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  1. The Kléber This is a ship that, when it came out, was pretty broken, as evidenced by the wolfpacks we saw in Clan Battles and KOTS. Then, its concealment was nerfed in 9.0, and many people forgot about it, shoved out of the spotlight, never to return... I know, pretty melodramatic. Anyway, on to the review. Quick Disclaimer: I am only a 54% WR player on NA, so take this all with a huge grain of salt. I do have a 59% WR in Kléber over about ~700 games, but this is meant to be more informative. There will be tips, especially with the captain build at the end, but since there are players like Gaishu with 80%+ WRs don't take this advice over much of anyone else's. Credit: Since I am lazy, I will being used WoWs FT for many of the images, so credit goes to them. Skill Floor: Very Challenging. -DDs in general are a difficult class to play, and playing a smokeless DD with poor torp range with no opportunities to inflect harm-free damage, this is doubly so. Skill Floor: High/Very High -Kleber's unique toolkit has the potential to be devestating in the right hands. CVs however can be a major limiting factor. Sections: -Main Battery -Torpedoes -Defense/Hull Mechanics -Concealment -Agility -AA (ha....just no) -Consumables -Upgrades/Captain Skills -Conclusion Main Battery: Kleber sports 8 139 mm barrels, the highest T10 DD caliber in the game, at least until the German DD split is released. These guns are key to Kléber's playstyle, and as such, a detailed look is required. First, let's take a look at the firing angles of Kléber: As you can see, Kleber has excellent firing arcs. In fact, it has the best gun firing arcs out of all T10 DDs. As LWM has often said, 30 degrees or less constitute excellent arcs. As such, Kleber's unified 24 degree arcs are best in class. This comes in handy in many situtions. For example, when kiting (a very strong position for Kleber, as I will discuss later), Kleber can maintain very heavy angling to a target. While this isn't as important in a DD, who don't have armor to angle shells against for the most part, it can be used to reduce overall damage taken. It also allows Kleber to have a very aggresive angle of attack, particularly when pushing and threatening DDs. Use these to your advantage. Let's look at some general stats for her gunnery: 8 139 mm guns 4x2 turrets 13.6 km range 18 sec turn time 7 sec reload. 2000 HE alpha 10% fire chance 2700 AP alpha Standard ricochet angles (45-60) 23 mm threshold (standard 0.025 fuse) That's quite a lot of data! Here are some DPM numbers: 137,143 HE DPM (stock) 164,046 HE DPM (MBM3 + nerfed BFT) 185,143 AP DPM (stock) 221,463 AP DPM (MBM3 + nerfed BFT) As you can see, Kleber's stock HE DPM is quite pitiful. It has comparable DPM to a stock Shima or a stock Z-52. Not exactly impressive. Main Battery Reload Booster enhances this when needed, of course, and Shimas probably won't build for guns, but still. You won't want to fight any serious gunboats without your reload booster to back you up, so be careful. However, these guns do have some advantages to compensate. For one, the pure alpha is quite impressive. Kleber as both the highest HE and AP alpha strike of any T10 DD, with only Khaba and Marceau coming close. 3-4k HE salvoes against DDs aren't at all uncommon, and 5k AP pen salvoes to chunky BBs (I'm looking at you Vermont) are definitely a factor. It also means that you can push up to finish off a low-health gunboat even with your reload booster, relying on alpha strike to clutch the engagement. Just make sure to land these shells. The second advantage these 139's have is their reach. For starters, these guns have the best stock range of all DDs in the game, at 13.6 KM. This allows Kleber to project her influence a good distance. A component of that is Kleber's ballistics. Here's a chart of 5 T10 DDs: Gearing, Daring, Shima, Kleber, and Khaba (Kleber is in pink): Kleber's ballistics are, again, best in class for a T10 DD, with only Khaba being the tiniest bit faster at close ranges. This allows Kleber to not only harass BBs at extreme ranges, but also nail escaping DDs. With some good aim and a little luck, you can anil dds for 2k HE salvoes even at 9+ km. In fact, using your agility, you can outfight certain gunboats at around 10km, juking their shells but nailing them. In one game (which I sadly don't have recorded), I outfought two Harugumos at around 10-11 km. I had full health, but no reload booster, and they both had like 20k HP. However, I juked most of their shells, and whittled them down. This certainly isn't the norm, but do be aware you can take gunfights without reload booster in certain situtions. That's why it can often be good to hang outside a cap circle, not to contest and get detected, but to nail some DDs that your friendly DD is trying to kill. The final part of Kleber's guns is their outstanding AP penetration. As see on the graph, Kleber has better pen than all DDs at T10, and it's not even particularly close. Khaba, again, is the closest, but even he has roughly 50 mm