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The difference between mine and the rest:

This originally started as a Explanation Thread. Though I will so going forward, i would like to keep it that way. If it begins to turn into one of those opinion threads, posts will start disappearing. 

 

:facepalm: Obvious joke isn't obvious. Will try do better next time. 

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On 1/3/2017 at 9:53 AM, RedSeaBear said:

 

:facepalm: Obvious joke isn't obvious. Will try do better next time. 

 

Oh no please, don't take it the wrong way. I got the joke. I was referring to others in the thread steering this into an opinion thread. 


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Pretty sure I knew most of this, but thanks!

 

One of the most memorable detonations I experienced was an Iso- or Minekaze shooting one ~18k HE shell of doom at my Murmank's bow and detonating me.  :P

The only other damage I had really taken was...a torpedo a few minutes earlier, directly under the front turrets. Funny how that works.


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Seems perfectly reasonable. As per the people saying Juliet Charlie doesn't prevent detonations 100% of the time, they are correct, but the circumstances needed to cause that scenario happen back in port. If you arm with a Juliet Charlie AND some of the flags which raise the chance of detonation, the JC doesn't cancel out the effects. The product of any number and zero doesn't equal zero in this case. What I don't know is to what degree is the chance of detonation minimized in such a configuration. It may be that the the JC is completely negated, or it may reduce the chance drastically. 


.Disregard that. Wiki alleges this is not the case, and I will take that as fact over the anecdotal evidence. 
 

On a related note, I once had my Atlanta detonated by the first shell to hit it, a HE round from an Aoba, in perhaps the most embarrassing zero damage game of my career. As fate would have it, my first supercontainer had 250 JCs, so my little 5" magazines will be safe for a long time to come :)

Edited by rapier_ape

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Thanks for the explanation of how these work... 

 

It wont stop the salt from pouring from a Yammy driver who got detonated from full health... :D (seen it twice, both were div mates and both were beyond angry. Massive TS rage... LOL)


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Thanks for the official explanation.  

 

The size of the AoE of splash damage from HE/Torp/Bomb and if it can/how it does pass through objects (such as hull and modules), are those values simply unpublished, or is that data confidential?

 

I can't speak for torpedoes, but the blast from HE shells "penetrate" to 1/6 of their calibre, or 1/4 in the case of German battleship shells. We know this from Sub_Octavian's forum Q&A. Basically, if the armour is thicker than the blast, the blast doesn't "reach" anything to damage it.

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The original explanation of the mechanic was a bit off, as it got bogged down in armor/hp pool stats.

For those of you who don't have guns accurate enough to repeatedly aim at and hit a specific module deep inside a ship that's only a few pixels wide, here's how detonations actually work:

 

****

 

Hope this helps clarify.

 

Content Moderated By Njourour.

 

Edited by Njourour

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I can't speak for torpedoes, but the blast from HE shells "penetrate" to 1/6 of their calibre, or 1/4 in the case of German battleship shells. We know this from Sub_Octavian's forum Q&A. Basically, if the armour is thicker than the blast, the blast doesn't "reach" anything to damage it.

 

Thank you, I recall the Q&A but is penetrate the same as the blast area or just the thickness of armor it will punch through?  Also what about modules, are they counted as their armor value and/or size only or does their HP pool slow down the blast?

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Wait wait wait, who on earth wants detonations to stay? I want direct quotes in context before I believe that.

 

I want detonations, I have advocated many times for more spectacular and impressive BOOMs, earth shattering!   Detonations were a real part of navel warfare, even with sailing ships... so get used to it, and learn to LOVE it, it will happen to you, but you will get to dish some out too and yesterday I detonated a full health DD with my German DD and it was... COOL!!

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Why not keep them. At least you get a few flags instead of nothing when you are vaporized by a huge strike and they are rare even without the flag or upgrade.

 

Heh.  When starting the day I play a couple Co-op tier I battles to see if my shootin' eye is in good form before getting serious.  A couple days ago a red and I spotted each other bow on at max range.  My first pair missed, my second erased him.  I confirmed in the after battle report, two HE for umpty-ump damage.  "Cool," I thought.  The very next battle, the same thing happened only I was on the receiving end.  Not so cool, and because it was Co-op, no flags.  :(

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As per the people saying Juliet Charlie doesn't prevent detonations 100% of the time, they are correct, but the circumstances needed to cause that scenario happen back in port. If you arm with a Juliet Charlie AND some of the flags which raise the chance of detonation, the JC doesn't cancel out the effects. 

YOU are 100% wrong. From the Wargaming wiki:

 

-100% to the risk of your ship's magazine detonating.

Note: This flag will nullify all chances of you detonating, regardless of additional flags that increase your chance of detonating (India X-Ray and Juliet Whiskey Unaone).


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Thank you, I recall the Q&A but is penetrate the same as the blast area or just the thickness of armor it will punch through?  Also what about modules, are they counted as their armor value and/or size only or does their HP pool slow down the blast?

 

I am assuming that the blast radius is the penetration depth, because that is what makes sense to me in terms of "penetration" given the projectiles are fused to detonate on contact. I am fairly sure collision meshes of any sort stop an HE shell, and thick enough armour is the only thing which can defeat the resultant blast. Frankly most modules don't have an armour value per se. Hit points, yes.


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...

Detonations were a real part of navel warfare

 

So was having your engine permanently (at least for the duration of a WoWs battle, even taking time compression into account) disabled. So was having your main fire control radar permanently damaged, reducing gun accuracy to nearly useless levels. So was having your rudder permanently jammed. So was some silly percentage of USN torpedoes not working. So was single-digit main gun accuracy. Etc.

