Jump to content
You need to play a total of 20 battles to post in this section.
Taichunger

Ten games in Gaede -- some thoughts

23 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

10,389
[INTEL]
Members
13,459 posts
37,320 battles

Well, played 10 solo Random games in Gaede, just for the heck of it. On the NA server Gaede has a 52.55% win rate averaging 26,220 damage. I won 8 of 10 with 25,024 average damage. I was surprised to find that Gaede is the leading non-premium DD in average damage at T6 (NA server, two weeks data), probably because so many people are experienced when they reach it, unlike the IJN and US DDs. I have played through the entire German DD line to T6. I don't like any except the T4 V-170, which is fun to seal club in.

 

Of the ten games, the two losses were collapses, of the eight wins I was first in team score once, second once, and stole the enemy cap once. In the other games I was no more than mediocre. I capped at least one cap in every match except two. I won eight games because I drew excellent teams, that simple. Could well have gone the other way.

 

I spec'd for a stealth torp boat. Dropped in 15 point captain with CE which brings detect down to 6.6. I do not bring stock boats to Random, so I ground it out in co-op for the B hull (which offers little gain), the 8 km torps, and the second range module. I played first six games with the smaller guns, and last 4 with 150mms. For upgrades I used the det reduction, dispersion reduction, engine, and rudder shift.

 

With AFT the stock guns have 12.9 range, the 150s have 10.9. That. Makes. No. Sense. Perhaps WG thought it was balanced better if the harder hitting but slow ROF guns had less range. Ummm..... no. Lots of players will like the way they hit, though, even with the crimped range and glacial ROF.

 

I played her like a torp boat primarily and a gunboat secondarily. A better player than me can probably gunboat in her, but every time you fire, you are detected by the whole map, which promptly fires at you. This is a problem for gunboating, so I stayed alive by not shooting except when the enemy would find it difficult to retaliate. 

 

Remarks:

 

-- this ship is not bad. It's almost a stealth torp boat. It's almost a gunboat, but really it's neither. It's meh as heck, just like the T5. 

-- torps are good when properly used.

-- Sonar? Wasn't much use in any of these games.

-- the smoke is too short. Needs at least 90 seconds and 100 would be better. 70 seconds is ridiculous.

-- Love the way the 150s hit, almost every salvo hits for over 1000, HE or AP. Hate the short range, feels crippled. But they punch holes in cruisers with AP.

-- can't invisifire. If this ship had even 2 kms of stealth firing window....

-- there is no wheee!! fuuuuuun!!!! in this ship. Every minute is a struggle to produce damage. In Fletch or Blys from time to time I can carry and almost always have confidence I will perform well. That will never happen with Gaede. It is too difficult to produce damage with, too slow to move, and too easy to detect when firing. No pew pew pew for you!

-- torp reload is too long. A T6 ship with a T9 reload time? Fletcher puts out ten torps faster, if you spec for it. C'mon, WG, reduce that reload time. Or give it 9.2 km torps.

-- uptiered she does ok provided that she doesn't face T7-8 DDs and T8 cruisers. She's no match in knife fight for most T7-8 DDs.

-- she can cap fine with 6.6 detect. Her problem is escaping caps when opposed. I had good luck capping unopposed in several matches. 

-- I really hated it at first, but it grew on me as I learned to manage its mediocrity. Not a keeper, but I don't hate it. 

 

For those of you tracking MM issues, in ten games I was top tier only twice. First game server population was about 12K, the last game it was around 5K. I have stopped playing T5 and T6 in Randoms entirely, and forgotten that one of the few positives of not playing those tiers is that you don't see Strait. Strait with 2 CVs on a side? There should be prison terms for that... 

 

xJRoQgs.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Taichunger
  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
690 posts

Already at T6 hmm... thought i saw u just recently in the T22.

 

Anyhow, good read. I don't play DDs (not my style) but ive a friend that does. will share the info with him

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
5,202 posts
3,461 battles

We played a division of T6 yesterday for about 5 or so games ( Gaede was in there) and each time we saw T8, which also isn't doing the ship many favours I'd think.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,117
[INTEL]
[INTEL]
Members
7,679 posts
35,879 battles

No at Gaede yet (no interest in the line so I slowly grind the T4). Good info.