less pen at most ranges, around only 3/4 of Kleber's pen. The pen is so good, it even rivals many light cruisers. For example: Once you get within about 12 km, Worcester's pen becomes greater, with Mino beating Kleber pen at about 9 km. However, as you can glean from these charts, Kleber's AP penetration is excellent, even outstanding for a destroyer. Combined with your generally shorter engagement ranges than those light cruisers, you can easily citadel many light and superlight cruisers. Most angling will defeat the pen, except at close ranges, but perfect broadsides are very vulnerable. You can citadel Minotaurs at 11-12 km, with their thin armor. Smolensks and Colberts are even worse: those can be citadelled at 13 km with flat broadside. Worcesters are a good amount trickier (and more dangerous), but around 7-8 km will probably be good enough. Closer with Des Moines, as it has 152 mm citadel unlike Worcester's 127 mm, but around 5 km. Here is a general list of cruisers and their ease to citadel: Extremely Easy: -Colbert -Smolensk -Austin (Probably, but it is WIP) Fairly Easy: -Minotaur Average: -Zao (Mostly because of the weird shape) -Worcester -DM Hard -Hindenburg (Actually works better at 10-11 km because of the turtleback, but still difficult) -Nevsky (Layered Armor) -Henri (Spaced Armor) -Moskva (Thick armor, but good results at 3-4 km ranges) Very Hard: -Stalingrad (Thick armor, but easy at very close ranges) -Petro (Thick armor + low freeboard) -Goliath (Thick and spaced, but possible at close ranges) As you can see, a little less than half the T10 cruisers can be citadeled at our above 8 km. Since your detection is 7.8 km when fully rigged, this means that you can get the jump on certain cruisers and citadel them. Another good tactic is to charge smoke cruisers (Smolensk/Mino), detect them, and then kill them. Just be careful because your smoke detect when firing is pretty high at 4.15 km. For the rest, you can't charge them in the open. If they are low hp (like 15k or less) you can aim for the upper belts and then reload boost, but that is less reliable. For some of those, like island campers (DMs and Moskvas) a viable tactic is charge around the island, get their broadside, and citadel, though in that case, torps are probably a better option. As far as Petros go, just don't. Like, don't even try. Their freeboard and thickness make them very difficult to cit. Henri and Goliath however, with their large freeboards are good targets for raw pen damage. Mostly, this comes down to experience. Angling, positioning, and cruiser belt armor knowledge are all key to pulling off a successful ambush on a cruiser. For starting Kleber players, Minos are good because of their general extreme vulnerability to citadels. Just be careful of the super-heal. That about sums up Kleber guns. I will go into more detail in Consumables when I talk about the Main Battery Reload Boost, but keep in mind, good use of your guns (since you are first and foremost a gunboat) is key to doing well in this ship. Torpedoes: Kleber's torpedoes are very interesting, in that they look bad on paper, but are quite useful in reality. Again, let's start with the firing arcs: Like the torpedoes, Kleber has god-tier firing arcs on her torpedoes. This is a great advantage when both yoloing (as you don't have to angle much to use your torps) and kiting (as you can easily dump both sets behind you). Next, let's get some general stats: 4 x 3 550 mm torpedoes 8 km range 18,400 alpha 77 reload time 75 kts of speed 1.8 detection 9.2 sec reaction time Kind of a data dump, but as you can see you can see these torps have 3 main characteristics: 1. They hit hard. 18400 alpha, while not challenging the likes of Japanese torpedoes, handily beats Halland torps, Daring torps, and Grozovoi torps. So, overall, pretty respectable alpha for a T10 warhead. 2. They are speedy. While nothing like Halland's 86 kts missiles, they are close to second otherwise, only beaten by Shima's F3s and Smaland's torps. This is also very useful in a yolo situation, since more speed = less time for the target to react, since they will be spotted anyways. 3. They have crappy range. Seriously, they are easily worst in the tier, with the exception of Khaba, who has even worse ones at 6 km. This is the range you would expect to see on a T6 or 7 DD, not a T10 one. This range is very deceptive, however. While you can only barely stealth torp, you can extend your window of stealth by up to 2 km in certain situations. How? Well, torpedoes have a significent travel time, with Kleber's torps taking almost exactly 40 seconds to complete their 8 km run time. During this time, any enemy that is pushing up torwards you will cover some ground. It's hard to get consistent numbers, since the enemy's angle of attack and speed will vary, but a good estimate is this: An enemy pushing torwards you at a 45 degree angle for sharper will probably cover about 2 km before your torps run out. That means if an enemy (say a Montana) is at 10 km and pushing sharply towards you, and you launch torps at him, they