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Stupid DD why aren't You Capping

destroyer CAPs tactics

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StingRayOne #1 Posted 01 May 2017 - 09:43 PM

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Hello I am StingRayOne

I am a Destroyer and Have been playing since Beta.

I'm Ok, well in the Fujin-Pretty darn good.

lets talk some basics here, How big is a cap, anywhere from 5km to 12Km depending on map and mode.

What is the average gun range of a Destroyer call it 10km for now

a cruiser maybe 15km and a Battleship will call 18km.

All these things are important to my capping.

picture this in your mind if I am 5km ahead of the nearest cruiser and 8km from the nearest Battleship on our own team, I am covered by your guns.

look at it visually

& (BB)      % (CA/Cl)          # DD   all our guns range to here  @

But if the BB is here & and the CA is Here % and                                                I am way out here   # I am a sitting duck.

Especially if your team runs away at the site of three enemy ships.

So if I cap taking all this into play the other team no where I am (ie the CAP) and has the ability to control my movements and kill me.

But what if I do not CAP?

well then I know where they are when they cap and your guns will hit them as I spot them. They do not know where the torpedoes' are coming from when I shoot. and we have a ability to control their movement and focus fire as the Enemy are all under the range of the Battleship and Cruiser guns as well as mine and the torpedoes we have.   GET IT.

The game is 20 minutes, why not use them, why not "NOT" CAP and spot for the kills. be a team player spot and fire as a group.


 

another option is to spot and go by the CAP.

why so I can snipe the slow enemy BBs in the back and maybe the CV. it is a long run so the friendly team must be patient but it works.


 

meanwhile when I do not cap I am according to chat

an idiot

a poor player

a a hole

a moron

a noob

a coward

a(edited)(edited)(edited)


 

what amazing is when not capping in a DD and not in a division I have in 20 battles in my Fujin that I tracked ______a 90% win rate.


 

I will post a few videos latter.


 

Your thoughts.


 

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Kombat_W0MBAT #2 Posted 01 May 2017 - 09:52 PM

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As a DD in domination our first job is to contest caps. I can't tell you how many times I've had to do this in my Russian DD (with terrible concealment) because the IJN/USN/KM DDs refused to.

 

#DoYourJob

 

EDIT: Yes, it's sometimes difficult to cap due to radar, planes, etcetera... but each game is different. You have to assess countless risk/reward scenarios during the course of a 20 minute game. 

 

 

 

 


Edited by Kombat_W0MBAT, 01 May 2017 - 09:58 PM.


Jnobsir #3 Posted 01 May 2017 - 10:09 PM

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Wait a minute, not rushing to the cap immediately.

 

Hmm, I need to think about this. Its a bit embarrassing that for how long I've played DDs that I've never actually though about that possibility. Moving towards the caps always served to give me a purpose/goal when in a DD. But there definitely is some potential here. Its not like capping even gives you that much XP anymore. I guess it really depends on the situation and what support you have.  I'll come back after I've given this some thought.

 

Its definitely a good idea if the enemy team has an IJN CV. Rushing into a cap is a great way to get picked off by torpedo bombers. You practically have to sit on top of your teammates(and their wonderful AA) to stand any chance of living, provided that the enemy CV is even somewhat competent.

 

 


 

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ValkyrWarframe #4 Posted 01 May 2017 - 10:16 PM

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Honestly a destroyer shouldn't throw their life away just to grab a cap.  There is a limit to what they should do.  Getting yourself killed very early just for a cap is meaningless unless your team also happens to be stomping the enemy team.  

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Wulfgarn #5 Posted 01 May 2017 - 10:16 PM

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I rarely go full on into a cap these days at the beginning of a match.

 

 


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GhostSwordsman #6 Posted 01 May 2017 - 10:21 PM

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I've found great success in Kagero by going to a cap and not jumping on it right away, especially if I don't spot anything or spot cruisers on the way there.

 

It's quite effective as the enemy has no idea I'm there, unless they're really paying attention to the spotted "!" symbol. It's also allowed me to nab way too many devastating strikes on foolish enemy DDs that run into the cap, get spotted by me, smoke up and then sit there to cap. Because as soon as I see that, I wait for them to disappear and then dump torpedoes into the smoke cloud. They die, then I take the cap anyway because the other team's only means of capping and vision is now dead.

 

Yes, it's a viable tactic to not jump on a cap immediately in a destroyer, most especially at high tiers, where you can be killed off very quickly if you make a mistake.


