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Poll: Which is the worst CV that you will scrap as soon as you can?


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Poll: Which is the worst CV that you will scrap as soon as you can? (75 members have cast votes)

Which is the worst Japanese CV?

  1. IV - Hosho (17 votes [22.67%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 22.67%

  2. V - Zuiho (11 votes [14.67%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 14.67%

  3. VI - Ryujo (10 votes [13.33%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 13.33%

  4. VII - Hiryu (6 votes [8.00%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 8.00%

  5. VIII - Shokaku (2 votes [2.67%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 2.67%

  6. IX - Taiho (1 vote [1.33%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 1.33%

  7. X - Hakuryu (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  8. I have not reached high tiers yet / I have not played them yet (28 votes [37.33%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 37.33%

Which is the worst American CV?

  1. IV - Langley (5 votes [6.67%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.67%

  2. V - Bogue (25 votes [33.33%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 33.33%

  3. VI - Independence (10 votes [13.33%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 13.33%

  4. VII - Ranger (14 votes [18.67%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 18.67%

  5. VII - Saipan (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  6. VIII - Lexington (6 votes [8.00%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 8.00%

  7. IX - Essex (3 votes [4.00%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 4.00%

  8. X - Midway (1 vote [1.33%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 1.33%

  9. I have not reached high tiers yet / I have not played them yet (11 votes [14.67%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 14.67%

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TenguBlade #21 Posted 12 October 2016 - 04:30 PM

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View PostHazeGrayUnderway, on 11 October 2016 - 09:32 PM, said:

I've gotten to Tier VIII USN and Tier VII IJN CVs.  I can confidently say all I missed with Bogue is wasting time, credits on a POS CVE.  Zuiho is 100x better.

You do know that strike Bogue is virtually strike Independence without the chance of seeing many potential victims that have Defensive Fire, right?  The bombers have the same 500lb bombs, and the standard American CV torpedoes appear on her planes too.


Edited by TenguBlade, 12 October 2016 - 04:31 PM.

Don't know if you have a dark sense of humor?  If you laugh at this, you do.

IJN: Yamato, Amagi, Ibuki, Mogami, Shokaku, Hiryu, Akatsuki, Shiratsuyu, Kamikaze R, Katori, MikasaKongō, Myōkō, Kirishima, Haruna, Hiei, Ashigara, Nachi, Haguro, TakaoSouthern Dragon

USN: Montana, Iowa, New Mexico, New Orleans, Pensacola, Cleveland, Langley/Bogue, Farragut

European Navies: Gnevny, Shchors, Nürnberg/Yorck, Bayern, Fiji, Blyskawica (Gift from Compassghost), Scharnhorst (First and only bought), Admiral Graf Spee


Numbah18 #22 Posted 12 October 2016 - 11:34 PM

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Stock Ranger almost made me rage quit :( Frankly the whole US line had moments of why am I using this but if I had to pick just one it would be Stock ranger. I lost planes to everything that even looked at my squads not to mention stock IJN is a 2/2/2.

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Systemrename33576 #23 Posted 13 October 2016 - 06:34 AM

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View PostCarefreeTongue, on 11 October 2016 - 02:26 PM, said:

 

Problem with the standard setup is that it's worse across the board against the standard setups of both the Hiryu and the Saipan.

 

I didnt say it was better than the other CV's. I simply stated that if you NEED fighters while you try to do damage, then stock is your best bet. but if you can manage without fighters then u might as well go all strike

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Carrier_Junyo #24 Posted 13 October 2016 - 08:49 AM

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I can summarize USN in a few lines:

 

USN Stock CV inferior to IJN every tier except Langley (Midway is close to being on par with Hak, but not quite). 

USN Strike is useless Tier 5-7. Lex Strike is at mercy of MM, Essex and Midway are playable but sub-par to Taiho/Hak.

USN Air Superiority rules the skies at every tier, especially Tier 5-6, but gives up too much strike power and therefore has very limited ability to impact the game. 


