Crosys

For events that occurred on Saturday, March 18, 2017

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Latina? Girls?

 

In Spanish, "Latina" do refers to feminine concepts, but not always refering to a female connotation. For example, Fuerza Armada Latina de Combate Organizado does not refer to female players, but a whole community of latin people.

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Whose responsibility is it to know what time the matches start? If you are in another country, how do you know what time 9pm eastern standard time is? 

 

So, if I understand this correctly. They voluntarily signed up for a free tournament (other than time to compete) that stated clearly the start times and dates for each battle including a online schedule then cry about not getting told it was time to compete? :sceptic: Each clan is responsible to perform their own research on how the rules previously set effect them and plan accordingly. Whats next, The clan you face in the next battle is too good and should be in a different league? 

 

The Supremacy Staff does a quality job on a high level for free to help the community have fun. I am thankful for their efforts and any criticism or suggestions i have will be share with them respectfully in private.  


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Ducati, then what would you suggest so that both sides gain something? I ca see you have an answer for everything


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Had we said EST, we would have made an announcement that we were switching to EDT or vice versa. We stated that matches will be played at whatever the time is on the east coast of the US hence just listing "ET" as per the pre-season meeting. It is not League Administration’s responsibility to make sure teams are ready at the stated time and date.

 

We have a specific way to deal with disputes, it's detailed in the rules.  You have missed the window to file your dispute and coming to the forums to claim that we are being discriminatory isn't the way to resolve this issue.

 

Seems to be an act of discrimination towards the South American teams, I did not know that WG speaks to tournaments where discriminatory acts are promoted towards the Latin people like us, nor did I know that the staff is not qualified to give favorable solutions to problems like this when the same staff is The culprit for not having notified such change in advance.

 

We do not have the same culture, we do not have the same habits and we do not have the same time zone. We decided to participate in the tournament as it is a ran event, but we had no idea that they fomented discriminatory acts in the Supremacy League, and it was my surprise that WG speaks about such acts against the Latino community. 

 

 

 

Those battles (the first round of Saturday) should be rebuked since it was a mistake of the staff not to have notified in advance the change of schedule, or maybe they only want to hurt the Latin American teams?

 

 

I'll remind you that although WG gives us the prizes they don't run the league, four of us handle all the grunt work.  We all put our own time and money into running the league to give teams an outlet until we are provided with a built in system from WG.  At the end of the day you may not like the answer you received on Saturday night but you had a window in which you could have attempted to resolve the issue that you missed and instead you chose to come here and publicly air a grievance.  As it stands your dispute will be considered received, filed and finalized the forfeits stand.  


 


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Had we said EST, we would have made an announcement that we were switching to EDT or vice versa. We stated that matches will be played at whatever the time is on the east coast of the US hence just listing "ET" as per the pre-season meeting. It is not League Administration’s responsibility to make sure teams are ready at the stated time and date.

 

We have a specific way to deal with disputes, it's detailed in the rules.  You have missed the window to file your dispute and coming to the forums to claim that we are being discriminatory isn't the way to resolve this issue.

 

 

 

I'll remind you that although WG gives us the prizes they don't run the league, four of us handle all the grunt work.  We all put our own time and money into running the league to give teams an outlet until we are provided with a built in system from WG.  At the end of the day you may not like the answer you received on Saturday night but you had a window in which you could have attempted to resolve the issue that you missed and instead you chose to come here and publicly air a grievance.  As it stands your dispute will be considered received, filed and finalized the forfeits stand.  


 

 

We tried to solve it by the Discord, but the response we received from the staff that was this: "did not cross my mind" was what caused us discomfort, because it did not give a solution according to the situation that was raised.

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We tried to solve it by the Discord, but the response we received from the staff that was this: "did not cross my mind" was what caused us discomfort, because it did not give a solution according to the situation that was raised.

The solution was the involved teams forfeited for not being ready at the designated time. We are not going to argue this point further. 


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We tried to solve it by the Discord, but the response we received from the staff that was this: "did not cross my mind" was what caused us discomfort, because it did not give a solution according to the situation that was raised.

 

I'll refer you to the official rule for a dispute then;

 

10.0 - Dispute Resolution:

10.1 - After any “on field” decision has been made, teams and players must accept the ruling and return to play as advised. Further discussions, arguments, or a refusal to follow direction may result in match forfeitures and other penalties for teams and players as determined by League Administration.