I prefer the RU/PL/US gunboats, and really like the IJN torp boats. KM DDs? Meh, (ok the first 3 are fun with the front shooting torps)..unboatd

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Testers
895 posts
4,571 battles

I have mine set up with the 150s and a dedicated captain to those guns, Since BFT and AFT dont help those weapons I dropped them for skills that make her harder to kill, SE, Last Stand, etc. I tend to get those WHEEE moments you are missing all the time. I have it set up as a close in knife fighter. My target priorities are:

1. DDs,

2. Cruisers

3. CVs

4. BBs

This can vary a bit depending on the situation, while the range can and WILL get you killed from time to time I find the Gaede to be very lethal when doing this, the mix of heavy hitting rounds and torpedoes can make quick work of most opponents. 

Because of the bad concealment after firing, I haven't yet speced for CE, that and my captain is only about 11 points. 

 

I tend to do rather well with this setup and here is an example of one of my best games in her. https://wowreplays.com/Replay/26710

While I freely admit my normal games are not as good as this, they are average enough to have me doing rather well and consistently with this little terror. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Testers
4,007 posts
14,539 battles

I free xp the 150mm and avrage around 40k dmg i think. its fun at that tier cause cruisers don;t know that you can murder them that easy

Gaede it's a good dd but it can't uptier , at least not at tier 8 , 6-7 is fine and super competitive , also hydro saved my [edited]many times :D

Probably the most fun that i had in a dd after un-nerfed minekaze ,

Main problem of the Gaede is that can't output as much dmg as the others because of the uptiering

 

Good side is that Maass is much much better , only blys can beat it at that tier in a knife fight

Edited by Destroyer_WolfgangZenker
  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Testers
895 posts
4,571 battles

I free xp the 150mm and avrage around 40k dmg i think. its fun at that tier cause cruisers don;t know that you can murder them that easy

Gaede it's a good dd but it can't uptier , at least not at tier 8 , 6-7 is fine and super competitive , also hydro saved my [edited]many times :D

Probably the most fun that i had in a dd after un-nerfed minekaze ,

Main problem of the Gaede is that can't output as much dmg as the others because of the uptiering

 

Good side is that Maass is much much better , only blys can beat it at that tier in a knife fight

 

I dont tend to have many issues fighting ships above my tier, but then again I rarely get into one on one fights with them. Fair fights are for suckers. ^^' Always bring a friend along. :3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Testers
4,007 posts
14,539 battles

 

I dont tend to have many issues fighting ships above my tier, but then again I rarely get into one on one fights with them. Fair fights are for suckers. ^^' Always bring a friend along. :3

 

But solo yolo best yolo :D and yea you can fight most but not a benson/tashkent or a mogami 155 or a kutuzov :ohmy:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10,389
[INTEL]
Members
13,459 posts
37,320 battles

I have mine set up with the 150s and a dedicated captain to those guns, Since BFT and AFT dont help those weapons I dropped them for skills that make her harder to kill, SE, Last Stand, etc. I tend to get those WHEEE moments you are missing all the time. I have it set up as a close in knife fighter. My target priorities are:

1. DDs,

2. Cruisers

3. CVs

4. BBs

This can vary a bit depending on the situation, while the range can and WILL get you killed from time to time I find the Gaede to be very lethal when doing this, the mix of heavy hitting rounds and torpedoes can make quick work of most opponents. 

Because of the bad concealment after firing, I haven't yet speced for CE, that and my captain is only about 11 points. 

 

I will have to watch that vid. My experience so far is that there is no way she can knife fight with that slow reload and those torps that take forever to reload, even with the captain's skill. She's such a huge target, too. When I encounter DDs I simply smoke and run, and count on my concealment to get out of trouble. I avoid fighting them unless I can unload torps on them first. 

 

One problem with this line is the captain problem -- you need two captains, one for the ships with the 150s and one for the other ships, or else you are shelling out to respec. Annoying...