WG, please remove Air Superiority Carrier loadouts from the game. I'm sure that if you looked at Air Superiority Win Rates vs Balanced or Strike Win Rates, your data will show you the vast inferiority of this loadout in its ability to help their team's chances to win. Meanwhile, they are encouraging the balanced or strike CV player to stop playing CVs due to decreasing their enjoyment of the game and creating frustration. Removing Air Superiority loadouts, and "re-balancing" the balanced and strike loadouts is the easiest fix to the current CV problem. Match the air power of both nations for equivalent loadouts. Ideally, players should be able to select their loadouts in-game, not in port. This way, they are able to adapt to enemy CV's actions and it adds an extra element of tactics and strategy, rather than being at a disadvantage already at Port. 


Shoukaku_Kai_Ni #25 Posted 13 October 2016 - 01:14 PM

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View Postlord_of_storms, on 13 October 2016 - 12:49 AM, said:

I can summarize USN in a few lines:

 

USN Stock CV inferior to IJN every tier except Langley (Midway is close to being on par with Hak, but not quite). 

USN Strike is useless Tier 5-7. Lex Strike is at mercy of MM, Essex and Midway are playable but sub-par to Taiho/Hak.

USN Air Superiority rules the skies at every tier, especially Tier 5-6, but gives up too much strike power and therefore has very limited ability to impact the game. 

 

I partially disagree. Bogue is still pretty good, Independence is fair to Ryujo, and Ranger is fairly good. I've had immense success in these ships, they're just difficult to play well against a flexible IJN counterpart. Strike Lexington appears scary, its rival needs to be focused to mitigate the great amount of damage it may potentially do. While I haven't played Langley since the change to 1-1-1, I'd figure it's pretty OP compared to Hoshou now. T9-10 IDK. 

I'd say that AS USN loadouts are useless and essentially have no strike power.

 

Basically I think, contrary to popular opinion, it's more difficult to play USN CVs well (emphasis on "well") than it is IJN CVs (aside from micromanagement). Even AS USN CVs should be denying most or all of every strike in order to be considered effective (as their damage output should be equivalent); yet most of these players are unable to do that, much less consistently for each and every strike.

I believe USN CVs get a lot of complaints b/c of the all-or-nothing builds, but also b/c so few players use them to full effectiveness.


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Palladia #26 Posted 17 October 2016 - 06:03 AM

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View PostShoukaku_Kai_Ni, on 13 October 2016 - 01:14 PM, said:

 

I partially disagree. Bogue is still pretty good, Independence is fair to Ryujo, and Ranger is fairly good. I've had immense success in these ships, they're just difficult to play well against a flexible IJN counterpart. Strike Lexington appears scary, its rival needs to be focused to mitigate the great amount of damage it may potentially do. While I haven't played Langley since the change to 1-1-1, I'd figure it's pretty OP compared to Hoshou now. T9-10 IDK. 

I'd say that AS USN loadouts are useless and essentially have no strike power.

 

Basically I think, contrary to popular opinion, it's more difficult to play USN CVs well (emphasis on "well") than it is IJN CVs (aside from micromanagement). Even AS USN CVs should be denying most or all of every strike in order to be considered effective (as their damage output should be equivalent); yet most of these players are unable to do that, much less consistently for each and every strike.

I believe USN CVs get a lot of complaints b/c of the all-or-nothing builds, but also b/c so few players use them to full effectiveness.

 

I'd agree with that.  Hammer and anvil IJN drops are much easier and more reliable then manually aimed USN torpedo drops.  USN torpedo drops have more damage potential but trying to hit anything other then a slow moving BB is a crap shoot at best.  IJN are also more forgiving in having more fighter groups to entangle the enemy with so that their damage dealers can get through.  There is a reason the Saipan is the most effective USN carrier right now.

I like balanced loadouts so the Bogue was bad for me and the Ranger is following.  I've actually stopped all progress on my ranger while I get up to a fifteen point captain in my Saipan.  I'll step back in after and probably use a strike loadout to rush the rest of the grind.