Edited by GhostSwordsman, 01 May 2017 - 10:23 PM.

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Soshi_Sone, on 26 April 2017 - 05:36 PM, said:

Literally speaking, one can only run into Lert if one is not alert.
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DakotaViking #7 Posted 01 May 2017 - 10:25 PM

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I can really relate. You do what you can and each game is different, ignore the ignorant fools.

LordBenjamin #8 Posted 01 May 2017 - 10:31 PM

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At the beginning of the game everyone is pointing guns at caps waiting for a tasty DD to be spotted.   I try to wait until some situational awareness has developed before going full on into the cap circle.

Stauffenberg44 #9 Posted 01 May 2017 - 10:55 PM

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It's not about capping per se, although a cap should be grabbed if the opportunity presents itself, your main job as a DD early on is to get out front and spot ships. Over and over I see DDs falling to do this basic task, noodling around, even behind their CAs, or simply afk. Also common: a DD placed on the east or west wing instead of heading out to recon decides to head over to the opposite wing leaving the CAs and BBs with no DD support. Brilliant!

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MrDeaf #10 Posted 01 May 2017 - 11:05 PM

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depends on what cards you are dealt.

 

Do you not have CE on your IJN/USN/KM DD?

If you don't, why not?

Is your DD the stealthiest ship in the match?

is there a stealthier ship on the red team?

Is my DD built for capping at the start of the match in the first place?

Is this cap circle large enough to avoid radar detection from 8.5km, 9.0km, 9.45km, 9.9km, 11.7km radar?

Is this a CV match?

Does this map offer enough room to offer flanking positions?

Do I have enough friendly backup to avoid getting focused down too hard?

Did some bad DD player leave a big gap in coverage?

etc.

 

Kagero and Yugumo aren't bad at capping right at the start, because they have the best concealment in their tiers and in the T7-10 bracket in general.

Shimakaze, on the other hand, that is a terrible ship to rush a cap with.


Edited by MrDeaf, 01 May 2017 - 11:07 PM.

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Morpheous #11 Posted 01 May 2017 - 11:10 PM

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Well lets put it this way OP.  All your DDs play to spot, none cap.  The enemy DDs cap, they now control more of the board and are more likely spotting your CAs and BBs instead of you spotting theirs.  Now your behind in points.  Points matter in this game much more than Tanks.  Its hard to move from cap to cap and regain them, especially if your a BB or even a CA moving from lets say A to C.  I have seen too many games lost by getting pointed out, or base capped because someone was too lazy to go back or to concerned about not losing their ship.  I would say your correct if your talking Russian DD with bad concealment here, and I fully admit I have taken my Tashkent to caps and really should not have.  A stock DD perhaps should stay out of cap too.  Otherwise I fully believe in other tiers where your not playing a DD that is pretty OP for that tier, your idea will fail.  I have had DD players doing this, and now as a BB or a CA like the Dontski, I am not spotted and shells are flying and I can't see a target.  That sucks, bad.

MelonFlavoredShells #12 Posted 01 May 2017 - 11:24 PM

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It is inevitable that you will have to gamble your ship under certain circumstances in order to get your team moving, or take an objective. I won't flame a destroyer for not taking a contested cap, but I will flame them for hiding behind the carrier and vomiting out torpedoes every ~2 minutes.

 

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_WaveRider_ #13 Posted 02 May 2017 - 12:06 AM

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To me it seems if you roll back the clock a year then yes, capping would be a DDs role; just like being a hard counter to BBs. 

 

But as WG has introduced more elements in game to stop DDs from getting to the BBs early in match, the same goes for contesting cap.

 

Is it a DDs role? No! A DD may be best suited with its concealment, but we all know the number of things in game that negates concealment! In a cap game, achieving cap is ANY players role!

 

So like a DD has to wait until the enemy ships have thinned a bit before it can get near a BB nowadays, the same patience has to be used when it comes to caps. :honoring:


Edited by _WaveRider_, 02 May 2017 - 12:08 AM.


Show_Me_Your_Cits #14 Posted 02 May 2017 - 12:07 AM

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I had a Roon berate me for not smoking him whilst he Yoloed into the entire enemy team at B on Okinawa. I was close enough to do so, sure, but.... 

.... I was in a Khabarovsk.

 


Edited by Show_Me_Your_Cits, 02 May 2017 - 12:08 AM.

