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Wormstrand11th

Need someone to explain how the Akizuki has become super stealthed

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So last night at some point I started running into these Akizuki DD's in my Hatsuharu, and a few other destroyers.  I could not outrun nor evade the Akizuki in a straight run at 40kts+ (40.9) nor could i see him firing at me at less than 8km with no smoke from him or I.  He was "hidden" by a small shoal sticking out of an island that stuck out of the water no more than a few feet high.  I could clearly see the shots fired and the distance from me was between 7km and 9km, and yet he remained unseen with no smoke while firing time and again.

I made a run for it on the next map and could not shake that dd who kept me permanently spotted for over 10 minutes. I burned through all 3 of my engine boosts while he and a Cleveland ran me down over that time period.  I never saw the Aki until after i was sunk and he appeared less than 4km from where i was going down at right as that last shot hit put me under.

For the purpose of info I kept the Cleveland at about 8-9km away and would spin and sling torps just to force him to turn (i only have the 8km range) and he would see them coming, turn, and charge right back after me as I was spotted anytime he got below 8km from me despite my 6.5km detection range (no i was not using my guns as I was trying to get away).  He also saw the torps coming way way too early and it suggests that the Aki was somewhere between us.

 

So the Akizuki has a detection range of 7.6km and yet i never saw him.

Even with Concealment expert that brings him down to 6.86km still more than the Hatsu detection range. (assuming we are running the same 3% cammo)

And this still doesnt explain the firing Akizuki either.  I am pretty sure I saw the firing at less than the spotted when firing range (10.6km) another time yesterday as well.

 

This is the only ship that I have seen act this way to where the listed numbers do not seem to be correct, so can either someone explain to me what I am missing here or how the Aki is pulling this off?  Has anyone else seen this?  I will update this if I can catch one and screenshot it firing while not being shown again.

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So last night at some point I started running into these Akizuki DD's in my Hatsuharu, and a few other destroyers.  I could not outrun nor evade the Akizuki in a straight run at 40kts+ (40.9) nor could i see him firing at me at less than 8km with no smoke from him or I.  He was "hidden" by a small shoal sticking out of an island that stuck out of the water no more than a few feet high.  I could clearly see the shots fired and the distance from me was between 7km and 9km, and yet he remained unseen with no smoke while firing time and again.

I made a run for it on the next map and could not shake that dd who kept me permanently spotted for over 10 minutes. I burned through all 3 of my engine boosts while he and a Cleveland ran me down over that time period.  I never saw the Aki until after i was sunk and he appeared less than 4km from where i was going down at right as that last shot hit put me under.

For the purpose of info I kept the Cleveland at about 8-9km away and would spin and sling torps just to force him to turn (i only have the 8km range) and he would see them coming, turn, and charge right back after me as I was spotted anytime he got below 8km from me despite my 6.5km detection range (no i was not using my guns as I was trying to get away).  He also saw the torps coming way way too early and it suggests that the Aki was somewhere between us.

 

So the Akizuki has a detection range of 7.6km and yet i never saw him.

Even with Concealment expert that brings him down to 6.86km still more than the Hatsu detection range. (assuming we are running the same 3% cammo)

And this still doesnt explain the firing Akizuki either.  I am pretty sure I saw the firing at less than the spotted when firing range (10.6km) another time yesterday as well.

 

This is the only ship that I have seen act this way to where the listed numbers do not seem to be correct, so can either someone explain to me what I am missing here or how the Aki is pulling this off?  Has anyone else seen this?  I will update this if I can catch one and screenshot it firing while not being shown again.

 

with out CE it is 6.6.  With CE it is 5.9 i think, with a stealth fire range if 8.9.  It is also slow and the worst handling dd in the game.  It only has 100mm guns so even DDs dont take a ton of damage from the HE.

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If he's still pounding away at you while behind cover, it means someone else was spotting you.

with out CE it is 6.6.  With CE it is 5.9 i think, with a stealth fire range if 8.9.  It is also slow and the worst handling dd in the game.  It only has 100mm guns so even DDs dont take a ton of damage from the HE.

For a unicum, you are quite ignorant of game mechanics.

 

Akizuki's 100mm HE penetrates 16.66mm (standard 1/6th HE penetration) of armor.  Any surface with 16mm of armor or less will take damage: that is, the superstructures of all T7- BBs and CAs, all surfaces of T7- DDs, and the superstructures of all T8+ DDs and CAs.  OP is driving a Hatsuharu, which is a T6 DD and thus fully vulnerable to 100mm HE.