As for IJN, I voted Hosho but really none of them have been instant sellers for me.  The Hosho was a fun introduction to dual torpedo bombers and an unopposed or poorly opposed Zuiho just cleared the sea's.  The Ryujo is starting to feel the effects of unupgraded torpedo bombers though.  Ought to make the Hiryu real fun.

Joe__defender_destroyer #27 Posted 12 March 2017 - 03:19 PM

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While I have got to T7 American Carriers, I found the Bouge to be great as long as your aware of your surroundings your fine.



AhosChaos #28 Posted 12 March 2017 - 05:29 PM

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View Posthiroshi_tea, on 10 October 2016 - 11:29 AM, said:

Independence was that horrible cv for me. The most suffering I've ever had due to combination of the small hangar and the bump in aa effectiveness that you see in tier 6

 

You're crazy.  The Indi is great.  BB's will eat all 6 torps and sail in perfectly straight lines for your DB's to set fires.

PASA006.png Independence 6 CV USA 38 71.05% 52,673 1,221 3.0 0.7 15.2 76% 0% 0% 1,472

 

The Ranger on the other hand is not so great.  The stock loadout sill works, it's just that there is such a disparity in plane speed and the extra HP doesn't really make up for it.

PASA010.png Ranger 7 CV  USA 52 67.31% 71,839 1,373 3.7 1.1 18.3 71% 0% 0% 1,509

 

There are ways you can make it work with stock, I am doing so for the most part, but yeah US CV's really aren't good.

 

edit apparently the flag they use for the stat line is huge

 

 


Edited by AhosChaos, 12 March 2017 - 05:30 PM.

Rip stat.png

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HazeGrayUnderway #29 Posted 12 March 2017 - 07:18 PM

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A picture is worth a thousand words.   Or maybe 6 points of failure by Bogue.

 

When the removal of manual attacks happens for Tier IV & V CV I expect these values to drop.  But I will confidently say that Zuiho will still be the superior CV in performance.  Even with auto-attacks only she can do an important thing that Bogue will never be able to do.  Also she will have smaller auto-drop patterns.

 

Anyways, Zuiho is almost worth 2 Bogues.


Edited by HazeGrayUnderway, 12 March 2017 - 07:18 PM.


SgtSullyC3 #30 Posted 12 March 2017 - 07:24 PM

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Meh. I'm only on Zuiho on IJN CVs.

US: Langley and Bogue were fun, Indy wasn't bad. Ranger I loved, best strike so far for US (I only run strike). Lexington is what I'm stuck on. Yes, I run strike. But for some reason, Lex didn't click like Ranger did. I can't do anything with strike, hated the stock, and refuse to use AS. I'll probably end up free-XPing to the Essex, because at least then I can keep a fighter squad in strike. Or.... I will just wait until the long promised CV rework, and see if they address the fact that IJN CVs are a million times better than US. What I wouldn't give to have a Shokaku instead of my Lexington. 


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_Marines #31 Posted 14 March 2017 - 03:04 AM

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View PostSgtSullyC3, on 12 March 2017 - 02:24 PM, said:

Meh. I'm only on Zuiho on IJN CVs.

US: Langley and Bogue were fun, Indy wasn't bad. Ranger I loved, best strike so far for US (I only run strike). Lexington is what I'm stuck on. Yes, I run strike. But for some reason, Lex didn't click like Ranger did. I can't do anything with strike, hated the stock, and refuse to use AS. I'll probably end up free-XPing to the Essex, because at least then I can keep a fighter squad in strike. Or.... I will just wait until the long promised CV rework, and see if they address the fact that IJN CVs are a million times better than US. What I wouldn't give to have a Shokaku instead of my Lexington. 

 

I have thought a ton about what carriers to keep. At the end I decided to keep Langley (IV), Ryujo (VI), Saipan (VII), Shokaku (VIII), and Taiho (IX).

 

Langley is great for how relaxing low tier matches are. Ryujo, Shokaku, Taiho are all quite OP for their tiers. Saipan is very fun with fast fighters and sharp bombers.

