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Gavroche_

Tier VIII+ ships with good AA, and those without:

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Good AA:

BBs: 

North Carolina, Iowa, Montana, Fredrick de Grosse

CAs:

Baltimore, Des Moines, Admiral Hipper, Prinz Eugen, Roon, Hindenburg, Zao, Chappy, Kutuzov, Dimitri Donskoi, Moskva, Neptune, Minotaur

CVs:

Lexington, Essex, Midway, Shokaku, Taiho, Hakuryu 

DDs:

Fletcher, Gearing

 

Ships with bad AA:

Amagi, Izumo, Yamato, Bismarck, Grosser Kurfurst, New Orleans, Mogami, Atago/Takao, Ibuki (sorta), Edinburgh, Benson/ Lo Yang,Tashkent, Udaloi, Khabarovsk, Fubuki, Kagero, Shimakaze

 

Anyone disagree?

 

Edited by Gavorche

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Good AA:

BBs: 

North Carolina, Iowa, Montana, Fredrick de Grosse

CAs:

Baltimore, Des Moines, Admiral Hipper, Prinz Eugen, Roon, Hindenburg, Zao, Chappy, Kutuzov, Dimitri Donskoi, Moskva, Neptune, Minotaur

CVs:

Lexington, Essex, Midway, Shokaku, Taiho, Hakuryu 

DDs:

Fletcher, Gearing

 

Ships with bad AA:

Amagi, Izumo, Yamato, Bismarck, Grosser Kurfurst, New Orleans, Mogami, Atago/Takao, Ibuki (sorta), Edinburgh, Benson/ Lo Yang,Tashkent, Udaloi, Khabarovsk, Fubuki, Kagero, Shimakaze

 

Anyone disagree?

 

 

Zao has pretty crap AA and that happens to be one of its' few weaknesses

 

These ships have pretty debatable AA: Chappy, Admiral Hipper, Prinz Eugen, and Roon (I think they are more so on the weak side)

Edited by FratStar4Life

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In contrast, Ship tier iii-iV with good AA:

Yuubari, Texas

Ships with virtually nonexistent AA;

Everything else.

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If it can use Defensive Fire, it should be classified as "good AA" because of the widespread mechanic.

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In contrast, Ship tier iii-iV with good AA:

Yuubari, Texas

Ships with virtually nonexistent AA;

Everything else.

 

Arkansas Beta FTW! :trollface:

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Zao has pretty crap AA and that happens to be one of its' few weaknesses

 

These ships have pretty debatable AA: Chappy, Admiral Hipper, Prinz Eugen, and Roon (I think they are more so on the weak side)

 

Chappyev and Roon are debatable IMO, I've seen a Zao get 60+ plane kills against me in my (admittedly stock) Taiho. I still didn't manage to sink the bastard in the end. Hipper has some pretty decent AA, IMO, or at least, I tend to stay away from them.

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I wouldn't say that the Benson (C hull) or the Lo Yang have bad AA specially with the addition of DF (it helps more than you would think). 

 

Yeah, but most Bensons tend to run the B-Hull without the AA consumable and most Lo Yangs run hydro.

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Good AA:

BBs: 

North Carolina, Iowa, Montana, Fredrick de Grosse

CAs:

Baltimore, Des Moines, Admiral Hipper, Prinz Eugen, Roon, Hindenburg, Zao, Chappy, Kutuzov, Dimitri Donskoi, Moskva, Neptune, Minotaur

CVs:

Lexington, Essex, Midway, Shokaku, Taiho, Hakuryu 

DDs:

Fletcher, Gearing

 

Ships with bad AA:

Amagi, Izumo, Yamato, Bismarck, Grosser Kurfurst, New Orleans, Mogami, Atago/Takao, Ibuki (sorta), Edinburgh, Benson/ Lo Yang,Tashkent, Udaloi, Khabarovsk, Fubuki, Kagero, Shimakaze

 

Anyone disagree?

 

 

The last time I took out my Amagi resulted in a Lexington crying about how I ate his full squadron of torpedo bombers with my AA.