Edited by TenguBlade

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OP, you are exaggerating about the Akizuki's speed.

- Akizuki's non-boosted speed is 33kts

- With Engine Boost it is 35.64kts

- With Engine Boost and signal flag it is 37.368kts

 

If you want to deal with an Akizuki, either go bow on or sail away and let your rear guns molest her.  There is nothing Akizuki can do but disengage.  The worst you can do is show your sides to Akizuki's AP with your DD.

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Concealment expert + camo will bring his detection range down to 6.6km and when firing to 9.6.  If he has a concealment mod as well the numbers are 6.0 and 8.9.   But the ship turns like a BB and is slow as hell.  I quit using the concealment mod on mine and went with the steering gears and the survivability of the ship went up.   

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with out CE it is 6.6.  With CE it is 5.9 i think, with a stealth fire range if 8.9.  It is also slow and the worst handling dd in the game.  It only has 100mm guns so even DDs dont take a ton of damage from the HE.

 

iirc CE can't reduce the  fire penalty so in reality she only has a 9.8 km det range when firing.

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with out CE it is 6.6.  With CE it is 5.9 i think, with a stealth fire range if 8.9.  It is also slow and the worst handling dd in the game.  It only has 100mm guns so even DDs dont take a ton of damage from the HE.

 

If those numbers are right then it wopuld explain part of it but the tech tree shows 7.6 not 6.6 for concealment... is the tech tree wrong?

 

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OP, you are exaggerating about the Akizuki's speed.

- Akizuki's non-boosted speed is 33kts

- With Engine Boost it is 35.64kts

- With Engine Boost and signal flag it is 37.368kts

 

If you want to deal with an Akizuki, either go bow on or sail away and let your rear guns molest her.  There is nothing Akizuki can do but disengage.  The worst you can do is show your sides to Akizuki's AP with your DD.

 

Not exaggerating about the speed... I am just saying that I was constantly lit and had the cleveland at 7km at all times and then the Akizuki appears as I am going down.  As for the speed I am just reporting what I was doing and I  cant figure out how it was keeping up tbh.

 

This is not a complaint I am putting this out there asking you guys for info on what I obviously don't know

 

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5.9 / 8.9 when firing with full concealment build as Mr wwwwwww has stated. 

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I drive the ship.  it is 8.9

 

  yeahmb I re checked this on my benson CE does apply to also whem the guns bloom. seems like i messed up my commander skills again lol.

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5.9 / 8.9 when firing with full concealment build as Mr wwwwwww has stated. 

 

Then this changes my thoughts on this matter some, still cant pin down the firing unless my scoped in estimates of where the shells were coming from was wrong on the distance which at 8.9 it could have been that or a hair over... hard to tell when you cant see where the ship actually at.  I guess I will leave the spotted mystery to one of the things that is never going to make sense without a replay from the other team.

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thats not a ton of damage.  I actually drive the ship and don't care that you know maths.

Uh huh.

 

Do me a favor: since you actually drive the ship, why don't you put a Hatsuharu up against it in Training Room and see how long that sucker lasts against you.  Post the replay here while you're at it; since you have nothing to hide, there shouldn't be any problem, right?

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Uh huh.

 

Do me a favor: since you actually drive the ship, why don't you put a Hatsuharu up against it in Training Room and see how long that sucker lasts against you.  Post the replay here while you're at it; since you have nothing to hide, there shouldn't be any problem, right?

 

a non moving full broad hatsu not long.  but in real life things dodge and don't sail full broad.  Sometimes they even shoot back and knock your guns out.  100mm guns get knocked out pretty ez.  Maybe you should get out of the training room and get some real game experience. 
Edited by WWWWWWWWWWWVWWWWWWWWWWWW
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the he damage on the akizuki is non existent virtually and you only shoot it to knock out modules,set fires PERIOD. if you really want to rack up damage look for broadside targets and let the ap fly! and WWWWWWWWWW is correct the blind fire with aft and ce and camo is 8.9 with a 5.9 surface detection giving you a 3.3 km blind fire buffer to move you`re tug boat in in hopes you dont get ran down!

Edited by timmyg1004

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I could not outrun nor evade the Akizuki in a straight run at 40kts+ (40.9) nor could i see him firing at me at less than 8km with no smoke from him or I.

This seems a little farfetched, as the Akizuki can only go 37kts max WITH speed boost + signal. Hatsuharu is fast enough to outrun Akizuki, and Akizuki slows down to about 27-30 kts on hard turns, so I don't know why you can't outrun her in your Hatsuharu. 