10.2- All disputes must be submitted to the WSL forums within six hours of the conclusion of the match along with the specific match information, infraction, and any replay or video attached. Disputes will be resolved by either League Administrators or referees, and all decisions are final.

 


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Now I seem to remember another naval-themed game with a large South American population, NavyFIELD.

 

I also seem to remember that their competitive matches were only published in Eastern and Pacfic times, yet the South American teams never had a problem showing up, and this was less than a decade ago, more like 5 years.

 

I would also be remiss to not mention that some names in the Warships clans look awfully familiar, if not identical to NavyFIELD ones.  Consider that last bit speculation for the record.  

 

The reality here is, folks, for a lot of us Warships is far from our first online multiplayer game.  I'm sure that goes for the South American folks in regards to "North American" servers as well.  While the game may be based on WW1/2 warships, this is not 1945, this is 2017.  The resources are readily available to anyone who takes a look - hell, New York is a default entry on the "World Clock" section of the clock on most smartphones.  There us no excuse for being ignorant, given every factor spoken of here.


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I'll refer you to the official rule for a dispute then;

 

10.0 - Dispute Resolution:

10.1 - After any “on field” decision has been made, teams and players must accept the ruling and return to play as advised. Further discussions, arguments, or a refusal to follow direction may result in match forfeitures and other penalties for teams and players as determined by League Administration.

10.2- All disputes must be submitted to the WSL forums within six hours of the conclusion of the match along with the specific match information, infraction, and any replay or video attached. Disputes will be resolved by either League Administrators or referees, and all decisions are final.

 

 

Ok Mrs Vas79, you are quoting the rules, 10.1 "on field decision"    

 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:22 PM

 
 
So the time changed last weekend

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:22 PM

 
 
but it changed for you
 
 
for that region
 
 
in south america
 
 
that time changes does not happen
 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:22 PM

 
 
So eastern is the default time

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:22 PM

 
 
UTC
 
 
it's our time zone
 
 
and it remainds the same
 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:23 PM

 
 
And ours changes, and the league works in Eastern
 
 
Are you now 2 hours ahead?

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:23 PM

 
 
and did you notify that?

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:24 PM

 
 
I didn't

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:24 PM

 
 
so

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:24 PM

 
 
Because it hadn't occurred to me

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:24 PM

 
 
see
 
 
it is not our fault because once again... in south america that time changes does not happen
 
 
ever

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:25 PM

 
 
We have 4 teams out of time zone
 
 
The remaining 30 are NA

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:25 PM

 
 
so
 
 
what about those teams
 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:28 PM

 
 
Go look at rule 2.2

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:29 PM

 
 
let me see
 
 
2.2 - Matches may only be played Saturday and will start at 21:00 ET for match one and 22:30 ET for match two.
 
 
but did you notify the south american team about the times change?
 
 
it's my point
 
 
because in South america does time changes never happen

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:30 PM

 
 
Rule says Eastern Time
 
 
Not EST or EDT

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:31 PM

 
 
but what about the South american teams that never have to change the timezone?
 
 
we are screw because of that?
 
 
for something that never happened in this time zone?
 
 
Does that count as a on field decision? the, and I quote "Because it hadn't occurred to me" is considered a field decision? and if it is so, we still got the same result, the match for forfeit.
 
And Rule 10.2 talks only about disputes ingame or after game, like infraction, it says nothing regarding time changes or not notifications from the staff in matters of time changes
Edited by Crosys

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Ok Mrs Vas79, you are quoting the rules, 10.1 "on field decision"    

 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:22 PM

 
 
So the time changed last weekend
 

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:22 PM

 
 
but it changed for you
 
 
 
for that region
 
 
 
in south america
 
 
 
that time changes does not happen
 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:22 PM

 
 
So eastern is the default time
 

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:22 PM

 
 
UTC
 
 
 
it's our time zone
 
 
 
and it remainds the same
 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:23 PM

 
 
And ours changes, and the league works in Eastern
 
 
 
Are you now 2 hours ahead?
 

