Is Tier 7 really the best tier now?

[Grand_Commander_LuXun]

atsf: "You are guaranteed to be top tier almost every match."

 

In my post about the New Mexico (how I am enjoying it), I was recommended to move to the Colorado which has the same playstyle. Centarina also recommended me to get it. It's one tier higher, which makes me sort of concerned and I've heard horror stories about it. I've also heard that Tier 7 is the place to be in terms of MM. I'm wondering how often does T7 see matches with lots of 5s and 6s? How often does it see matches with 9-12 T7 enemies? How often does it see T8 and 9? I especially hate maps like Land of Fire, North, Two Brothers, Hotspot, Northern Lights, and Trap. How does the Colorado perform? I'm also thinking of trying the Warspite as it's same tier as NM, has 15-inch guns and a 2.0 sigma meaning very good accuracy compared to the NM. It should have pretty much the same brawling / tanky kind of playstyle as the NM, if I'm not wrong.

[Grand_Commander_LuXun]

To clarify, I meant to ask: How does the Colorado perform against its own tier and Tiers 5 and 6? How does it perform against 8s and 9s, if I ever see 9s? How well does Warspite uptier?

[MrDeaf]

There are a multitude of stat intricacies that makes NM and lolorado not very different at all.

NM is better in T6 than lolorado is in T7.

 

In fact, were it not for the seriously bad ships in T7, Colorado and Nagato would also not flatter anyone with their stats.

 

 

Icon	Name	Tier	Type	Nation	Battles	WR ▲	Dmg	XP	K/D	Sh☠	Pl☠	Srv	MBH	TH
	Ranger	7	CV	USA	20,802	47.08%	41,676	1,047	1.6	0.7	12.5	57%	0%	0%
	ARP Haguro	7	CA/CL	Japan	23,360	48.10%	28,029	874	0.7	0.5	0.9	22%	28%	5%
	Pensacola	7	CA/CL	USA	45,732	48.25%	27,186	967	0.7	0.5	1.0	23%	29%	0%
	ARP Nachi	7	CA/CL	Japan	21,050	48.59%	28,776	910	0.7	0.6	0.9	22%	29%	5%
	ARP Ashigara	7	CA/CL	Japan	16,653	48.59%	30,232	930	0.8	0.6	1.0	22%	29%	5%
	Mahan	7	DD	USA	56,520	48.82%	21,467	1,022	0.7	0.6	0.1	20%	35%	6%
	Akatsuki	7	DD	Japan	42,740	48.88%	26,276	946	0.9	0.7	0.1	24%	41%	6%
	Colorado	7	BB	USA	74,627	49.13%	42,587	1,011	1.1	0.7	1.0	38%	25%	0%
	Yorck	7	CA/CL	Germany	32,768	49.24%	29,084	1,010	0.8	0.6	0.8	26%	28%	7%
	Nagato	7	BB	Japan	44,118	49.38%	47,817	1,078	1.2	0.8	1.1	38%	25%	0%
	Old Hatsuharu	7	DD	Japan	13,638	49.72%	23,156	1,063	0.8	0.6	0.3	28%	44%	7%
	Kiev	7	DD	USSR	19,259	50.43%	30,814	1,162	0.9	0.7	0.2	24%	41%	8%
	Myoko	7	CA/CL	Japan	29,350	50.43%	33,801	1,018	0.9	0.7	0.9	28%	29%	5%
	ARP Myoko	7	CA/CL	Japan	9,629	50.46%	32,143	975	0.8	0.6	1.0	24%	30%	5%
	Shchors	7	CA/CL	USSR	20,952	50.82%	39,683	1,152	1.1	0.8	0.6	27%	28%	10%
	Indianapolis	7	CA/CL	USA	8,884	50.83%	28,811	1,138	0.7	0.6	1.1	22%	30%	0%
	Sims	7	DD	USA	23,602	51.44%	23,519	1,412	0.9	0.6	0.5	27%	36%	6%
	Gneisenau	7	BB	Germany	71,855	51.50%	49,598	1,150	1.4	0.9	2.5	35%	29%	14%
	Atlanta	7	CA/CL	USA	45,576	52.53%	29,884	1,237	1.0	0.7	2.3	23%	27%	10%
	Hiryu	7	CV	Japan	14,673	52.98%	49,590	1,141	2.9	0.9	14.3	69%	0%	0%
	Scharnhorst	7	BB	Germany	63,004	54.03%	53,282	1,399	1.6	1.0	1.8	36%	28%	15%
	Leningrad	7	DD	USSR	10,814	54.08%	30,303	1,257	1.1	0.8	0.1	31%	44%	6%
	Fiji	7	CA/CL	UK	27,217	54.30%	44,272	1,342	1.6	1.0	1.0	35%	33%	9%
	Błyskawica	7	DD	Poland	14,872	54.72%	34,270	1,247	1.2	0.8	0.1	32%	42%	6%
	Saipan	7	CV	USA	9,040	55.64%	48,405	1,394	3.1	0.9	20.8	72%	0%	0%
	Belfast	7	CA/CL	UK	28,622	56.26%	44,917	1,432	1.6	1.0	1.4	36%	34%	0%
	Shiratsuyu	7	DD	Japan	15,852	57.12%	38,919	1,381	1.7	1.0	0.2	39%	45%	7%
	Flint	7	CA/CL	USA	1,369	66.84%	58,368	1,743	2.4	1.4	3.7	41%	35%	7%