Muh 1337 stets. 

Herr_Reitz #15 Posted 02 May 2017 - 12:11 AM

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Funny thing... when I dd these days it's in the Kami R, because... 5.4 conceal plus a commander with RDF. I almost never ever rush a cap because most other ships on the red team will have a higher (worse) conceal than me. More times than not (excluding red dd of the fujin/kami type) I'll see the red DD while they are 6 to 7 km away from me. I keep them lit, throw torps at them and generally make their lives miserable because they cannot see me. 

 

That's pretty much my game plan every time I take the Kami R out. 

 

PS: My new catch phrase is "A-hull" which comes out sounding like something else but of course that's not what is intended. :red_button:



Mariner17 #16 Posted 02 May 2017 - 12:51 AM

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Rushing to cap with a DD mostly depends on which nation you are using.

 

In a IJN destroyer i wouldnt cap unless their are no other DDs/CLs in the immediate vicinity and you arent spotted, else wise I wouldnt chance it because you are no use dead and DDs capping in late stages of the game can be the deciding factor in those long drawn out slug fests.

 

I mostly play soviet destroyers and I can contest any cap that has another DD in it and I do, because if i can take out that DD thats one less ship on the enemy side and maybe even an open cap afterwards. If its a IJN DD I engage aggressively and just watch for torps, if its american I will keep my distance and use my flat arcing guns to deal more accurate damage than his high arcing guns can do.

 

In IJN DDs you need to be very selective in capping and really shouldnt try to contest caps to hard against other DDs. You should focus on taking uncontested caps and dealing long range torpedo hits against BBs with their amazing torps.


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bad_arcade_kitty #17 Posted 02 May 2017 - 03:26 AM

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when wg introduced radar i announced that if cruisers were going to ruin our capping fun let they cap themselves then and so i began to avoid capping contested points since then

Edited by bad_arcade_kitty, 02 May 2017 - 03:27 AM.

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_WaveRider_ #18 Posted 02 May 2017 - 06:17 AM

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View PostHerr_Reitz, on 02 May 2017 - 12:11 AM, said:

Funny thing... when I dd these days it's in the Kami R, because... 5.4 conceal plus a commander with RDF. I almost never ever rush a cap because most other ships on the red team will have a higher (worse) conceal than me. More times than not (excluding red dd of the fujin/kami type) I'll see the red DD while they are 6 to 7 km away from me. I keep them lit, throw torps at them and generally make their lives miserable because they cannot see me.

 

That's pretty much my game plan every time I take the Kami R out.

 

PS: My new catch phrase is "A-hull" which comes out sounding like something else but of course that's not what is intended. :red_button:

 

This where I feel the kami should either continue to be on sale full time or Tier V-VI ships should also have Radar.
 

The first anti-DD mechanic is the enemy gunship DDs! If that first line of conflict is out of balance then the game is out of balance. This is why I totally agree with Tier V being up-tiered to Tier VII; if I am new to Tier V what does it matter if I die to a Tier V ship with a high skilled captain or a Tier VII ship (in fact at least the latter seems more fair as the fact there are ships = to the Kami and Gremy).

 

 

View Postbad_arcade_kitty, on 02 May 2017 - 03:26 AM, said:

when wg introduced radar i announced that if cruisers were going to ruin our capping fun let they cap themselves then and so i began to avoid capping contested points since then

 

This is wrong (IMO). Whereas I don't agree in capping being any specific ships role (DD) with the amount of anti-concealment mechanics in game, being a player that actively avoids caps when you may be the best equipped to do so is purposefully hurting your own team. :honoring:

Edited by _WaveRider_, 02 May 2017 - 06:17 AM.


Squidward_Tentpoles #19 Posted 02 May 2017 - 07:13 AM

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View PostValkyrWarframe, on 01 May 2017 - 05:16 PM, said:

Honestly a destroyer shouldn't throw their life away just to grab a cap.  There is a limit to what they should do.  Getting yourself killed very early just for a cap is meaningless unless your team also happens to be stomping the enemy team.  

 

This. I've seen many games where DDs charge headlong into a cap only to get themselves blown up.

SgtSullyC3 #20 Posted 02 May 2017 - 07:00 PM

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I don't like charging the Cap in anything other than a USN DD. IJN and Russian DDs just don't react quick enough to a DD popping up in their face IMO, and IJN DDs suck at gunfights anyways.

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