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:23 PM

 
 
and did you notify that?
 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:24 PM

 
 
I didn't
 

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:24 PM

 
 
so
 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:24 PM

 
 
Because it hadn't occurred to me
 

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:24 PM

 
 
see
 
 
 
it is not our fault because once again... in south america that time changes does not happen
 
 
 
ever
 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:25 PM

 
 
We have 4 teams out of time zone
 
 
 
The remaining 30 are NA
 

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:25 PM

 
 
so
 
 
 
what about those teams
 
 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:28 PM

 
 
Go look at rule 2.2
 

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:29 PM

 
 
let me see
 
 
 
2.2 - Matches may only be played Saturday and will start at 21:00 ET for match one and 22:30 ET for match two.
 
 
 
but did you notify the south american team about the times change?
 
 
 
it's my point
 
 
 
because in South america does time changes never happen
 

Vas79-Last Saturday at 9:30 PM

 
 
Rule says Eastern Time
 
 
 
Not EST or EDT
 

[F.AL.O.]Crosis-Last Saturday at 9:31 PM

 
 
but what about the South american teams that never have to change the timezone?
 
 
 
we are screw because of that?
 
 
 
for something that never happened in this time zone?
 
 
 
 
Does that count as a on field decision? the, and I quote "Because it hadn't occurred to me" is considered a field decision? and if it is so, we still got the same result, the match for forfeit.
 
And Rule 10.2 talks about only disputes ingame or after game, like infraction, it says nothing regarding time changes or not notifications from the staff in matters of time changes

 

Had we said EST, we would have made an announcement that we were switching to EDT or vice versa. We stated that matches will be played at whatever the time is on the east coast of the US hence just listing "ET" as per the pre-season meeting. It is not League Administration’s responsibility to make sure teams are ready at the stated time and date.

 

 

 

 


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Let the record show Mrs Vas doesn't play boats, smart phone games are more her thing.


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So, just to clarify, we made a complaint about a loophole found in the rules set regarding times sets and the famous daylight saving time, and all we can get is a hand washing from the staff saying that it is our fault for not having the same custom? Just to clarity, because all I read is "not the staff responsability" but the staff is the one that live in the ET zone, the staff is the one that know the daylight saving time in the ET zone, the staff is the one that set up the time for the matches and then change them because of the famous daylight saving time, and it is not the staff responsability to notify then when a change in the time zone occur? just asking, since is the staff the ones that have to make the change in the time of the matches to be play, according to "2.2 -  Matches may only be played Saturday and will start at 21:00 ET for match one and 22:30 ET for match two." So, if a time change occurs in the ET time zone, is the staff responsible to make a notification to the others teams that are out side of the time zone that a time change has occur? or we are just supposed to know all this atypical things?   

 

You all can be Supertester or Alpha tester and all of that, but whos responsibility is to notify the rest of the players when a change in the time occurs? the clock? or the ones that set the time for the matches in the first place?

Edited by Crosys

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So, just to clarify, we made a complaint about a loophole found in the rules set regarding times sets and the famous daylight saving time, and all we can get is a hand washing from the staff saying that it is our fault for not having the same custom? Just to clarity, because all I read is "not the staff responsability" but the staff is the one that live in the ET zone, the staff is the one that know the daylight saving time in the ET zone, the staff is the one that set up the time for the matches and then change them because of the famous daylight saving time, and it is not the staff responsability to notify then when a change in the time zone occur? just asking, since is the staff the ones that have to make the change in the time of the matches to be play, according to "2.2 -  Matches may only be played Saturday and will start at 21:00 ET for match one and 22:30 ET for match two." So, if a time change occurs in the ET time zone, is the staff responsible to make a notification to the others teams that are out side of the time zone that a time change has occur? or we are just supposed to know all this atypical things?   

 

You all can be Supertester or Alpha tester and all of that, but whos responsibility is to notify the rest of the players when a change in the time occurs? the clock? or the ones that set the time for the matches in the first place?