 

[TenguBlade]

Against other T7 BBs, Colorado has to be careful.  Scharnhorst and Gneisenau will run you down and ram torpedoes up your stern, and Nagato has a massive HP advantage.  Colorado has really punch guns with good accuracy to boot, but she's slow and has very low HP.  You still suffer from the weakness of being unable to bounce 15"+ shells from the front, which means that while you're hard to citadel, you will eat a lot of normal-pen damage.  But, on the plus side, her 16" guns will lolpen everything T7 and below, and you will crush T6 BBs under the sheer weight of your gunfire despite your lower HP pools.

 

When uptiered, Colorado's primary issue is her speed.  She has the accuracy to stand off and trade shots at range unlike New Mexico before her, so keeping your distance from higher-tier BBs isn't as hard as it looks.  Keep in mind that Iowa and Izumo have gigantic citadels and that while your guns are relatively weak they're still 16" rifles and will still eat huge chunks out of their health bar at even long range if not citadel them.  The size of high-tier maps means that you need to be decisive about what flank you commit to, and if your guess is wrong, just accept your fate and bring as many enemies down as possible with you.

 

As for Warspite, she does not play like New Mexico at all.  She has wickedly-accurate 15" guns, but her turret traverse is tied with Yamato for worst in the game and while her citadel is somewhat protected she eats scores of normal penetrations.  You do not want to be brawling with this ship.  She's more like Nagato and Colorado in the sense of being a sniper - her excellent maneuverability is merely a holdover from a bygone era before the chain of events from torpedo complaints.  Don't let it fool you.

[Kapitan_Wuff]

Personally I have yet to get the Colorado to perform well for me, and I can't say I enjoy playing that bathtub. But then again, never really enjoyed the New Mexico either, but at least I could get a good game out of her. Tier 7 is possibly my favorite tier right now, better matchmaking than 5 and 6. But its not that huge, being bottom tier just gives you a chance to punch up. I don't have the Warspite, looks like a great ship but it seems one of its strengths has been usurped by the german BBs.

[Grand_Commander_LuXun]

Hmm.... So how often does T7 see T8s and T9s compared to being matched with 5s and 6s? I do have trouble with the German BBs (Gneiseneau, Scharnhorst) in the NM as well. Against T5 and 6 BBs no problem at all unless I get careless. I heard that with Expert Marksman Warspite's turret traverse can be reduced to 56 seconds. I absolutely hate large maps in the NM, the ones I get when up-tiered. I like a good brawler.

[Carrier_Ikoma]

As for Warspite, she does not play like New Mexico at all.  She has wickedly-accurate 15" guns, but her turret traverse is tied with Yamato for worst in the game and while her citadel is somewhat protected she eats scores of normal penetrations.  You do not want to be brawling with this ship.  She's more like Nagato and Colorado in the sense of being a sniper - her excellent maneuverability is merely a holdover from a bygone era before the chain of events from torpedo complaints.  Don't let it fool you.

 

..I agree with most of your post but I do have to disagree a little with warspite. Her bow armor can tank anything not 16", and her very vulnerable deck armor means getting closer can be an advantage.  But, for example, a Fuso or NM at close range can fire every single gun into Warspite's bow and be rewarded only with bounces.

