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Found 12 results

  1. So, Kelorn posted a very good commander skills guide yesterday, but he mentioned he didn't address DD skills due to not being as strong in DDs as he is in other ships. So I said I'd write a capt skills guide for DDs since I'm a DD main. Here it is. Intro and bona fides: I am above average in destroyer play (1117 WTR, 57% win rate over last 90 days), but certainly not unicum. I certainly advise players to look at multiple sources for advice besides this guide, as there are differing opinions as to optimal captain skills and I dislike the mentality many have of 'this is the one twue way to play DDs', but my captain builds do work well for my playstyle. I tend to play very aggressively in DDs, but I also prioritize winning over dealing damage and getting kills. For example, if I need to flex across the map to defend something or to cap when we need a cap, I do that even if it means lower personal damage, because I play for the win. On DDs that are pure damage-dealers like Khabarovsk, I may play more of a DPM-oriented style, but on boats that are good at cap control like USN DDs, I focus more on capping. And even in Khab I probably try to cap more than I should since so many DDs won't, but I digress. These builds are primarily optimized for maximizing chances to win matches while playing solo in random battles. The first build listed for each ship is intended to be a 'balanced' build that optimizes the strengths of that particular ship while providing the versatility to do other basic DD tasks (spotting, capping, cap control, and hunting/killing) as well as possible for that ship. Some ships have alternate builds listed that may work better if running in a division or in Ranked/Clan battles; these builds are usually a better build to optimize the ship's strengths if you have trusted teammates along to help in other tasks. The first build listed for each ship is what I am personally running on that ship except where I've noted that I am trying to decide between the listed builds. The two most discussed new skills and how I incorporate them: IF/HE: I use IF/HE on some boats but not others, as IF/HE is only a benefit if it allows the ship to penetrate armor it can't penetrate without the skill. Shiratsuyu, Akizuki, Clemson, Lenin, and Farragut all benefit from IF/HE as the ships they face often have armor that can be penetrated with IF/HE but not without, which makes it worth the 3% decrease in fire chance. Some DDs don't benefit, or they don't benefit enough to make it worth using 4 capt skill points and/or a 3% reduction in fire chance. See the following for more information about IF/HE, I used this information extensively in developing my captain builds and am indebted to the original posters for their work in these guides. Flametz's IF/HE guide Killjoy1941's IF/HE guide RPF/Radiolocation: I don't use this skill. Why? I have close to 5000 games in DDs. So I have very strong instincts for where DDs will go in a match, and I have very strong minimap awareness and know how long it takes for a DD to get from the point it was last spotted to other places on map. RPF has a high opportunity cost (4 points) and on every one of my ships, I'd have to give up other skills I really want to get RPF. Yes, it can be useful late-game. Yes, it can help you hunt other DDs, or know where the nearest unspotted ship is to avoid getting spotted yourself. However, not using RPF forces you to hone your instincts and gives you more available points for other skills. There are players that swear by using RPF. But I don't, and my builds reflect that. I recommend doing without. Even without having RPF, you get an icon on your screen when someone is locating your direction via RPF; I've had several kills now where I was able to use RPF against a player by determining where they were using the timing of me getting that icon. If I look at where other friendlies are when the icon pops up, I can often figure out where the ship using RPF is even if I haven't spotted them yet. RPF is a crutch, and for someone that hasn't played as much DD as I have, maybe a useful one for them, but I am a better player than I would have been otherwise because I learned how to anticipate where ships would be without using it. My DD builds. Notes: Each build's skills are listed in the order in which you should get them. If build is for less than 19 points, that means I really don't see a 'best' way to use the point left over. All builds assume that you are using the Concealment Upgrade Mod if DD is tier 8+. Shiratsuyu (this build is also good for Hatsuharu, and works well for Shinonome/Kamikaze) Primary (I use