will make it there. This takes some judgement, but again, experience is key. This is probably the best way to make use of the torps; harassing kiting enemies. If you get a flood and they damage con, you can reload boost and set them on fire. The second piece to the torps is the DPM. Not many people realize this, but Kleber has top-tier torp DPM. In fact, it has better stock torp DPM than any other DD at T10 DD, until they build for it. Here is a quick ranking of the top 5 stock torp DPM at T10 (and I threw in Benham cause why not.) 1. Kleber: 172,051 2. Benham: 171,670 3. Shimakaze (12 km): 139,805 4. Gearing (10.5 km): 110,871 5. Khabarovsk (kek): 92,125 Pretty crazy, right? Kleber has the highest theoretical torp DPM of any T10 DD, even beating Benham (though only by a fraction). What does this mean? Well, if you can use those tricks I talked about earlier, you can dump a crazy amount of torps back at the pushing enemy forces. Of course, many of these other ships will build for torps, so you will get beaten, but it is cool to think about. In summary: Kleber's torps serve two solid purposes: They are excellent for yolo situations with strong alpha-per side and excellent arcs, and are also suitable for kiting, with their top-tier reload and, again, good arcs. Just be wary of the range: many a time I set up the perfect torp salvo on an enemy BB, only for him to slightly angle out, and the torps to run out right in front of them. You just have to get used to it, it is part of the Kleber experience. Defense/Hull Mechanics: HP: 21,900 Kleber is certainly one of the most interesting T10 DD hulls. While it has no special armor (so I won't both showing a graphic), it does have some nice features. For one, the health is very competitive. It is beaten only by the Khaba (only by 600 hp) and the Harugumo, as of now, and is of course tied with the Marceau. DDs with less HP but heals, like Grozovoi, Daring, and Halland, do have higher theoretical health, but as I will show, this has less of an impact than you might think. The French DD line in this game has a special satuaration gimmick. Essentially, it means two things: one, the ship saturates much faster than other DDs, and two, its center hull component can (and will) saturate, unlike other DDs, who normally can only saturate their nose and stern. It's difficult to get hard numbers on this, since saturation is depend on where the damage is taken and in what amount, and that varies from game to game. Best summarized, this mechanic allows the Kleber to saturate much quicker, and, since full saturation results in half damage in HE pens, means it can tank a significant more amount of DD fire than you would think. To put it another way, Kleber's fully upgraded health of 25,400 (without Auboyneau) is, in practice, more equivalent to around 30-32k health. This isn't stricly true, as saturation doesn't increase your health and instead decreases damage, but it is a good approximation. This means that you can take gunfights with other DDs at a good amount lower health than other DDs would dare. This is especially useful in the late stages of the game, when you might have to chase down other DDs, and you can count on taking less damage overall. Because of your already high health pool, you are in practicality probably the tankiest T10 DD, with the obvious exception of Khaba (since it has a heal and 50 mm plating). Use this to your advantage, and be aware that saturation shows up as black marks and patterns on your ship's hull in game, eventually making that whole section blackened, so try to keep track of that as the match progresses. A final note: because you have no heal, and no smoke, health management is key to winning games. If you lose too much health at the end, you probably won't be able to yolo that key battleship or cruiser, so try not to lose too much health at the beginning. Having 18k+ health in the last 10 minutes (when it looks like it will be a close match) is a good marker to work torwards. Concealment: Stock Surface Conceal (with camo): 9.58 km Stock Air Conceal (with camo): 5.38 km Upgraded Surface Conceal (with camo): 7.76 km Upgraded Air Conceal (with camo): 4.36 km Kleber's concealment is horrible. The surface concealment is the worst of all T10 DDs, except for Khaba. Additionally, the air conceal is also the worst among all T10 dds, bar none, so carriers are a huge threat (as I discuss in AA). Interestingly, the upgraded conceal, 7.76, is just about the range where you can reliably citadel most light cruisers. Accordingly, you must manage this conceal well. I wouldn't recomment compromising your conceal in any way, like Fearless Brawler, sinceconceal gives you a tiny range within which your torps have your range but you are not detected. Personally, I wouldn't want to take that opportunity away, but it is personal choice. I won't go on too much, just to add that this large conceal precludes you from taking caps too early. Unless you know for sure their is no DD nearby, I would stay out of caps until the mid-late game, when hopefully the cruisers have