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Testers
4,007 posts
14,539 battles

 

One problem with this line is the captain problem -- you need two captains, one for the ships with the 150s and one for the other ships, or else you are shelling out to respec. Annoying...

 

 

 

You don't ( unless you plan to keep the ship )

Spec the KM dds for AFT+DE , dosen't matter if you have 150 or not , you still need aft.

 

That's what i was running till tier 10

BFT/Last stand/SuperInt/Aft/Demo/Bos/Em

At tier 10 i got rid of aft cause it has almost 17 km range and it's useless , then got concelment insted

 

I think the results ware ok

 nqzFNv9.png

 

Edited by Destroyer_WolfgangZenker

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
873
[SCCC]
Members
3,177 posts
12,818 battles

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/110973-ernst-gaede-totally-not-a-high-tier-ship-in-tier-6/page__pid__2703649#entry2703649

 

I don't have a 15 point captain yet but I went for SE over AFT. 18,100 hp for a tier 6 DD is a lot, I primarily gunboat with her, and I average some 45k-50k damage per game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,588
[CRMSN]
Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters
6,009 posts
4,625 battles

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/110973-ernst-gaede-totally-not-a-high-tier-ship-in-tier-6/page__pid__2703649#entry2703649

 

I don't have a 15 point captain yet but I went for SE over AFT. 18,100 hp for a tier 6 DD is a lot, I primarily gunboat with her, and I average some 45k-50k damage per game.

 

Same here. SE gives it a big time advantage. 

 

Unfortunately the sip suffers due to her tier more then anything else. constantly facing Tier 8 ships is not fun. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
873
[SCCC]
Members
3,177 posts
12,818 battles

 

Same here. SE gives it a big time advantage. 

 

Unfortunately the sip suffers due to her tier more then anything else. constantly facing Tier 8 ships is not fun. 

 

I've experienced the opposite. A lot of tier 5/6 and some tier 7 and some tier 8 games. But I would still prefer the Gaede in a tier 8 game as opposed to the Hipper/Eugen in a tier 10 game a thousand times over. Good lord those ships absolutely suck in tier 10 games.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
419
[D2P]
Members
2,293 posts
6,976 battles

Pretty accurate review of the ship but I feel it actually has it's place as a cap fighter. 

 

The pros of this line starting at t6 and this ship in particular are 

-High HP

-Hydro

-Both weapon types are usable.

-150mm guns 

 

So for me the Gaede's play style is obvious.

Drive into the cap and beat the other DD's through a combination of being tough and hydro/smoke fighting. Unless they have radar (t7atlanta or indy) or a crusier drives into the cap (doubtful) you should be able to bully anything else out of there - or sink them.

 

I've used to Gaede to great effect like this in several games now.

 

For QOL sake - this whole line starting at t6 needs increased gun range - the range right now is 1km-1.5km too short.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
2,300 posts
5,512 battles

Just got the Gaede yesterday. I do only Co-Op, so my impressions are for that. Love the torps! I use it to hunt down Carriers and BBs. Haven't got the upgraded guns yet, but am looking forward to them. I installed Steering Gear Mod 2 to solve the rudder shift problem and Sierra Mike signal flag to boost speed. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21
[KARP]
Beta Testers
204 posts
9,533 battles

I have played only a few games in the Gaede (at the time of posting seven). I also have not played very well in it (See image below). I did not play very well in the T-22 either. I do much, much better in the IJN and USN DDs. But I don't do particularly well in the Russian destroyer line either. 

The V-170 was such ridiculous amounts of fun. The direction that German DDs take after tier 4 feels more like a branching than a natural progression. I will say that there might be hope for the Gaede though. I've added the 150mm guns to her before my last game. Having cruiser guns on a destroyer is a potential source of much fun. The first time I citadeled a like tier cruiser made me smile. The 150mm gun turrets still turn like Russian guns but man do they pack a punch. I'm already looking forward to the Tier 8 German DD which also has 150mm guns available.