 

I honestly don't think any of us actually live on the east coast. ET was chosen so that east coast players didn't have to be online until midnight or after. We said ET. Not EST. Not EDT. Meaning whatever time it is on the east coast of the US is the time that matches are going to happen. If you were present at the pre-season meeting, you would know this. If you weren't present, you should have been present or had a representative fill-in. Scheduling never changed and the match 1 time has always been slated for 21:00 ET. If you did not check the time then it's not our problem. It is that simple. We have no obligation to inform any of the teams of DST as it is their job as participants to verify the times/dates and be present for their matches. We are not going to give special treatment to any team regardless of their geographical location. If a team outside of North America participates in our tournament then they are accepting our rules and will abide by them regardless of whether or not the timezone becomes an inconvenience for them. I'm not going to argue this any further. So for the last time: It is not our responsibility to notify you about a time change when you knowingly joined a North American Tournament while living in South America. It is your responsibility as a team to be present at the time dictated by the ruleset which was never altered and has always been 21:00 ET. Not EST, not EDT, but ET as per the pre-season meeting. You are going to accept it whether you are happy with the outcome or not. This could have been very easily handled through the admin email or supremacy forum where it belongs.

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Let the record show Mrs Vas doesn't play boats, smart phone games are more her thing.

 

:hmm:

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Ok, since the staff have a completely contemptuous treatment against the Latin American people, the Fuerza Armada Latina Oranizada team withdraws from the tournament that clearly discriminates against anyone who does not live in North America, as Latinos we will not tolerate this type of deal. As staff are obliged to notify these changes, above when we ask for the solution to this on Saturday we receive a response by the staff.

Not all countries have the habit of changing schedules, but I repeat, we will not tolerate the attitude they have against people who do not live in North America.

 


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All 4 teams who were late were treated the same, only 2 of which were Latin. 


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I live in Korea currently and make the matches. There is no daylight saving in Korea. Yes I'm American, but it's not like we all inherently know when daylight savings time is, and generally rely on our phone clocks updating so we stay on time.

 

That being said I don't have that as an option here and just make sure I keep track of eastern time so I don't miss out on things. It's common sense to pay attention to proper times when dealing with other time zones. That's true both with US time zones as it is European or south American. If you have to do business in those time zones make sure you're on time.

 

You insist it was the leagues responsibility to inform you of a change that happens twice a year in the time zone the league is set? Why? You are playing (doing business) in that time zone, it's your responsibility. Do your businesses that do business with US companies complain about missing meetings with US companies because "they didn't know"? I some how doubt it, I'm sure they're aware of the fact that they're both in two separate time zones and plan accordingly.


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Ok, since the staff have a completely contemptuous treatment against the Latin American people, the Fuerza Armada Latina Oranizada team withdraws from the tournament that clearly discriminates against anyone who does not live in North America, as Latinos we will not tolerate this type of deal. As staff are obliged to notify these changes, above when we ask for the solution to this on Saturday we receive a response by the staff.

Not all countries have the habit of changing schedules, but I repeat, we will not tolerate the attitude they have against people who do not live in North America.

 

To be fair, you were treated like anyone else. If anything, giving you special treatment would be an exception. Consider it a lesson when dealing with people from other time zones, especially if they're the ones running the show.

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Agree, if you are going to change the date of a battle, you need to notify the teams, it is unfair to lose by your mistakes.

you are supposed to guarante fairness in the tournament

 

 

 

Edited by IMAwesomo

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Agree, if you are going to change the date of a battle, you need to notify the teams, it is unfair to lose by your mistakes. you are supposed to guarante fairness in the tournament
 

 

We didn't change anything. The issue is a group looking for special treatment and we're quite frankly not going to supply such treatment. 

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Frankly, none of the regular season matters since all divisions have 8 teams or less, everyone will make it to playoffs.


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I'll put this straight: If you are working from home, and you missed your work schedule because your boss didn't tell you daylight saving is over, will you put the same attitude in and hope he won't fire you? This will not happen because no matter what it is your job to follow up your own schedule, ain't anyone will be covering up for you because it is your responsibility on checking the hours, if someone did it then that is his kindness, he isn't responsible to help you at all. I do understand the frustration of losing a week under the change of timezone, but on the other hand does it really matter to you and your team that much that you need to withdraw the league? Might be so but I'd say it's a childish move because all teams in bronze will be in the final playoffs for sure (Quoting on Rhino above). throwing your chance to get prizes because of a single issue just isn't smart.


Disclaimer: I am not helping either side, but from what I see this post is unnecessary and yet setting up inflammatory argument for the public, which doesn't help on improving the situation in any way. Keep the discussion in a professional way please.


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