 

Detonations are staying in the game, so you win. Yay. But the argument that it's a great idea "because they were real" makes no sense, as there are about a billion things that were real that would make the game worse/unplayable. No one will ever agree on the perfect skill/chance balance for this game (that is, after all, what this discussion boils down to), so there's no point trying. But it would be best to use arguments that at least make sense. "I like when ships randomly blow up" is a valid opinion. It is not my opinion, but others are entitled to feel that way. "It must be good because it happened in real naval warfare" is a bizarre argument, because this game would be unplayably boring/arbitrary if it was remotely realistic.

 

Enjoy your random, skill-less ship deletions.


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Why keep them? Then we can get rid of the flags and upgrades and not ever have to worry about taking one random hit and go from full health to zero. They are not "fun and engaging" as WG claims they are. They are just silly.

 

One shot volleys without a detonation are not exactly fun either so I suppose you will want them removed next. Most detonations and one shot volleys are because you made a mistake, quit giving the enemy easy shots.

 

Edit: I am open to removing detonations from the game but I doubt the DD players would consider having their citadels back in return a good deal.

Edited by BrushWolf

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Detonations are an awful game mechanic, but some people want more realism than others so here we are

Edited by mrmariokartguy

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Detonations are hilarious when they happen to the other guy, and the only thing in gaming that gives me a legitimate startle when it happens to me. Larger (and louder hopefully) explosions resulting from them would make both of these factors even better. 


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YOU are 100% wrong. From the Wargaming wiki:

 

-100% to the risk of your ship's magazine detonating.

Note: This flag will nullify all chances of you detonating, regardless of additional flags that increase your chance of detonating (India X-Ray and Juliet Whiskey Unaone).

 

Edited. I was going off something from youtube that seemed credible. 

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Thank you for the explanation, Pigeon.  I can cross this one off my list of mechanics whose details were bugging me.  It's also neat to see that the research done by some players got pretty close to the mark on pinning down how this worked. 

 

2vt5f8o.png

In approximately one game in five, I will ruin someone's match by blowing their ship out from under them, suddenly and dramatically.

 

It's no secret that I love detonations and causing high-damage alpha strikes with torpedo strikes or multiple citadels.  I celebrate when I cause one and laugh when one happens to me.  I deliberately go out of my way to try and cause them.  I'm very much looking forward to them getting some good press finally when the visuals change.  Could it be that we might see them updated in 0.6.0 or 0.6.1?  Please, please, pretty please? 


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 Could it be that we might see them updated in 0.6.0 or 0.6.1?  Please, please, pretty please? 

 

Good things take time. 

That's all I'll say about that :tea_cap:


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in the 6 hundred and something games I've played i detonated i think 23 people but i only have been detonated twice and i haven't been detonated since may 5 of 2016, so it's been a long time since i got blown up in a shot so im not really complaining (Knock on wood) 


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I don't enjoy detonations.

I do, however, think they are a part of the game and belong there because it brings a better sense of realism to the gameplay.

So, if you are asking my opinion, I would want them to stay.

(and you could make the explosions a bit more, well ... , spectacular, memorable, intense.)

and thanks for all the other fun stuff, too!


 


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Wait wait wait, who on earth wants detonations to stay? I want direct quotes in context before I believe that.

 

I do.  And that's a quote.

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Wait wait wait, who on earth wants detonations to stay? I want direct quotes in context before I believe that.

 

This is a bit of an old topic, but I do.

 

I could go on about why, but in essence they're so infrequent that they're really more of an element of colour than they are a game changing mechanic as far as I'm concerned.  The difference between realistic and gamey mechanics is somewhat arbitrary at times so I'm open to the alternative point of view but I've yet to be convinced that they're actually a problem in any real way other than a more general argument that there should be no probability based mechanics in the game at all, but I don't think that would be much fun either. This isn't a mechanic that bothers me very much so it's worth the surprise/variety to me.

 

Given how infrequent they are, I like the idea that they're going to be made a bit more... exciting.  And now that they've been explained in detail it's hard to even say that they're random.  There's a definite and fairly easily understood logic to how they happen.  Detonations not really any more arbitrary/random than citadel damage and less so than fire chance as far as I'm concerned.


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One shot volleys without a detonation are not exactly fun either so I suppose you will want them removed next. Most detonations and one shot volleys are because you made a mistake, quit giving the enemy easy shots.

 

Edit: I am open to removing detonations from the game but I doubt the DD players would consider having their citadels back in return a good deal.

 

One shot volleys require someone to make a massive mistake and some one else to take a well aimed shot and get lucky with RNG. Detonations require neither of these. One random shell from any angle can detonate someone and even secondaries can cause them. There is a massive difference between a detonation and citadeling someone out of existence.

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Why not keep them. At least you get a few flags instead of nothing when you are vaporized by a huge strike and they are rare even without the flag or upgrade.

I don't mean to be rude, but that is completely illogical. So you are fine with being instantly vaporized, because you get flags that will stop you from getting instantly vaporized? That's rather a large internal contradiction in your statement. 

Detonations are hilarious when they happen to the other guy, and the only thing in gaming that gives me a legitimate startle when it happens to me. Larger (and louder hopefully) explosions resulting from them would make both of these factors even better. 

Well even though I dislike detonations (a lot), I guess I would be somewhat happier if there was a larger explosion. It's annoying how you can be instantly deleted by RNG like that, yet get nothing but a minuscule explosion. 


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