Uh huh.

 

Do me a favor: since you actually drive the ship, why don't you put a Hatsuharu up against it in Training Room and see how long that sucker lasts against you.  Post the replay here while you're at it; since you have nothing to hide, there shouldn't be any problem, right?

 

 

a non moving full broad hatsu not long.  but in real life things dodge and don't sail full broad.  Sometimes they even shoot back and knock your guns out.  100mm guns get knocked out pretty ez.  Maybe you should get out of the training room and get some real game experience. 

 

Sry Tengu, but I have to agree with WWW... on this

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Concealment expert + camo will bring his detection range down to 6.6km and when firing to 9.6.  If he has a concealment mod as well the numbers are 6.0 and 8.9.   But the ship turns like a BB and is slow as hell.  I quit using the concealment mod on mine and went with the steering gears and the survivability of the ship went up.   

 

I use all of the above (CM, CE, Rudder mod) and think the destroyer is a blast. Even if the 100mms are weak, Akizuki is the first destroyer I've used where I haven't been afraid of fighting another destroyer.

 

I regilarly fire and get hits in stealth mode, and used it in smoke mode to farm my hits for the repeated tasks I needed to clear mission one of Honorable Service. One game was even a 400-hit game. Damage has been low, but acceptable due to volume of fire, actual fires, and the occasional torp hit.

 

First high tier ship I actually liked; I either can't do well, or just plain hate all the other T8 ships I've reached.

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a non moving full broad hatsu not long.  but in real life things dodge and don't sail full broad.  Sometimes they even shoot back and knock your guns out.  100mm guns get knocked out pretty ez.  Maybe you should get out of the training room and get some real game experience. 

Well, I'll give you credit for not assuming the OP is another potato right off the bat as I did.  It's a personal dogma of mine with the internet: never assume anyone else has intelligence until they prove it.

 

You're absolutely right in that a dodging DD will be harder to hit, even with high-velocity guns.  I'm also not a stranger to the frailty of Akizuki's gun turrets, having run into a fair number myself (albeit in a Farragut, not yet with my own Hatsuharu).  I ignored those factors - perhaps wrongly - because of what I said above.  Point taken, I concede.

This seems a little farfetched, as the Akizuki can only go 37kts max WITH speed boost + signal. Hatsuharu is fast enough to outrun Akizuki, and Akizuki slows down to about 27-30 kts on hard turns, so I don't know why you can't outrun her in your Hatsuharu. 

There's a difference between being able to outrun someone in theory and being able to outrun someone in practice.  Very rarely will you be able to gain distance fast enough on a pursuing Akizuki to escape without breaking LoS first; in my experience any speed gap of less than 10 knots isn't going to cut it.  A straight-line race between the two of them would have a 7-knot gap at most; this assumes the Akizuki driver isn't running Engine Boost himself or mounting Sierra Mike.  The gap shrinks to 3 knots in that case.

 

Sure, on paper he can outrun the Akizuki, but in practice (this doesn't even count engine incapacitations) a 3-knot speed difference won't put enough distance on him to disengage quickly without having to break LoS first.

Edited by TenguBlade

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With all of what you guys have informed me on regarding the Akizuki I think that since I never spotted her she was in my "blindspot" area between the Cleveland and I and having never fired on me in pursuit then I would have never known she was there.  I was intent on making the Cleveland slow down so I came about multiple times to put torpedoes downrange.  I must have been rubberbanding and keeping the Aki in range the whole time and not known it since I had no reason to suspect that it tailed me that long without firing. 

As I said originally I never saw her until I was sunk and then she appeared way closer that i thought would be possible.  I was going off the information on the tech tree of 7.6km detection range.

 

 

He was behind the island. LOL You answered the question yourself.

as for this above, it wasn't an island it was the rocks barely higher than the sandbar on that one map.  But again I was going with the tech tree 10.6km after firing the main gun numbers having no idea that 8.9 was possible. As i had said I was looking at the approximate area of 7km-9km from where I am seeing the rounds originate from, I didnt have time to string out a tape measure and the FBI has not allowed me the use of the computer scaling model that they use for identifying peoples heights and distances from pictures/videos.  Once they do and I can reproduce a replay that I don't have then I can update the post.

 

I appreciate those of you that have taken time to explain what I was missing, and how I wasnt understanding what unfolded so that I dont fall into that same trap next time.

 

By the way if that Akizuki captain happens to read this post and my assumptions are correct then kudos to them for having the discipline to not fire for that whole chase 

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