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Illegal Mods and Consequences


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awiggin #41 Posted 23 May 2016 - 03:11 AM

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View Postdmckay, on 22 May 2016 - 07:02 PM, said:

Great.  I have never understood why, as the thread states, people would cheat to win in a video game. How the hell can you feel good about your gameplay if it is, in part, dependent on cheating? Just do not understand people like that. 

 

Then you don't understand 30% of the population...:trollface:

 

When my son was growing up, the first thing he'd do is look for cheats and hacks for games he played....used to drive me nuts.

The win at all costs mentality seems to be very prevalent these days, so player trying to get an advantage shouldn't really surprise anyone... 


Edited by awiggin, 23 May 2016 - 03:11 AM.

 

 


BladedPheonix #42 Posted 23 May 2016 - 03:19 AM

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Forgive me but I"m calling Bull on this statement by WG.....:sceptic:

 

Mr Nyx, you do know that saying WG is going to do something and  actually following through with it, is another right? In the past WG has said many things and have failed to follow through with promises to crack down on cheating, a prime example is WOT's 1st and 2nd campaign where certain clans (can't name do to Forum Rules)  cheated by rigging matches. When WG was confronted with these claims of cheating, they claimed they would punish the clans who were involved but instead ended up doing nothing causing a huge divide in the player population. Now granted, when the 3rd campaign kicked off there were a large amount of clans that got kicked out of the event for rigging, but by this time most of the trust players had towards WG was gone.

 

My point is this, unless WG were to implement a wall of shame, and start making an example of players who break forum/in-game rules by listing what they did wrongshowing how long they were suspected of doing said wrong doings, and how long they will be banned for, no one can or will believe that you are truly making a difference to make the game more fun and fair to play. 

 

and before you stat quoting " we can't have a wall of shame ,we don't have the rights to do that action", you need to remember this, every update players have to sign a waver stating we will follow the rules and blah blah blah excessive legal stuff. You can't tell me that in this long, legal, garbal of text, you guys/gals can't input a part that says " oh btw if you break any of these rules and are caught red handed with overwhelming evidence, you will be made an example of and put on a wall of shame and banned for a set period of time" into your contract? this type of excuse is just laziness :sceptic:



MajorRenegade #43 Posted 23 May 2016 - 03:22 AM

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My major concern is that you might ban someone by mistake for a harmless mod. Are you sure your methods of hunting for aim assist users is fool proof?

          
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TenguBlade #44 Posted 23 May 2016 - 03:23 AM

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View PostDirty_Deeds, on 22 May 2016 - 10:04 PM, said:

This right here is pretty disheartening.

 

Aslain has been the most respected and #1 source of mods to this community (as well as his work in WoT) and you guys have not even confirmed if what is included in his mod pack is acceptable?!  Before starting these sanctions?!

 

Just today i was answering questions from a newish player who wasn't even sure aim assist was OK or not.  After the usual dog pile from the forum regulars, some of us did mention that World of Tanks itself has both a built in aim assist and auto aim function, so it CAN be easy for players who do not frequent forums to know what is kosher and what is not.

I'm as much in favor of active policing as the next guy, but this is an important point.  A list of greenlighted mods (even if everything under Aslain's modpack or of one category is one blanket item on the list) would be highly appreciated, and IMO should be sent along with every email that delivers a notice of punishment for illegal mod usage/hacking.


Edited by TenguBlade, 23 May 2016 - 03:24 AM.

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NikoPower #45 Posted 23 May 2016 - 03:27 AM

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Deathskyz #46 Posted 23 May 2016 - 03:29 AM

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View PostBladedPheonix, on 23 May 2016 - 11:19 AM, said:

 this type of excuse is just laziness 

 

I wouldnt call the WoWS Team lazy.

They've done more to stop cheating than WoT ever did.


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spacegolfer #47 Posted 23 May 2016 - 03:47 AM

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Way to go WoWS Team! I am all for getting rid of the hacking or mods or whatever. I have no tolerance for cheaters. If caught they need to be identified so others can know them in the games. They should be punished and if caught again then banned permanent. Thanks for all your work on making this game more enjoyable.

 



NyxWGA #48 Posted 23 May 2016 - 03:59 AM

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View PostMajorRenegade, on 22 May 2016 - 07:22 PM, said:

My major concern is that you might ban someone by mistake for a harmless mod. Are you sure your methods of hunting for aim assist users is fool proof?

We worked for an extensive an amount of time to understand these mods and we feel very confident that we have hit the correct people. We lightened the touch here. We could have been more strict, but we wanted to be ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN that we had the right people. I will admit freely that there are people who are guilty who did not receive consequences because we were not ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN. The list was smaller than I expected, so I am confident that people who were guilty went unpunished - it's not that I wanted that to happen, but I recognize that we do NOT want to give out consequences UNLESS WE ARE SURE.