 

Hiryu I decided to sell. She's just not a particularly strong ship. Hakuryu I decided not to grind, because of the long queues for Tier X CV random matches. Also "Hakuryu" (White Dragon) is a really weird name for Taiho-Kai. In ancient Japanese mythology, the (rather obscure) White Dragon dwells in the imaginary West Sea and is the guardian of Central Asian people. Unless the imperial Kaigunsho runs out of names of mythological creatures, I don't see them naming any of the Taiho-Kai-class (5 ordered: #5021, 5022, 5023, 5024, 5025) as Hakuryu.:D

 

Note: "Hakuryu" might be WG's humorous reference to "Hakuho" (White Phoenix), a possible name for Taiho-Kai. Source: http://www.cwo.zaq.ne.jp/bface700/kanntei_date_j_02_13.html


Edited by _Marines, 14 March 2017 - 03:08 AM.


aethervox #32 Posted 15 March 2017 - 06:42 AM

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I won't vote because I didn't see any really bad CVs - I have used strike load outs only (as the optimal damage dealer).

 If I recall any CV as being kind of 'bad' I would have to say the Bogue.

 As to the Saipan - I like it when they get sunk since it is an OP premium (hence a P2W POS) that cheats/wreaks the battles it is in.



Taylor3006 #33 Posted 15 March 2017 - 06:58 AM

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I actually like my carriers, the Bogue is probably my least favorite but still has her place. Up to Lexy for the USN line and Zuiho on the IJN line. I have a great time in all of them but I play PvE only with them so take that for what it's worth. I am hopeful for the carrier rework and look forward to a premium Japanese carrier to help train up my captains. German CV would be awesome too, I really enjoy carriers.

Dr_Oppenheimer_ #34 Posted 24 March 2017 - 12:43 AM

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funny how bogue is the most hated USN ship. I find the bogue to be the most powerful USN ship. One of my best games, 222k+ damage in a [edited]tier 5 ship.

 



Taylor3006 #35 Posted 24 March 2017 - 12:57 AM

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The Bogue is a decent ship, a good captain can do well in her no doubt. Just is a "meh" ship. Will be interesting to see how she does against tier 6's when she can't strafe but the others can. Guessing her likeablity factor will go down a notch or so. 

Kanmusu_Yamato #36 Posted 24 March 2017 - 10:33 AM

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I really enjoyed Houshou since its just 1 fighter and 2 torpedo bombers. Sure you lose fighter battles but it teaches you how to pick your fights. 2 torpedo bombers taught me how to hammer and anvil and do the cross effectively. I never use it though since grouping is much easier especially against slow BBs.

 

I still hate how the fighters are ALWAYS lose most of the time against USN but its a trade off, meh.

 

I'm thinking I might go back to grind commander/free EXP on houshou after I get a level 19 commander one day since it reminds me of the Hetzer in WoT. OP in the right hands.



457th_FighterGroup #37 Posted 26 March 2017 - 09:13 PM

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I say Langley. The Langley is a great ship at its tier but when your planes meet Bogue or Zuiho fighters, they get shredded. However the ship was pretty enjoyable overall.

I hate the Bogue and I have found it extremely hard to grind in, as most Bogue captains choose AS, which leads the weak Strike planes to be destroyed quickly, and you don't have anything left to fight back with. Overall the Bogue is just underpowered and needs a major buff to stock or whatever. I would suggest adding a fighter squadron to Strike Bogue, which takes pretty much all reserve planes away but leaves your planes with at least some protection.



Shoukaku_Kai_Ni #38 Posted 29 March 2017 - 01:45 PM

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Whoever voted Shoukaku is fake news.

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BRailfanH #39 Posted 02 April 2017 - 05:54 AM

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I, myself, have only reached T6 on both lines, and I haven't found an IJN CV yet that I despise.

 

The same cannot be said, however, for the USN CV line.  I feel as if the Bogue is something of a dog of the line.  Independence felt like a breath of fresh air.



yaluen #40 Posted 02 April 2017 - 05:36 PM

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Tier 7 in general so I won't have to deal with Saipan and maybe Kaga once she's out.




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