this one) - 'GunboatPOI' build : Priority Target, Last Stand, Demolition Expert, Concealment Expert, Advanced Firing Training, Inertia Fuse/High Explosive, Alternate - 'TorpedoPOI' build: PM, LS, DE, CE, AFT, Torpedo Armament Expert, Adrenaline Rush Discussion: Given that I run premium torpedo reload booster, I choose to optimize my guns instead of my torps, especially since TAE is now a 3-point skill. Shiratsuyu can comfortably invisifire even without AFT, but she has good shell arcs and can land shots consistently even out to the edge of her AFT-extended range. IF/HE allows her to do direct penetration damage to 25mm plating, which means many sections of cruisers as well as the bow and stern of same-tier and lower BBs. The alternate build forgos IF/HE, but has a better fire chance because of it. You get faster torp reloads in between uses of torp reload booster (which may mean not needing to run the premium version) and can pick up an extra 2-point skill (I recommend adrenaline rush since I play aggressively and usually take damage throughout the game.) Akizuki (as Akizuki is very different from other IJN boats, this is a specialized build) Primary (I use this one) - Wreck Face build: Priority Target, Last Stand, Demolition Expert, Concealment Expert, Inertia Fuse/High Explosive, Advanced Firing Training. Discussion: Since I already had a 19-pt capt ready for Akizuki and at least two of the three 4-pt skills are must-haves to get the most out of her, I struggled with the order in which to equip skills if you don't have a 14-point captain at least. Basically, don't even bother playing Akizuki without *at least* a 14-point captain ready to go for her, as she's almost unplayable without IF/HE and either AFT or CE. Without IF/HE, she can't pen same-tier or higher DDs with HE shells.With IF/HE she's a fearsome DD hunter. DE offsets the lost fire chance from IF/HE. She has a workable invisifire window without CE or AFT (assuming you're running concealment upgrade mod.) AFT allows you to fire at ships 12+ km out, but CE increases your concealment so you can invisifire from closer-in. CE also improves her ability to control caps and be more versatile and survivable; it also helps keep her from being surprised by other DDs spotting her first and using their speed advantage to run her down and/or keep her spotted. With how low her speed is and because cap control is so important in randoms, I think CE is marginally more important than AFT. AFT is still important, because it gives her an even larger invisifire window and allows Akizuki to stay back where she's less likely to get run down, because she is the slowest DD by far in her tier range. Alternatively, if you give up AFT, you can get BFT and have two points left over for Adrenaline Rush. While I would not use the BFT+AR in place of AFT if you play mostly solo, it could be workable if you play in divisions a lot since you can rely on your divmates to cover you if you do get rushed by a faster ship. Clemson (Clemson is unique in the USN line and so this is a specialized build, all higher-tier USN DDs have terrible shell arcs and do not need AFT): Primary (I use this one) - Seal Club Extraordinaire build: Priority Target, Last Stand, Demolition Expert, Advanced Firing Training, Inertia Fuse/High Explosive, Concealment Expert Alternate - Maximum DPM build: PM, LS, DE, AFT, IF/HE, Basic Firing Training, Adrenaline Rush. Discussion: I never ran CE on my Clemson until 0.6.0, as it precluded my ability to run DE and AFT and I play my Clemson like a Russian DD, merrily flying across the map spraying fire like a madman. However, I've tried CE now that I can do AFT+DE+CE and the extra .6km stealth does help a lot with capping early-game. I had a hard carry in Clemson this morning where the extra stealth kept me alive...we were down by 3 ships, and came back to win, but I would have been killed several times without the extra stealth window as I was able to keep from getting cornered and/or complete capping without getting seen. While Clemson is still first and foremost a gunboat and I don't worry about being spotted most of the time, it's a nice bit of versatility, and gives her a usable invisifire window. Clemson has very good shell arcs and so benefits from AFT. Starting with B-hull Nicholas, USN guns suffer from terrible ballistics and so I do not recommend AFT for other USN DDs. IF/HE allows you to penetrate the bow and stern of BBs. DE offsets the lowered fire chance of IF/HE. The alternate 'Maximum DPS' build listed boosts your gun ROF and increases both gun and torp ROF as you take damage, but you give up most of your invisifire window and lose a bit of versatility. I've tried both