View PostDirty_Deeds, on 22 May 2016 - 07:31 PM, said:

 

There has never been any legal reason why any game company has not been allowed to post the user names of people they have banned.   There's no slander or other nefarious actions involved.  It's just a simple statement of action (using illegal mod) and reaction (banned) that has a very strong result, IMO.  Sad fact is, most companies do not have the nerve to do these lists because they actually still want these people's money. 

 

One of the most inspiring recent actions I saw a game developer take against cheaters was when John Smedley banned almost 30,000 H1Z1 players after being caught cheating and then offered to let them play again if they publicly admitted to cheating and apologized,   He then posted those video apologies on his twitter account.

I know the perception is that we don't want to scare off paying players. I want to stress that is not what is happening here. The majority of players that were banned in this incident were in the top percentage of paying players. These kind of players are, in fact, the kind of players that pay my salary. But I want to reassure you that just because you pay us money, doesn't mean you get to get away with things that the average player does not. Paying us money does not give you a free pass to act inappropriately.

 

Please note that there are federal privacy laws that we are working to adhere to. What we feel adheres to the law, and what someone else feels adheres to the law may be different. Only time will tell, through a court of law, which of us is correctly adhering to the law. In general, what we really want is to adhere to the law correctly, while still revealing as much info that the rest of the players want to hear.


Edited by NyxWGA, 23 May 2016 - 04:01 AM.

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FlashTX1 #49 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:06 AM

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Cool! :B

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How_Terrible #50 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:11 AM

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View PostNyxWGA, on 22 May 2016 - 09:59 PM, said:

We worked for an extensive an amount of time to understand these mods and we feel very confident that we have hit the correct people. We lightened the touch here. We could have been more strict, but we wanted to be ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN that we had the right people. I will admit freely that there are people who are guilty who did not receive consequences because we were not ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN. The list was smaller than I expected, so I am confident that people who were guilty went unpunished - it's not that I wanted that to happen, but I recognize that we do NOT want to give out consequences UNLESS WE ARE SURE.

I know the perception is that we don't want to scare off paying players. I want to stress that is not what is happening here. The majority of players that were banned in this incident were in the top percentage of paying players. These kind of players are, in fact, the kind of players that pay my salary. But I want to reassure you that just because you pay us money, doesn't mean you get to get away with things that the average player does not. Paying us money does not give you a free pass to act inappropriately.

 

Please note that there are federal privacy laws that we are working to adhere to. What we feel adheres to the law, and what someone else feels adheres to the law may be different. Only time will tell, through a court of law, which of us is correctly adhering to the law. In general, what we really want is to adhere to the law correctly, while still revealing as much info that the rest of the players want to hear.

 

Nyx, is there a any way that Niko or yourself could post and pin a list of criteria for what constitutes an illegal mod (as in what types of mods are prohibited)?

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Red_Raven_168 #51 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:11 AM

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View PostNyxWGA, on 22 May 2016 - 07:02 PM, said:

These players have been identified by us as using forbidden modifications, including aim assist mods.

 

 

wait - this implies that there exists more than ONE category of forbidden mods (aim assist / aim bot mods)

 

what are the other categories?


View PostCapnCappy, on 28 June 2016 - 08:12 AM, said:

You realize you're commenting on a thread that's older than some players?


Paul_Sean #52 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:15 AM

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nice sharing post, thanks for info :)
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Pendragon1951 #53 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:18 AM

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View PostNyxWGA, on 22 May 2016 - 06:02 PM, said:

Good day, Commanders,

 

Please take a moment to read this message, it’s actually quite important!

 

We’re happy to inform you that we’ve taken another step in our struggle against unwanted exploiting of our game mechanics through client modifications and outright cheats. A group of players was banned earlier today. These players have been identified by us as using forbidden modifications, including aim assist mods.

 

These players have been banned for 7 days. After this punishment is over, they will be unbanned and receive amnesty. However, should a player be caught by the system a second time, the game ban applied to his/her account will be permanent.

 

Please don’t ask us about the details of the system’s operation – we won’t tell!

 

At this point, we would like to remind everyone that cheating sucks. Cheating only makes someone appear to be good at the game, it doesn't actually make them good at the game, and it lessens everyone else's enjoyment. If you’ve been using such modifications and were not caught this time, or have been considering using them, please stop now. You will end up losing your account entirely by continuing to use these.

 

I also want to stress that we are now and will continue to take steps to improve gameplay and fairness for everyone. I know some folks disagreed with the TK bans. I know some folks will also disagree with these bans.

 

BUT - The majority of our players have expressed disappointment that we have not taken action against these blatant offenses in the past. We wish to work towards improving that, and NOT disappointing our players in this manner. I don't think what we are asking is unreasonable. We're simply asking that you do not take actions that inherently cause other players to be unhappy. Everyone has the right to play a game without another player ruining their experience.

