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About Thunder_Feet

  • Rank
    Warrant Officer
  • Birthday April 7
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  • Location
    Near Baton Rouge, LA
  • Interests
    History, Philosophy, Cosmology, Geography, Travel, Golf, Computers, Home Improvement.

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  1. Thunder_Feet


    I recently got the tropical island one for Atlanta. That camo is so ugly that it's good looking. I have the "Holiday" one on several T-8 ships, too - they do the same thing as the regular perma-camo without paying.... so who cares if it's ugly?
  2. Thunder_Feet

    Coops at their worse

    Yup, they were just awful. One battle today the queue had over 70 BBs waiting for a battle. Before that, in a DD, I got pinked because I had enough of a griefer and torped him intentionally. I watched a Law and Order marathon instead. I'll do my directives once this foolishness ends and the arrogant, self-satisfied (deleted) go back to randoms. Co-op is probably going to suck until next Monday, sadly.
  3. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    Well, I may have rhetorically overstated when I said none, zip, and bupkus. There is some, but very rarely do I see it, and almost every time someone asks for the kill or the ability to gather secondary hits, etc. someone will kill the intended gift anyway. The teamwork is so rare, in my opinion, as to be merely an exception to the rule. I came to the game expecting teamwork, and other than in divs, have found precious little.
  4. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    Can't find anything in your post with which to disagree, Asym. I think we're on the same page, mostly, and your last paragraph, bravo zulu.
  5. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    I agree with your thesis that the whole purpose of this is fun, but the question then becomes what is fun? I find bettering myself fun. Some find pew pew pew fun. Raising my PR and trying to get to 97.5 WR (one loss every 40 battles) in co-op is my fun at this phase of my game. But nobody has given me a single shred of evidence that there is any value in co-op as a training tool for randoms that you can't do in a training room (learn to shoot guns and torps). So why is co-op often crowded? Because it's fun in and of itself, I would say, and that to many others... and therefore, it's not "just a tool" for random players. QED.
  6. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    You forgot after "W" to hit "U" for engine boost (hey, I'm a DD main).
  7. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    I think this is pretty well said. I'm sort of a combination of the two types. I don't care for the drama, but I do care about improving, and that requires stats. Also, I have done what you describe exactly - rammed for that 4th or 5th kill only to notice I was the last human green ship alive. And I felt like the resultant loss was my fault, too.
  8. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    Good points made, but I still think the fun is in being the best on the team as often as possible. Yes, sometimes supporting another player, even a green bot, is a good idea, but in your development of that idea, it's still based on what you get out of it (a longer lasting meat shield) so is it really co-operation or simply using the other player (bot) as a tool? I don't do anything intentional to other players because of an ethos I have, not because there is anything in the meta itself to reward being a cooperative player. And, I might add, I have mostly been treated with courtesy by other co-op players. Not so much in randoms. But again, I don't see courtesy or even basic "fair play" as cooperation. Divisions with a voice chat is cooperation, sure - but I see one division in about every 40 games of co-op. EDIT: As to your point 4, I seem to see the BBs do that a lot, particularly on weekends, and if you look at the stats of the players who do camp in the rear, typically they play more randoms than co-op. I may be making a fallacious "post hoc proper hoc" conclusion here, but it seems to me co-op "mains" know you can't do much in co-op if you're in the rear with the gear.
  9. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    Let me clarify that I enjoy co-op immensely, but I enjoy it based on my understanding of what it IS. Not what it was intended to be or what it is named. The fact that it fails as a trainer for randoms and that the cooperation quotient approaches zero, doesn't make me enjoy it less. Also, just because cooperation isn't there to be found doesn't mean I do any dirty tricks to beat my competitors on the green team. I just try my best to compete fairly, and do it better than them. Often I don't, frequently I do. You're entitled to your feelings, but nobody is there to help you, that I have ever seen. They are there to entertain themselves, in whatever way they find their entertainment. Extending courtesy yes, but I courteously will shoot anything red to get points. I won't intentionally block your shot or do anything underhanded to get more points, but I'm there to be the best bot basher I can be. What you think of me because I have a "realpolitik" outlook on the game means very little to me.
  10. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

  11. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    It has. And the irony of it being named that isn't lost on me. There is no cooperation, none. Zip. Bupkus. Doesn't exist. Especially with green bots. It's strictly a competition to hit the most targets more effectively than the other greens.
  12. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    Because we're competitive creatures by nature? I get satisfaction when I'm top dawg on my "team". It isn't the main part of the fun, but 'tis icing on the cake. Actually, one of the reasons I like co-op is that my fun killing bots is NOT directly causing another human to have "un-fun". BTW: I have a black kitty looks just like your avatar. I have a black kitty Hawaiian shirt on right now!
  13. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    In other words, fun. Agreed, but doing a good job of what you say leads to better stats, right?
  14. Thunder_Feet

    Philosophy of Co-op

    I have thought, experimented, and discussed co-op play for over a year, and over 12,000 games in co-op - with just under 1000 in randoms (for perspective), and have developed these concepts: 1. Even if originally intended as a "training mode" for randoms, co-op really isn't that currently. It fails. I am very high in PR in co-op, unicum PR in DDs and well above average in all respects except CVs, which I seldom play. I am slightly below average in Randoms in WR and not great PR there in any ship type. So this shows me that co-op fails as a training mode, and has to be something else, and therefore is a "different mode" of battle in its own right. Other people, including posters in this "PVE" sub-forum, seem to substantiate this. 2. The object of co-op battles is not to win, even a potato is going to win over 90 percent of the time. So what IS the object? To me, it seems abundantly clear that the object of the game is to get more damage, more caps, more aircraft kills, more ship kills, than the other green players, bot or human. It's a race for XP against your allies. The red bots are just your targets, the other green ships are your competitors. 3. Despite this competing for the XP, co-op has much less toxicity in the chats than randoms. It is because we don't depend on each other to win, the win is provided by red bot potato-ness. No pressure to win means no blame for loss, and much less salt. 4. Some skills are common to PvE and PvP, but tactics are completely different. It's not just that being good in co-op doesn't necessarily mean you're good in randoms, it also means that random players are equally likely to not be good in co-op. We can see that when there is a "directive grind" that sends random players over to co-op and they skew the meta by camping on the border in their full heath BB and create a higher incidence of lost battles. 5. Green bots are stupider than red bots. They are as good at seeking and being hit by friendly torps as red bots are at dodging torps. Green bots are as often as not griefers. I'm sure I can come up with more, but this is the core of what I've been thinking. I'm perfectly willing, given good evidence, to change my mind, but these are the conclusions brought about by the evidence I've seen, both personally and by what others say or show in clips. I hope there can be thoughtful discussion, amplification, etc. without this becoming acrimonious.
  15. Thunder_Feet

    Thank Heaven for Co-op

    D'accord - moi aussi.