builds and I stay alive longer and do more damage with the primary build I listed and am able to secure caps better, which as I've mentioned is a big advantage in randoms as you often can't get capping help from other ships (especially in low tiers such as Clemson plays in) Farragut (this build is just as good for B-hull Nicholas or Mahan) Primary (I use this one) - Swiss Army Knife build: Priority Target, Last Stand, Demolition Expert, Concealment Expert, Inertia Fuse/High Explosive, AR, Survivability Expert (can alternate Basic Fire Training instead) Discussion: Farragut is the most underrated ship in the game, IMO. She is the best cap control boat relative to her tier in the game. She has an advantage in a knife fight versus almost any ship she sees; she's at least close to even against even Benson and Mahan. The only ship I really struggle to beat in a knife fight is Akizuki. Her torps are very good; you can't *quite* stealthtorp but you can come close, especially at ships that are coming toward you or angling toward you since there's only a .3km difference in torp range versus concealment range. She's fast, maneuverable, and tough. IF/HE is a big help for Farragut in penetrating BB bow and stern plating of T5-7 BBs as well as significant portions of still will not be able to penetrate t8 BBs except for the superstructure, but there's a lot of ships you'll penetrate more often than you did before if you use IF/HE. I use SE as the extra hp helps when knife-fighting, especially against a Mahan, Sims, or Benson. BFT is also a strong choice, they're neck and neck. Depends on your playstyle. I would definitely use SE in place of BFT with a Mahan or a Benson as the benefit from SE increases as one climbs tiers. Fletcher (also valid for Benson) Primary (I use this one) - Fletcher Gonna Fletch build: Priority Target, Last Stand, Demolition Expert, Concealment Expert, Survivability Expert, Basic Firing Training, Adrenaline Rush (alternatively, drop AR and you can get another 3-point skill like superintendent or torpedo armament expert) Discussion: Fletcher is the pinnacle of the USN line ( I prefer it even to Gearing), and the build I use is similar to my Farragut build. The main difference is IF/HE is of *very* limited benefit compared to Farragut, since they have the same guns but Fletcher sees mostly t8+ BBs, with thicker armor plating that resists penetration even with IF/HE equipped. I decided that for Fletcher, the higher fire chance without IF/HE outweighed the cruisers that Fletcher could penetrate with IF/HE but not without it. Also, Fletch has very good AA and gets more benefit from SE at tier 9, so dropping IF/HE allows one to get SE and BFT, and if you drop adrenaline rush you can even get TAE or Super. Since Fletcher is a very good stealthtorp boat, TAE is more attractive on her than most USN boats. Z-23 (150mm guns) Primary (I use this one) - Schadenfreude for Days build: Priority Target, Last Stand, Demolition Expert, Concealment Expert, Inertia Fuse/High Explosive, Adrenaline Rush, Survivability Expert. Discussion: I am not currently playing any other German DDs besides this, so can only discuss the 150mm Z-23. Not a fan of the DDs leading up to the Z-23 but the Z-23 with 150mm guns is a keeper; I've fallen in love with this boat. Once I get the tier 9 Z-46 and test some builds, I will edit this post to include a recommended build for 128mm gun-equipped German boats. While the 150mm guns have good ballistics, AFT (and BFT) have no effect on them, the only DD guns to not be affected by these skills. Then again, the 128mm guns on other German DDs don't have the shell arcs needed to make AFT an optimal choice anyway. The 150mm guns do have a much better fire chance than the 128s, so I chose to buff that fire chance with DE. IF/HE allows them to penetrate the bow and stern of enemy BBs up to t10 (except for Grosser Kurfurst bow) and large portions of most cruisers. These are gunboats and will take damage, so Adrenaline Rush helps boost the slow ROF of the 150mm guns as you take damage. Leningrad (assuming you have a dedicated captain for her) Primary - Glorious Soviet Stronk Victory build: PM, EM, Last Stand, DE, CE, AFT, Basic Firing Training Alternate (high risk) - In Soviet Russia, DD Penetrates You build: Priority Target, Expert Marksman, Demolition Expert, Concealment Expert, Advanced Firing Training, Inertia Fuse/High Explosive Alternate - Speedy Sniper Build: PT, EM, LS, DE, AFT, IF/HE, BFT Discussion: Leningrad is a bit of an odd duck amongst Russian DDs in that she is a decent stealthtorp/cap control boat with CE, so I chose to keep CE as a 'must-have' skill on her for randoms. If I was divisioning more or