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Ships with bad AA:

 

Amagi

 

Amagi isn't automatically a menace to bombers, but when built around AA, it's quite potent:

O8OxVWj.png

 

 

These ships have pretty debatable AA: Chappy

 

Chapayev built for AA is extremely effective at-tier. During defensive AA fire, it puts out nearly as much AA DPS as a fully upgraded North Carolina. Observe:

 HTvItx1.png

mTcj18t.png

EjVU0QR.png

 

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My Atlanta eats planes and spits them out, nom nom nom!

 

When it has DF.

 

Without it's DF it's nothing.

 

Psst here's a secret. AA spec makes almost all ships good at AA and planes will fear even DDs. Don't tell the CV players.

 

Don't tell the CV players? So you're going to gimp yourself in 80% of the situations so you'll maybe stand a better chance in the remaining 20?

 

And CVs stay away from ships with strong AA anyway, as a matter of fact.

 

My Hindenburg an Iowa are both AA specced, and they both chew up any planes that get close. But no one ever sends their friggen planes my way.

 

I've hung out alone, and had CVs pass me over to attack 2 grouped ships somewhere else with weaker individual AA.

 

AA builds just aren't that worth it.

Edited by issm

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When you are up against good CV players it is worth it to AA spec. MAA is the best captain skill of its tier. You only lose 4 captain levels and 1 module just to be almost immune to one class of ship. Not only that, but CVs have no idea who is actually built to counter them so they will lose a lot of their damage going after you, and when the CV player is good this can save the lives of one or two teammates.

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In contrast, Ship tier iii-iV with good AA:

Yuubari, Texas

Ships with virtually nonexistent AA;

Everything else.

 

Wait, isn't Texas T5?

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Wait, isn't Texas T5?

 

Whoops, it's supposed to be tier iii-v, the ships that a tier IV carrier can possibly see.

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Some of those destroyers you say have 'bad' AA regularly shoot down my planes when I'm trying to keep them spotted. In my mind that means they have 'good' AA.

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When you are up against good CV players it is worth it to AA spec. MAA is the best captain skill of its tier. You only lose 4 captain levels and 1 module just to be almost immune to one class of ship. Not only that, but CVs have no idea who is actually built to counter them so they will lose a lot of their damage going after you, and when the CV player is good this can save the lives of one or two teammates.

 

And therein lies the problem.

 

There's no way of knowing when you're going to be up against a good CV player. 25-50% of the time, depending on tier, you aren't even going to be against a CV. Out of those CV matches, how many are actually going to be good?

 

Furthermore, the good ones will know which ships have good AA, and avoid them. Any surprises will be known the first strike, and you'll be added to the "later" list.

 

You give up so much in exchange for that AA that overall, it's just not worth it.

 

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Fletcher and Gearing only have good AA if they give up engine boost and other modules--and good CVs like me quickly register them as "later" and inform the team that particular DD is AA-specced, so will hold off spotting until team's ready to chase.

 

I've found that except for Kutuzov, the CAs require DF to pose a real threat. Plus it's very amusing to spot them outside their AA and let my teammates know "this is an AA ship, pls focus." I normally wait for the BB to get weakened before I pounce, though Izumo/Amagi/NC/Bismarck/Tirpitz are generally safe targets to hit right away.

 

High tiers' hangars are huge. Speaking from using my Taiho against even 3/0/2 Essex and doing nasty damage, here's how to defend against CVs at high tier (assuming campfest):

1) At all times stay within 4km of a BB equal to or higher tier than the CV. Support that BB.

2) Ctrl + LMB enemy fighters, never the bombers. Your AA spent killing bombers, unless the CV loves suicide missions, is wasted. Help your CV teammate get air control. His fighter strafe is the best AA usually available save for the rare AA-specced ship. Plus with fighter ammo nerfed and bombers packing the HP buff module, the ammo's far more effective on strafing bombers. It will take time, but running the red CV out of fighters is more important, gives your CV an easier time escorting with his fighters. The fighter-less CV is generally not going to send his bombers where last he saw your team's fighters patrolling.

3) Take Hydro for spotting DD torps sooner, since CV cannot always do that. DF is easily baited by staggered bomber attacks and even the premium version takes 2 minutes to come off CD. Generally DD torps, not CV sorties, are the main threat to your BB escort.

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