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Comments on Prinz Eugen from NA Publishing Team


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Boyarsky #1 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:27 AM

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Commanders,
We noticed some of you were confused by the way we released Prinz Eugen last Friday and we want to clear up any misconceptions around her gameplay design, economic benefits and the staggered bundle release structure.

 

We do realize that while this ship may not add much to gameplay diversity due to her similarity to the Admiral Hipper, there are additional factors which resulted in our decision to include her.

 

Firstly, Prinz Eugen has significant place in history and many players in our community requested her to be added to the game. She was similar to Hipper historically and after internal debates we decided to go with historically accurate design. It was important to us to be straight about this fact in the Spotlight Article to make sure you know what you are paying for.

 

Second, as with any other Premium ship, Prinz Eugen offers +50% XP and +50% Commander XP with an additional bonus camo giving an additional 50% Commander XP bonus on top of that, for a +100% Commander XP total boost.This leaves her unmatched in speedily training German Commanders, and has since been clarified in the article. Although this benefit is unrelated to gameplay, we wanted to test its impact on perceived value of the ship.

 

Third, the staggered release approach is an experiment and we constantly adjusting our methods to learn what works and what doesn't. Our intention was to deliver additional value to the players who purchased the Deluxe and Fully Loaded bundles in the form of earlier access to the ship. We had concerns that this design might upset buyers of the "bare bones" bundle, but didn't anticipate the magnitude.

 

And as with all our experiments, this is a learning moment for us which we will to take into account with future bundles.
Please rest assured: your feedback is heard and appreciated. 


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Judge_Doom #2 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:34 AM

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As far as I could tell by the numerous comments that have been made, there was no confusion about game play diversity, there was however concern that it was despite whatever benefits you may try to list, over priced.  The consensus was, why put out such a large sum of cash, when there was no real noticeable difference between it and Hipper.  Simply put it appears the player base is getting a little burned out by over priced virtual ships and bundles.

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dionkraft #3 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:38 AM

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The Prince of Bel-Air is too pricey. Tell you what, price it at let's say.....naked at $29.99

Nuk_ #4 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:40 AM

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View Postdionkraft, on 13 September 2016 - 09:38 PM, said:

The Prince of Bel-Air is too pricey. Tell you what, price it at let's say.....naked at $29.99

 

Atago is $47 by itself, what makes you think the Prinz would be so much cheaper?

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Das_Schlippo #5 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:41 AM

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View PostBoyarsky, on 13 September 2016 - 08:27 PM, said:

Third, the staggered release approach is an experiment

Experimental money grab of epic proportions is what you mean.



DarthDoge #6 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:43 AM

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View PostNuk_, on 13 September 2016 - 08:40 PM, said:

 

Atago is $47 by itself, what makes you think the Prinz would be so much cheaper?

 

Because the Atago is actually worth it?

Boyarsky #7 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:51 AM

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2Judge_Doom:

Any premium ship in our game has a base price in doubloons, which is defined by its Tier, Class and some other minor factors.

It would be unfair to offer a way for new players to skip the grind without paying a reasonable price for it.

But your point makes me believe that there is a way we could resolve this conflict. Personal offerings with discounts based on previous achievements in game, for example.

We will explore these options.


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Gaishu_Isshoku #8 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:53 AM

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I greatly appreciate the openness WG has had recently. It feels as though you actually take feedback into consideration. I'd also like to say that I actually appreciate Eugen from a balance perspective; in my opinion, many premiums have ended up being superior to their counterparts (Atago, Kutuzov, Saipan, Anshan to name a few) and very much prefer for premiums to be released like Eugen, with the possibility of buffs/changes to playstyle in the future that could make her unique, as opposed to simply being stronger and unable to be nerfed. With that said, I would agree with others about her price; it feels far too much for her in her current state, which is almost a clone of Hipper.

