets DFAA and hydro on the same platform(observing tier restrictions). Cat fighters (for catapult cruisers) become cat spotters, with a weak tail gun and a 0.1 sigma bonus for their duration. Radars need to be severely limited. DDs get speed boost, smoke, and short-range hydro. Spec out the ships to near-historic levels and tweak as needed. BBs are mostly OK as they are, since they mostly all have the same consumeables across the board.

 

I just think its time to level the playing field. Yes, some ships will get nerfed (I'm looking at you, smoke meta), and some buffed, but this will encourage better play and more teamwork. Ships parked in smoke pumping out 60 shells a second is just a load of crap. Speed boost on cruisers: crap. Cat FIGHTERS: crap. Only the Japanese had anything resembling a float FIGHTER.  My point is simple: anyone should be able to play their favorite country/line/ship and not have such a severe disadvantage to ships of the same class that one of forced to play something they would rather not.

 

OMG Fox the British CLs will SUCK. Really? They did fine in World War II against a variety of threats, when they worked as a task force. This game should encourage teamplay in any nations ships. Yoloing off or charging in solo in a paper cruiser should reward you with deletion.

 

(Fire-retardant suit: on)

 

Since you demand it.  Anything you say.  To hell with other players.  By the way... you DO realize that ships ARE balanced dont you?