been thinned out. This is definitely Kleber's weakest point, so managing your conceal is also key to a good game. Agility Base Speed: 44 kts +Speed Flag: 46.2 kts Turning Radius: 740 m Rudder Shift: 4.8 sec On the flip side, Kleber's agility is another strong point. While the turning circle is a little on the large side, and the rudder shift isn't great, those are more than compensated by the outstanding 44 kts speed. Additionally, Kleber has the 20% French engine boost, meaning with the flag and your boost active, you can break 55 kts. Except for Yolo Emilio, you are the fastest ship in the game, and functionally the fastest because your boost also lasts for an excellent 3 minutes, compared to the standard 2 minute boost. This also means that you can juke shells quite effectively. You can also outrun CV torps (except some German and Japanese ones upgraded). This speed is one of your greatest strengths. Another bonus is that you can run down dds very effectively. A good choice of prey for a Kleber player is a Halland. With only 6 km detect, quite slow speed, and no smoke, Halland is very vulnerable to a good Kleber player. If you catch a Halland, they can't run and can't hide, as the saying goes. Other slow DDs, like Gearings, are also vulnerable. Another strength is for yoloes. You can come racing around the corner of an island in the blink of an eye, and with your fantastic yolo torps, this turns Kleber into a god-tier yolo machine. This speed can get you in trouble though, with your high conceal, so be careful AA: Just no. Kleber has the horrible distinction of being the only T10 DD of having a worse AA range than air conceal, at a pitiful 3.8 km range. You also have 0 flak puffs. Your dps (210 stock) isn't that bad, but overall, your AA is trash. Combined with your crappy air conceal and lack of smoke, your are exceedingly vulnerable to CVs of all types. As much as I hate to say it, staying back and grouping up for the first few minutes when a CV is in the game is not a bad idea. While you would like to scout, trust me from experience, CVs will focus you relentlessly. This your critical downside. Be always aware of it Consumables: Damage Con: (5 s active period, 40 sec cooldown). Standard damage con. Nothing special Main Battery Reload Booster: (15 sec active period, 100 sec cooldown) - 4 charges. This is a key part of Kleber's ambush style. This doubles your dpm for the 15 second active period. In makes both your HE and APM DPM top of the bunch, with your HE DPM reaching over 270k stock, and close to 330k fully upgraded. This allows you to either shred a DD or brutalize a broadside cruiser. Strategic use of this consumable is key, but don't always be hasty to use it. While I very rarely run out in a match, the cooldown is limiting. For example, if you pop it right when a DD is spotted, and then it goes dark a second later, you just wasted it. A good tip is keep track of who is spotting who. If the DD is spotted by a radar, you probably should go ahead and use your consumable. If, however, they just used smoke, I would hold off. Just be aware, a wasted consumable means over 1 1/2 minutes till your next consumable is ready. Engine Boost: (180 sec active period, 90 sec reload time) - 3 charges. This is also key. A 20% boost in speed is huge, and it also provides a sizable boost in acceleration/deceleration. This can be quite useful for speed-juking. Because of the long-duration of this consumable, it can be used much more freely. However, I would want at least one of these consumables left for the end game when needed, as it is important for those all-too-fun yolos. Upgrades/Captain Skills: I'm going to start with the upgrades, which for me are pretty straightforward: Slot 1: MAM1: Pretty obvious, you want to protect your all important guns and torps. The magazine mod is an option, but you can always run Juliet Charlies instead. Slot 2: EBM1: You want to boost that speed boost duration. This makes it go from 180 secs to 234 secs, a not huge but useful increase. If you don't have the special upgrade, Engine Room Protection is the default choice. Slot 3: MBM2: Kleber's turrets are quite slow, at 18 sec for 180. Your dispersion is already pretty good (it's a DD), so I probably wouldn't take Aiming Systems. The torp tubes mod is nice for the extra speed, but having the fast turning turrets is useful. Slot 4: PM1: Your rudder shift is already pretty good, so their isn't much reason to take that. The accel, however, it useful for speed juking, a quite effective tactic combined with your Engine Boost. Slot 5: CSM1: Pretty obvious. Still a very strong upgrade, not really any other good options. Slot 6: MBM3: Your guns are your strong point, you want to make them batter. While range is an option, as I discuss in Captain Skills, I generally don't upgrade range on Kleber. Finally, its time for captain skills. This is my current build, minus Gun Feeder (Expert Loader), as my captain is currently only 20 points: First 10 points: -Grease the Gears: None of the other 1 points skills are as good, and that extra turret traverse