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Edgecase #9 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:54 AM

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View PostBoyarsky, on 13 September 2016 - 08:51 PM, said:

Personal offerings with discounts based on previous achievements in game, for example.

 

In the case of Hipper/Eugen, this would be particularly interesting. Elited Hipper? Half off Eugen! (as an example)

 

It might also help in the case of ships that are nearly unplayable without previous experience like Saipan.



IKU19 #10 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:57 AM

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View PostBoyarsky, on 13 September 2016 - 08:51 PM, said:

2Judge_Doom:

Any premium ship in our game has a base price in doubloons, which is defined by its Tier, Class and some other minor factors.

It would be unfair to offer a way for new players to skip the grind without paying a reasonable price for it.

But your point makes me believe that there is a way we could resolve this conflict. Personal offerings with discounts based on previous achievements in game, for example.

We will explore these options.

 

The storefront allows for account-tied offers, right? You could offer a discount to people that have progressed to a certain stage in the game, you've briefly experimented with this system with I believe Aurora. I think the RU cluster also tried this with Saipan and offering her exclusively to people that have a carrier above a certain tier researched (or so I heard, no clue if they actually went ahead with that system)


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Stauffenberg44 #11 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:57 AM

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Boyarsky. I appreciate the feedback and response to some obvious disgruntlement on the forum about the ship. For myself I bought her without waiting for a cheaper package because all the items included were of interest to me at the time. And as you say, this is one of those premier ships of historical value, as would be the Graf Spee or Hood, and these are important issues for the collectors among us.

 

The final issue for me re the similarity to the Hipper, which I also have, was clear enough. I'll play them both out for a time and see if perhaps you tweak a difference into one of them; if not, and I expect not, I can sell the Hipper for the credits and slot and sail on with the Eugen. I have no complaints.

 

Again thanks for passing on your thoughts and observations.


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thepointofluck #12 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:57 AM

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Historical value can be a huge purchasing influence but these tend to be more impulsive buys. Low tier ships can be based entirely on their historic value (think Campbeltown or Mikasa) since they are cheap and people are willing to pay for a ship with cool history when it is cheap. When you get to tier 6 and 7, it can be a important factor (Warspite or Sharnhorst) but it begins to trail off with the gameplay having more of an influence since you start dishing out larger amounts of money to get them. At tier 8, the ship's history is only a small factor, since people are looking for competitive ships that the can play, have fun in and grind credits in before they look for a historic ship (think Atago, not popular because of historic value but because it prints credits) and tend to be picky with the amount of money required to by one.

 

The Prinz just didn't overcome the similarity to the  gameplay of the Hipper with historic value causing people to hold on to there money for a better deal. 

 

Also high tier Commander Trainers are a bit of a hard sell since I could get 1 tier 8 commander trainer for one nation or I could buy two lower tier trainers for two nations for similar prices. 


Edited by thepointofluck, 14 September 2016 - 02:14 AM.


Xeilin #13 Posted 14 September 2016 - 01:58 AM

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In any case.  It is nice for a response on this.  Especially about the camo giving the additional bonuses.  

 

However,

While people here like shiny things.  Some shines attract different people.  If people want the flag.  They'll naturally get the Deluxe bundle.  If they don't want the flag but like the additions to it in terms of extra equipment.  They get Fully loaded (Which is actually quite lackluster this time around).  But for the people that might just want the ship itself for use or collection purposes.  Bare bones is all they need. 

 

Since not everyone might not want the flag. Giving it out as an 'earlier' release with only the flag bundle just comes off as unsavory.  We see the things that come with the ships, and most people likely know what they want.  If it is there for a limited time.  That's fine.  I can understand having things for sale for only limited periods.  Just make all the ship bundles available during said period.

 

The highest price early release to lowest price later is a slippery slope that many companies fall down.  If this was taken as a great success perhaps it might have lead to something of.  Well players with premium time can purchase any bundle at any time.  Please just stick to the usual type of release with all 3 bundles.  (Or more should you choose to add them.)