 

I'm not sure how the overall "feel" of the German DD is yet. It will be some time before I get to high tier with this line. But from Tier 6 I can say that in my own personal experience the bulk of the ships are turds with the exception of the Tier 2-4 ships.

 

 

qK6jEGQ.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,588
[CRMSN]
Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters
6,009 posts
4,625 battles

 

I've experienced the opposite. A lot of tier 5/6 and some tier 7 and some tier 8 games. But I would still prefer the Gaede in a tier 8 game as opposed to the Hipper/Eugen in a tier 10 game a thousand times over. Good lord those ships absolutely suck in tier 10 games.

 

I hate the hipper for that sole reason! 

 

Like in a tier 8 match she is great.. but outside of that ouuuff.. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1,270
[-ARP-]
[-ARP-]
Beta Testers, In AlfaTesters
4,178 posts
4,376 battles

Tai, this line is a pretext to what the other lines are going to look like. WG is using this line to see how well removing stealth fire will work. If the data is preferable, it's likely all ships in the game that can produce hilariously broken results from stealth firing will have it horribly nerfed and ships that benefit only slightly will also lose it. Stealth firing is going to soon become a thing of the past. So I think it's best to get used to the rest of the line like this, as the rest of the line doesn't have ANY stealthfiring either.

 

~Hunter

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10,389
[INTEL]
Members
13,459 posts
37,320 battles

Qn8VS2c.png

 

Well, I finally had my first 100K game in it. Would have been really satisfying if we had won but my team of potatoes blew a 400 point lead. Very frustrating. I am getting more comfortable with the 150s and with the ship in general, but still feel like it is far more work than any of the other DDs I regularly play. 

 

I've been using the guns sparingly -- waiting til my target is involved with another ship before firing, shooting at ships I've torped until they are set on fire, then stopping, etc. Seems to work better for me. I capped twice unopposed in this game, early and late, so still haven't done any knife fighting.

Edited by Taichunger

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Members
648 posts
3,799 battles

 

You don't ( unless you plan to keep the ship )

Spec the KM dds for AFT+DE , dosen't matter if you have 150 or not , you still need aft.

 

That's what i was running till tier 10

BFT/Last stand/SuperInt/Aft/Demo/Bos/Em

At tier 10 i got rid of aft cause it has almost 17 km range and it's useless , then got concelment insted

 

I agree that 17km range on the Z-52 is useless, but the only way you're going to see that kind of range with an AFT setup is running the range mod upgrade. You'd be better served picking up the torpedo reload mod instead, and for a 15 point captain BFT, LS (because your engine is always getting knocked out), SI (because you need smoke), AFT, CE.

 

The other option is to respec to BFT, LS, SI, DE, CE and then run the range upgrade to compensate if you don't want to have a 76 second torpedo reload and favor the 90 second reload.

 

I very much disagree that the 150's on a 15 point captain need both AFT and DE to run two tier four skills in the current captain skills. Pick one or the other, and you pretty much determine which gun choice you're going to use and keep (either 128's or 150's). CE on the line is pretty much a necessity to maximize the window for torpedoing since if you used your gun you're going to be spotted from the surface of the moon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
419
[D2P]
Members
2,293 posts
6,976 battles

Qn8VS2c.png

 

Well, I finally had my first 100K game in it. Would have been really satisfying if we had won but my team of potatoes blew a 400 point lead. Very frustrating. I am getting more comfortable with the 150s and with the ship in general, but still feel like it is far more work than any of the other DDs I regularly play. 

 

I've been using the guns sparingly -- waiting til my target is involved with another ship before firing, shooting at ships I've torped until they are set on fire, then stopping, etc. Seems to work better for me. I capped twice unopposed in this game, early and late, so still haven't done any knife fighting.

 

Well done - and yes - guns are for pot shots, smoke firing, and DD brawling. This boat will lose any kind of sustained ranged battle. One thing I love about the 150's is the citting cruisers. Had a game where a Molotov suprized me right as my smoke faded at about 5 km he was full broadside raked off 5 cits in 7 seconds - he post in chat "wth" I'm like "150's". Was grand.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×