playing her in competitive play, I'd probably use the sniper build as it accentuates her strengths, but for solo randoms I like the flexibility CE gives me for capping. The first build is a high-risk build; Leningrad has terrible turret traverse and badly needs EM to keep guns on target as she maneuvers, so you have to give up Last Stand in order to have CE, AFT, and IF/HE. With IF/HE, she can pen much of the plating of t7 BBs, although she still can't pen t8+ BBs anywhere but the superstructure so it's a trade-off. The second build gives up IF/HE. This lowers your penetration damage as you can't pen as many ships in as many places, but that does increase your fire chance and you're able to keep Last Stand and pick up BFT. I would only recommend using the first build (without LS) if you're running premium damage control and premium smoke, as if you do lose your engines, you're going to need to either fix them quick or hide quick. I may come back and edit this; I'm going to test the high-risk build for another ten-twenty matches in Leningrad and see how badly my survivability is hampered by skipping Last Stand. I will edit this if I change my mind about the viability of the high-risk build. but so far it's working for me. Edit: The DD Penetrates You build is EXTREMELY high-risk and I have bumped it to an alternate build. When it works, it works beautifully, but even with the 40-second cooldown with premium DC, it really hurts survivability for aggressive gunboating (and Leningrad begs for aggressive gunboating.) Khabarovsk Primary (I will probably use this one for randoms) - Stronk and Versatile Build: Priority Target, Last Stand, Demolition Expert, Advanced Firing Training, Concealment Expert, Survivability Expert, Adrenaline Rush Alternate (my probable setup if/when there are t10 clan battles) - Speed-Tanking Sniper Build: PT, LS, DE, AFT, Inertia Fuse/High Explosive, SE, AR Alternate - Smoke+Shoot Flamethrower Build: PT, LS, DE, AFT, BFT, SE, Superintendent. Discussion: Ah, Khabarovsk. In a perfect world, I'd say screw CE. I didn't use CE on Khab before 0.6.0 as I couldn't run AFT+DE otherwise. But the recent range nerf to Khab, and CE becoming a 4-point skill as opposed to 5 points, makes CE a more intriguing pick for Khab. On the one hand, Khab's biggest potential contribution is as a pure DPM dealer, speeding along at 40+ knots spraying fire merrily at all comers, using its speed and maneuverability to dodge fire and laugh at everything shooting at her (except for Zao and Moskva, because their railguns can actually hit Khab from long range.) On the other hand, the t10 meta means that sometimes other DDs don't do their job, and I find myself trying to cap in my Khab even though she's way too visible to do it well. And with the range nerf a few months ago, I do take a lot more hits than I used to and I do sometimes need to stop firing and get concealment back so I can pop up elsewhere and start spreading HE love again. I think the second or third build is stronger for division play or clan battles as it allows Khab to be used to its greatest strengths. The second build gives Khab IF/HE, which allows her to pen t8 and t9 cruisers, plus Des Moines and Minotaur, anywhere but the armor belt and penetrate Moskva, Zao, and Hindenberg through their bow and stern plating. The third build forgoes IF/HE, which of course increases fire chance, and uses those points for BFT (higher ROF) and Superintendent (extra smoke and extra speed boost). The first listed build is interesting for the current super-campy, people-afraid-to-push t10 meta as it sacrifices IF/HE for CE. While Khab has terrible concealment even with CE, this gives the Khab a bit more ability to push up without getting spotted and focused, and at least a limited ability to cap, especially mid or late game. I hate to waste 4 points on CE when ideally Khab would always be focused on maximizing DPM and speed-tanking, but given that sometimes one has to use Khab in suboptimal ways to compensate for other DDs that won't play to win, this helps make her a bit more versatile.
  2. Just a simple question.....does RPF hold as much value for IJN DD's in Ranked as it does Randoms? Is there any value in it at all in competitive?
  3. I just got RPFed for like the 13th time this week, and I still haven't been killed! This is so broken! Only the best players use this ability, and yet I live. How can War Gaming allow this to happen? This is not the advertised OP, and the re-advertised again as REALLY THIS TIME OPness I was being told of. I feel like people are being some how cheated out of sinking me with this "I Win Button" and it should be reviewed and improvement promptly. Game breaking.