 

In pretty much every other way though... yes the armor is terrible and try not to take hits.

[TenguBlade]

Hmm.... So how often does T7 see T8s and T9s compared to being matched with 5s and 6s? I do have trouble with the German BBs (Gneiseneau, Scharnhorst) in the NM as well. Against T5 and 6 BBs no problem at all unless I get careless. I heard that with Expert Marksman Warspite's turret traverse can be reduced to 56 seconds. I absolutely hate large maps in the NM, the ones I get when up-tiered. I like a good brawler.

T5-7 and T6-8 are the most common placements for any T7 warship.  Expect 7-9s to happen though.

 

Warspite's turret traverse goes down to 56 seconds if you have both Expert Marksman and MBM2 which increases reload time.  So unless you want to sacrifice reload speed (adds about 3 seconds on), I wouldn't.

..I agree with most of your post but I do have to disagree a little with warspite. Her bow armor can tank anything not 16", and her very vulnerable deck armor means getting closer can be an advantage.  But, for example, a Fuso or NM at close range can fire every single gun into Warspite's bow and be rewarded only with bounces.

 

In pretty much every other way though... yes the armor is terrible and try not to take hits.

That would be true if that gigantic island superstructure were not right behind her bow.  Warspite's superstructure doesn't have nearly enough armor to stop battleship AP from lolpenning, and it's thick enough to trigger normal pens from the front if you aim at its base just behind the B turret.  I'm not sure of any other definite weaknesses, but another thing I've noticed about Warspite players is that they tend to be off of their optimal angles - whether this is because of her good handling or what, I can't tell - but that also results in whatever armor she does have being negated to an extent.

 

Of course, I haven't run across many people who struck me as knowing how to play their Warspite beyond "it's not a T8+ BB, I can aim anywhere and I'll score damage" - which is blatantly untrue anyways but whatever.  

[Grand_Commander_LuXun]

Neither ship looks that promising to me..... Not sure if there are any BB alternatives.

[stockmankrause]

Im tier 7 and always in tier 9 battles it all sucks so bad.

[awiggin]

Im tier 7 and always in tier 9 battles it all sucks so bad.

 

Was bound to happen with the Tier 8 ship give away, and the tier 9 Epeen symbol now available.

Be very surprised if Tier 7 doesn't start getting up tiered more as those ships are grabbed. Add to that the income positive perm camo you can buy for top tiers now, I'd say at very least tier 7's will see a more balanced mm than recently. 

[Personator]

With tier 7, I'm usually seeing tier 5, just like Eurobeat has said. And Colorado is also a very accurate BB - has the same sigma as Warspite but much better penetration due to heavier and larger shells. However, Colorado has only similar playstyle to NM, not the same. If CO sees planes, it can handle them alone better than NM would be able to. Additionally, due to the different penetration mechanics of CO's 16", it's more viable just to spam AP at everything you see, including bow-on USN dreadnoughts. I've maanged to bow-citadel other NMs / COs with the CO before

[DoctorMcDerp]

I love tier 7.  I'm fine even as bottom tier, mainly because of Pensacola's penetrate everything AP rounds and the Mahan's long range torps, and the streams of HE and endless fires with the ARP cruisers is also fun.

[SovereignEagle]

In fact, were it not for the seriously bad ships in T7, Colorado and Nagato would also not flatter anyone with their stats.

There are bad ships at Tier 7? Let alone seriously bad. I can't speak for the CVs, but every ship at Tier 7 I've used has been strong. 

 

 

Biggest thing to note about the Colorado is that while she has a very small health pool compared to the other Tier 7 battleships, she also has the best heal. Meaning if you can disengage from combat (either via getting into concealment or eliminating the enemy) and then pop back out again, you can still tank a huge amount of damage. 

 

Colorado's 406mm guns also uptier exceptionally well. They are also accurate and you'll be loving the increased turret traverse and lower reload speed.

[atPrick__]

Colorado can more than handle her tier but...

 

Map movement has to be direct, you do not have the luxury of going to the wrong place on the map. Colorado has the problem of always being late to the party, either an engagement is already won or lost before you get close enough to have an effect. Which can lead to overcompensating and pushing to hard.

 

It makes her difficult to get accustomed to, she is the slowest ship in the game for her tier.

 

But...