Capt_Binkley #14 Posted 14 September 2016 - 02:16 AM

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View PostDarthDoge, on 14 September 2016 - 01:43 AM, said:

 

Because the Atago is actually worth it?

 

I think the Atago may be my least played premium.  I'm finding the PE a lot of fun to play.

Sir_Godz #15 Posted 14 September 2016 - 02:23 AM

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View PostNuk_, on 14 September 2016 - 01:40 AM, said:

 

Atago is $47 by itself, what makes you think the Prinz would be so much cheaper?

 

Because the atago is actually a different ship from the mogami that plays different and thus gives a different experience. The people who own her pay a steep enough price for a difference whereas the eugen is actually the same ship and if we are getting picky then it's actually worse in a variety of areas. Due to it being undifferent at the very least charging a minimal amount would be appropriate. WG did not even invest in modeling of the new ship so why not pass on the savings. Additionally, due to when the KM cruisers were released and the BBs with their prem ships the eugen is not nearly the value it could have been because of how many people have all ready trained captains for both lines.

 

What makes you think the eugen is even worth half of what atago commands considering all of this?



TenguBlade #16 Posted 14 September 2016 - 02:24 AM

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Even if I'm not personally involved in this, I greatly appreciate that WG is being a little more open.  A huge portion of the angst in this community comes from people losing faith in the company.

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Boyarsky #17 Posted 14 September 2016 - 02:29 AM

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View PostDas_Schlippo, on 13 September 2016 - 05:41 PM, said:

Experimental money grab of epic proportions is what you mean.

 

2Das_Schlippo: who defines the distinction between money grabbing and fair monetization tactics?

The mere restriction of premium content to payers only without the ways to earn it for free may be considered as money grabbing.

Some tactics just look bad in comparison to history and expectations, but are perfectly neutral if you look at them from the outsider's perspective.

Having said that, we realized that this innovation will drive negative reactions. But we can't stop trying something new just because of this concern.

When we released Arpeggio in January we also knew there will be negativity. However, it turned out over time more players enjoyed non-historical fantasy content than left our game because of it.

Maybe this is not a perfect analogy, but I'm just trying to illustrate a burden of decision maker to make such calls and then either succeed or learn.

In this case we've learned something. :)


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Sir_Godz #18 Posted 14 September 2016 - 02:43 AM

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How about the marketing team decided that the ship will be so underwhelming that the only people likely to buy it would be the hipper lovers or collectors so why don't we soak them for as much as we can right away while the ship is seen as a limited available purchase.

 

The reasons people get pissed about your tactics is that you deceive and manipulate routinely and follow that up with more of the same.

 

You prey on the EU and NA player base's love of gaming to carry the free loading RU server. Considering western servers pay 80% of the bills if not more you could consider not milking the cow til it dies of dehydration.

 

FU WG, working as intended.



BladedPheonix #19 Posted 14 September 2016 - 02:43 AM

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ok then answer us this, why did WG got the P2P route on the ship this time? you've never had us wait to by lower level bundles before. why did you do it this time? and you should also rethink your strategy if you think we (the player base) will continue to allow this type of bundle shinanigan to be allowed in the future. its dumb, unfair for players who have set(limited) amounts of funds and if you add the posibiblity of limited playing hours, you also risk losing out on sales!:sceptic:

Edited by BladedPheonix, 14 September 2016 - 02:44 AM.


Pendragon1951 #20 Posted 14 September 2016 - 02:47 AM

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@Boyarsky To be honest I never understood the logic of why you would sell your bundles this way, from a perception point of view it makes your company look like a money grabbing company with only dollar signs in their eyes. Also you risk the loss and future sales of the ship because if the ship has some negative aspects you can be sure it will be announced on the forums and in-game thus scaring away any possible customers for the later bundles. Whom ever thought this up really missed the mark or needs some education in marketing.




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