  4. There was a lot of drama with RPF before 0.6.0 came out. Well, now we've had a month to play around with various captain skill builds, and to finalize them before the skill reset discount was over. So, this is what I'm wondering: how many of your captains have kept the RPF skill? Personally, I only kept RPF on my Benson captain, which I'll also use on my Sims -- I think this might be rather useful for ranked battles. I also kept free four points on my Shima captain, and maybe will add RPF at some point in the future, I still haven't made up my mind about that. That's it. All my other captains don't have RPF. I found other captain skills much more useful. What about you?
  5. No gimmicks, vote yes or no according to your own rationals which could be anything.
  6. Just wondering what everyone's thoughts are on having RPF on destroyers? I was thinking personally that it might be nice to necessary to have but could be situational. I've had games where I was the last one left in a game playing one of my DD's and our team WAS winning and then suddenly there's 4 enemy's left and you're the last DD (last hope). So you try to maintain caps and keep the score ahead without dying, and I've won a couple of games for my teams that way. With RPF depending on who's left especially if it's cruisers who I think are more likely to be running that skill then you could need to have RPF as well so you know what direction the closest enemy is to you so you can hope to stay alive. Otherwise it's just an unfair fight. There's no more hiding and waiting out the clock, which really isn't fair if your team racked up a 850 - 450 score and suddenly a bunch of allies got killed. Your team won by points and maybe there's 3 minutes left on the clock to do it if you're that DD or whoever you are that's left. But you need to know where your enemies are coming from especially if they have RPF and are hunting you down actively which they will be.
  7. Lots of complaints about recent changes today. Lots of people even claiming they will never play DDs again until they undo these changes. I'm a hardcore DD player so I had to check out these changes for myself. Played 8 US DD games today from Tier6 to Tier10 (all US ships). I "never" division (see my stats) so all games are purely random with no division mates to help me. After 8 games, WT Rating for DD games today was 2,968 with a 75% win ratio. Average damage 91,369 (The Gearing game was 190K+). My impressions? 1. RPF makes me a better DD player. Some examples: When I see a lone BB or CA, I now know when he is truly alone. Twice today when in smoke, I was warned that someone was charging me when the radio detection suddenly changed from the ship I was shooting at to an approaching DD. RPF also prepares me to point my guns at the right place during the initial engagement (or if someone is trying to surprise me). Having your guns pointed at the right place and knowing how to angle your ship is a huge advantage if you know where the enemy is coming from. 2. I start less fires now because DE doesn't seem to worth it considering the options you have (CE and RPF take a lot already). SE is still worth it for high tier DDs. Those extra Hit Points have saved me a lot of times. 3. Priority Target is awesome for DDs. Even if detected I can keep on shooting until I see someone actually bothers to aim at me. If its just a 1 v 1 situation, I keep shooting. But if 2+ target me, time to pop smoke or run and find cover behind an island. So far I don't my DD game negatively affected by these changes. Some people may have to adjust to them but I don't understand why some DD players complain that it is a serious nerf and they will stop playing DDs entirely.
  8. Only Sith deal in absolutes. As such, I'm taking a more nuetral and pragmatic view on this yet to be released Captain skill. Let me know your thoughts on it, though I suspect I know what they are. I'd prefer too discuss both the good and bad. Also, as a BB lover, I'm skipping out on this one. Too many more important skills. I think this is a CL skill and actually, I think DDs can use it to great affect.