She is a [edited]tank and rewards players for playing her recklessly and brutally.

 

T7 is the sweet spot for mm right now, which means you will be even or top tier a lot but like any BB she struggles when bottom tier. Iowa and Izumo even played poorly will wreck a Colorado.

[IronWolfV]

atsf: "You are guaranteed to be top tier almost every match."

 

In my post about the New Mexico (how I am enjoying it), I was recommended to move to the Colorado which has the same playstyle. Centarina also recommended me to get it. It's one tier higher, which makes me sort of concerned and I've heard horror stories about it. I've also heard that Tier 7 is the place to be in terms of MM. I'm wondering how often does T7 see matches with lots of 5s and 6s? How often does it see matches with 9-12 T7 enemies? How often does it see T8 and 9? I especially hate maps like Land of Fire, North, Two Brothers, Hotspot, Northern Lights, and Trap. How does the Colorado perform? I'm also thinking of trying the Warspite as it's same tier as NM, has 15-inch guns and a 2.0 sigma meaning very good accuracy compared to the NM. It should have pretty much the same brawling / tanky kind of playstyle as the NM, if I'm not wrong.

 

Honestly I see just as many top tier matches in my Scharnhorst as I do being 1 or 2 tiers lower.  It's almost 50/50 unlike 5 and 6 these days.

[IronWolfV]

With tier 7, I'm usually seeing tier 5, just like Eurobeat has said. And Colorado is also a very accurate BB - has the same sigma as Warspite but much better penetration due to heavier and larger shells. However, Colorado has only similar playstyle to NM, not the same. If CO sees planes, it can handle them alone better than NM would be able to. Additionally, due to the different penetration mechanics of CO's 16", it's more viable just to spam AP at everything you see, including bow-on USN dreadnoughts. I've maanged to bow-citadel other NMs / COs with the CO before

 

But heaven help you if a Scharnhorst or worse yet Gneisneau comes barreling it at you full steam and gets to short range brawling.  Can be a VERY bad day since the CO's secondary is split up between half great secondaries and half garbage.

[Sovek1944]

I just sold my Colorado in a fit of frustration. I've never liked the ship because of one singular issue. When she's uptiered, you're screwed. Any T8 BB with 16" or better guns will citadel it from the front or rear (trust me on this), and it suffers from two big issues, speed and health.

 

I've had better luck with the NM at T6 vs T8s than the Colorado in T8 matches, to say nothing of 9s.

[Xero_Snake]

In general, Tier VII is the "turning point" pivot from your comfort zone to prepare yourself for a more hardcore gameplay - especially when dealing with Tier IX.

[IronWolfV]

In general, Tier VII is the "turning point" pivot from your comfort zone to prepare yourself for a more hardcore gameplay - especially when dealing with Tier IX.

 

Yeah first run through with tier 9 was trying in the Baltimore. Roon much as I like the ship is giving me plain fits.

[Battlecruiser_Amagi]

There are a multitude of stat intricacies that makes NM and lolorado not very different at all.

NM is better in T6 than lolorado is in T7.

 

In fact, were it not for the seriously bad ships in T7, Colorado and Nagato would also not flatter anyone with their stats.

 

 