 

Please feel free to ask questions or give feedback in this thread. If you have been affected by this or the TK ban, and don't feel that it has adequately been explained to you, please send a support ticket. Feel free to even mark my name on it, and I will instruct the other folks in support to send them to me, if they have my name on them. Most of you know that I've been around awhile, and I think of myself as pretty fair and pretty responsive to the needs of the community. If you feel that you got the short end of the stick, I am happy to look in detail at it, to ensure it was done correctly.

 

Action Stations!

First off I want to applaud your efforts in this and the TK problem but at the same time as far as the TK problem is concerned I think WG is being a bit naive in the mechanics your using to find and ban them and the results there of. Basically actual TKers DON'T CARE, they don't care if you punish them, they don't care if you remove them from the game, they will just make new ip's and come back and start all over again. What is happening now is that the system has gone so overboard that I read in forum that a player actually was in a game with all pink players, now if that doesn't tell you something is wrong with the system nothing will. Your devoting resources to a problem that could be taken care of simply by removing friendly fire and retaining the collision physics. The game would continue on without TKers, and yes you may get some trolls just shooting you just because but to be honest I'd rather have that than have a fellow team mate kill me on purpose at the beginning of a game. I know a few games who don't have friendly fire one of which is Warframe and they have continued on with no regrets going on three years now. If you don't remove the TKer's greatest weapon then IMHO you will never eliminate the TK problem.



MajorRenegade #54 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:19 AM

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View PostDirty_Deeds, on 22 May 2016 - 09:12 PM, said:

 

How would posting the names of the accounts you banned be any different then a mod making a comment in red on one of those people's forum posts here when they violated some rule? It's the same thing.    Unless you were also releasing their account information, you are in no way violating any privacy laws. A username held under an EULA and ToS agreement is not private information.

 

My example above of former SOE CEO John Smedley banning 30,000 H1Z1 accounts was true as was his posting the apologies publicly on his twitter account.   I have also read something about Valve giving it's game developers the power to inform them of cheaters in their specific games so they can ban them across all Valve/Steam games.

 

If ban lists are against some federal privacy laws, i would sure love to see some examples.

try googling privacy law?


          
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BGrey #55 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:20 AM

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View PostPendragon1951, on 22 May 2016 - 11:18 PM, said:

First off I want to applaud your efforts in this and the TK problem but at the same time as far as the TK problem is concerned I think WG is being a bit naive in the mechanics your using to find and ban them and the results there of. Basically actual TKers DON'T CARE, they don't care if you punish them, they don't care if you remove them from the game, they will just make new ip's and come back and start all over again. What is happening now is that the system has gone so overboard that I read in forum that a player actually was in a game with all pink players, now if that doesn't tell you something is wrong with the system nothing will. Your devoting resources to a problem that could be taken care of simply by removing friendly fire and retaining the collision physics. The game would continue on without TKers, and yes you may get some trolls just shooting you just because but to be honest I'd rather have that than have a fellow team mate kill me on purpose at the beginning of a game. I know a few games who don't have friendly fire one of which is Warframe and they have continued on with no regrets going on three years now. If you don't remove the TKer's greatest weapon then IMHO you will never eliminate the TK problem.

 

Were there even any changes to criteria for going pink? I don't recall any being mentioned.



Xannari #56 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:20 AM

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View PostNyxWGA, on 22 May 2016 - 10:59 PM, said:

These kind of players are, in fact, the kind of players that pay my salary. But I want to reassure you that just because you pay us money, doesn't mean you get to get away with things that the average player does not. Paying us money does not give you a free pass to act inappropriately.

 

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Pendragon1951 #57 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:25 AM

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View PostBGrey, on 22 May 2016 - 08:20 PM, said:

 

Were there even any changes to criteria for going pink? I don't recall any being mentioned.

I think in the last big patch 055 they listed the new criteria, which almost made it sound like breath on someone wrong and your pink, thus the reason why I posted what I did.



Mr_Alex #58 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:30 AM

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If I am correct, being caught using a illegal mod could result in a permanent ban?

NikoPower #59 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:33 AM

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View PostMr_Alex, on 22 May 2016 - 08:30 PM, said:

If I am correct, being caught using a illegal mod could result in a permanent ban?

 

These players have been banned for 7 days. After this punishment is over, they will be unbanned and receive amnesty. However, should a player be caught by the system a second time, the game ban applied to his/her account will be permanent.

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Bl4ckBaron #60 Posted 23 May 2016 - 04:38 AM

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Cheating is the most important negative factor for poor player retention.

 

Unbalanced ships, bugs and maps affect everyone equally...if you think a ship is OP get it and fight with it.

 

ONLY CHEATS are truly unfair because some have them and the majority have not.

 

Ban everyone cheating and this game will get a population boost.

 

Please dont forget to publicize your ban policy and actions because a lot of people that left the game in disgust will almost for sure return.

 

Flood the forums, flood all the gaming sites, please flood the internet and announce that cheaters are being actively persecuted and banned from WoWs.

 

Best regards.


Edited by Bl4ckBaron, 23 May 2016 - 04:39 AM.





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