is quite nice. -Last Stand: Always will be a key skill, never a bad choice on DDs. -Survivability Expert: More HP is always nice, especially on a DD like Kleber where HP conservation is so key. -Concealment Expert: A very powerful skill. Even on gunboats like Kleber, concealment and the spacing opportunities it provides are always useful. Next 8 points: -Adreneline Rush: More reload is always better. Since you will often be on lower health near the end of the match, you can get some super filthy DPM at the end of the match. With a full gun build and at 80% health, you have the same burst DPM as a Worcester when reload booster is active. Like I said, super filthy in the right situation. -Main Battery and AA Specialist: Basically a nerfed BFT. Even with the nerf, more reload for no penalty at all is useful on Kleber. The 10% AA boost is also nice to have on a ship with so bad AA already. -Priorty Target: Even with the point increase, this skill is still very useful. When you are on a flank and farming BBs, it is useful to know who is aiming at you, as it can give you an idea if a DD is nearby. Final 3 points (These are more flexible, I think these skills are less useful and more interchangable): -Gun Feeder: With your slow reload, if a cruiser pops up broadside, I find it pretty useful. More useful than you would think for a DD. -Consumables Specialist: Just reduces your Reload Booster cooldown from 100 to 90 seconds. While minor, because of how dependent Kleber is on the Reload Booster for killing DDs and Cruisers, this skill is somewhat useful -Preventative Maintnence: While 30% is minor, DD modules are very vulnerable, so this is actually a nice skill to have. Other Options Here are some 4 point skills that I think are decent but I personally don't take: Main Battery and AA Expert: Just AFT. While definitely viable for long-range spammy builds, I honestly find 13.6 km to be more than enough most of the time. Again, certainly viable, but not as useful. Radio Location: RPF. I tried this before, and while I think it is viable, it is less useful. This is honestly better on torp DDs, where you need to be aware of gunboats. Kleber can 1v1 pretty much any DD if played well, so I don't use it. Just personal opinion of course. Fearless Brawler: 10% reload, like i've said, is nice. More DPM is always great. However, it is 4 points, and you also lose 5% conceal, driving your conceal to be above 8 km. Like I said before, there is nice synergy between the 7.8 conceal and the 8 km torps/citadel potential on light cruisers. Conclusion: Well, I hope this 59% WR Kleber review/guide was helpful. I don't really post much on the forums, so this is my first major post of any length. I'd love some feedback, so any you have is helpful. P.S. While the standard the permacamo for 5k doubloons is nice, the French Navy one they added a year or so ago is pretty snazzy. Good luck captains, and make the Kléber proud!
  2. 180 shells fired at 15km while using the Aiming System Modification 1 upgrade on AL Montpelier. Stock mapping was pulled from a stationary Fuso bot without camouflage, skills or upgrades. Dazzle mapping came from firing at a stationary Kléber (piloted by @Chobittsu) without camouflage or concealment upgrades. Kléber was using skills and upgrades to boost range on top of the Dazzle skill. Methodology was to use a Reference Fuso™ for scale then have Montpelier move to 15km away from Kléber (Kleber did not move). Kléber would fire, revealing herself and activating Dazzle for 15 seconds. Montpelier would lock on and fire a salvo. Kléber would then cease fire and return to stealth. Rinse and repeat to collect the necessary results.
  3. Sigh...it was fun while it lasted. I suspect with the new detection ranges and torpedo nerf that my Kleber and Mogador will not be seen too much. Longer detection range kills the possibility of torpedo attacks and they then made the torps easier to see killing them anyways. Fantasque may still be a very viable boat but I have been playing it as a torpedo boat and not a gunboat. That will be a little more difficult. Yes, they were probably overpowered but now Kleber is just a Khaba with less powerful guns. It was overkill. The speed is still wonderful but now they will just be dodging gunfire and air attacks with it. Talk among yourselves....
  4. eagle_lance

    Kleber buffs when?

    The ship has no defense against cv's and has horrible dpm. Additionally, it gets out spotted by every dd except the overpowered khaba. It needs better dpm, longer range torps, better concealment, better aa, or smoke. The speed is nice, but you can't break contact or survive against cv's for too long. This ship needs help and makes the Yueyang look strong.
  5. I checked the update 8.10 video and in this forum but did not see any Nerfs. Both my Kleber and Mogador AA mod 1 slot 3 are gone. I cannot add AA MOD 1 back in slot 3. Was this a nerf for 8.10 or is this a 8.10 issue? Thanks This did have me reading more about how AA works and of course 8.10 so not a complete loss. I just cannot find the answer. Thanks