Icon	Name	Tier	Type	Nation	Battles	WR ▲	Dmg	XP	K/D	Sh☠	Pl☠	Srv	MBH	TH
	Ranger	7	CV	USA	20,802	47.08%	41,676	1,047	1.6	0.7	12.5	57%	0%	0%
	ARP Haguro	7	CA/CL	Japan	23,360	48.10%	28,029	874	0.7	0.5	0.9	22%	28%	5%
	Pensacola	7	CA/CL	USA	45,732	48.25%	27,186	967	0.7	0.5	1.0	23%	29%	0%
	ARP Nachi	7	CA/CL	Japan	21,050	48.59%	28,776	910	0.7	0.6	0.9	22%	29%	5%
	ARP Ashigara	7	CA/CL	Japan	16,653	48.59%	30,232	930	0.8	0.6	1.0	22%	29%	5%
	Mahan	7	DD	USA	56,520	48.82%	21,467	1,022	0.7	0.6	0.1	20%	35%	6%
	Akatsuki	7	DD	Japan	42,740	48.88%	26,276	946	0.9	0.7	0.1	24%	41%	6%
	Colorado	7	BB	USA	74,627	49.13%	42,587	1,011	1.1	0.7	1.0	38%	25%	0%
	Yorck	7	CA/CL	Germany	32,768	49.24%	29,084	1,010	0.8	0.6	0.8	26%	28%	7%
	Nagato	7	BB	Japan	44,118	49.38%	47,817	1,078	1.2	0.8	1.1	38%	25%	0%
	Old Hatsuharu	7	DD	Japan	13,638	49.72%	23,156	1,063	0.8	0.6	0.3	28%	44%	7%
	Kiev	7	DD	USSR	19,259	50.43%	30,814	1,162	0.9	0.7	0.2	24%	41%	8%
	Myoko	7	CA/CL	Japan	29,350	50.43%	33,801	1,018	0.9	0.7	0.9	28%	29%	5%
	ARP Myoko	7	CA/CL	Japan	9,629	50.46%	32,143	975	0.8	0.6	1.0	24%	30%	5%
	Shchors	7	CA/CL	USSR	20,952	50.82%	39,683	1,152	1.1	0.8	0.6	27%	28%	10%
	Indianapolis	7	CA/CL	USA	8,884	50.83%	28,811	1,138	0.7	0.6	1.1	22%	30%	0%
	Sims	7	DD	USA	23,602	51.44%	23,519	1,412	0.9	0.6	0.5	27%	36%	6%
	Gneisenau	7	BB	Germany	71,855	51.50%	49,598	1,150	1.4	0.9	2.5	35%	29%	14%
	Atlanta	7	CA/CL	USA	45,576	52.53%	29,884	1,237	1.0	0.7	2.3	23%	27%	10%
	Hiryu	7	CV	Japan	14,673	52.98%	49,590	1,141	2.9	0.9	14.3	69%	0%	0%
	Scharnhorst	7	BB	Germany	63,004	54.03%	53,282	1,399	1.6	1.0	1.8	36%	28%	15%
	Leningrad	7	DD	USSR	10,814	54.08%	30,303	1,257	1.1	0.8	0.1	31%	44%	6%
	Fiji	7	CA/CL	UK	27,217	54.30%	44,272	1,342	1.6	1.0	1.0	35%	33%	9%
	Błyskawica	7	DD	Poland	14,872	54.72%	34,270	1,247	1.2	0.8	0.1	32%	42%	6%
	Saipan	7	CV	USA	9,040	55.64%	48,405	1,394	3.1	0.9	20.8	72%	0%	0%
	Belfast	7	CA/CL	UK	28,622	56.26%	44,917	1,432	1.6	1.0	1.4	36%	34%	0%
	Shiratsuyu	7	DD	Japan	15,852	57.12%	38,919	1,381	1.7	1.0	0.2	39%	45%	7%
	Flint	7	CA/CL	USA	1,369	66.84%	58,368	1,743	2.4	1.4	3.7	41%	35%	7%

 

 

Poi! Interesting that the Shiratsuyu has high WR. I barely even see her in battles. It's average MG isn't even that high, too. Hmmm.

[Fodder4U]

T7 at least for me seems to be a sweet spot. Most often than not I am top tier. This is yet another reason why I love my Scharnhorst so much but even when bottom tier in it I generally don't have to change my playstyle much to win matches.

[IronWolfV]

T7 at least for me seems to be a sweet spot. Most often than not I am top tier. This is yet another reason why I love my Scharnhorst so much but even when bottom tier in it I generally don't have to change my playstyle much to win matches.

 

Amen. when you're bottom tier, angle, spam HE till short range,then unleash the AP.

[Menemy]

Always has. Nagato, Myoko, Saipan, Kiev, Hiryuu (when not fighting Saipans), Pensacola (in the hands of someone that knows AP exists), Gneisenau, Scharnhorst, Mahan, Shiratsuyu. These are all competitive in T8 and some in T9, now that they are top tier it's just uncensored seal clubbing.

[IronWolfV]

Always has. Nagato, Myoko, Saipan, Kiev, Hiryuu (when not fighting Saipans), Pensacola (in the hands of someone that knows AP exists), Gneisenau, Scharnhorst, Mahan, Shiratsuyu. These are all competitive in T8 and some in T9, now that they are top tier it's just uncensored seal clubbing.

 

Forgot Gneisneau, Scharnhorst, Blyskawika, Atlanta, Flint, Belfast.