  9. RPF (or, as it's now called, Radio Location) is not OP. It's not something that DDs should be afraid of, or any other ship. But I still think it's a terrible idea given the current game meta, not for what the skill can do, but for the effects the skill will have on an already camptastic high-tier meta. I played the test server extensively and tested out skills and builds with various ship lines, and as I suspected, the RPF skill is not that big a deal for smart players. I'm a DD main, and I'm fine with facing it. Why? Opportunity cost. If someone spends 4 points on RPF, that's 4 points they can't spend elsewhere, weakening their build. Good players have solid instincts for knowing where ships are, where they'll appear, the flow of the game. RPF is useless to those players, and for potatoes, they won't be able to make good use of it and they'll be giving up other valuable skills. For example, with German BBs...if you take RPF, it's going to be a suboptimal build. My German BBs will use a secondary build (for a 19pt capt): Preventive Maintenance, Jack of All Trades, Expert Marksman or high alert (haven't decided yet), Super (for extra charge of heal and hydro), BFT, AFT, and Manual Secondaries. 19 points. You can't get RPF without giving up a needed skill for a secondary build (imo). It's even worse for cruisers and DDs; I've theorycrafted builds for most of my ships and there's no way that RPF doesn't block you from getting a more useful skill, because 4 points. So, why do I think RPF is a mistake and should not be included? Because potatoes. The NA server is campy AF. And it's hard enough to get DDs to go cap. Hell, part of the reason I play mostly DD is because it's so obnoxious to lose games when DDs won't cap and play the objective. So now, you've got this skill that every potato on the server thinks is OP, and every potato DD driver thinks will result in being permaspotted. Which means getting DDs to push up, cap, and spot will become even harder. Getting cruisers to play aggressive will become even harder. People will camp harder. The high-tier meta is already damn near unplayable, and now you're adding a skill which will make everyone BUT battleships afraid to push up...and that might be worth it if most BBs would play more aggressively as a result, but let's be honest, they won't. So everyone will camp in back and t10 will be even more miserable. RPF is not a skill that people should be afraid of, but they are. As a DD main, radar did not ruin my game. I adapted. RPF will not ruin my game. I will adapt. But there are so many DDs who freak out about radar and won't push or cap or scout (you'd think they'd just stop playing DD if they're afraid to go do DD stuff, but that makes too much sense.) I see RPF as being just like radar; it will create more lopsided steamrolls when you have DDs on one side that are smart and push, and DDs on the other side that are like "OMGWTFBBQ THEY HAVE RPF I CAN'T GO CAP BECAUSE THEY'LL KNOW EXACTLY WHERE I AM OMGPANIC!" Those are the games that make me just stop playing for a day or two or three because it's so frustrating. Close, hard fought losses are part of the game. I can get enjoyment out of a loss, if it was a good game. But when I go on a streak and lose t10 game after t10 game where I'm performing at or above server avg level but my teams are terrified to push, that makes the game not fun anymore. Even when it works against the other side (because I acknowledge this will go both ways, it's just extra frustrating when it happens to my team several times in row,) it's still frustrating, because landslide games aren't as fun as tough, hard-fought, intelligently played matches. And I think RPF is going to exacerbate this problem greatly, not because the skill is OP, but because potatoes will overreact to it. TL;DR: We need to rethink RPF. I am disappointed to see that it is being added to the game. If, overall, NA server players were less whiny about change, smarter about learning the actual effects of skills, and less scared of getting their paint scratched, I'd be totally OK with RPF, because I can adapt to it and it weakens my opponents that choose it. But I am very concerned about how many 'bad losses' we'll see because DDs overreact to the existence of RPF and camp instead of capping and/or spotting. Edit to add this note because some people are missing a major point here: I am not arguing that it can come in handy in some scenarios. It's a potato skill because of the opportunity cost, and the fact that taking it prevents you from using those 4 points on other skills. If it was a 1 or 2 point skill, it'd be silly NOT to take it. I'm glad it's a 4-point skill, because it would be unbalanced if someone could have RPF along with all the other useful skills they want.
  10. For the TL-DW crowd. I don't think RPF should be in game as is. Not because I feel its OP after using it, but because there is no need for it to be in game. It will be ignored by better players and a crutch for beginners. There are other skills that will affect gameplay much more than RPF. Two planes in the air for BBs? Nerfing demo expert coupled with a buffed fire prevention? I promise those will affect things much more than RPF. BTW... TAP (as always) broke news that 0.6.0 will undergo further testing. Their leak was also suppressed. Infer what you will. Also, give me a name for a new series and win a ship. Details in the video.
  11. Disclaimer: I have not played the PTS server as it would take too long to download. If anything is just dead wrong, tell me, and I'll try to change it. I've seen a lot of folks saying basically "This will nerf IJN dds even more," or "It will get rid of the ability of ships to ambush other ships." I agree - to a degree depending on how often it's taken (hence the second question). I think that what this skill specifically will do is negate your ability to ambush ships that take this skill. That seems to somewhat fall in line with the "specialized" builds: you will be immune to ambush tactics, but you'll have to sacrifice either offensive or survivability capabilities of your ship in other situations. You'll also know a general location of ships you may not be able to shoot or sink, and that information will be useful in a variety of situations: (note, these are all based on being the ship being described being the closest to you) - you'll know where at least 1 enemy is headed (caps, flanks) before you even see them - you'll be able to hunt ships at least somewhat better regardless of their stealth - you'll know when ships leave their smoke - you'll know a better location of ships in their smoke if you want to torp them - you'll know if someone is approaching your smoke unseen My own opinion on RPF is that in its current state, I don't want it, but if they modified it somehow I could be open to it. Maybe a range limit, making the marker significantly bigger, or something else along those lines, but I'd still prefer they just not add it.
  12. Much of the discussion of the 0.6.0 captain skills has, explicitly or implicitly, focused on high-skill point captains (usually) played on high-tier ships. What can one do with 14 or 18 points, etc., and what effects will there be on overall gameplay? A lot of concern about specific aspects of the proposed new tree, such as RPF, also does not differentiate its effects on play at different tiers. My thesis here is that it is worth distinguishing predictable effects of the new skill tree on mid versus high-tier play, and that such effects may in fact be opposite in terms of their impact on ship type balance. If in fact the new tree has one set of consequences at high tiers and another one at middle tiers, this will make it unusually difficult to balance overall. Although there has been a lot of discussion about the 0.6.0 skills already, I think it might thus be worthwhile to devote some attention specifically to mid-tier effects. For purposes of this thread, by mid-tier I mean mostly tier 5-8 ships (centering on 6-7), with captains largely in the 10-13 point range at the helm. Given the proposed new 0.6.0 progression table, and assuming a large proportion of the player base that is just moving a captain up a line, using free or credit retraining, with some but not excessive use of dragon flags, etc., I don't think 10 point captains will be the norm until tier 5-6, and I don't think 14 point captains will be common until some way into tier 8. So, in other words, what does the game look like when we consider captains with access to one, but only one, tier 4 skill? (1) I think we see most non-VMF destroyers, many/most cruisers, and some battleships taking CE the first chance they get. CE is currently the must-have skill at T5 for many builds because of the huge advantage it gives in controlling engagement, and I don't see this changing as CE is moved to T4. Many other captains that do not take CE will likely choose some other T4 skill other than RPF to advance some specific build: AS will likewise be must-have for CVs as the first T4 choice, AFT perhaps for VMF destroyers/AA monster wannabes/secondary build psychos, etc. So in other words, in mid-tier play, I don't predict a lot of RPF on the board, and those captains that do choose RPF will be giving up something significant and relevant to their survival chances or offensive capacity. (2) As a result, the "concealment meta" will extend into mid-tier play before RPF makes a large-scale appearance, and this will provide an overall buff to ships that rely most on concealment - i.e., torpedo destroyers. (And this can be true even as the new skills nerf DDs at higher tiers.) Picture a New Fubuki. Now picture a New Fubuki with CE and, possibly, if someone wants to have some giggles at 12 captain points, Torpedo Acceleration, operating in an environment in which radar is still rare and RPF is as well. (The two-for-one airplane skill at T1 may offset this somewhat.) (3) Meanwhile, another hidden effect of the new skill tree will be to take some amount of AA power off the board at mid-tiers. The same Cleveland that would take AFT at T4 will now have to choose between that at the opportunity to take CE earlier; even battleships that might want to spec into AFT and/or MFAA will be choosing between that and concealment. At tier 3, BFT has a lot of competition: BoS for battleships, DE, etc. So again, the net result is that carriers may have less AA to contend with at mid-tiers, even as they may (as some have argued) get the short end of the stick once one is in the realm of 14+ point captains. TL; DR: If one considers not just ultimate, 19-point builds, there is a progression of different effects the new skills may have on the game at different tiers of play, to the extent that they may affect mid- and upper-tier play in contrasting directions, particularly in terms of ship type (BB, CA, DD, CV) balance. Thoughts?